OH - Pike Co, 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #70

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  • #61
Agreeing to testify against her spouse? She does not legally have to do so. I'm a bit behind, but, I do not believe she was there that night. I think she stayed with the children. Those two things might have given her a lighter sentence, and, consider her age. If she testifies, and was cleared of being there that that night, she will soon be 52. She'd go up for parole at 81 ish, if I understand correctly.
Unfortunately, we may never know the truth, as for her exact location on the night of the murders. We dont know if this was a concocted story, pre arrest. Many are of the belief she was in the vicinity of the murders. It is hard for me to believe anything coming from the W camp. I take anything they say with a grain of salt. Jmo
 
  • #62
Unfortunately, we may never know the truth, as for her exact location on the night of the murders. We dont know if this was a concocted story, pre arrest. Many are of the belief she was in the vicinity of the murders. It is hard for me to believe anything coming from the W camp. I take anything they say with a grain of salt. Jmo

No, probably not, but some things have to line up, or they'd never made the deal with them, seeing as the prosecution has a mountain of evidence.

G4 says he was there but never shot anyone, so far, he has not received nor made a deal, much like his father.

JW admitted to killing five, leaving three up in the air (for us). Do I think it's the whole truth and nothing but the truth? Likely not. I do believe that their statements had to line up with evidence enough to receive their plea deals.

One thing I don't believe, is that HMR, stating "they'll have to kill me first" before she signed a custody agreement, is what set it in motion. I also think that AW was as big, or bigger, instigator, than JW.

Just early morning thoughts.
 
  • #63
I agree rsd. I wish i knew rhe answers but i dont. I dont trust anything coming from the W camp. My views aren't to demean or belittle another persons opinion. I dont know what happened that night but i wish i did and could change the outcome.
 
  • #64

Be interesting to hear what the family says after the jury finds George guilty of murder plus some, if not all, of the other charges.​

Woman pleads guilty for role in 2016 killing of 8 members of Ohio ... - UPI

"I see a woman with no sympathy, no remorse," a Rhoden relative said after the sentence, according to the Dispatch. "She's getting 30 years more than what our family gets."

Rhoden family murders: Tony Rhoden still grieving in Pike County

“People use the word monster a lot,” Tony Rhoden said. “And I looked at him and saw a monster.”

But, he said, he felt it when Jake Wagner choked up a couple of times during the hearing. And it made him wonder after all this time: What changed?

“He has held out for five long years. So many lies. So much pain. What clicked in his brain to say ‘I need to make this right?’” Tony wonders. "Maybe there's a human being under all that after all."

'So much pain': After Jake Wagner pleads guilty in …

Tony Rhoden:

"Has there been healing? Not really. I don't feel like in 5 years it's gotten any easier. So many lives that were destroyed that day - not just those who were murdered but the lives of all the victims who were left behind. Yep. Alot of lives destroyed."

Very poignant quotes that capture some aspect of family's pain but also perseverance. The rhoden Gilley Manley showed nerves of steel to handle everything these cowards brought down on them. Commendable th÷y never wavered even tho I'm sure they wanted to expose tge Wagner cult but always did what was best for the case and justice
 
  • #65
IANAL. I do have a family full of them. I do not ask them about this case. They are far too busy for me to call and "chat" about a case they are not involved in. I did have the opportunity to ask one of them what they thought, they were obviously aware of the case, and they felt strongly that LE had the right folks. That's the gist of our conversation. However, I have seen this in action, more than once. Also, this is an interesting read, if anyone has the time, and is bored enough.

This is not for nor against the W4.

Just how things work. Remember, all charges were identical, except for JW's, and they tossed in the statutory rape charge.

JW and HMR had been together, slept together under both parents' roofs, and had a child together, yet there had been zero reporting from any mandatory reporter, that we are aware of, and if this is the case, I find it abhorrent. The relationship was not hidden. I have felt all along that the school, physicians, and parents of both (for knowledge, and permission), should have been held accountable, and maybe these deaths wouldn't have occurred. Even after the fact, I feel those in mandatory reporting positions, should be held, in part, responsible, that the affair was going on, and he'd impregnated an underage girl. After the fact armchair quarterbacking today.

Who here would allow their 13-year-old to sleep with a 17-year-old, under their roof, knowingly, and be okay with it? Personally, I would not.

No judgement though, if you do. I know folks who have done so, and was overjoyed with the resulting grandbaby. I live in this region. We usually leave each family to run their own home. If someone calls CPS on another person, it's usually considered vindictive, unless it is a mandatory reporter, or discovered during an arrest.
Delete if found offensive.

Edit: Look now at AW's charges. How they've changed. She was originally charged with the exact same charges.
(Forgot part of the point)

THE HIDDEN LAW OF PLEA BARGAINING
The ability to control a defendant’s sentencing exposure by manipulating the charges against him—that is to say, the ability to charge bargain—is widely recognized by scholars as “the core of prosecutorial power in the United States.” 22 . Charge bargaining is not, however, the only mechanism of prosecutorial power, nor the only mechanism structured by subconstitutional procedural law. Prosecutors, for example, can also exercise leverage in plea negotiations by offering to recommend specific sentences in exchange for pleas of guilt, a process known as sentence bargaining. Sentence bargaining is generally seen as less problematic than charge bargaining insofar as it retains a meaningful role for judges. See, e.g., Bibas, Outside the Shadow, supra note 17, at 2534 The practice itself is simple enough to describe: A criminal defendant’s sentencing exposure is a function of his likelihood of conviction and his likely sentence if convicted. Those two factors, in turn, are heavily influenced by the charges he faces, which define the possible grounds for conviction, the maximum potential sentence, and frequently the minimum sentence as well. 23 . Because this Article takes charge bargaining and the attendant manipulation of trial penalties as its point of departure, it focuses on cases in which large sentencing differentials are at issue—namely, felony cases. In some instances, misdemeanor prosecutions raise similar dynamics, particularly when serious collateral consequences such as deportation, loss of government housing, or sex offender registration are at stake. See generally Paul T. Crane, Charging on the Margin, 57 Wm. & Mary L. Rev. 775 (2016) . A charge bargain is thus simply an agreement to replace a higher charge with a lower one in exchange for the defendant’s promise to plead guilty, which guarantees the prosecutor a conviction without the expense of trial.
 
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  • #66
I think FW will become a confused, fragile and elderly woman on the stand. She will portray herself as not understanding the question, knowing nothing, etc. and offended that she was even called to testify, IMHO
 
  • #67
Agreeing to testify against her spouse? She does not legally have to do so. I'm a bit behind, but, I do not believe she was there that night. I think she stayed with the children. Those two things might have given her a lighter sentence, and, consider her age. If she testifies, and was cleared of being there that that night, she will soon be 52. She'd go up for parole at 81 ish, if I understand correctly.
AW can voluntarily testify against BW, anf I am sorry I was clear I am thinking other unsolved crimes and murder(s) before the Rhoden massacre.
 
  • #68
AW can voluntarily testify against BW, anf I am sorry I was clear I am thinking other unsolved crimes and murder(s) before the Rhoden massacre.
She can, but can also refuse. I asked it in the form of a question, as in, if that could be a possibility, b/c it appears she's going to do so. I didn't mean it in any other way.
 
  • #69
Very poignant quotes that capture some aspect of family's pain but also perseverance. The rhoden Gilley Manley showed nerves of steel to handle everything these cowards brought down on them. Commendable th÷y never wavered even tho I'm sure they wanted to expose tge Wagner cult but always did what was best for the case and justice

Remember the video of Miss Geneva and her daughter crying, asking for answers of who did this to their family?

Pike County murders: 'End this nightmare,' …

Published: Apr 21, 2017

Rhoden and her daughter, Teresa Grebing, issued a gripping plea for answers Friday, a day before the anniversary of the Pike County murders of eight people.

Geneva Rhoden spent a year waking up, losing sleep and shedding more tears than she cares to count.

“I would like to say from a mother’s heart, that I hurt so bad inside from the day that I found out,” Rhoden said about the methodical executions of her sons Christopher Sr. and Kenneth, her grandchildren and grandson’s fiancee.

“I think about it day and night.”

We can at least be glad that they got answers to who did it and why, and that the 4 Wagners have been miserably locked up for going on 4 years and all of them will stay locked up. I believe only Angela will have the chance to get out and that isn't until she is 78 years old.

Point is, the family not knowing who did it and why, and the evil perpetrators out in society - ended on November 13, 2018 with the arrests and no bail incarceration.

This is a big thing, that the family can see the wheels of justice turn for them. Things may even come out at trial through witnesses that the family would like to know about.

I am happy for the Rhoden family that BCI solved this and the courts are giving out justice for them. Slow? Yes. But justice and a reckoning is coming for the Wagners.

1661367121397.png
 
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  • #70
I think FW will become a confused, fragile and elderly woman on the stand. She will portray herself as not understanding the question, knowing nothing, etc. and offended that she was even called to testify, IMHO
I so agree.
Maybe even throw in a cane, a walker and very obvious hearing aids. I'd also not be surprised to 'hear of' a recent Altzheimer's diagnosis....
IMO, it will be all show.

JMO
 
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  • #71
AW can voluntarily testify against BW, anf I am sorry I was clear I am thinking other unsolved crimes and murder(s) before the Rhoden massacre.
She can, but can also refuse. I asked it in the form of a question, as in, if that could be a possibility, b/c it appears she's going to do so. I didn't mean it in any other way.

Here is where it says Angela is cooperating with prosecutors against Billy plus also testifying against Billy. I find it interesting that the subject is brought up that because of spousal privilege Angela could refuse to testify against Billy. She has agreed to do it but I wonder if she refused if they would take her plea deal off the table? Seems to me she could refuse but then jeopardize her plea deal. Judge Deering warned her she had to comply with the prosecution. I can't remember his exact words but he did give her some type of warning.​

Angela Wagner Pleads Guilty In Rhoden …

Prosecutors dropped eight aggravated murder charges on Friday against Angela Wagner, who was charged with her family in the elaborately planned, execution-style slayings of eight members of another southern Ohio family in 2016.

In exchange, Wagner, 50, agreed to plead guilty to 14 lesser charges — including conspiracy to commit aggravated murder, burglary, possession of firearms, tampering with evidence, forgery, obstructing justice and engaging in a pattern of corrupt activity.

She'll also testify against her husband and oldest son in the case. She agreed to serve 30 years in prison with no option for early release.

George Wagner IV's brother and mother can testify …

As part of their plea agreements, Jake and Angela Wagner both agreed to cooperate with prosecutors in the cases against George Wagner IV and Billy Wagner.
 
  • #72
I so agree.
Maybe even throw in a cane, a walker and very obvious hearing aids. I'd also not be surprised to 'hear of' a recent Altzheimer's diagnosis....
IMO, it will be all show.

JMO

HA! She already used the "poor hearing" and "age forgetfulness" defense - I remember her emphasizing her age when saying she forgot where she bought the vests from. "I forgot, I'm 76 years old!"

Owen also brought to light that Wagner’s claims that she has impaired hearing and was having difficulty understanding questions at the time of her testimony that he says led to the obstruction and perjury charges.

Purchase of bulletproof vests at center of …

 
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  • #73
Just now happened to see this.

(4) Watch | Facebook From Angenette Levy (Reporter) facebook. Clip of Angela being led out of court into a white van, ignoring Angenette Levy asking her if she has anything to say.

After Angela's guilty plea.

Angela never once looked at the families in the court gallery and never apologized or expressed remorse.

A poster had mentioned that at her court hearings the right side of her face was often covered with her hair down on just that side of her face, like she was trying to avoid the family members looking at her.
 
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  • #74

Here is where it says Angela is cooperating with prosecutors against Billy plus also testifying against Billy. I find it interesting that the subject is brought up that because of spousal privilege Angela could refuse to testify against Billy. She has agreed to do it but I wonder if she refused if they would take her plea deal off the table? Seems to me she could refuse but then jeopardize her plea deal. Judge Deering warned her she had to comply with the prosecution. I can't remember his exact words but he did give her some type of warning.​

Angela Wagner Pleads Guilty In Rhoden …

Prosecutors dropped eight aggravated murder charges on Friday against Angela Wagner, who was charged with her family in the elaborately planned, execution-style slayings of eight members of another southern Ohio family in 2016.

In exchange, Wagner, 50, agreed to plead guilty to 14 lesser charges — including conspiracy to commit aggravated murder, burglary, possession of firearms, tampering with evidence, forgery, obstructing justice and engaging in a pattern of corrupt activity.

She'll also testify against her husband and oldest son in the case. She agreed to serve 30 years in prison with no option for early release.

George Wagner IV's brother and mother can testify …

As part of their plea agreements, Jake and Angela Wagner both agreed to cooperate with prosecutors in the cases against George Wagner IV and Billy Wagner.
That was the point I kinda failed to make. Thanks CC. I don't think she'd gotten a plea, or not the one she got, at least, without agreeing to testify against G3.
 
  • #75
Right. Hannah Gilley's family members also could speak at sentencing, giving a victim impact statement.

Hannah Gilley's mom: 'Is my little girl dead?' - The …

Chris Graves
October 25th 2016


Andrea Carver bolted up in bed at precisely 3:45 a.m. April 22, sucked in her breath and gripped her chest.

A sound sleeper, Carver couldn't shake the sickening feeling that wouldn't let her rest again. So she put on a pot of coffee and got to her day.

A mother feels things.

The call came about her youngest child, Hannah Hazel Gilley, just hours later.

The caller simply said there had been an accident involving Hannah and her fiance, Clarence "Frankie" Rhoden. Carver was needed up on Union Hill Road because Pike County's child protection services was going to take the couple's 6-month-old son, her grandson.

She thought of her son-in-law to be, who she knew adored her blue-eyed, blonde-haired 20-year-old daughter and their baby, Ruger Lee Rhoden.

Damn it, Frankie, she thought, you always did drive too fast. It was the only thing she ever worried about concerning him. She was going to give him a piece of her mind when she saw him.

A mother hopes against hope.

But sheriff's squad cars blocked Union Hill Road by the time she and her husband, who worked with Frankie at a local sawmill, got there. She pleaded with them to tell her what was going on. She begged for any information. She was hollering at them and, as the minutes wore on, screaming.
I read it when it was published and it's as heartbreaking now as it was then. I have a question when they took the DP off the table for the time being did they talk to the families first? If this has been asked and answered I apologize.
 
  • #76

Here is where it says Angela is cooperating with prosecutors against Billy plus also testifying against Billy. I find it interesting that the subject is brought up that because of spousal privilege Angela could refuse to testify against Billy. She has agreed to do it but I wonder if she refused if they would take her plea deal off the table? Seems to me she could refuse but then jeopardize her plea deal. Judge Deering warned her she had to comply with the prosecution. I can't remember his exact words but he did give her some type of warning.​

Angela Wagner Pleads Guilty In Rhoden …

Prosecutors dropped eight aggravated murder charges on Friday against Angela Wagner, who was charged with her family in the elaborately planned, execution-style slayings of eight members of another southern Ohio family in 2016.

In exchange, Wagner, 50, agreed to plead guilty to 14 lesser charges — including conspiracy to commit aggravated murder, burglary, possession of firearms, tampering with evidence, forgery, obstructing justice and engaging in a pattern of corrupt activity.

She'll also testify against her husband and oldest son in the case. She agreed to serve 30 years in prison with no option for early release.

George Wagner IV's brother and mother can testify …

As part of their plea agreements, Jake and Angela Wagner both agreed to cooperate with prosecutors in the cases against George Wagner IV and Billy Wagner.
The way I take it she agreed to testify against BW and GW4 to get the sentence of 30 yrs with no early release.
 
  • #77
Just now happened to see this.

(4) Watch | Facebook From Angenette Levy (Reporter) facebook. Clip of Angela being led out of court into a white van, ignoring Angenette Levy asking her if she has anything to say.

After Angela's guilty plea.

Angela never once looked at the families in the court gallery and never apologized or expressed remorse.

A poster had mentioned that at her court hearings the right side of her face was often covered with her hair down on just that side of her face, like she was trying to avoid the family members looking at her.
The only thing she is sorry for is getting caught. I think she is a coward who instigated things then turned on her husband and son to save her own behind. If she could get less time I think she would turn on JW by giving up more details.
 
  • #78
I agree. 30 years is a sweet deal. As determined as A.C. Is to bring justice in this case, I feel that A.W. gave up something pretty heavy. I think ole gal gave up her husband. There is mention of past threats of murder and possibly murder.
i question with the "aw help more charges" concept. very unlikely angela has any direct evidence of crimes committed outside of her sons and husband. sure she knows some crazy stuff billys done but practically speaking- b3 is headed for lwop or an insane plea. aw proffer really only serves to coorborate jw "POSSIBLY true statements" considering how much of a mommas boy jake is im sure they had it rehersed as a contingency. and it sure did work. astounded and disgusted when aw got that deal- this whole case is about her refusing to allow a mother to raise her daughter. aw shouldnt get to win and that deal was a win and a half. it cemented the conecept she wasnt at murder scenes, which for all we know she could have been! outside of theoretical advantages, what is one thing aw added to case they didnt have without her?
 
  • #79
Just now happened to see this.

(4) Watch | Facebook From Angenette Levy (Reporter) facebook. Clip of Angela being led out of court into a white van, ignoring Angenette Levy asking her if she has anything to say.

After Angela's guilty plea.

Angela never once looked at the families in the court gallery and never apologized or expressed remorse.

A poster had mentioned that at her court hearings the right side of her face was often covered with her hair down on just that side of her face, like she was trying to avoid the family members looking at her.
Yep … no apology & no remorse. No wonder her sons are being tried for murder. I honestly don’t believe she really asked them if they really wanted to go through with it.
 
  • #80
Im sure this is only the beginning of self-serving statements
 
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