OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#46

[rsd1200]

Thanks. I’m not sure either which is why I asked. The church didn’t move to Mt Etna until 2006 according to this. In the end, I guess it doesn't really matter who started it. Things can change after so many years.

‘The Lucasville Mission was formerly located on Maplewood street in Lucasville from 1959 thru 2006; In 2007 the Mission moved to 718 Mt Etna Road, Piketon, Ohio 45661 where it is still located. GPS 718 Mt Etna Road, Piketon 45661 or the house next door which is 799 Mt Etna Road and that will get you here. We hope those children who grew up in the Mission at Lucasville will bring their children and come join us for Mission VBS 2016. We look forward to having you here. Come as you are, everyone welcome.”

WUKV 88.3 FM Radio Station Information - Radio Lineup

I think they are two separate churches now, aren't they?

Here is a link to the one on Mt Etna. It's their website. AW did the stained glass windows.

Mission Church-Piketon Ohio

 

[Tiff23fr]

CC...I don't understand why he's stealing in the first place? FW and Flying W farm is extremely well known for the Friesian horses they breed, and have been breeder of the year in 2016. Also well known in the miniature horse world and get $5-8,000 each. The Friesians go for much more. So why does he need to steal? I'm not clear how involved he was with the breeding operation but it seems mom would have made sure he was taken care of?? I understand the mentality from a rural upbringing, I understand the gun mentality but not why he was stealing and not sure if I believe Angela was under his thumb. He came from a dominate female family, so it seems he would marry someone of similar traits.

Maybe at some point his parents cut him off? When told to figure it out, the illegal way was how they found themselves making it, by stealing.
Or maybe he was stealing from his own family in addition to others and that caused Bob or Fredericka to say hit the road.
It's hard to say.
All JMO

 

[Tiff23fr]

I think they are two separate churches now, aren't they?

Here is a link to the one on Mt Etna. It's their website. AW did the stained glass windows.

Mission Church-Piketon Ohio

All the paperwork back then and today via the state still runs through the same female from what I interpreted. In court when Canepa mentioned the pastors name it's also the same last name.
No negative intent meant to that Pastor or the female that intercepts the paperwork.

 

[rsd1200]

Maybe at some point his parents cut him off? When told to figure it out, the **** way was how they found themselves making it, by stealing.
Or maybe he was stealing from his own family in addition to others and that caused Bob or Fredericka to say hit the road.
It's hard to say.
All JMO

The grandkids were both adults when the Peterson place was purchased. Maybe they came into a trust fund that had been started for them, and they decided to embark out on their own. FW and Bob told the parents to embark out on their own too (or maybe only one of them). When a child doesn't succeed, sometimes, the inlaws can't accept that it's their child to blame. It has to be the spouse. Just thinking on things I've seen throughout the years. Especially mothers. It has to be that woman they hitched up with. Can't be their boy.

 

[rsd1200]

All the paperwork back then and today via the state still runs through the same female from what I interpreted. In court when Canepa mentioned the pastors name it's also the same last name.
No negative intent meant to that Pastor or the female that intercepts the paperwork.

So, we're looking at same church but two different locations, if I'm reading you right.

 

[rsd1200]

It looks to me as if FW created a new breed of horse and the registry is her own registry.

I have thought for a while that this horse breed is a thorny issue. A lot of people stand to possibly lose money if that horse registry is owned by her and she created a 'new' breed. jmo. moo.

They did create a new breed. They created, and held, the registry too. Beautiful horses. Well bred from what I've seen and shown to others. I think that Bob had the knack with them. Just guessing, I think that RW and RAW got that same knack.

BBM
And yes, that's very possible. RW may take over the registry though, should mother go to jail.

 

[Tiff23fr]

The grandkids were both adults when the Peterson place was purchased. Maybe they came into a trust fund that had been started for them, and they decided to embark out on their own. FW and Bob told the parents to embark out on their own too (or maybe only one of them). When a child doesn't succeed, sometimes, the inlaws can't accept that it's their child to blame. It has to be the spouse. Just thinking on things I've seen throughout the years. Especially mothers. It has to be that woman they hitched up with. Can't be their boy.

This statement you made:
It has to be that woman they hitched up with. Can't be their boy.

What if this embarking on your own (2014) and Fredericka moving her assets into White Pines are connected? Back to the gut feeling of something going on in 2014. -Just spitballing the idea.

Protecting it from Angela maybe? I don't know, it's a thought.

How do we know what FW and AW's relationship was really like? Even at arrest time AW was staying in South Webster.

 

[Tiff23fr]

So, we're looking at same church but two different locations, if I'm reading you right.

Yes- go to the Secretary of State webpage and look all pages of each filing comparing addresses and names.

 

[Tiff23fr]

This statement you made:
It has to be that woman they hitched up with. Can't be their boy.

What if this embarking on your own (2014) and Fredericka moving her assets into White Pines are connected? Back to the gut feeling of something going on in 2014. -Just spitballing the idea.

Protecting it from Angela maybe? I don't know, it's a thought.

How do we know what FW and AW's relationship was really like? Even at arrest time AW was staying in South Webster.

Reminded me of this:
“They have nothing,” Fredericka Wagner said in a 2017 Dayton Daily News interview. “Their searches have turned up zilch. Nothing. And they aren’t going to either because Jake had nothing to do with it.”

 

[Puzzles8]

Has anyone possibly confirmed if this is the same Lucasville Mission? Read the news clip in the post. This female evangelist was also a resident of RT 2, Flying W original paperwork states RT 2, but I'm not sure what all was RT2 in the '70's.
All Things Wildly Considered: International Works of Faith -- Geraldine Conway

At first I thought going into this discussion could be off topic, but since Frederickas church was mentioned in the article around her assets and we know BCI took records from the church, I'm hopeful it's ok to try and explore its possible origins.

I remember there was some discussion about this back in thread # 43.
Starts about here:
OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#43

 

[rsd1200]

This statement you made:
It has to be that woman they hitched up with. Can't be their boy.

What if this embarking on your own (2014) and Fredericka moving her assets into White Pines are connected? Back to the gut feeling of something going on in 2014. -Just spitballing the idea.

Protecting it from Angela maybe? I don't know, it's a thought.

How do we know what FW and AW's relationship was really like? Even at arrest time AW was staying in South Webster.

It is a good thought. 2014 does not look like a good year at all for the W4. Lots of other stuff happened in 2014. Also, we only know about the times that G3 was CAUGHT doing stupid stuff, my guess he did lots more stupid stuff that he was not caught doing. That's usually the way it works. If you catch someone stealing from you, most likely it wasn't the first time they stole, it was just the first time you caught them. The wife or mother are usually always to blame, too. If they'd only ______ (fill in the blank).

 

[Kyshoegal]

They did create a new breed. They created, and held, the registry too. Beautiful horses. Well bred from what I've seen and shown to others. I think that Bob had the knack with them. Just guessing, I think that RW and RAW got that same knack.

BBM
And yes, that's very possible. RW may take over the registry though, should mother go to jail.

What breed registry did she create? I know they have a lot of crosses for their Friesian's (they crossed with Cobb's, Saddlebreds, and Gypsy's) But I wasn't aware that she created a registry for them. I do know the USEF is a very serious organization and has top level competitors so to get breeder of the year is an outstanding accomplishment. I also noticed she uses [email protected] for her email, I wonder if the name change is something new.

 

[Dudly]

It looks to me as if FW created a new breed of horse and the registry is her own registry.

I have thought for a while that this horse breed is a thorny issue. A lot of people stand to possibly lose money if that horse registry is owned by her and she created a 'new' breed. jmo. moo.

I believe it was her husband that "created" that breed of horse thus the name Georgian Grand. It is basically a work horse crossed with a saddle breed horse type riding horse...
From the link posted:

The first attempts to create a new, heavier Saddlebred-type breed were made in the 1970s by George Wagner Jr, in Piketon, Ohio. His ambition was to recreate the stockier, sturdier look of the Saddlebred of older times, such as the animals used as cavalry mounts during the American Civil War. He considered this the original type of the Saddlebred horse instead of the prevailing modern, lighter type. Wagner's breeding succeeded in creating horses of the desired type, and the breed was named after him as "George's great horse". The breed association International Georgian Grande Horse Registry was founded in 1994, and was later accepted as member under the United States Dressage Federation All Breeds Council and the American Horse Council.[1] While not a national recognized breed affiliate with the USEF,[2] Georgian Grandes may compete in any open all-breed USEF division, and a Georgian Grande that is also a Friesian cross with 50% or more Friesian breeding and one purebred Friesian parent may compete in part-bred Friesian classes.

 

[rsd1200]

What breed registry did she create? I know they have a lot of crosses for their Friesian's (they crossed with Cobb's, Saddlebreds, and Gypsy's) But I wasn't aware that she created a registry for them. I do know the USEF is a very serious organization and has top level competitors so to get breeder of the year is an outstanding accomplishment. I also noticed she uses [email protected] for her email, I wonder if the name change is something new.

Check out the Georgian Grande Horse. It's been awhile since I researched them, but I believe they created the breed and the registry.

Georgian Grande

Edit: I have to give them credit. It's a beautiful horse. Looks great in the showring.

 

[Kyshoegal]

I believe it was her husband that "created" that breed of horse thus the name Georgian Grand. It is basically a work horse crossed with a saddle breed horse type riding horse...
From the link posted:

The first attempts to create a new, heavier Saddlebred-type breed were made in the 1970s by George Wagner Jr, in Piketon, Ohio. His ambition was to recreate the stockier, sturdier look of the Saddlebred of older times, such as the animals used as cavalry mounts during the American Civil War. He considered this the original type of the Saddlebred horse instead of the prevailing modern, lighter type. Wagner's breeding succeeded in creating horses of the desired type, and the breed was named after him as "George's great horse". The breed association International Georgian Grande Horse Registry was founded in 1994, and was later accepted as member under the United States Dressage Federation All Breeds Council and the American Horse Council.[1] While not a national recognized breed affiliate with the USEF,[2] Georgian Grandes may compete in any open all-breed USEF division, and a Georgian Grande that is also a Friesian cross with 50% or more Friesian breeding and one purebred Friesian parent may compete in part-bred Friesian classes.

Oh WOW..I'm a horse lover so from that aspect it's very interesting. Thank you for the info!!

 

[Kyshoegal]

Check out the Georgian Grande Horse. It's been awhile since I researched them, but I believe they created the breed and the registry.

Georgian Grande

Edit: I have to give them credit. It's a beautiful horse. Looks great in the showring.

Yes!! I had no idea he created that breed, they are stunning!!

 

[rsd1200]

Yes!! I had no idea he created that breed, they are stunning!!

They truly are. I have shown them to others who, like me, appreciate a good horse, and they said the same as you, Stunning! To risk all of that, does not make sense to me at all. Have a hard time wrapping my mind around it.

Edit: I have not seen, in any of their vids, the two boys working with, or riding, any of the horses. It's usually RW. RAW got bit by the horse bug but it seems that G3 did not. Just an observation.

 

[Cool Cats]

BBM
Idk a lot about GWSr. other than he came from a large family out of Eastern Ky. that seemed to move around a lot. GSr has a connection to Greenup too. They did not appear to be a family of means, but I could be wrong. I'd not be surprised if the R & W families have known one another, or of one another for awhile. Even if FW married beneath her, in this region, and especially in their era, and probably still a lot in G3/AW's era, most wives deferred to the husband. Although, many women pretty much ran the house their way, and saw to the kids needs.

Yes, you "hit the nail on the head." The wife deferred to the husband in the sense of supporting 100% the husband's business/career/job. But the wife was number one in charge of the kids and family life. The husband actually deferred to his wife in this way. Hey, I like the psychology of things. It's very interesting. What drives people to do the evil that they do? Mind Hunter.

 

[rsd1200]

<modsnip - deleted a post that was removed and a comment on that post>

That line of thinking for the horse farm though, could be possible. It's very expensive to own a single horse, let alone a herd. Services for the disabled are very much needed in most areas, so it would be a good investment. It's also not a business that will run out of customers (unfortunately).

As many horses as they have, they probably did need another business(es) to assist with expenses. Just to keep a single horse, can run you around $1k per year. Hay, grain, immunizations, unexpected vet bills, hoof care, just to name a few expenses, and that's if you don't show or breed. Add on showing and/or breeding, and, I'm just spitballing, but I'd guess at least another $500-$1k per year for either of those. Vet bills can be killer. That amt. doesn't even count your own personal time working with them.

 

[Tiff23fr]

They truly are. I have shown them to others who, like me, appreciate a good horse, and they said the same as you, Stunning! To risk all of that, does not make sense to me at all. Have a hard time wrapping my mind around it.

Edit: I have not seen, in any of their vids, the two boys working with, or riding, any of the horses. It's usually RW. RAW got bit by the horse bug but it seems that G3 did not. Just an observation.

It seems Billy may have been into cattle for a while. JMO