GUILTY NV - Tammy Meyers, 44, fatally shot at her Las Vegas home, 12 Feb 2015 - #4

[jayme1133]

This is primarily why I keep going back to the theory that TM wasn't even in the car that night. I don't think she was that kind of person. I don't think she would have done that. I just can't go along with the crowd that throws TM under the bus after she's no longer here to defend herself.

I raised 4 very popular daughters, and there were many "cool" parents. Matter of fact they "partied" w/ the kids, purchased alcohol and allowed pot etc. The kids migrated to these homes (obvious why).

I'm not insinuating TM was one of these. But, I don't believe there was a road rage confrontation that night. Curious why was Defense wanted a residue test (was Tammy armed?). Maybe EN told his attorneys what really happened.
And, at this point...100% believe it was a drug deal gone bad! Someone (daughter or son) went with TM to confront EN about drugs (my opinion).

If the Meyers family allowed the 15 yr old to lie about the sketch to throw investigators off, shame on them!!!

I do have compassion for the Meyers and their loss. I also find it sad they continued to lie during this investigation of a loved one. I'm curious if there was a life insurance policy on TM?

 

[jayme1133]

I also have trouble believing TM acted in the way she is being betrayed. Could EN have been hired to kill her. Justing thinking of other possibilities.

OKAY!!! Don't get me started, lol!!! I have thought about this too....But, was the entire family involved?? That is why I cancel that thinking. Has RM been confirmed at a "market" in Carlsbed, Ca?

 

[Hiandmighty]

I also have trouble believing TM acted in the way she is being betrayed. Could EN have been hired to kill her. Justing thinking of other possibilities.

At this point, I think anything is still posible.

 

[sonjay]

I raised 4 very popular daughters, and there were many "cool" parents. Matter of fact they "partied" w/ the kids, purchased alcohol and allowed pot etc. The kids migrated to these homes (obvious why).

I'm not insinuating TM was one of these. But, I don't believe there was a road rage confrontation that night. Curious why was Defense wanted a residue test (was Tammy armed?). Maybe EN told his attorneys what really happened.
And, at this point...100% believe it was a drug deal gone bad! Someone (daughter or son) went with TM to confront EN about drugs (my opinion).

If the Meyers family allowed the 15 yr old to lie about the sketch to throw investigators off, shame on them!!!

I do have compassion for the Meyers and their loss. I also find it sad they continued to lie during this investigation of a loved one. I'm curious if there was a life insurance policy on TM?

BBM. According to Brandon, she told him she was going back out to hunt for EN with or without him. She wanted Brandon to come with her and bring his gun, but she was going whether he went or not. That suggests, to me, that she might well have been armed herself. At any rate, it certainly gives the defense room to claim that she may have been armed.

 

[jjenny]

BBM. According to Brandon, she told him she was going back out to hunt for EN with or without him. She wanted Brandon to come with her and bring his gun, but she was going whether he went or not. That suggests, to me, that she might well have been armed herself. At any rate, it certainly gives the defense room to claim that she may have been armed.

If she were armed, where is the gun? Where are the bullets? Only two types of bullets were found at both scenes. Most from .45 caliber gun (most bullets) and 3 bullets from 9 mm gun which was Brandon's.

 

[Miss Muffet]

Whoa! The next to last paragraph of this article, from RM's interview with N. Grace:

"How do we know my son didn't fire first? It doesn't matter. They were at our home!"

That suggests to me that there's a possibility that Brandon did fire first in the cul de sac. It sounds like RM is planting the seeds for justifying that in case it comes out somehow.

It doesn't matter whether Brandon fired first? Well, maybe it does and maybe it doesn't. But it would sure be nice to know the truth.

That's an excellent find you have there!

I raised 4 very popular daughters, and there were many "cool" parents. Matter of fact they "partied" w/ the kids, purchased alcohol and allowed pot etc. The kids migrated to these homes (obvious why).

I've seen my share of that type of "cool" parents too. Of course their children view them as loving and wonderful: They get to do whatever they want.

Then there are some kids who despise their parents. One young man I know said his mother was a crack addict throughout his entire life. He's a very responsible, hardworking father of two beautiful children who intends to never be that type of parent.

Bottom line is this type of parent do exist in society. There are many cases of parents committing crimes in the presence of their children, putting their children at risk, etc. We have no idea if Tammy was like this or not because very little has been reported about her life prior to death. I do recall her daughter did say she was a cool parent.

I'm curious if there was a life insurance policy on TM?

"Barbara" said there was a small insurance policy. Who knows though. Perhaps it was big enough to pay off debts or something.

 

[jayme1133]

If she were armed, where is the gun? Where are the bullets. Only two types of bullets were found at both scenes. Most from .45 caliber gun (most bullets) and 3 bullets from 9 mm gun which was Brandon's.

TRUE!!! But, if no residue test was done on Brandon or TM. It could be just another lie!

 

[Miss Muffet]

BBM. According to Brandon, she told him she was going back out to hunt for EN with or without him. She wanted Brandon to come with her and bring his gun, but she was going whether he went or not. That suggests, to me, that she might well have been armed herself. At any rate, it certainly gives the defense room to claim that she may have been armed.

That's a very good point! That is something someone would say while they were holding a weapon themselves.

The possibility of TM having a handgun is why I wondered if LE has compared the 45 caliber bullets to make sure they all were fired by the same handgun.

 

[Miss Muffet]

If she were armed, where is the gun? Where are the bullets? Only two types of bullets were found at both scenes. Most from .45 caliber gun (most bullets) and 3 bullets from 9 mm gun which was Brandon's.

Her handgun could have been a .45 too. Her family could have disappeared her gun before police arrived.

 

[jayme1133]

"Barbara" said there was a small insurance policy. Who knows though. Perhaps it was big enough to pay off debts or something.

We can't deny the judgment of $25,000 on 1/5/2015 either. I just can't wrap my head around the entire family being part of a cover up. Is this even possible?

The Cool parents forget their kids grow up someday and resent the parents, some do anyway

 

[Miss Muffet]

I just can't wrap my head around the entire family being part of a cover up. Is this even possible?

I don't think so. I think we can rule out the hired kill for insurance policy theory. There's no way the entire family conspired to collect a small insurance policy on their mother. The only conspiring I can imagine is to cover up what happened so a family secret doesn't come out---such as the reports about drugs.

 

[PaperDoll]

Oh, yeah, definitely could be mitigating factors for sentencing.

If the Meyers' story is true that TM took Brandon and his gun and went out hunting for EN, I think that would also be a mitigating factors. Because once the original encounter was over, it was over, and for the second encounter, TM and BM were the instigators.

But TM and BM were not the ones who fired the shots per EN's police statement. Even if TM and BM went out with a loaded gun looking for the Audi, doesn't mean they actually used the gun, maybe they carried it "just in case". When the Buick (with TM and BM driving) found the Audi, that is when the chase took place. The Audi spotted the Buick, took off with the Buick in pursuit. Then the Audi spun around and took shots at the Buick, the Buick then headed home and the Audi pursued and shots were once again fired while BM and TM were at their own house. The only shots that were recorded in the police statement that came from BM's gun was when he said he fired after EN took the first shots, IIRC ..

 

[Miss Muffet]

But TM and BM were not the ones who fired the shots per EN's police statement.

EN didn't make a statement to police. His friend did. The friend did not say that EN said no shots were fired at him. The friend said EN didn't say anything about shots being fired at him. There's difference between those two things. Either shots weren't fired at EN, EN didn't mention shots fired at him or his friend doesn't remember EN saying it. We can't know which because the police statement doesn't have a definitive answer to that question.

The only shots that were recorded in the police statement that came from BM's gun was when he said he fired after EN took the first shots, IIRC ..

If TM had a .45, some of the .45 bullets could have come from her handgun. That's why I hope the police compared the .45 bullets. It's doubtful though since we already know the LE didn't do GPR test to consider other possibilities. It seems LE only did tests to confirm their theory and nothing else. But perhaps EN's lawyers will have someone compare the bullets.

 

[PaperDoll]

EN didn't make a statement to police. His friend did. The friend did not say that EN said no shots were fired at him. The friend said EN didn't not say anything about shots being fired at him. There's difference between those two things. Either shots weren't fired at EN, EN didn't mention shots fired at him or is friend doesn't remember EN saying it. We can't know which because the police statement doesn't have a definitive answer to that question.


If TM had a .45, some of the .45 bullets could have come from her handgun. That's why I hope the police compared the .45 bullets. It's doubtful though since we already know the LE didn't do GPS to consider other possibilities. It seems LE only did tests to confirm their theory and nothing else. But perhaps EN's lawyers will have someone compare the bullets.

LOL, maybe I'm reading the police report wrong :blushing:, I understand EN didn't make the report but "Nowsch told Krisztian no one fired shots at him". EN said someone in the Buick was "waving a gun at him" but EN or someone else in the Audi were firing the shots.

 

[kaen]

Whoa! The next to last paragraph of this article, from RM's interview with N. Grace:

"How do we know my son didn't fire first? It doesn't matter. They were at our home!"

I find this quote very interesting. I do think that EN had to know the car even if the driver did not. TM and BM going back out to find the car seems like they might have been trying to get the Audi to follow them home so any confrontation appears to be an attack on them at home. Then, if something happened to the people in the Audi, the situation is automatically self-defense. I find the more important question to be, why were they at your home? What purpose did it serve to engage and possibly have them come to your home?

I am not a victim blamer by any means. In this case, I struggle with how to not think that there is some blame for the Meyer's family. Scary interaction on the road and you evade it. You are at home-- safe and sound. You leave a safe place (where if you were concerned about the thugs you encountered you call the police) and look for them to engage. You get into another skirmish and go back to your home with knowledge that they probably know who you are (based on Meyer's accounts that they were mother and daughter threatened). Seems like you want them on your property.

I look forward to hearing the trial evidence of the conversation between TM an BM as they leave the house and go into the neighborhood. What was her state of mind in going back out into the night? What was he saying to her? And, when did they make the decision to go home?

We have a sense of EN's perspective. He told other's he was being chased. Clearly, he thought he was in danger. Was he in danger from TM and BM? I don't know.

How could someone who seemed like a rational being-- described as a good mom, caring person, and seemingly grounded--make the decision to go out and look for these people?

 

[Miss Muffet]

LOL, maybe I'm reading the police report wrong :blushing:, I understand EN didn't make the report but "Nowsch told Krisztian no one fired shots at him". EN said someone in the Buick was "waving a gun at him" but EN or someone else in the Audi were firing the shots.

I was talking about the male friend's statement:

"Altergott said Nowich never told him the people in the green car shot at him."

These two witnesses' statements conflict each other on this point. Since they were both present at the time Nowich told his story, he didn't tell one person one thing and another person another thing.

 

[sonjay]

LOL, maybe I'm reading the police report wrong :blushing:, I understand EN didn't make the report but "Nowsch told Krisztian no one fired shots at him". EN said someone in the Buick was "waving a gun at him" but EN or someone else in the Audi were firing the shots.

That's when EN reportedly told Krisztian. But in the same affidavit, "Altergott said Nowsch never told him the people in the green car ever shot at him."

The warrant affidavit makes it sound as if EN's conversation with Altergott & Krisztian was one conversation with all 3 of them together. If so, then one of them is either misremembering that conversation or lying. Or maybe Altergott left the room (bathroom? get another beer?), and while he was out of the room, EN told K no one had shot at him.

Either way, that same affidavit says that Brandon says that he fired at EN in the cul de sac, and that police found 9mm casings in the cul de sac.

Both can't be true. Either Brandon fired, or Brandon didn't fire. I tend to believe that Brandon fired. Not only does that correlate with the fired 9mm casings found by police, but it's actually one of the very very few statements by the Meyerses that hasn't changed at all. (Although in early reports they said Brandon was firing a shotgun, but they have consistently reported that he fired.)

So IF EN told one or both of his friends that no one shot at him, he was either mistaken or lying. Or Krisztian might be mistaken or lying about EN telling her that.

 

[kaen]

Her handgun could have been a .45 too. Her family could have disappeared her gun before police arrived.

The only way that I think her family could have tampered with the scene before LE/EMT arrival is if they had the whole situation planned beforehand. (i don't think they did.) It does not appear that TM or BM had been involved with shootings before so how could a child be looking at his mother--dying or dead--- and make a plan that hides a gun, constructs a story, or anything else. I have been third on the scene of a fatal accident. The situation is almost surreal. The horror of dead bodies with a compulsion to move toward yet also move far away to get the visual out of your head is strong. I am familiar with this scene and do not think I could do it. I don't see her children as being able to witness their mother with head gunshot wound and begin to execute a plan.

 

[sonjay]

But TM and BM were not the ones who fired the shots per EN's police statement. Even if TM and BM went out with a loaded gun looking for the Audi, doesn't mean they actually used the gun, maybe they carried it "just in case".

When you take a gun and go looking for someone that you just had a confrontation with, you are instigating the second confrontation. If the Meyers' story is true, then TM & BM did instigate the second confrontation. Whether or not either of them shot at EN is immaterial to that fact. They did instigate the second confrontation.

That is, if you believe there was a second confrontation. I do not. I think that whoever was in the Meyers car for the initial encounter near the school was in the car for the entire thing. I don't think the Meyers car ever went home to drop off one person and pick up another.

 

[sonjay]

The only way that I think her family could have tampered with the scene before LE/EMT arrival is if they had the whole situation planned beforehand. (i don't think they did.) It does not appear that TM or BM had been involved with shootings before so how could a child be looking at his mother--dying or dead--- and make a plan that hides a gun, constructs a story, or anything else. I have been third on the scene of a fatal accident. The situation is almost surreal. The horror of dead bodies with a compulsion to move toward yet also move far away to get the visual out of your head is strong. I am familiar with this scene and do not think I could do it. I don't see her children as being able to witness their mother with head gunshot wound and begin to execute a plan.

BBM. Nah. It doesn't take a criminal mastermind to say to oneself, "Mom having this gun will make her look bad. I'd better run into the house and hide it before the cops get here."

People do all sort of crazy things when they think they might get in trouble with the law. They hide weapons. They make up stories to tell LE. They hide or dispose of evidence.

I would bet almost any amount of money that the time from the shooting to the time the first cops arrived on scene allowed plenty of time for BM or KM to run inside and stuff mom's gun under a sofa cushion. Or put it in granny's drawer. Or stick it under the seat of the family's truck.

Also, keep this in mind: we have not yet seen the police report of all the evidence found at the scene. We've only seen the arrest affidavit, in which they included only enough info to justify arresting EN. The complete list of all evidence found at the scene might well include a gun other than Brandon's found on or near mom, or in her purse or in the car.