OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) - #28

[Daisy47]

http://www.mydaytondailynews.com/ne...vestigators-want-know/u0j6B0ClMU9UbdLsQvYdpK/

FW, JW's grandma says 'They have nothing.' Referring to LE.

Good article Goofy Jen. I had not seen this one.


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[RAISINISBACK]

It is possible to go to Alaska to hide or escape. Many people with a past have escaped to Alaska and quietly started a new life.

However, Seward and the Kenai Penninsula is not the place to hide. They should have gone to Kake. Or Little Diomede. Or any off-the-grid place and if they kept to themselves they might have had a chance.

For me that's a problem, I don't think you can keep to yourself in those small towns in Alaska or Canada either. The people in them know you are not from there and they start asking questions.

Just like the neighbor down the road from the W's. He stopped in to welcome them. Stayed for 90 minutes talking to them. And believe me if their photos had not been plastered all over the news, he would have been back to talk more until he found out everything about them.

You have been there and you know that it is not like the lower 48. The people there are friendly and curious and in those small villages like Kenai they have nothing else to do but socialize with the new neighbors.

Yes many people have escaped to Alaska and quietly started a new life before the internet, before cable TV, before wholesale news coverage like CNN maybe. But not now. Now it is too easy for those friendly Alaskans to google your name on the internet.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

I'm hearing rumors of more police searches in Pike County tonight. Maybe the W's are breaking their silence and telling what they know. Maybe the Alaska trip was a way to get out of the line of fire before they told what they know.

I hope this is going to be a big break in this case. But I think it is JM talking not the W's. Remember that grand jury hearing for him a few weeks back? I think whatever he told the grand jury is causing all this fallout.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

AMs maiden name is either Crabtree or she is a half sister to a Crabtree.

Hypothetical situation-how far would you go to get revenge against someone that sold your loved one drugs that she overdosed and died on? If you say you would kill them, then how long would you wait to do it? Less than a month? Would killing them be justified if you thought it would save more lives in the long run?

If i had the ways and means, I would kill someone that sold to my son and he overdosed. Without a doubt.

http://wyso.org/post/memory-alisha-federici

Why not go kill the doctor who got them on the pain pills that led to the heroin addiction? You do know that people over dose on Oxycontin every day don't you? Pills they have a prescription for. Pills that lead to heroin addiction. So how do you determine that the doctor is any less guilty in their death? Because he is a doctor and not a dealer?

Why not go wipe out the pharmaceutical companies that produce and promote and advertise opioids like Oxycontin? After all they were the ones who told doctors there was a less than 2% chance anyone would get addicted to Oxycontin.

How about going after the FDA that allowed those drugs to be mass proscribed? Or the WHO that declared pain to be a vital sign that must be treated with pain pills?

Or how about just accepting that when your son began taking drugs he himself made a life choice that finally caught up with him.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

http://www.mydaytondailynews.com/ne...vestigators-want-know/u0j6B0ClMU9UbdLsQvYdpK/

FW, JW's grandma says 'They have nothing.' Referring to LE.

Does grandma really think they are going to tell her if they did find something? They took an enclosed trailer, remember that grandma? No way are they going to tell her if they found something in it.

“They have nothing,” Fredericka Wagner said Tuesday in a Dayton Daily News interview. “Their searches have turned up zilch. Nothing. And they aren’t going to either because Jake had nothing to do with it.”

Again no way is any LE in a murder investigation going to tell some random pastor in Alaska that they have no evidence on the W's. That might fly with his church members but I don't buy it for a minute. If that were true anyone could call the lead investigator and say they were some pastor and get information about what evidence they have. It is ridiculous to even contemplate. LE is not going to just freely give out any information about a murder case and especially not this one where they won't even release autopsy reports.


Good evening church, this is pastor Kelly,” the post reads. “I just wanted you all to know that I am aware of the current situation involving the Wagner family. The lead investigator in southern Ohio does not have any evidence that the Wagners are guilty in this case.”
Without identifying the investigator, the post said he “has my phone number and I have his.”

Grandma and the pastor need to get real because both of them sound a little delusional.

 

[Obiwankenobi]

IF the W's are in fact innocent folks just trying to escape the chaos that surrounded them in Ohio, it sure would suck to be them right now. I just caught up on the articles about their Ak adventures and how embarrassing it must be! To be questioned by a pastor of a church you are visiting? Friend or not, that just stinks. Knowing that the LE in AK has received so many calls about them? Wow, that would make someone very uncomfortable. And, am I the only one who finds it weird that AK LE have asked that people STOP calling in? Maybe AK LE knows the depths of the story from LE in Ohio?

 

[rsd1200]

I have heard it repeated on many occasions that the FBI and a few other alphabet agencies are assisting with the investigation. From day one. They can't take lead of a local murder (according to their website) they can only consult and assist in the background. I'm curious as to why you do not believe they actually are involved?
I believe they have been assisting. Federal agencies don't have to notify the local Alaska LE of an investigation. An arrest, maybe but not an investigation or surveillance. They would coordinate with the local AK FBI field office. That's why I am sure LE has known their whereabouts. I think tracking is one of the ways the federal agencies have been assisting. In that same spirit of cooperation, I also would not be surprised if the latest arrests will be federal charges.

I think so too.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

IF the W's are in fact innocent folks just trying to escape the chaos that surrounded them in Ohio, it sure would suck to be them right now. I just caught up on the articles about their Ak adventures and how embarrassing it must be! To be questioned by a pastor of a church you are visiting? Friend or not, that just stinks. Knowing that the LE in AK has received so many calls about them? Wow, that would make someone very uncomfortable. And, am I the only one who finds it weird that AK LE have asked that people STOP calling in? Maybe AK LE knows the depths of the story from LE in Ohio?

The people calling in to the APD are calling in tips about sightings of the W's. Ohio AG did not ask for information from the public on the W's whereabouts. He asked if anyone had any dealings with them or transactions with them including but not limited to vehicles, firearms or ammo. So unless some dude in AK bought or sold them a gun, vehicle or ammo, or had a conversation with the W's about those items, they don't want to hear about it.

 

[rsd1200]

Why not go kill the doctor who got them on the pain pills that led to the heroin addiction? You do know that people over dose on Oxycontin every day don't you? Pills they have a prescription for. Pills that lead to heroin addiction. So how do you determine that the doctor is any less guilty in their death? Because he is a doctor and not a dealer?

Why not go wipe out the pharmaceutical companies that produce and promote and advertise opioids like Oxycontin? After all they were the ones who told doctors there was a less than 2% chance anyone would get addicted to Oxycontin.

How about going after the FDA that allowed those drugs to be mass proscribed? Or the WHO that declared pain to be a vital sign that must be treated with pain pills?

Or how about just accepting that when your son began taking drugs he himself made a life choice that finally caught up with him.

Or when you watch friends and family die early, horrible, slow, deaths, from legal alcohol addictions, why not hold the liquor store owners responsible? An old friend died before 55 b/c of an addiction to one of the most addictive substances out there, nicotine. Legal, nicotine, served up in a legal pack of tobacco. I've lost family to nicotine. I helped my family raise tobacco for years, should I be held responsible for someone picking up their first pack? Doctors even went on record back in the 50s with adverts as to which brand they preferred. It was my choice to pick up my first pack, and my choice to lay them down. I feel for addicts. I've watched them when they're in d.t.s. That's when you can tell. Not so much when they're leveling out on their drug of choice. It's when that drug isn't available. Be it alcohol, smokes, Heroin, pills, or meth.

 

[rsd1200]

Does grandma really think they are going to tell her if they did find something? They took an enclosed trailer, remember that grandma? No way are they going to tell her if they found something in it.

“They have nothing,” Fredericka Wagner said Tuesday in a Dayton Daily News interview. “Their searches have turned up zilch. Nothing. And they aren’t going to either because Jake had nothing to do with it.”

Again no way is any LE in a murder investigation going to tell some random pastor in Alaska that they have no evidence on the W's. That might fly with his church members but I don't buy it for a minute. If that were true anyone could call the lead investigator and say they were some pastor and get information about what evidence they have. It is ridiculous to even contemplate. LE is not going to just freely give out any information about a murder case and especially not this one where they won't even release autopsy reports.


Good evening church, this is pastor Kelly,” the post reads. “I just wanted you all to know that I am aware of the current situation involving the Wagner family. The lead investigator in southern Ohio does not have any evidence that the Wagners are guilty in this case.”
Without identifying the investigator, the post said he “has my phone number and I have his.”

Grandma and the pastor need to get real because both of them sound a little delusional.

Whether guilty or not, I think that's just blowin' a bit too much sunshine. I might be cool to them, and all, but I'd keep one eye on them til all of this was over. In other words, their kids could come to my house to play, but mine wouldn't be going there. That's too much baggage and I don't know what they are right now.

 

[MVLM]

I may be speaking out of turn, but, I feel that at 14 that was a bit too young to have a serious bf, and especially to be going on vacations with him, and his family. This romance was not something that both sets of parents didn't know about and couldn't have put the brakes on, or at least pulled the reigns in, til she was at least a little older. Her parents had to give consent for her to go on vacation with them and she was around 14 or 15 at that time.

You are looking at them through your own cultural lens. In their culture, their relationship was normal and probably expected. DR had FR when she was 17. HHG was a young mom. Scroll through the social feeds of their friends and family--their relationship was standard.

I am no special snowflake that needs a safe space, but I bristled at these types of statements on this particular case since the murders first took place. I commented in the early days, too. Many posters are assuming that the Pike County culture is the same as Hamilton County, or any primarily middle class community in any state. That's simply not the case. If one were a sociologist, this would be a fascinating study--how people of different socio-economic status see the victims, their lifestyles, and possible "justification" for their murders. I quote the world justification because obviously there is none...but when a multi-millionaire offers a reward for information, and then pulls it based on limited knowledge of a grow op, that says there are indeed people who believe at least some of the Rs invited their homicides.

 

[jk204]

The people calling in to the APD are calling in tips about sightings of the W's. Ohio AG did not ask for information from the public on the W's whereabouts. He asked if anyone had any dealings with them or transactions with them including but not limited to vehicles, firearms or ammo. So unless some dude in AK bought or sold them a gun, vehicle or ammo, or had a conversation with the W's about those items, they don't want to hear about it.

To be accurate, as you said, "not limited to firearms ", so I understand any conversation or business dealing.

If you haven't spoken with them, then you should not call.

The PR says to call ohio BCI, not Alaska SP. I think that's the issue.

 

[Dudly]

This is becoming like the game telephone. LE says they want info about transactions and interactions with the Ws. MSM reports that they are wanted for questioning in 8 murders. Someone sees the news and tells his coworkers that the people that murdered 8 people live up the street from me.

 

[rsd1200]

You are looking at them through your own cultural lens. In their culture, their relationship was normal and probably expected. DR had FR when she was 17. HHG was a young mom. Scroll through the social feeds of their friends and family--their relationship was standard.

I am no special snowflake that needs a safe space, but I bristled at these types of statements on this particular case since the murders first took place. I commented in the early days, too. Many posters are assuming that the Pike County culture is the same as Hamilton County, or any primarily middle class community in any state. That's simply not the case. If one were a sociologist, this would be a fascinating study--how people of different socio-economic status see the victims, their lifestyles, and possible "justification" for their murders. I quote the world justification because obviously there is none...but when a multi-millionaire offers a reward for information, and then pulls it based on limited knowledge of a grow op, that says there are indeed people who believe at least some of the Rs invited their homicides.

I'm from their culture. I live in, and have worked in, Appalachia, further down than where the Rhodens live, my whole life. My own cousin married at 14. (Edit: and no, she didn't HAVE to.) I said "serious" bf. As in no car dating. No going on vacations w/other families. If he wants to visit at the house then fine, if he's a nice boy. (same rules applied for the male children). As far as poverty? I can tell you all you want to know about poverty in Appalachia. So no need to bristle at me.

Just to base one family's relationship, by scrolling through FB feeds, as "standard" for a whole region, is placing quite an assumption on other families throughout the Appalachian Region. We all have likenesses within our culture, but we are not cookie cutter cut-out families, like some sort of hillbilly stepford families. We raise our families how we see fit. My cousin was permitted to date and marry at 14, my parents did not allow it.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Whether guilty or not, I think that's just blowin' a bit too much sunshine. I might be cool to them, and all, but I'd keep one eye on them til all of this was over. In other words, their kids could come to my house to play, but mine wouldn't be going there. That's too much baggage and I don't know what they are right now.

And one gun loaded. For the bears. LOL

 

[rsd1200]

And one gun loaded. For the bears. LOL

One for me, and one for the better half, never know, there might be TWO big bears...

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I believe LE is getting closer to solving this case. They aren't putting pressure on the Ws for no reason, and they are doing it publicly making the pressure more intense.

I have always felt these murders were done by someone/s they had interacted with on a familiar basis. Someone who knew the layout of the homes well and the habits of the victims. I never felt it had anything to do with the family growing pot and still hold the same opinion.

Things I ponder.

Was this done to eradicate those who may have been able to ask for custody in the future in case the other parent was murdered? I believe some were murdered because they could identify the suspect/s but also believe others were murdered to remove any obstacle of obtaining custody.

It wouldn't be the first time multiple family members were murdered and the motive involved child custody issues.

IMO

 

[Hapworth]

“They have nothing,” Fredericka Wagner said Tuesday in a Dayton Daily News interview. “Their searches have turned up zilch. Nothing. And they aren’t going to either because Jake had nothing to do with it.”

Grandma, what about the rest of the family? You only said "Jake had nothing to do with it".

http://www.mydaytondailynews.com/ne...vestigators-want-know/u0j6B0ClMU9UbdLsQvYdpK/

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[crystal72]

I have been thinking what the motive could be. Drugs? Money? But neither of those made sense.
What about this and this is purely speculation I'm not accusing anyone of anything-I believe there was history or at least rumors of sex abuse with the old man Rhoden. A lot of times ppl abused will abuse. What if the someone thought there was sex abuse going on at the home and that nobody was doing anything to stop it? If someone had a child living there and thought/suspected she was being abused and nobody was protecting her that would be enough to want to kill the abuser and anyone who was allowing it yet not kill the little ones.

 

[rsd1200]

“They have nothing,” Fredericka Wagner said Tuesday in a Dayton Daily News interview. “Their searches have turned up zilch. Nothing. And they aren’t going to either because Jake had nothing to do with it.”

Grandma, what about the rest of the family? You only said "Jake had nothing to do with it".

http://www.mydaytondailynews.com/ne...vestigators-want-know/u0j6B0ClMU9UbdLsQvYdpK/

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Took note of that too. :thinking: