NV NV - Steven T. Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - #11

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  • #221
I saw in a recent post that Steven's utilties were scheduled to be turned off. Where did this info come from? Very confusing to me. Utilities were in landlord's name, impact would be on landlord's credit reports (even though it isn't credit), would it not? Landlord would allow utilities to be turned off?

And this really changes things as far as my uderstanding goes. While actually being angry at parents for knowing about the situation and wanting to help, taking $100 to drive hundreds of miles to see a former gf family (and he thought she would be there?) instead of say keeping the lights on, it doesn't seem like he was planning on staying there.

Being religious and heavily involved in those activities makes it even more complicated. Given those constraints, I can't think of too many options he had. A job with room and board maybe.

rd

I thought the landlord was responsible for utilities? IIRC SK Mom said that. Or was it clarified by landlord that SK was responsible for that.( half of them)

All of the above. I'm serious.

The landlady claimed that the tenants were responsible to split the utilities, and give that amount to the them.
But since Steven hadn't been paying his rent or utilities, and Z had skipped out, the landlords weren't paying the utility bills.

That's why the utilities were due to be shut off.

But legally, Steven's mother is correct. The utilities were all in the landlord's name; it was up to them to make those payments. There's probably some detail in Utah's rental laws that state you can't turn off your renters' utilities if the utilities are in your name.

The set-up at that house was doomed to failure, IMO. You can't get a decent amount of rent out of a home, if you're keeping the master bedroom and bath for yourself. You're not going to attract the type of renters you need (a solid family), who can pay the bills. You're going to attract exactly what they got: a couple of single, down-on-their luck guys looking for a crash pad.

IMO, it would have been better for them to rent it as a family home at market rate, with the renting family responsible for the utilities. That would have given them enough extra to pay for a motel when they were in St George. They were already having to eat out, since they'd turned the kitchen over to the renters.

My post above asked about utilities. It seems Steven and the other guy stiffed the landlord on everything. So I guess instead of paying them landlords were going to shut them off? Have no idea what they would do since they sometimes stayed at that house as well.
 
  • #222
I know these are questions that have been asked and no one knows the answer yet, but the no landline, no internet thing bothered me. What was the library where he had currently checked out books on Pete Maravich, his own family geneology, and another one? Were the books in his room? When were they checked out?

What I'm getting at here is library internet access. Only LE could know with subpoenas whether SK had gmail or yahoo email accounts, and it'd possibly be dicey determining it at that. Was Steven a regular at a library using internet access, such as at the library where he checked thiose books out? Does Mequite possibly have a library with internet access that he used the day or two before he disappeared?

I am having a hard time dealing with SK driving to that spot in the Henderson suburbs to park and walk away with no apparent directions or communications with anyone in the area. If he was going to a St. George area library to use the internet, possible he was doing searches, exchanging emails via yahoo or gmail and such at the library to determine to visit that location for a business opportunity. It would seem to be non-trivial for him to forego church and do this on Sunday, would it not?

What's in Mesquite for him to go there? If he was handing out fliers they would have been seen. Not handing out fliers, what's he doing there and decides to go to Henderson and disappear.

rd
 
  • #223
I saw in a recent post that Steven's utilties were scheduled to be turned off. Where did this info come from? Very confusing to me. Utilities were in landlord's name, impact would be on landlord's credit reports (even though it isn't credit), would it not? Landlord would allow utilities to be turned off?

It's the SL Trib2 link on the timeline, the last event listed under "Dec 9th/10th":
"The power company was threatening to disconnect electricity at the house where Koecher rented a room and lived alone, according to Webb.
Deanne Koecher said she knew her son was having financial difficulty, but said the power bill was the landlord's responsibility."


And this really changes things as far as my uderstanding goes. While actually being angry at parents for knowing about the situation and wanting to help, taking $100 to drive hundreds of miles to see a former gf family (and he thought she would be there?) instead of say keeping the lights on, it doesn't seem like he was planning on staying there.

Being religious and heavily involved in those activities makes it even more complicated. Given those constraints, I can't think of too many options he had. A job with room and board maybe.

rd

I think he was so far under (rent-wise), he didn't see a way out. Unfortunately, Steven (although smart) lacked some sort of social/decision-making skills.

As I've said here before: Two people who love Steven very much, have told me that "his entire life revolved around finding a job".

Yet, look at his work history. He's had some positions that others his age would die for: intern in the Utah Governor's office! Salt Lake Tribune! You don't quit jobs because people are "too worldly" (as he told a friend when he quib the Trib). You find a way to get along with people. That's part of being an adult. Otherwise, you end up washing windows and passing out flyers.

He may have been "looking" for jobs (by calling all the "A" listings in the phone book, then moving onto the "B" listings....), but that's not how you get a job. That's "working" but it's not productive. One has to know the difference.

I don't know how else to describe it, other than "downward spiral".
 
  • #224
I know these are questions that have been asked and no one knows the answer yet, but the no landline, no internet thing bothered me. What was the library where he had currently checked out books on Pete Maravich, his own family geneology, and another one? Were the books in his room? When were they checked out?

What I'm getting at here is library internet access. Only LE could know with subpoenas whether SK had gmail or yahoo email accounts, and it'd possibly be dicey determining it at that. Was Steven a regular at a library using internet access, such as at the library where he checked thiose books out? Does Mequite possibly have a library with internet access that he used the day or two before he disappeared?

I am having a hard time dealing with SK driving to that spot in the Henderson suburbs to park and walk away with no apparent directions or communications with anyone in the area. If he was going to a St. George area library to use the internet, possible he was doing searches, exchanging emails via yahoo or gmail and such at the library to determine to visit that location for a business opportunity. It would seem to be non-trivial for him to forego church and do this on Sunday, would it not?

What's in Mesquite for him to go there? If he was handing out fliers they would have been seen. Not handing out fliers, what's he doing there and decides to go to Henderson and disappear.

rd

R, my gut tells me Mesquite was just as gas stop on the way home from somewhere else in a southern direction. Vegas or that area. We know he went at least a bit further south, due to the cell tower hit.
TH's business wasn't licensed to do work in Nevada, and he was never sent there to solicit. The St George area (Washington County) population is approximately 140,000; there's no way he'd have completely solicited the entire area.

Obviously, we don't know whether the library internet records were subpoenaed...or if they'd tell anything. We have another case in Utah were a Weber County library IP address is the source of threatening emails to teachers -- yet, all Weber County libraries use the same IP address. And they each have wifi, meaning someone could have sat outside in their car, and sent the threats.
You have to have the other end of the transmission (ie, something like the infamous traceable Mapquest map tracked back to a home ISP account) to be able to tell what actually happened. In the case of a library, it's likely all anonymous **although** possession of Steven's computer would give a good techie the info needed to trace certain things.

In other words: this case is being treated (IMO) as a "purposeful disappearance" and although it's an open case, it's not like LE's busting their gut to solve it.
 
  • #225
Something else that's important to remember: Steven's mother worked at the bank. That would give her access to his financials (including any high credit card debts). She'd have been the manager of the family "joint bank account", also, and know what went in/out and who'd accessed it.

The fact that SK was far behind in his rent, was an apparent surprise to his parents.

I could be wrong, but I think he lived as cheaply as possible on what he brought in.

There was no flashy car or clothes. A very basic cell phone. A notebook computer, but he did not pay for an internet connection; he used the internet at the library. We don't even know if his computer had wifi capabilities.

Car payment, lowest possible (liability) insurance on the car. Half of the home's utilities (gas/electric, water). Food. If he was bringing in very little, I suspect he kept the car payments and insurance current.

When he bought Christmas present for an entire family, he spent less than $10.

I think if he had debt, it would have had to have been in a way that was unknown to his parents - because he went to St George "to be independent" and his parents apparently didn't know he was failing at that, until the call from the landlord to his parents.

JMO, of course.

bbm~
Hi laytonian! This may sound like a stupid question, but I'm just pondering some things..Do you (or anyone) know what kind of Christmas presents Steven had bought in years prior? I mean, was he usually a $ store type gift giver?..nothing wrong with that, especially with times as hard as they are, I'm just curious ..Or did he used to give a little more expensive gifts? You know what I mean...were the gifts he purchased, his 'normal' types of gifts? TY!
 
  • #226
I didn't know that. I just thought he was a dog-walker who lived in the area (his address IS right near where the stuff was found), and who took the pictures after he heard about the search.

I don't see his posts on the FB anymore.:waitasec: I see the pics in the photos section, but not his posts. What the heck!?!?!?!
 
  • #227
They didn't find Steven's keys in the car, right?
 
  • #228
I don't see his posts on the FB anymore.:waitasec: I see the pics in the photos section, but not his posts. What the heck!?!?!?!

Whose posts are missing?
 
  • #229
  • #230
I saw a post there today from him about Steven on the milk carton.
 
  • #231
I saw a post there today from him about Steven on the milk carton.

But what happened to the ones where he posted the pics? Am I losing my mind????
 
  • #232
bbm~
Hi laytonian! This may sound like a stupid question, but I'm just pondering some things..Do you (or anyone) know what kind of Christmas presents Steven had bought in years prior? I mean, was he usually a $ store type gift giver?..nothing wrong with that, especially with times as hard as they are, I'm just curious ..Or did he used to give a little more expensive gifts? You know what I mean...were the gifts he purchased, his 'normal' types of gifts? TY!

Good question, not stupid at all. I'll put that on a list to ask Naegle, after she responds to the rather-long lists she's received in the past couple of days. We don't want her to run away screaming.

We do know one thing: the family drew names, and Steven had drawn his brother Matthew's family to buy for.
 
  • #233
But what happened to the ones where he posted the pics? Am I losing my mind????

They are still there, I just read them again. He is the one that notified JB that the homeless camp was there. ( that question was asked earlier)
 
  • #234
But what happened to the ones where he posted the pics? Am I losing my mind????

They're on the photos page HERE.

At least the page is working; I was really worried.
 
  • #235
They're on the photos page HERE.

At least the page is working; I was really worried.

Thank you, guys! I guess he just notified JB because he was the local contact.

Sorry!
 
  • #236
R, my gut tells me Mesquite was just as gas stop on the way home from somewhere else in a southern direction. Vegas or that area. We know he went at least a bit further south, due to the cell tower hit.
TH's business wasn't licensed to do work in Nevada, and he was never sent there to solicit. The St George area (Washington County) population is approximately 140,000; there's no way he'd have completely solicited the entire area.

Obviously, we don't know whether the library internet records were subpoenaed...or if they'd tell anything. We have another case in Utah were a Weber County library IP address is the source of threatening emails to teachers -- yet, all Weber County libraries use the same IP address. And they each have wifi, meaning someone could have sat outside in their car, and sent the threats.
You have to have the other end of the transmission (ie, something like the infamous traceable Mapquest map tracked back to a home ISP account) to be able to tell what actually happened. In the case of a library, it's likely all anonymous **although** possession of Steven's computer would give a good techie the info needed to trace certain things.

In other words: this case is being treated (IMO) as a "purposeful disappearance" and although it's an open case, it's not like LE's busting their gut to solve it.

yeah, you're right about library internet access records and network IP address. I wasn't talking about that. Of course LE tries to find out what they can with library subpeona when investigating a serious crime, but that could only shed some light on possibilities at best.

What I was talking about was subpeonaing Yahoo and Google, to name two of the most common webmail hosts, to see if SK had email accounts with them, and what if any email had been in them. That's a real shot in the dark, and dicey to determine if SK had not used his real name, but yahoo and gmail are two most common ways to have email over web.

The point of library questions is not to try to figure out from a library PC, or subpeona library IP access to their internet host (government or some library association server), but whether Steven was possibly using library to find opportunities and was in Henderson based on an email or search.

If SK truly was focused on getting a job as two people close to him say, had no internet access at home, and had recently checked out books from a library, it's almost a given he was doing job hunting on a library PC.

So again, the question is, can we determine that, what libraries might he have gone to, and was Mesquite one of them?

For starters, where and when were those books checked out? Was it recent enough to have been on a library PC (if they have one, that's the question), and obtained some info that took him to Henderson in a day or two?

I know the family won't know, police won't know, but it would be helpful if library employees noticed that he frequented an internet PC if they have one, for example where he checked the books out. But in the end it would be cooperation from the likes of Google gmail and Yahoo to tell LE that he had mail accounts and what was in them to perhaps identify who he was communicating with before he disappeared, unless he really did just drive to a very hard find cul-de-sac in a random suburb in Henderson and walk away. He would not have survived very long in the open, which I guess police must be thinking is the point.

rd
 
  • #237
Steven was an "independent contractor" for TH, so TH wouldn't have been paying into the employee funds (unemployment, disability, etc). It was likely the same with the matchbin sales job.

We don't even know how long he worked for TH. It could have been from May, or just recently.

The rent bugs me, too. Maybe not for the same reason it bugs you, but because I can't see "sliding" that long, and thinking you could get away with it. Especially a nice religious boy who everyone claims was doing everyting right, otherwise.

Yes, likely the Matchbin job was the same deal, but we know practically nothing about that job, so we can't really say for sure. Unlikely, definitely, but not impossible.

The rent doesn't fit no matter what way you come at it. Steven does not seem like the kind who would let his rent slide. It seems odd that both renters were behind by about the same amount and it seems odd, or at least out of the ordinary, that the landlord would go to SK's father. It seems odd that both renters are apparently unreachable, though in different ways. It seems odd that SK would not have said anything to his family -- though if indepencence is the issue, that's at least understandable.
 
  • #238
Yes, likely the Matchbin job was the same deal, but we know practically nothing about that job, so we can't really say for sure. Unlikely, definitely, but not impossible.

The rent doesn't fit no matter what way you come at it. Steven does not seem like the kind who would let his rent slide. It seems odd that both renters were behind by about the same amount

Do we know how much Z owed, or how long he'd lived there? I don't. AFAIK, we don't even know when Steven moved in. I'd 🤬🤬🤬/u/me that he moved in when he first went to St George, but that's an 🤬🤬🤬/u/mption.

and it seems odd, or at least out of the ordinary, that the landlord would go to SK's father.

Me, too. Unless Steven listed them as emergency contact.
They were calling every day Dec 1st and onward...and apparently getting kinda desperate (IMO).

It seems odd that both renters are apparently unreachable, though in different ways.

That part's bugging me too. Early on, someone (?) said that Z had family in Vegas...but that may have just been what shows up on one of those internet "people finder" sites, which if the info on my family is a measure of accuracy, I wouldn't count on any of those sites.

It seems odd that SK would not have said anything to his family -- though if indepencence is the issue, that's at least understandable.

Kinda. I can see being one month behind on rent..but doesn't that make you want to work harder (and even take a second job?) to catch up to the responsibilities that independence requires?

Plenty of jobs were available in that area.
Why were a stack of job apps left behind in his apartment? Was that for show, or what?

Something was going. Or not at all.
 
  • #239
I think I saw in the threads that landlord contacted Steven's father as emergency contact. But not being able to be reached (SK's cell phone could be reached), two guys both not paying rent or utilities (and they didn't even like each other), and then the one leaving, the landlord claiming utilities in his name will be shut off, that's all very odd.

Maybe without rent mortgage couldn't be paid and place was going into foreclosure, in which case didn't matter if utiilities got turned off. Don't know. But concerning SK's aspect of it, laytonian's "downward spiral" about sums it up.

rd
 
  • #240
They didn't find Steven's keys in the car, right?

This is a question I have posed also. I don't remember anything being reported about his keys. I'll have to go back and search, because I can faintly remember a conversation questioning if the family had a set of keys.

On the side, is it possible Steven placed an ad seeking employment or for genealogical searches?


ETA: Ok, here is info on the keys and credit card:

Q: How did he start the car (ie, did he have a key to it, or was it unlocked with hidden key, or what?)
A: I think Steven's dad has a key to the car or they found the spare in Steven's
room.***** The car was locked when they found it.

Q: What kind of mail has Steven received, since he disappeared?
Q: Any bills?
A: IDK He did have some automatic payments that kept going this month, but those have been investigated.
Q: Any credit card statements?
A: His credit card was one of the auto payments

***They did not go to Steven's room until after the trip to Henderson. This really does not answer the question if the keys were left in the car or not...
 
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