OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #56

[Antimony]

Yes it is possible that GW4, with the most to lose and with the weakest reason to be involved, decided to avoid the inside areas of the crime scenes to make sure there was no chance of his DNA being found. He may have even said that he would participate, in order to stand with his family, but wanted to remain outside with no chance of him being connected to the victims.

I find this very plausible because emphasis was brought up early regarding his DNA. From what was said, the prosecution is not using his DNA against him at trial. He may have told (nagged) his attorneys that his DNA can't be there because he was never over visiting the victims (but that's not what he really meant.) DNA is however, listed in evidence for all 4 Wagners.

The Wagner's talked as though they did not expect all 4 to be arrested. I find this peculiar. Again, they may have taken greater measures to distance GW4 from the crimes. Just theory.

Remember, he was the only one of the 4 asking for bail at his arraignment.
I think he was surprised he got arrested....2 Cents......

If GW4 was home babysitting instead of going out that night he and the others must be really shocked that it did not protect him in any way. I always thought Angie stayed home to babysit, now I am wondering if it was GW4? I believe for sure Jake and Billy went, no doubt in my mind there.

A blood sample, as a matter of course, would have been taken from all arrestees.
It would have been necessary to have everyone's DNA (blood) to rule in or rule out
suspects. Those samples would be listed in evidence.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

Defiance Farms

If you look in the picture of Defiance Farms on her FB you can plainly see Angela Wagner is overweight and she was no ninja running around the Rhodens property that night, JMO she was with GW4 taken care of the kids and gathered cameras, ONE THING I would like to know is what Jake and George’s children had to say about that night did they see something they shouldn’t have?????

 

[Johnny B Bad]

Jake Wagner, 23, said there’s a 50/50 chance he’s Kylie’s father. He and Hanna Rhoden dated for nearly three years before they welcomed her half-sister, Sophia, now 2 1/2 years old. If Wagner is her father, that would mean her half-sister would become her full sister.

And there is nothing Wagner would like more, he said, fondly recalling how he pulled the tiny sock off her litty, bitty foot shortly after she was born on April 17. He was checking for a hammer index toe: A Wagner family trait.


He’s almost sure, he said, that he saw that bend. It’s the hope he holds onto these days.

But if he isn’t Kylie’s dad, and if the courts deem another man suitable to care for her, he will step aside -- at least partially.



So is Jake Wagner caught making bragging statements to the news people, if the two families where arguing a few weeks prior of the murders than here is another lie LE caught Jake in, I wouldn’t think that the Rhodens wouldn’t want any of the Wagners at the hospital that day, the Wagners where just to full of their self, they really thought that they were smarter than the LE and all of public, the Wagners are over bearing people that I would think that any jury would not have any trouble voting for the Death Penalty, Chris Graves put this article out 6/5/2016 at 6:13AM.
There is no doubt that LE knew who killed the Rhodens in June 2016 JMO

This is a old Websleuth post.

 

[Dudly]

Was it one person wearing two left shoes in two sizes? Not sure I get it. JMO

Or...could it have something to do with hammer toe?

Or, two people with different size shoes walking around in the same area.

 

[dgfred]

If y'all have both Angie and G either not at the crime scene or in a car (sleeping kids?)...
Do you think that just Jake and B were the ones doing all the killing at such different sites?

 

[Johnny B Bad]

If y'all have both Angie and G either not at the crime scene or in a car (sleeping kids?)...
Do you think that just Jake and B were the ones doing all the killing at such different sites?

Myself I really think that Kenneth would only trust the family or a woman at that time of the night to let inside his camper but and I say this based up on what I read in 2016, LE is not letting all the information out yet so someone could have been killed and took back to their home????

 

[dgfred]

That would have made things very tricky IMO. Blood trails, evidence in cars, etc.

 

[Dudly]

Jake Wagner, 23, said there’s a 50/50 chance he’s Kylie’s father. He and Hanna Rhoden dated for nearly three years before they welcomed her half-sister, Sophia, now 2 1/2 years old. If Wagner is her father, that would mean her half-sister would become her full sister.

And there is nothing Wagner would like more, he said, fondly recalling how he pulled the tiny sock off her litty, bitty foot shortly after she was born on April 17. He was checking for a hammer index toe: A Wagner family trait.


He’s almost sure, he said, that he saw that bend. It’s the hope he holds onto these days.

But if he isn’t Kylie’s dad, and if the courts deem another man suitable to care for her, he will step aside -- at least partially.



So is Jake Wagner caught making bragging statements to the news people, if the two families where arguing a few weeks prior of the murders than here is another lie LE caught Jake in, I wouldn’t think that the Rhodens wouldn’t want any of the Wagners at the hospital that day, the Wagners where just to full of their self, they really thought that they were smarter than the LE and all of public, the Wagners are over bearing people that I would think that any jury would not have any trouble voting for the Death Penalty, Chris Graves put this article out 6/5/2016 at 6:13AM.
There is no doubt that LE knew who killed the Rhodens in June 2016 JMO

This is a old Websleuth post.

How much of anything can you believe from JW? Only two people would know if JW had a 50/50 chance of being the father of the baby if any chance at all. One of the two cannot answer the question or dispute his claim. Has anyone beside JW said he was at the hospital and checked the baby’s feet? We don’t know if he really helped put the crib together. We don’t even know when he picked up his daughter for sure. There is no one to dispute anything he says after the murders happened, except his family, every one of them, that could, are dead...

 

[Dudly]

If y'all have both Angie and G either not at the crime scene or in a car (sleeping kids?)...
Do you think that just Jake and B were the ones doing all the killing at such different sites?

No on here one knows where anyone was that night.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

I keep thinking about the 6 month old boy that was in bed between Frankie and Hannah, this child would have been screaming his head off if he was in bed with the mother and father when they were shot, a homemade suppressor is very loud, especial in a tight room like a mobile home, just what if the LE checked baby Ruger for DNA, someone could have been holding him while the murders was going on, remember HG had 5 shots to the head and face, Frankie had 3, the Wagners knew who was there that night they saw CR come and go and leave little BR, JMO

 

[Loomis124]

Or, two people with different size shoes walking around in the same area.

I believe this is correct.

 

[molly1255]

Agree about George and in regards to not leaving out Angie......

LOL Yes in past discussions with you I would relegate Angie to being the babysitter at home because I figured the guys would not want her to see the violence and you would argue why you believed she was there.

However, as time marches on I believe Angie is more involved than I previously realized. Mastermind even? I believe she is the sole instigator of the fake custody documents including signing her mom's name and telling her mom to take the blame so as not to jeopardize her case. The manic phone calls from jail, even roping her brother and Jake into a forbidden 3-Way call, show how controlling and obsessed and manipulating she is towards her family.

Then she bought at least 2 pairs of shoes that the shoe print expert matches to Chris's trailer and to Dana's. And if she bought a pair of shoes for herself it means she had planned to be at the crime scenes, in fact the evidence specifically mentions 1 or 2 women's boots from Walmart.

Then there is the Oxygen show where a credible witness explains that Angie was apparently very mad at Hanna for leaving Jake, much "bad blood" between them.
Yet she told a different story to the press and even told Jake what to say. In fact, Jake did not even communicate with the press without her doing it with him, they were always giving interviews together. She made sure he said what she wanted, correcting him even. She even went into Facebook groups to try to sway the narrative on her family.

So more and more I think Angie was at the crime scenes. And I think she is trying to manipulate someone, in some way, regarding her stubborn refusal to wear her regular clothes to court. Who does that after going on 2 years in jail?

This is all JMO, but I have always thought AW was the mastermind. JMO, she showed incredibly manipulative and very bold behavior in arranging the 3 way call with JW and her brother, and it took a whole lot of "something" to make calls from jail to her mother to try to manipulate her mother further, especially when she knew her phone calls from jail were being monitored.

As far as wearing the old, worn-out jail garb in the pre-trial hearings rather than her own street clothes - it certainly makes her look rather pitiful and docile, IMO. Perhaps designed to gain the empathy of others? I have an idea about "why" she might be doing this. I'm not qualified professionally to do anything other than speculate about it, but in my life, I've known two people who have anti-social personality disorder. Lucky me! One is a cousin, who did incredible damage to my family years ago, and he was cherubic and very, very sweet. That was his facade. The other had a very similar kind of facade. It took a long time for them to get figured out, but the proof was in the pudding in terms of the horrible things they did. When they each got caught, their pity plays were beyond monumental. Some people bought into their pity plays, while others, like me, had a lightening bolt moment when we realized we were being played.

These experiences led me to read a lot, including a book by Dr. Martha Stout entitled "The Sociopath Next Door". She defined the pity play as the most reliable sign of a sociopath. "There are times when appeal to sympathy is nothing more than a manipulation technique that is used to force us to drop our guard and let the sociopath get away with murder."

These are just my own thoughts, based on my own personal experiences. It's hard to explain why someone would wear jail garb into pre-trail hearings when they are allowed to wear their own clothing. But then again, it's also hard to explain how anyone could be so calculatingly cold and heartless, and so without empathy and remorse, to be able to plan and carry out the execution of an entire family.

All JMO

 

[Cool Cats]

This is all JMO, but I have always thought AW was the mastermind. JMO, she showed incredibly manipulative and very bold behavior in arranging the 3 way call with JW and her brother, and it took a whole lot of "something" to make calls from jail to her mother to try to manipulate her mother further, especially when she knew her phone calls from jail were being monitored.

As far as wearing the old, worn-out jail garb in the pre-trial hearings rather than her own street clothes - it certainly makes her look rather pitiful and docile, IMO. Perhaps designed to gain the empathy of others? I have an idea about "why" she might be doing this. I'm not qualified professionally to do anything other than speculate about it, but in my life, I've known two people who have anti-social personality disorder. Lucky me! One is a cousin, who did incredible damage to my family years ago, and he was cherubic and very, very sweet. That was his facade. The other had a very similar kind of facade. It took a long time for them to get figured out, but the proof was in the pudding in terms of the horrible things they did. When they each got caught, their pity plays were beyond monumental. Some people bought into their pity plays, while others, like me, had a lightening bolt moment when we realized we were being played.

These experiences led me to read a lot, including a book by Dr. Martha Stout entitled "The Sociopath Next Door". She defined the pity play as the most reliable sign of a sociopath. "There are times when appeal to sympathy is nothing more than a manipulation technique that is used to force us to drop our guard and let the sociopath get away with murder."

These are just my own thoughts, based on my own personal experiences. It's hard to explain why someone would wear jail garb into pre-trail hearings when they are allowed to wear their own clothing. But then again, it's also hard to explain how anyone could be so calculatingly cold and heartless, and so without empathy and remorse, to be able to plan and carry out the execution of an entire family.

All JMO

Cool, thankx Molly for sharing your own personal experiences.

Everyone's personal experiences matter ... All opinions matter ...

 

[Betty P]

How much of anything can you believe from JW? Only two people would know if JW had a 50/50 chance of being the father of the baby if any chance at all. One of the two cannot answer the question or dispute his claim. Has anyone beside JW said he was at the hospital and checked the baby’s feet? We don’t know if he really helped put the crib together. We don’t even know when he picked up his daughter for sure. There is no one to dispute anything he says after the murders happened, except his family, every one of them, that could, are dead...

I agree completely. The Wagners stand accused of murdering eight people in their sleep. After the murders, they were saying anything they could come up with to disassociate themselves from the crimes and direct attention to other suspects.

Nothing they said then or since should be considered factual. The same goes for FW and other family members or friends, unless they're cooperating with LE.

 

[NotHammerToed]

AW seemed hell bent on maintaining a positive image of her family and herself. Just by looking at her Facebook it was plain as day to me that she is a straight up control freak. I really believe she’s self conscious of the weight loss she’s probably experienced in jail and that could be why she isn’t wearing her personal clothing? Just speculation. I also believe her lack of control of her surroundings is why she seems so tamed as if she knows she can’t push the narrative anymore.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

I would love to see some of the interviews and tips that was called to LE, I wonder if JW was facing jail time over non-support payment on SW and if he was he also was facing underage sex charges when the state of Ohio started custody rights/child support??

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Agree about George and in regards to not leaving out Angie......

LOL Yes in past discussions with you I would relegate Angie to being the babysitter at home because I figured the guys would not want her to see the violence and you would argue why you believed she was there.

However, as time marches on I believe Angie is more involved than I previously realized. Mastermind even? I believe she is the sole instigator of the fake custody documents including signing her mom's name and telling her mom to take the blame so as not to jeopardize her case. The manic phone calls from jail, even roping her brother and Jake into a forbidden 3-Way call, show how controlling and obsessed and manipulating she is towards her family.

Then she bought at least 2 pairs of shoes that the shoe print expert matches to Chris's trailer and to Dana's. And if she bought a pair of shoes for herself it means she had planned to be at the crime scenes, in fact the evidence specifically mentions 1 or 2 women's boots from Walmart.

Then there is the Oxygen show where a credible witness explains that Angie was apparently very mad at Hanna for leaving Jake, much "bad blood" between them.
Yet she told a different story to the press and even told Jake what to say. In fact, Jake did not even communicate with the press without her doing it with him, they were always giving interviews together. She made sure he said what she wanted, correcting him even. She even went into Facebook groups to try to sway the narrative on her family.

So more and more I think Angie was at the crime scenes. And I think she is trying to manipulate someone, in some way, regarding her stubborn refusal to wear her regular clothes to court. Who does that after going on 2 years in jail?

She is trying to play the martyr to sway any jury picks. Poor little Angie, still made to wear jail stripes after being in jail almost 2 years. Oh! How she is being abused!

I think she was the one trying to send out messages to her mother and brother by writing on clothing brought to her so when it was taken home RN would see it and read it, just like she made phone calls to RN. I think she was desperate to tell RN exactly what she wanted her to say in court. At first they may have said she couldn't wear street clothes to court but after they lifted that restriction she keeps wearing them thinking it makes her look sorely abused to the public and also to her mother RN who is testifying against her. After all what mother would not be very upset seeing her child deprived of decent clothes to wear to court when all the men and even other murder suspects are allowed to wear them. I think RN favored her and spoiled her terribly as a child and Angie is trying to guilt her mother into not testifying against her. She is extremely manipulating and controlling, even to trying to control her family from jail. So you can bet your own boots from Walmart that she was there and right up in everything from the word go. No way she would have trusted those men to do it right. I also have a strong belief she is the one who killed Dana because of jealousy and rivalry. SW may have talked a bit too affectionately about her Granny Dana to Granny Angie and that hit a wrong note with Angie.

JMO

JMO

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Defiance Farms

If you look in the picture of Defiance Farms on her FB you can plainly see Angela Wagner is overweight and she was no ninja running around the Rhodens property that night, JMO she was with GW4 taken care of the kids and gathered cameras, ONE THING I would like to know is what Jake and George’s children had to say about that night did they see something they shouldn’t have?????

You would be surprised how fast some over weight women can run with hatred and adrenaline from killing 8 people driving them. She was there with her hand on the trigger just to make sure it was done right. Do not forget these murders were overkills except for Kenny. That's because they didn't really have anything per se against Kenny except I think he saw their vehicle parked near Chris's house that night so he had to go because he knew the car and who was driving it. They could not leave him alive to run to the police the next morning to tell what he saw the night before.

Don't forget that Angie spent her life raising animals, horses and big dogs and even hogs. RN even had horses and animals she had to feed in addition to FWF and Defiance farms. You can be sure wrestling horses, big dogs and hogs she was very strong even if she did have a few extra pounds hanging around. We have a few overweight women on our police force here and they can run just as fast, shoot just as well and take down a suspect every bit as well as the men and skinny women can.

JMO

 

[Loomis124]

https://www.scribd.com/document/402565469/Angela-Wagner

Just wanted to get thoughts from others about some things listed in AW's Discovery.

Under the main heading "Walmart Shoes," the following subheadings are interesting:

--Heath
*Images (4)
*Receipts and Images (9pp)

--Size 11 Final Presentation (14 Images)

--Expedition Search (8 Items, Excel sheet)

------------------------
My thoughts and Opinion only:

***A receipt from the Heath Walmart means shoes were purchased from that store. Could have been an online purchase. IIRC, that's about 350 miles from Peebles?

***Size 11 Final Presentation. Hmmm, 14 images. Could be the evidence from the recent shoe analysis posted a page or two back by Dudly.

***Expedition Search --Was there only one search? Does anyone have the date? May 18, 2017? Could the 8 items be referring to pieces of carpet with bloody shoe prints? Remember, it's under Walmart Shoes.

Please keep in mind these items are listed in AWs Discovery under "Walmart Shoes" provided by the Prosecution in March 2019.

All is Just my speculation and opinion.

 

[Puzzles8]

If y'all have both Angie and G either not at the crime scene or in a car (sleeping kids?)...
Do you think that just Jake and B were the ones doing all the killing at such different sites?

My current opinion (subject to change...). I think the original plan was for Billy and Jake to be the shooters and George be the well armed backup I think George was primarily the driver and in charge of grabbing the outside/maybe inside security equipment, also probably was in charge of the cell phone jammer. Angie at home with the kids.

I have no doubt George was heavily armed that night, but he didn't think he would need to fire. Billy and Jake told him, don't worry, we have this well planned, you're just our backup.

Who knows what went down from there.

JMO, MOO, etc.