NV NV - Steven T. Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - # 8

[laytonian]

Couldn't we find out if Steven was locked out? IIRC, the neighbor saw him go in and come out, what, 20 minutes later?

Good point about the Christmas presents.

Would the property owner admit to a grieving family, that he'd done such a thing. Or he may have, which accounts for the "guilt" previously mentioned.

 

[laytonian]

I think if Steve had been locked out of his room, the landlady would have told us that. She has posted several times and seemed to like him. Plus, it hadn't been long since her husband had talked to Steve's father - I would think they would wait a while and see if that brought any results.

Maybe "locked out" would be part of the evidence in the case. She used to post, but I think she got (rightly) gunshy because these kinds of things reveal everyone's lives, not just the missing person's.

 

[Fairy1]

Would the property owner admit to a grieving family, that he'd done such a thing. Or he may have, which accounts for the "guilt" previously mentioned.

I doubt it. And the "landlady" hasn't been around here for quite some time now.

 

[sbakker]

I do not know if I trust the neighbor-the one that saw him leave.

 

[Fairy1]

I do not know if I trust the neighbor-the one that saw him leave.

Me neither. Or any of the other key players in this story.

 

[Fairy1]

Other than the receipts, nearly everything we "know" about Steven has been provided by others. Other's descriptions of conversations, other's speculation about Steven's character, other's speculation about his lifestyle in St. George, etc.

Just because someone tells us something doesn't mean it's true. I could tell you I'm the queen of England here on an anomynous Internet board - and who's to say it's not true?

 

[laytonian]

Other than the receipts, nearly everything we "know" about Steven has been provided by others. Other's descriptions of conversations, other's speculation about Steven's character, other's speculation about his lifestyle in St. George, etc.

Just because someone tells us something doesn't mean it's true. I could tell you I'm the queen of England here on an anomynous Internet board - and who's to say it's not true?

Very true...but if you think about it, we also have *more* information than most cases, because we've had some family input. Just think what could be done with the Susan Powell case, if we knew what/when purchases had been made Dec 6th-9th!

Another thing we have to remember: when people with even the most tenuous connection to a cse make public statements, that exposes them to scrutiny, locks them in to their story, and/or leaves them vulnerable to legal challenge.

I can understand why people hold back, because for every question they answer, we come up with ten more.

 

[wannab1]

I think we're agreeing: there's no logical reason for Steven to have even been in Vegas, Henderson, or SCA.

But his car was found there. Mystery person hiding their own tracks, after some conflict?

There's value in re-jammin' the same thoughts over and over

Since we are doing a bit of re-hashing...! We often talk about what is logical and we think logically! I'm not so sure that Steven was always being logical or thinking logically. In the beginning it was often talked about him possibly looking for work in the Las Vegas area or possibly having an interview, dropping off a resume, etc. That seems logical. IMO, I have never thought he was in Nevada for that reason. It seems like someone that was 3 months behind in his rent and had a part-time, low paying job would make job hunting a priority. I'm not sure I believe it was a priority for Steven. I think he could have had a "better" job in St. George than he did. Maybe not the perfect job, but a better paying job with regular hours that would make paying the rent possible. So, I have tried to think what he really may have gone to Las Vegas for that day, and not necessarily thinking logically...if his conversation with GW is accurate and he was willing to drive back to St. George for church, it makes me think he really may have been on another one of his joy rides. What did he do for the couple of hours after he talked to GW? I have NO idea...but maybe the reason he didn't have a better job and wasn't really pursing a full time job was because he liked the freedom to just drive around! I feel that he maybe struggled with the structure and obligations of a real job.

 

[Fairy1]

Very true...but if you think about it, we also have *more* information than most cases, because we've had some family input. Just think what could be done with the Susan Powell case, if we knew what/when purchases had been made Dec 6th-9th!

Another thing we have to remember: when people with even the most tenuous connection to a cse make public statements, that exposes them to scrutiny, locks them in to their story, and/or leaves them vulnerable to legal challenge.

I can understand why people hold back, because for every question they answer, we come up with ten more.

Yes - but let's consider that ALL of the "insiders" that have posted here haven't been around for awhile. Naegle, bigtexastom, gsmith and stilLooking. Gone - all of them. Just like Steven. Someone they all claimed to care about. Don't you wonder WHY?

 

[ThePhantom]

Yes, I wonder why -- but, what do you think is the reason they are no longer commenting?

 

[hollyblue]

Other than the receipts, nearly everything we "know" about Steven has been provided by others. Other's descriptions of conversations, other's speculation about Steven's character, other's speculation about his lifestyle in St. George, etc.

Just because someone tells us something doesn't mean it's true. I could tell you I'm the queen of England here on an anomynous Internet board - and who's to say it's not true?

LE has stated they can find no foul play--nor do we have a body from suicide--and he wouldn't have gone that far with no transportation..unless someone drove him there, which I don't think happened. So to me, the only conclusion is he had a plan to go on his own and doesn't want to be found. Do other people know of it---of course; I don't think he could carry it out on his own. ETA: I really think if something "terrible" happened, there would be more response..from people who knew him. I think we here have come to care also, so if freinds thought he had come into something/somebody that could maybe cause him harm...I think they would, no doubt, step up to the plate.

But I think Your Majesty is on the right track of questioning everything we have been told by everybody. JMO

 

[Fairy1]

LE has stated they can find no foul play--nor do we have a body from suicide--and he wouldn't have gone that far with no transportation..unless someone drove him there, which I don't think happened. So to me, the only conclusion is he had a plan to go on his own and doesn't want to be found. Do other people know of it---of course; I don't think he could carry it out on his own.

But I think Your Majesty is on the right track of questioning everything we have been told by everybody. JMO

BBM

Well, I do. Not out of meanness or spite. But because he didn't really have much to tether him to his life in St. George. No wife, no children, no close friends, no money in the bank, no bajillions of credit cards or a mortgage. It would be very easy for someone like Steven to walk away. IMO.

And it's easy for people to live "off the grid" in this day and age, under such circumstances.

 

[pudd]

And it's easy for people to live "off the grid" in this day and age, under such circumstances.

Yes, remember the Haylee Donovan case from last year, where they were found living at a farm in CA where it took about a week for someone to realize who they were?

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2009/jun/25/fugitives-found-welcoming/?metro&zIndex=122348

 

[hollyblue]

BBM

Well, I do. Not out of meanness or spite. But because he didn't really have much to tether him to his life in St. George. No wife, no children, no close friends, no money in the bank, no bajillions of credit cards or a mortgage. It would be very easy for someone like Steven to walk away. IMO.

And it's easy for people to live "off the grid" in this day and age, under such circumstances.

Might be Fairy. That's why I brought up the thought of the volleyball league. He had played two years in a row. They look like they really had a fun time and it would have been full of social get togethers, gatherings....etc. They could travel all over and play. I notice Mesquite was mentioned on the website. But I don't know if Steven was involved in this after his move. The VB season would have started shortly right after he had moved. We have asked before, what he did with his time socially, between April and December, but never heard a thing.

 

[webrocket]

Yes, I wonder why -- but, what do you think is the reason they are no longer commenting?

They are not commenting as they are more concerned with appearances than with reality. They would rather believe he was the victim of foul play than the alternative. Keep in mind they never did reveal what was on his computer hard drive other than issuing a self serving statement that the hard drive did "not reveal why he was in Henderson that day".

I was clear to me from day one he walked out on his former so-called life. No job, no wife, no children, behind on his rent, living in a closed LDS society where he played the role of a zealot (god said the girl was not right for me), etc. That is a perfect facade for explaining why the guy was not married and some of his former cohorts might actually have believed that fiction. The real reasons he was not married was because he had NOTHING to offer a prospective wife. The guy could not hold down a job. Not exactly husband material folks.

These people he used to associate with closed rank when Steven disappeared and almost none express any concern for Steven. Not exactly the type of people I would want to call friends. Maybe Steven had an epiphany of a sort and realized that he could not be who he wanted to be and have these people in my life.

It is beyond frustrating that we have had countless entries on these threads by ordinary citizens expressing concern for Steven yet those closest to him either don't get involved, sign on but share no information, or just vanish when they get some LDS pressure to clam up.

I really hope Steven is happy with whomever he has chosen to spend his life with. A stranger on the internet is likely to provide him more happiness than the uncaring stone cold crowd he left behind in St. George.

 

[hollyblue]

They are not commenting as they are more concerned with appearances than with reality. They would rather believe he was the victim of foul play than the alternative. Keep in mind they never did reveal what was on his computer hard drive other than issuing a self serving statement that the hard drive did "not reveal why he was in Henderson that day".

I was clear to me from day one he walked out on his former so-called life. No job, no wife, no children, behind on his rent, living in a closed LDS society where he played the role of a zealot (god said the girl was not right for me), etc. That is a perfect facade for explaining why the guy was not married and some of his former cohorts might actually have believed that fiction. The real reasons he was not married was because he had NOTHING to offer a prospective wife. The guy could not hold down a job. Not exactly husband material folks.

These people he used to associate with closed rank when Steven disappeared and almost none express any concern for Steven. Not exactly the type of people I would want to call friends. Maybe Steven had an epiphany of a sort and realized that he could not be who he wanted to be and have these people in my life.

It is beyond frustrating that we have had countless entries on these threads by ordinary citizens expressing concern for Steven yet those closest to him either don't get involved, sign on but share no information, or just vanish when they get some LDS pressure to clam up.

I really hope Steven is happy with whomever he has chosen to spend his life with. A stranger on the internet is likely to provide him more happiness than the uncaring stone cold crowd he left behind in St. George.

What a fabulous, touching, and truthful post webrocket. I got tears......TY.

 

[MBLover]

I know not every one is interested...but for those of you that are... Leomoon has completed a chart for Steven

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Forensic Astrology - CASE BRIEFINGS only

 

[sbakker]

They are not commenting as they are more concerned with appearances than with reality. They would rather believe he was the victim of foul play than the alternative. Keep in mind they never did reveal what was on his computer hard drive other than issuing a self serving statement that the hard drive did "not reveal why he was in Henderson that day".

I was clear to me from day one he walked out on his former so-called life. No job, no wife, no children, behind on his rent, living in a closed LDS society where he played the role of a zealot (god said the girl was not right for me), etc. That is a perfect facade for explaining why the guy was not married and some of his former cohorts might actually have believed that fiction. The real reasons he was not married was because he had NOTHING to offer a prospective wife. The guy could not hold down a job. Not exactly husband material folks.

These people he used to associate with closed rank when Steven disappeared and almost none express any concern for Steven. Not exactly the type of people I would want to call friends. Maybe Steven had an epiphany of a sort and realized that he could not be who he wanted to be and have these people in my life.

It is beyond frustrating that we have had countless entries on these threads by ordinary citizens expressing concern for Steven yet those closest to him either don't get involved, sign on but share no information, or just vanish when they get some LDS pressure to clam up.

I really hope Steven is happy with whomever he has chosen to spend his life with. A stranger on the internet is likely to provide him more happiness than the uncaring stone cold crowd he left behind in St. George.

This post you made is very powerful. The words and thoughts were very meaningful. So many things you said, I feel. I wish you would post this on Steven's FB page. It is real food for thought.

 

[laytonian]

Yes - but let's consider that ALL of the "insiders" that have posted here haven't been around for awhile. Naegle, bigtexastom, gsmith and stilLooking. Gone - all of them. Just like Steven. Someone they all claimed to care about. Don't you wonder WHY?

In their culture, being "here" might mean just the opposite of caring.

 

[laytonian]

BBM

Well, I do. Not out of meanness or spite. But because he didn't really have much to tether him to his life in St. George. No wife, no children, no close friends, no money in the bank, no bajillions of credit cards or a mortgage. It would be very easy for someone like Steven to walk away. IMO.

And it's easy for people to live "off the grid" in this day and age, under such circumstances.

True. Remember, I alluded to something like that yesterday.

If I were a true conservative surrounded by worldly people, would I look for more worldly people or a place where people like me could be "true patriots"?