OH - Ma’Khia Bryant, 16, fatally shot multiple times by Columbus police officer, 20 April 2021

[Cappuccino]

<modsnip - quoted post was removed>
Shooting someone in the leg isn't a non lethal option either. The largest artery in the human body runs through the leg. I think people got the idea that it wasn't life threatening to shoot in the leg from Terminator 2.

 

[Betty P]

-She had to be stopped
-Was his use of force, 4 shots, FOUR , justified if one could have stopped her, possibly without killing her?
-Had he any other methods at his disposal that were less lethal and equally effective at stopping her?
-Did this officer's special training provide him with additional skills that he could have used instead?
These are my questions about the shooting.

What about Ma'khia?
-What happened in her life that made her want to stab people?
-Had she ever displayed violence before and if so what was the outcome?
-Had any interventions taken place to save her , from herself and others.
-Was she a victim of bullying, because of her weight , circumstances or personality?

What happened on the day of the shooting? Where was she? Who was taking care of her- who was the responsible adult in her life on that day?
Lastly, I cannot tell from the videos whether she was in a blind uncontrolled rage or merely trying to impress whatever members of her family or peer group that were present at the time?
Was she so out of control that she didn't recognise the significance of the police being present, even though she may have called them herself?

These are the questions I'll be pondering.


She didn't attempt to stab the girl that was down. Why not?

All good questions.

One point - she did attempt to stab the first woman she knocked down. People viewing video on cell phones probably can't see it, but if you're viewing the video from the police officer's bodycam in slow motion on a larger screen (laptop or desk top computer), you can see her slash at the first victim with the knife.

This keeps popping up, so I guess I'll have to go search for that video and post a screen shot.

 

[Dawookie]

Shooting someone in the leg isn't a non lethal option either. The largest artery in the human body runs through the leg. I think people got the idea that it wasn't life threatening to shoot in the leg from Terminator 2.

There's that as well. Hit that femoral artery and its just as deadly as being shot center mass.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

"I think we need to let this investigation play out," DeWine said. "That’s what Mayor Ginther has said. I think, as governor, that’s what I would request — we need to let the investigation play out."

"One thing that I’ve learned in 74 years of life is that gathering the facts is the most important thing that there is. Sometimes, that takes longer than we like. We all want things instantly — I certainly do. But to gather the facts, get all the information, let an impartial body look at that, impartial people do the investigation. I have every confidence that that will be done in in this case. That’s what we all should wait for.”
Ohio governor urges patience, ‘wait for the facts’ in Columbus police shooting of Ma'Khia Bryant

 

[lynchmob67]

This wasn’t a petty crime. She was trying to commit murder. But why are we not also talking about the men who is bashing in that females head after she lands on the ground?

Hopefully charges are being filed against that coward. If I’m not mistaken, he’s the same one that was yelling “she’s just a child!”....

 

[tayaway]

There's a difference between being a trained marksman with a rifle and one with a pistol. There's also a difference in shooting at the range and having the added level of stress of being in a situation of having to use your weapon in a life or death situation.

The whole talk about shooting an arm or a leg is all Hollywood fiction. Even the guys who are among the most highly trained shooters in the world and could possibly do something like that, are taught to shoot center mass because it stops the threat. A perfect example of that is Bin Laden. DEVGRU operators spend countless hours and amounts of ammunition on the range training. Those guys would have the skills to disable someone and their shot choice was the head and chest because it stopped the threat of him shooting at them.

Yes, it's different, the point is, he's got decent weapons training, and hey, he wasn't 400 yards away, he was mere feet. The authorities are investigating whether he used excessive force (4 shots to the chest area as opposed to say 1?) to stop a female from stabbing another. I'm not sure about using the bin Laden example; as far as we know, unlike bin Laden, MB hadn't yet been responsible for murdering 1 person let alone thousands, and maybe Rob O'Neill felt some satisfaction in taking out the infamous terrorist. Unlike bin Laden, MB was not an enemy of the state. She also did not have lieutenants or rifles, she had a knife. It's not Hollywood to ask whether NR needed to kill her to stop her. Is NR's 'shot choice' to shoot to kill MB supposed to be how LE handle civvies who are a threat to themselves or others? Why aren't mass shooters like James E. Holmes or Ahmad al Aliwi al-Issa shot dead on site when they've killed people and are still active threats to others? eta: Why did LE only wound Aliwi in the leg, when he was killing random strangers?

 

[imstilla.grandma]

-She had to be stopped
-Was his use of force, 4 shots, FOUR , justified if one could have stopped her, possibly without killing her?
-Had he any other methods at his disposal that were less lethal and equally effective at stopping her?
-Did this officer's special training provide him with additional skills that he could have used instead?
These are my questions about the shooting.

What about Ma'khia?
-What happened in her life that made her want to stab people?
-Had she ever displayed violence before and if so what was the outcome?
-Had any interventions taken place to save her , from herself and others.
-Was she a victim of bullying, because of her weight , circumstances or personality?

What happened on the day of the shooting? Where was she? Who was taking care of her- who was the responsible adult in her life on that day?
Lastly, I cannot tell from the videos whether she was in a blind uncontrolled rage or merely trying to impress whatever members of her family or peer group that were present at the time?
Was she so out of control that she didn't recognise the significance of the police being present, even though she may have called them herself?

These are the questions I'll be pondering.


She didn't attempt to stab the girl that was down. Why not?

It’s interesting that you’re trying to get into her head. Your questions: Boom... yes, answers to any of your ?s increase our insight, perspective and vantage points of the players. We can’t forget the crowd though. This element is often ignored. They played a role too. I guess it’s kinda like a “group think”

 

[kittythehare]

All good questions.

One point - she did attempt to stab the first woman she knocked down. People viewing video on cell phones probably can't see it, but if you're viewing the video from the police officer's bodycam in slow motion on a larger screen (laptop or desk top computer), you can see her slash at the first victim with the knife.

This keeps popping up, so I guess I'll have to go search for that video and post a screen shot.

We simply must get the whole story.
She slashed 'at' her but didn't connect and suddenly turned her attention to the pink girl.
it's quite confusing, isn't it?

 

[Dawookie]

Yes, it's different, the point is, he's got decent weapons training, and hey, he wasn't 400 yards away, he was mere feet. The authorities are investigating whether he used excessive force (4 shots to the chest area as opposed to say 1?) to stop a female from stabbing another. I'm not sure about using the bin Laden example; as far as we know, unlike bin Laden, MB hadn't yet been responsible for murdering 1 person let alone thousands, and maybe Rob O'Neill felt some satisfaction in taking out the infamous terrorist. Unlike bin Laden, MB was not an enemy of the state. She also did not have lieutenants or rifles, she had a knife. It's not Hollywood to ask whether NR needed to kill her to stop her. Is NR's 'shot choice' to shoot to kill MB supposed to be how LE handle civvies who are a threat to themselves or others? Why aren't mass shooters like James E. Holmes or Ahmad al Aliwi al-Issa shot dead on site when they've killed people and are still shooting?

Being able to shoot a rifle at expert level is a different thing to compared to being able to shoot a pistol at expert level. Its two different skill sets. Even at mere feet, it's hard to hit a limb because they are moving targets. People will try and use his experience against him just like they did with the LAPD officer who was a competitive shooter.

He shot until the threat was stopped, plain and simple.

The Bin Laden example was used because those are among the highest trained shooters in the world with the skills to actually shoot and hit a limb in a situation like and they are trained to shoot center mass because it's a guarantee to stop the threat. Hitting a limb isn't a guarantee and as pointed out, a shot to the leg can be just as deadly.

Yes his shot choice is what he's trained to do because it stops the threat plain and simple.

Holmes wasn't still shooting, he was standing by his car watching LE and EMS response. Al-Issa got into a gun fight with officers and when shot in the leg, surrendered.

 

[Area52]

We simply must get the whole story.
She slashed 'at' her but didn't connect and suddenly turned her attention to the pink girl.
it's quite confusing, isn't it?

The fact that she didn't connect is a blessing for the first girl, who the gets her head bashed in by the punk seen kicking her in the head. The girl in pink is in a life threatening situation as it is obvious that KB wanted to stab someone. This officer saved a life, yet will be crucified in the press. Unfortunately, had KB killed the girl in pink, without any officers around, it would be buried on page 5 of the newspaper, and never even hit the 6 o'clock news! MOO

 

[Deleted member 39678]

After reading all of the posts on this thread I still believe that this is a justified shooting and the officer, while doing his duty, had no choice other than to shoot Ma'khia in order to protect the other girl from imminent great bodily harm or death. JMO

 

[tayaway]

Being able to shoot a rifle at expert level is a different thing to compared to being able to shoot a pistol at expert level. Its two different skill sets. Even at mere feet, it's hard to hit a limb because they are moving targets. People will try and use his experience against him just like they did with the LAPD officer who was a competitive shooter.

He shot until the threat was stopped, plain and simple.

The Bin Laden example was used because those are among the highest trained shooters in the world with the skills to actually shoot and hit a limb in a situation like and they are trained to shoot center mass because it's a guarantee to stop the threat. Hitting a limb isn't a guarantee and as pointed out, a shot to the leg can be just as deadly.

Yes his shot choice is what he's trained to do because it stops the threat plain and simple.

Holmes wasn't still shooting, he was standing by his car watching LE and EMS response. Al-Issa got into a gun fight with officers and when shot in the leg, surrendered.

Aliwi was actively shooting at LE, threatening them, and they only wounded him? Why?

Why not shoot 'center mass' once, instead of four times? The case is under criminal investigation. We are just spectators, who don't have all the info, so it's not plain and simple. <modsnip>

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Being able to shoot a rifle at expert level is a different thing to compared to being able to shoot a pistol at expert level. Its two different skill sets. Even at mere feet, it's hard to hit a limb because they are moving targets. People will try and use his experience against him just like they did with the LAPD officer who was a competitive shooter.

He shot until the threat was stopped, plain and simple.

The Bin Laden example was used because those are among the highest trained shooters in the world with the skills to actually shoot and hit a limb in a situation like and they are trained to shoot center mass because it's a guarantee to stop the threat. Hitting a limb isn't a guarantee and as pointed out, a shot to the leg can be just as deadly.

Yes his shot choice is what he's trained to do because it stops the threat plain and simple.

Holmes wasn't still shooting, he was standing by his car watching LE and EMS response. Al-Issa got into a gun fight with officers and when shot in the leg, surrendered.

A gunshot to the leg could have eventually caused the death of Ma'Khia and not stopped her from killing the innocent young woman.

It would have been a very poor choice of action for the officer. Ending up with two dead people instead of only the assailant. JMO

 

[SugarQueen]

While background information and life story may be interesting, I don’t think it changes anything. The reason MB was acting the way she was really has no bearing on the police officer’s reaction.
We are not here to determine if MB was justified in wanting to stab someone, or acting the way she did. The officer didn’t know her back story and it doesn’t really matter. What the officer DID know is she was currently the aggressor. SHE was currently, actively trying to stab someone. At that point her back story doesn’t matter.
Let’s suppose she was the one who originally called for help. Let’s suppose the others there were originally the aggressors. Would we then expect the officer to allow her to stab the girl in pink? Of course not, because MB’s life story doesn’t matter in regard to what ultimately happened.

 

[PrairieWind]

Aliwi was actively shooting at LE, threatening them, and they only wounded him? Why?

Why not shoot 'center mass' once, instead of four times? The case is under criminal investigation. We are just spectators, who don't have all the info, so it's not plain and simple. Our opinions are like p*ss in the wind.

My understanding was that officers responding were told that he was wearing body armor (he was not in fact) so officers were trying for head, or leg shots. Once he was hit in the leg, he gave up.

 

[IceIce9]

While background information and life story may be interesting, I don’t think it changes anything. The reason MB was acting the way she was really has no bearing on the police officer’s reaction.
We are not here to determine if MB was justified in wanting to stab someone, or acting the way she did. The officer didn’t know her back story and it doesn’t really matter. What the officer DID know is she was currently the aggressor. SHE was currently, actively trying to stab someone. At that point her back story doesn’t matter.
Let’s suppose she was the one who originally called for help. Let’s suppose the others there were originally the aggressors. Would we then expect the officer to allow her to stab the girl in pink? Of course no, because MB’s life story doesn’t matter in regard to what ultimately happened.

Agree with this 100%.

If the officer had stood by and allowed her to stab the unarmed girl in pink in the neck, she would be dead (or severely injured) no matter whether MB was an honor student, mentally impaired, or anything else. The fact that she was attacking an unarmed victim with a knife is what is important.

 

[Betty P]

A similar story in Cincinnati news that demonstrates how the situation could have turned out.

A 13 year old Cincinnati girl is on trial for stabbing another 13 year old girl in the neck with a pocket knife Monday night during a fight. The victim, 13 yo Nayira Givens, died. The incident happened in front of the victim's home. The name of the girl who killed Nayira is being kept confidential as she's a juvenile. She had no record of criminal activity and was an A student.

13 year-old girl accused of killing 13-year-old Nyaira Givens appears in court

It's so tragic to hear of these young girls getting into knife fights with each other.

ETA: The 13 yo girl is not yet on trial, but is beginning the process of being charged.

 

[kittythehare]

While background information and life story may be interesting, I don’t think it changes anything. The reason MB was acting the way she was really has no bearing on the police officer’s reaction.
We are not here to determine if MB was justified in wanting to stab someone, or acting the way she did. The officer didn’t know her back story and it doesn’t really matter. What the officer DID know is she was currently the aggressor. SHE was currently, actively trying to stab someone. At that point her back story doesn’t matter.
Let’s suppose she was the one who originally called for help. Let’s suppose the others there were originally the aggressors. Would we then expect the officer to allow her to stab the girl in pink? Of course not, because MB’s life story doesn’t matter in regard to what ultimately happened.

<modsnip>
I have only a few observations on that part because those that are qualified to make that decision are already working on it and they don't need my assistance.
I'll wait.
Some people believe LE can do no wrong, other believe they can do no right.

And although we are here probably because it is an officer involved shooting primarily there is nothing to do until the investigation is complete.
Seeing as I am here too, I'm interested in the whole story. Not just one sentence.

 

[Betty P]

We simply must get the whole story.
She slashed 'at' her but didn't connect and suddenly turned her attention to the pink girl.
it's quite confusing, isn't it?

Not too confusing, really. It sounds like she wanted to attack both girls, and did. She may have wanted to attack others in the crowd. I'm sure they'll get the whole story. Was it a case of bullying or some kind of long running teenage feud?

 

[IceIce9]

We simply must get the whole story.
She slashed 'at' her but didn't connect and suddenly turned her attention to the pink girl.
it's quite confusing, isn't it?

It is obvious that she was a threat and needed to be stopped from seriously injuring or killing others.