NY NY - Leslie, 29, Julie, 6, & Timothy Guthrie, 3, drove away from home, Katonah, 6 Feb 1977

[Skigirl]

I found what appears to be a submerged item in a little pond off the 684 exit near Katonah. I can't tell what it is exactly, it appears square, but it could be nothing.
If this body of water was flooded back in the day to make a water reservoir, it's not unheard of for old houses and buildings to be underwater, so it could be that. My state has a submerged town from water management/conservation. Here are some pictures from Google Earth.
I can't tell how big it is from the map perspective.
View attachment 263167 View attachment 263168

I pointed this one out a number of years ago and it turned out to not be the car. I grew up in the area and used to figure skate at a rink very close to that ramp. We took that route every single morning for many years on my way to and from practice. The idea that the car flew off of it and into the water isn't far-fetched. It was very icy sometimes.

Also, someone asked if the IBM headquarters was in that location in 1977 and I can confirm that it was in that location in Armonk near the Greenwich line. The campus shared a border with the American Can campus and had been there for some time before 1977. Many of the parents in my town worked there.

I have always been convinced that they went into a body of water. Maybe the Kensico Reservoir or maybe the little body of water near her sister's house. There's a lot of water in the area.

Even before global warming, the lakes rarely froze enough to bear the weight of a car, though I could see a scenario in which the ice near the bank was thick enough to support a car temporarily while it skidded out a ways and finally hit thinner ice and fell through. So if the car is in a body of water, it may be a little further out than it would be if the car went into the water in the summertime.

 

[Alleykins]

@Skigirl Thank you for the insight. If it wasn't a vehicle, do you know what it turned out to be?

 

[Skigirl]

@Skigirl Thank you for the insight. If it wasn't a vehicle, do you know what it turned out to be?

I think it was just an optical illusion/artifact on the satellite image. I think someday someone will encounter the car by accident

 

[VaYank5150]

Update. I received an email from Jared with Adventures with Purpose and they will be onsite to search the first week of October!

 

[Alleykins]

Update. I received an email from Jared with Adventures with Purpose and they will be onsite to search the first week of October!

Thank you for the update.

 

[VaYank5150]

I am sad to report that AWP did manage to do some diving around Katonah, but nothing of substance was discovered.

 

[Alleykins]

Thank you for the update.

 

[Skigirl]

The second place I'd look for a car that was heading from Katonah to White Plains is the Kensico Reservoir. Depending on where you are going in White Plains, it would be convenient to get off of I-684 at Armonk and take Route-22, which takes you on a road that wends around the reservoir.

 

[DD Byrd]

If she indeed wanted to stay off 684, and came from below via King Street she would have had to to have taken a left on 22 to get to IBM. As I mentioned before, the water comes very close to King Street in certain places, but if she did take the left and slid there is another body of water there as well. The wired guard rail, and trees, weren't there then. 41.111306, -73.729399 on Google Maps

 

[Skigirl]

I think I missed something. Was she going to IBM? I thought she was going to her mother's in White Plains, but this is all from memory.

I lived off of King Street/Rt. 120. To your point, the way my mom would have gone (since I was too young to drive when I skated at Harvey) from Katonah to IBM, left to her own devices back then, probably would have been 684 (briefly) -> Saw Mill River Parkway -> Chappaqua, and then to King Street/Rt. 120.

Back then, people tended to have favorite routes because they didn't have GPS to reveal what was optimal, and coming from Katonah, the Saw Mill was always our go-to. I don't know if that was the same for her, but the Saw Mill would probably have been more familiar than 684, since 684 was still pretty new.

 

[DD Byrd]

Exactly. I'm not sure where IBM came up, but I thought she was going to pick up her Mom there? I agree with King Street to 22 for either the Armonk IBM or south to White Plains. And at the time would have been less traveled, even less in winter weather.

 

[Skigirl]

Is it 100% confirmed that they were heading to IBM to pick up her mom?

I spent a little time over the weekend thinking and reading more about this case. First of all... I looked for her mom's address, and I found one in West Harrison (I do not know if that's where she was living at the time, but it would make sense since where she was living was described as an apartment, and the address I found was in an apartment complex; it would be a very easy commute to IBM and it's near the White Plains border), which changes my thinking about the route they might have taken.

For those of you who aren't from the area, the way people refer to towns is very confusing. Katonah is not a town, it's a village/hamlet in the town of Bedford. Chappaqua and Armonk are also not towns, they are villages (or hamlets) in the towns of New Castle and North Castle, respectively. Harrison is its own town/village, but it's right next door to White Plains, which is the closest thing to a "city" in Westchester County. Elmsford is a village in the Town of Greenburg (along with Ardsley, Hastings, Tarrytown, Dobbs Ferry, and several others).

Psychologically, people usually consider themselves residents of their village and sometimes don't even know what town they live in. And they refer to their village as a "town". I'm originally from Chappaqua and I literally never say "I am from New Castle" nor do I really consider New Castle a real "thing" except as a legal entity (in fact, I just googled it to confirm what other villages are in New Castle and I was today years old when I learned that parts of Ossining are in it).

The closest airport is referred to as "White Plains" by the airlines, but people always call it "Westchester County Airport" (that may be changing as people move in) and psychologically, it is definitely not in White Plains, it's in... Purchase, maybe? Or just "the County."

All this is to say that that's probably why it was said that she was "going to White Plains" when she could have either been going to IBM (technically in Armonk/North Castle) or to her mother's (maybe in West Harrison).

The only reason I'm giving all of this background is that it might add some driving routes to consider. If she was going from 7 Grandview Ave in Katonah to her mother's apartment in West Harrison, located (I think) at 189 Columbus Ave, she might have gone some routes that I hadn't considered before. For example, one of them would take her to the spot pictured here, which is a bridge over the Cross River, on Rt. 35.

 

[VaYank5150]

This is a post I had earlier in this thread.

Wow. I just had a very pleasant conversation with Detective Haynes of the Bedford Police Department. I kept apologizing if I was wasting his time, but he kept responding "No. We will take anything we can get our hands on for help on this."
Detective Haynes stated he has been assigned this case for 12 years now. He initially agreed with the original police assumption that there was no way Leslie's Maverick could have crashed through the ice, but has since changed his mind and now feels that her car probably IS in a body of water.

Unfortunately, there is no known route of travel for Leslie on the day she and her children disappeared. However, like me he thinks it unlikely that she used I-684 as had she had an accident in the middle of the day, it is unlikely that no one saw it happen, or leave evidence on the newly constructed interstate. He admitted that she was supposed to pick up her Mother from IBM in Armonk that day, and did not arrive. Detective Haynes also mentioned that she had relatives in Ohio, who she may have attempted to visit, but there is no way to confirm this.

Detective Haynes stated that they have used drones, sonar, divers, boats, etc. to search many of the bodies of water between Katonah and White Plains to no avail. He actually mentioned the photo that is seen in this thread and how they acted on it only to find no car.

I was pleasantly surprised by Detective Haynes' willingness to discuss all of this with me, and while I did not find out any additional information that can help us put this case to rest, I will continue my efforts.

 

[VaYank5150]

I have reached back out to Jared with AWP to see if I can figure out specifically where they did sonar searches this past year. If nothing else, this may help us minimally eliminate some bodies of water.

 

[VaYank5150]

Jared from AWP responded that while their initial search was unsuccessful, they are working with Leslie's sister Stephanie Puckhaber, and plan a return trip. Also, Jared stated they would be posting videos of their search on their website and YouTube channel in the near future.

 

[Alleykins]

@VaYank5150
When the detective said Leslie was supposed to pick up her mother, was that the same day she picked up the kids, or the day she planned to drop them off?

 

[VaYank5150]

@VaYank5150
When the detective said Leslie was supposed to pick up her mother, was that the same day she picked up the kids, or the day she planned to drop them off?

Based on my recollection, Leslie and the kids were living with her Mother at the time. Leslie picked up her kids and then was headed to IBM to pick up her Mother, but never arrived.

 

[Alleykins]

Based on my recollection, Leslie and the kids were living with her Mother at the time. Leslie picked up her kids and then was headed to IBM to pick up her Mother, but never arrived.

From what I've read, it sounded like Leslie was living with her mother, but the children were living with their father, as she was picking them up in Katonah for a one day visit and was to return them the next day. That's my understanding, based on articles posted here. So what you're saying is she was supposed to pick up her mother at work after picking up the kids from their dad's, not picking her up the next day after dropping them back off? Is that correct?

 

[VaYank5150]

From what I've read, it sounded like Leslie was living with her mother, but the children were living with their father, as she was picking them up in Katonah for a one day visit and was to return them the next day. That's my understanding, based on articles posted here. So what you're saying is she was supposed to pick up her mother at work after picking up the kids from their dad's, not picking her up the next day after dropping them back off? Is that correct?

Based on what I have read and my recollections of the phone conversation with the detective, yes that is my understanding.
Also....just got notice of this post on the Charley Project website:

"I grew up in Cross River. I had a friend from high school who lived in Yorktown and sometimes went to a bar in Cross River. He went missing one night in the winter. He was missing for many months until they found him in his car submerged in one of the bodies of water along Rt 35 ( a very curvy road) Evidently he was headed home and went off the road into the water. Cold enough to freeze over and hid the car until spring thaw. All this about the same time this family went missing."

 

[VaYank5150]

Ironic timing, but just saw this.

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