OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#46

[Jonas_Klein]

No one has said anything about the weed. Can you really grow that much weed and not have a connection to some sort of organized crime outfit?

How many plants did they have? We discussed here long time ago. 200 plants just starting in trays maybe?

That's a very small crime operation. Organized crime have much bigger operations.

 

[buttonbaby]

.


Thanks. This video doesn’t state what you are in search of. Each time I watch it, I feel so heart broken for this man.
A few things he says- “more than one, I’d say more than 2” and ‘worked at the Bear Lake, him, Chris, and TWO more boys”. Does anyone know if Billy might have worked at BBL?

CRSR, FR, and CRJR, all worked at Big Bear Lake, and if I remember correctly, CRSR was instrumental in helping to develop and build it... I've never heard anything about GW3 working there though. JMO. MOO.

 

[Cool Cats]

To me, that reads as digital evidence, searches for the weather forecast on or for those days. IMOO

Very interesting. Like, say their computers show the only time they searched the weather---for 3 days in a row that year--- just happened to be those 3 days! Day before, day of, and day after the crimes.

That is circumstantial evidence and there looks to be more of that type of evidence, then say, actual forensic evidence that directly ties them to the scenes. We know there is no DNA evidence on GW4.

Even if a case is only circumstantial evidence, what happens is that evidence builds up to the point it's beyond a reasonable doubt. I think most of this case will be circumstantial, but clearly not all of it.

 

[rsd1200]

Oddly, Jake - Edward J. Wagner - has also received farm subsidies for many years.... Wasn't aware he owned land, before the Peterson property.

I think that's a diff W.

 

[Puzzles8]

CRSR, FR, and CRJR, all worked at Big Bear Lake, and if I remember correctly, CRSR was instrumental in helping to develop and build it... I've never heard anything about GW3 working there though. JMO. MOO.

Wasn't there an evidentiary excel spreadsheet under the Heading of "Billy's cell phone" that was titled BBL?

 

[sunshineray]

Liquidating?

Here's what I keep thinking about. If this whole thing is solely about custody of the young girl. Why did BCI seize her business records? I'm not talking personal family documents. She right out stated they took records of her non profits and businesses.

It wouldn't be the first time other criminal avenues, besides the ones being investigated at the time, have been uncovered. Who knows what might be in store down the road for FW or any of her business associations. AJMO

 

[GoBuckeyes]

I admittedly don't know a lot (anything) about firearms and ammunition.
Can someone give me a brief primer?
Are certain sizes of ammo specific to certain types of weapons - shotgun, pistol, automatic weapon?
And in general what are the types of weapons/ammo suited for? Close range, hunting, murder, loudness, etc?
TIA

I doubt a shotgun or rifle was used. Those are both long guns, difficult to muffle the sound, not compatible with the silencers allegedly used, unwieldy in tight spaces, and, I apologize for not being able to state this delicately, but in most cases would be expected to cause enough damage that if pressed to the skull the damage would be so extensive that it would be difficult to determine what area on the upper third of the body the next shot targeted, let alone 2 shots.

I also find it unlikely that an automatic weapon was used. Due to legislation, they are more difficult to come by legally without leaving a paper trail. They are harder to control concerning sparing an infant lying between 2 parents who the perpetrators targeted. And, again, the alleged silencers used would be incompatible with many automatic weapons.

A handgun (pistol) would be the most likely choice for tight quarters, multiple targets, wanting to spare all but one child, using a silencer, and maneuvering around each other.

Here is an example of a brass catcher for a pistol. Catch-All Brass Catcher Pistol

Here is a good read on ammunition, calibers, etc.

https://www.pewpewtactical.com/bullet-sizes-calibers-and-types/#toc0

 

[sunshineray]

Tiff23fr..possibly to see if she was moving money to help fund this? Pay for weapons, the AK trip? That's the only thing I can think of right off. It's going to be a long summer waiting for a trial to start, that's for certain. Does anyone know if the trails will be televised?

"When it launches in May 2019, Court TV will feature "in-depth legal reporting and expert analysis of the nation's most important and compelling trials," according to a release."
I would say the biggest investigation in Ohio history and the subsequent trials would be "important and compelling". We can hope Court TV covers them.

Court TV is returning - CNN

 

[sunshineray]

Wasn't there an evidentiary excel spreadsheet under the Heading of "Billy's cell phone" that was titled BBL?

"Also in the list of evidence being handed to defense attorneys for Billy Wagner are cell tower records from his phone.

The document shows records for March 2016 and April 2016. Listed under those records is "Big Bear Lake (1 excel sheet)."

Documents: ATF files report on item pulled from well, Wagner family arrested a week later

 

[sunshineray]

Dunno if this has been mentioned..... but in AW discovery there is game cam footage from 51 UHR. I looked it up on Google Earth and there is only 1 home that seperates 51UHR from DR new home. 51UHR was for sale not long ago and there are pics online. The trailor on the property sits a pretty good distance from the road w/ a winding driveway. Looking at the landscape on Google Earth I cant imagne where a game cam could have been mounted in order for it to have any relevance to LE?

There's a, I don't what you'd call it, a utility path behind that residence too. I always thought the killers could have use these paths instead of the roads. But maybe their cams were set up back there?

 

[Kyshoegal]

Dunno if this has been mentioned..... but in AW discovery there is game cam footage from 51 UHR. I looked it up on Google Earth and there is only 1 home that seperates 51UHR from DR new home. 51UHR was for sale not long ago and there are pics online. The trailor on the property sits a pretty good distance from the road w/ a winding driveway. Looking at the landscape on Google Earth I cant imagne where a game cam could have been mounted in order for it to have any relevance to LE?

Around the back along the fence line? Looks like they could have skirted along the fence line past the property between the two and came onto DR's property from the back "undetected". I find that unlikely and the drive isn't that long so I feel a car could have been spotted easily if they parked there? Is it possible they pulled into the trees across the street and crossed UHR there?

 

[Loomis124]

"Also in the list of evidence being handed to defense attorneys for Billy Wagner are cell tower records from his phone.

The document shows records for March 2016 and April 2016. Listed under those records is "Big Bear Lake (1 excel sheet)."

Documents: ATF files report on item pulled from well, Wagner family arrested a week later

The kiddos sure weren't smiling in this photo. So sad.

 

[Puzzles8]

Very interesting. Like, say their computers show the only time they searched the weather---for 3 days in a row that year--- just happened to be those 3 days! Day before, day of, and day after the crimes.

That is circumstantial evidence and there looks to be more of that type of evidence, then say, actual forensic evidence that directly ties them to the scenes. We know there is no DNA evidence on GW4.

Even if a case is only circumstantial evidence, what happens is that evidence builds up to the point it's beyond a reasonable doubt. I think most of this case will be circumstantial, but clearly not all of it.

I'm not even sure if it was AW that searched the weather.
It also might be an exhibit for the Prosecution in support of the Corener's Report estimating the time of death by body temperature, given the open windows.

 

[Kyshoegal]

Very interesting. Like, say their computers show the only time they searched the weather---for 3 days in a row that year--- just happened to be those 3 days! Day before, day of, and day after the crimes.

That is circumstantial evidence and there looks to be more of that type of evidence, then say, actual forensic evidence that directly ties them to the scenes. We know there is no DNA evidence on GW4.

Even if a case is only circumstantial evidence, what happens is that evidence builds up to the point it's beyond a reasonable doubt. I think most of this case will be circumstantial, but clearly not all of it.

Agreed. I think that's another reason for the volumes of electronic data. Not a lot of physical evidence.

 

[Puzzles8]

The kiddos sure weren't smiling in this photo. So sad.

Loomis, surprisingly I'm going to stick up for the Wagners regarding this photo!
For many years my family has tried to get the perfect family photo for our Christmas card picture.
More years than not, we settled for the photo that was the "least awful" of all of us.

 

[NLM1234]

Adding that white pines website is archived on the way back machine. It was active in ‘03 - ‘06. Billy and Angela were both named on the site in ‘03. His name is not on it later, but it did reference Angela as Owner and location at Bethel Hill. They had another loss due to fire and the site was removed a couple months later.

Am I understanding this correctly? There were two fires at the kennel owned by Billy and Angela? Wasn't there also a fire at Fredericka's farm at some point in time? This seems strange to me. JMO

 

[Betty P]

They had brass catchers so they used semi auto pistols most likely. JW had photos of a pair of Colt 45 1911s Iirc, and a HKP30, on his FB. These may have been just guns he had on his wish list and were not actually owned by him. Thought I'd toss'em out there though.

(Shudder). It's possible one or both of those were used for the murders. Would these use different types of ammo? My ammo knowledge is also somewhat limited when it comes to hand guns.

 

[Loomis124]

Can anyone post a link to one of the 4 Ws indictments? The one on WS Media is giving me an error. TY

 

[Puzzles8]

Can anyone post a link to one of the 4 Ws indictments? The one on WS Media is giving me an error. TY

See if this works
https://www.ohioattorneygeneral.gov...cial-Prosecutions/PikeCountyMurderIndictments

 

[Betty P]

I'm not even sure if it was AW that searched the weather.
It also might be an exhibit for the Prosecution in support of the Corener's Report estimating the time of death by body temperature, given the open windows.

Yes, that's what I was thinking - that it may have to do with trying to calculate when the murders occurred. Also to get information about available light, time of nautical sunrise - when things begin to get light outdoors, etc. How long would it take for their eyes to adjust to dark bedrooms? What could they see? How much could other potential witnesses see? We went over a lot of this stuff in the days and weeks after the murders.

Remember, it was also the first day of turkey hunting season, so they probably wanted to check to see when any hunters in the area would have begun shooting. How much mud would the killers have tracked inside, etc.?