OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) - #31

[rsd1200]

Thanks Nickandnora! :tyou:

[FONT=.SF UI Text][FONT=.SFUIText-Semibold]My mom and dad were the first of many generations to leave the farm in NE corner of Mississippi.The Rhodes feel like family to me. Hard working people that would never accept handouts but took care of family.People who tried to go to church,attended family reunions,marked Decoration Day and many more funerals than weddings.[/FONT][/FONT]
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[FONT=.SF UI Text][FONT=.SFUIText-Semibold]I feel I know everyone in Piketon and the individual that kinda reminds me of Keyser Soze from 'The Usual Suspects' is RW.[/FONT][/FONT]
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[FONT=.SF UI Text][FONT=.SFUIText-Semibold]I was doing more reading on the BBL and I can't help but feel RW lured these poor families into signing their souls away to feed his enterprises & $ laundering beast. [/FONT][/FONT]
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[FONT=.SF UI Text][FONT=.SFUIText-Semibold]I'm attempting to work up the courage to read about what kinda stuff he had going in Florida. It will probably take years to to get though the way RW has used the BBL campgrounds to recruit the poor families in Piketon to do his bidding. RW skillfully deflects any detection from his 'businesses' so he smells like a rose.Gosh when I read his recollections of CHsr I thought if this guy didn't already own all the local politicians he could very well be one himself.I do not think I have the stomach to read much more about him tonight.

This is just my opinion(where's my :bodyguard: )and please feel feel to disagree.But be gentle.:scared:

If I don't check back in I'm in :hiding:

:cow:[/FONT][/FONT]

I swear i think there could be something there. There was a fella who was jailed, down near BBL. He was a dealer. Iirrc, he and RW had some type of connection. It's been awhile so please forgive. I'm going to have to look this fella up before I go further. Some of the timing is pretty odd though. It's probably nothing, other than "vibes" about RW.

 

[rsd1200]

Wonder why Kendra mentioned KR was helping her mom in lean times? Most people who have ex's don't worry about or stay involved with their ex"s. That's curious to me especially when there was a domestic violence order againest KR and his ex. Anyone know if Sta** Rig** only ex?

He's only been married once but had three living children, one deceased.
He and SR were married in May '91 and divorced in April of 2007 and were living in Waverly.
There were two minor children at the time of the divorce, LR and KR. ages 15, and 10, respectively.

I'd not think too much of that protective order. He could've gotten drunk and done something stupid. They could've been fighting over property and gotten pushy. Idk what went on here. It could have been a shoving match. The violations were in August of 2007 and the divorce was in April of 2007. Possibly fresh wounds. She posts his pictures, gets in on interviews, so it doesn't "seem" as if there's hate there on her part.

 

[MizStery]

:yeahthat:

hen I was looking into that Adams Health Solutions, there was a Daycare listed at that address but there were zero attendees listed on their site and no phone number or something else really odd about it. It looked like a fake business set up, too....
W

I swear i think there could be something there. There was a fella who was jailed, down near BBL. He was a dealer. Iirrc, he and RW had some type of connection. It's been awhile so please forgive. I'm going to have to look this fella up before I go further. Some of the timing is pretty odd though. It's probably nothing, other than "vibes" about RW.

:saber:
"Obi-Wan Kenobi
You are our only hope"

:cow:

 

[rsd1200]

[FONT=.SFUIText-Semibold]Just a heads up when referring to BBL and RW safer to jut use initials. (I think you got my drift ) :escape:
This is all from my scribbling notes while reading about this case over the last 2 years.
Back when I looked originally at Adams Health Solutions, LLC (this listed RW girlfriend initials (JW )as the name associated with AHS along with CRsr ) a number of businesses used the address 100 Grove Street in Peebles. RW (owned the property at one time). Also at one time several other medical businesses were operating out of that location. For the last few years, RW was leasing that space to a day care center. Later he sold the property to a person named McGraw? I believe.[/FONT][FONT=.SF UI Text]
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[FONT=.SF UI Text][FONT=.SFUIText-Semibold]His wife or ex-wife was a physical therapist they/she owned a Sports Med /Physical Thearpy clinic in southern Ohio. Not sure if she was still there at the clinic when it and number of other clinics were closed down. [/FONT][FONT=.SFUIText-Semibold]So any attempt to understand the holding of the BBL empire is very difficult because I believe it stretches even out of state of Ohio.But I have not looked at that.[/FONT][/FONT]
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[/FONT][FONT=.SFUIText-Semibold]I am going by my notes some of my article and videos are by now broken links. Please correct me if I have erred.

I know there are many who have followed this tragedy for years.

:cow:[/FONT]

I definitely get your drift. Oh, and if I remember correctly, I was looking at that particular trio the other day and RW, from what I could tell, is married, and his gf gave birth a few months back. Even if it the theory is only a theory, I still find them a bit sketchy.

 

[rsd1200]

:yeahthat:




:saber:
"Obi-Wan Kenobi
You are our only hope"

:cow:

May the Force Be With Us All! :saber:

 

[MizStery]

I definitely get your drift. Oh, and if I remember correctly, I was looking at that particular trio the other day and RW, from what I could tell, is married, and his gf gave birth a few months back. Even if it the theory is only a theory, I still find them a bit sketchy.

[FONT=.SF UI Text][FONT=.SFUIText-SemiboldItalic]hone: now rsd1200 that's connecting the dots.

So let's see how I'm doing so far. I had read RW was at one time a DJ . And that is how some crony of his contacted him to find out if he would be interested in purchasing the BBL when it went into bankruptcy years years ago.So now I find out; he also manages his girlfriend JW music career. :flashback:

I need a scoreboard to keep this straight.

This is exhausting,so now we know the musically gifted girlfriend is in addition the owner of the LLC car business. Whew,stay with me folks and this Is the same [/FONT][/FONT]Scioto Rivers Car business [FONT=.SF UI Text][FONT=.SFUIText-SemiboldItalic]CRsr owned.

The Force is With Me :saber:

Please all of you if I have it confused please correct me. I have read so much about this dude I need a flow chart to keep it straight.

:cow:



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[Betty P]

Kind of along a tangent of your pondering BBL, Chris's employer, I wanted to review and organize the information relating to Chris Sr & Kenneth's other business: growing pot.

rsd1200, I know you crunched some numbers on this previously. Do you still have them around?

In this article, a "law enforcement source" told CBS there were 200 plants in the 3 Rhoden grow ops

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/offici...ound-in-executed-ohio-familys-grow-operation/

A law enforcement source has confirmed that investigators found some 200 marijuana plants in the executed Ohio family's indoor grow operation, CBS News senior investigative producer Pat Milton reports.

The source said the size of operation indicates it was being grown for sale not for personal use.

Each plant could produce about one pound of marijuana. A pound of high-grade quality marijuana has a street value of about $2,000.

BBM

There was also this interview with Felix Jimenez, a retired DEA agent, discussing the market demand for MJ and competitive factors, which I found interesting.



Felix Jimenez, who worked as a DEA agent for more than 30 years, said the Piketon, Ohio, killings on April 22 are a message from Mexican drug cartels.

https://www.*************.com/ex-de...nd-message-through-ohio-massacre_2041944.html

“That style of murders we are seeing only in Mexico between the cartels,” Jimenez said during a video interview with Univision.

The former DEA agent said that since the legalization of marijuana in various states, demand has risen on par with the black market. He believes the family was competing with cartels.

“These types of murders, when people are tortured, is because they are looking for something,” said Jimenez, who believes failed monetary payments may have been a been a motive.

“The message is they are in control, they are going to have the complete market, and if you try to invade their territory these will be the consequences you will receive, and you will pay with death,” he said.


BBM

So, if we're looking at the grow ops being related to the murders, there are a couple of assumptions / theories to consider:

1 The murders were done by cartels or some other organized crime group; torture was involved

2. The motive was:
a. Revenge over missing funds (money was taken from the crime scenes); or
b To get rid of competition; or
c Some combination of the two

Here are my questions for discussion:

How much MJ would the Rhodens been capable of producing with their indoor grow ops? If they could harvest 200 plants at time, how often could they turn over a harvest of that size?

The article said each plant was capable of producing 1 lb of MJ. So shall we assume each harvest was 200lbs of MJ?

Who is buying the product each time it's harvested? Foreign cartel? Local cartel?

If they were growing for a cartel, the cartel would take care of sales and marketing. CRSr & KR would just harvest, load it up and ship it out,right?

If Rhodens were handling their own marketing and sales, who were they selling to and how? It's not like you can put an ad on Craigslist.

Were they selling it in a single lot to a wholesaler who then distributed it?

Which markets were they selling in? How far away? Was some of it sold locally, the rest shipped elsewhere?
How was it transported to market?

Who was collecting the money? How much of a cut were the Rhodens getting? Who else was getting a cut?

How did the Rhoden grow op relate to the other grow ops in the area? There were several large scale busts before and after the murders, with operations even bigger than the Rhodens. Were they competitors or just fellow farmers? Were they all selling to the same wholesalers or brokers?

Of all this grow op activity (especially the Rhodens) who in LE may have known about it? Local or federal or both?

I know we've answered many of these questions before, but I'm trying to organize the info and see if we can eliminate some possibilities.

ETA: For the sake of discussion, let's just set aside anything that BCI or local LE have said about Rhoden grow ops, cartels, etc. It's just so much white noise right now.

 

[Betty P]

After a year investigating, $10 million in drugs confiscated in bust that has connections to Mexican Cartel. Southwest Ohio is where the first arrest was made.
http://www.whio.com/news/charged-al...rom-mexico-middletown/3f4AztA78b7ciNJb4lUv2J/

Woah. Sinaloa Cartel.

Federal investigation, federal grand jury

Auxiliary police officer arrested in connection to the case

Initial arrest that spawned the investigation was done by local Middletown LE and Ohio State Patrol

As a result of the federal investigation and seizures, a federal grand jury has charged 12 individuals in a narcotics and money laundering conspiracy in a superseding indictment unsealed in Cincinnati on Thursday. Members of the group allegedly distributed fentanyl from Mexico in Middletown and sent proceeds back to the Sinaloa Drug Cartel in Mexico.

In addition, 40 defendants have been charged in San Diego, and additional defendants have been charged in Columbus, the Eastern District of Kentucky, the District of Kansas and the Eastern District of Washington.

Wonder if we can find the names of the defendants in the other states? Just curious.

The defendants in the Cinti case:

Jose Chavez-Meraz Chema, 55, Mexico
Rolando Chavez-Garcia, 24. Mexico
Favrisio Orozco-Meraz Favi, aka Gordo and Gordito, 34, Mexico
Raul Trejo Duende, 52, Middletown
Donte Holdbrook Jay, 24, Middletown
Mariela Penaloza, 25, Cleveland
Charleston Quinn Buddy, aka Buddy Rowe, 34, Mason
Frank Frazier, Jr., 24, Middletown,
Jesus Diaz Chuy, Chewey, 47, Ontario, Calif.
Jettie Bailey, 23, Middletown
Christopher Watkins, 23, Trenton
Courtney Bailey 24, Middletown

Also significant. This is how you do it. Don't just bust for drugs, follow the money, too.

When a sizeable amount of drug proceeds had been collected, the co-conspirators would arrange bulk cash transports back to Mexico, officials said. Investigators witnessed at least seven bulk cash pick-ups within the Southern District of Ohio, six on Tivoli Lane in Cincinnati and one at a Comfort Inn and Suites in West Chester. Transactions ranged from $25,000 to more than $180,000.

Did all the cash go back to Mexico?

Scroll below the top article at the link to another article about one of the local Middletown people busted as part of the operation

Apartment manager on accused drug ring member: ‘I just thought he was a stoner, a pothead’

Published: Friday, March 09, 2018 @ 12:19 PM
By: Rick McCrabb - Staff Writer

He sounds pretty much like a low level local guy, not a big fish.

According to the federal indictment that was unsealed and announced on Thursday, Frazier’s apartment was used as a “stash house” for the Donte Holdbrook drug trafficking organization that sold fentanyl and heroin to customers in the vicinity of Middletown. Another residence in the 4800 block of Holly Drive was also used to drop off the cross-country drug shipments.

Jeez, the Sinaloa Cartel has this system organized about as well as a string of McDonald's franchises.

Landlord said there were a lot of cars with Kentucky plates at the drug distributors apartment. I hope the feds monitored and got all the license plate numbers.

Here's another update about the apartments used as distribution centers:

https://www.journal-news.com/news/m...g-indictments/H2m7XGiH1EE4H9eRIg8mjN/new.html

Kudos to the new federal prosecutor, Benjamin Glassman. He's the same guy who investigated and prosecuted the Ohio State Patrol officer who was dealing drugs up north of Columbus.

Also this:

Holdbrook allegedly used trusted associates as “drug mules” to pick up the drugs in California or Arizona, where the drugs would be placed inside the fuel tanks of their vehicles provided by Holdbrook and driven cross-country back to Middletown for distribution. One of those “drug mules” is alleged to be Christopher Watkins, an auxiliary Seven Mile police officer, who was recruited for his law enforcement knowledge, which Glassman said “was disturbing.”

Wow. Interesting. We need to read the indictments for the Columbus and Eastern KY groups.

http://nbc4i.com/2018/03/08/three-c...ested-on-charges-tied-to-mexican-drug-cartel/

It is alleged that Watkins was recruited because his law enforcement experience and police training would aid the group in avoiding detection while traveling with the drugs. Watkins allegedly traveled to Ontario, Calif. to pick up narcotics in exchange for $1,000 cash.

 

[Betty P]

I definitely get your drift. Oh, and if I remember correctly, I was looking at that particular trio the other day and RW, from what I could tell, is married, and his gf gave birth a few months back. Even if it the theory is only a theory, I still find them a bit sketchy.

Remember, though, we can't sleuth and mention people here who haven't been named as POI's or suspects by LE. Yeah, it's frustrating, but .. I don't know who some of the people are whose initials you're mentioning, but if they're not POIs we can't discuss them here.

 

[MizStery]

“The message is they are in control, they are going to have the complete market, and if you try to invade their territory these will be the consequences you will receive, and you will pay with death,” he said.

How they selling it in a single lot to a wholesaler who then distributed it?

Which markets were they selling in? How far away? Was some of it sold locally, the rest shipped elsewhere?
How was it transported to market?

Who was collecting the money? How much of a cut were the Rhodens getting? Who else was getting a cut?

How did the Rhoden grow op relate to the other grow ops in the area? There were several large scale busts before and after the murders, with operations even bigger than the Rhodens. Were they competitors or just fellow farmers? Were they all selling to the same wholesalers or brokers?

You have been gracious to me in listening while
I drone on about my theories. :tyou:

There are are many knowledgeable posters like rsd1200 and others who have been number crunching on this thread since the beginning.

So Betty P I am going with the theory (I'm kinda weaseling out)the Rhodes had a local sponsor with deep pockets and very connected who acted as a cash machine to add liquidity and were helping expand their cash crop or your street drug of choice.

How this all fits I am not at all sure but your theory is as good as any others I've read. I am massaging it and trying to piece it togeather.

[FONT=.SF UI Text][FONT=.SFUIText-Semibold]Betty P I also would like to add and it's related to your post how did CRsr finance the huge newer buildings seen in the aerial shots.I would like to know if a local bank or say one in a neighboring county loaned CRsr the money. I'm pleading guilty to engaging in circular logic because it's like playing the 7 degrees from bbl link.[/FONT][/FONT]
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[FONT=.SF UI Text][FONT=.SFUIText-Semibold]I absolutely do not believe CrSr might have been trying to break away on his own. That wouldn't sit well to go from working for someone who had some lucrative investments to using those investments to go out on their own. [/FONT][/FONT]
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[FONT=.SF UI Text][FONT=.SFUIText-Semibold]What if the people higher on the food chain had a 'problem' with CRsr operations and used connections and knowledge of issues on a lower totem pole to incite anger and take care of his problem. More than once I have read speculation from locals saying they thought it was a distant family member perhaps even other locals who might have signed up.

:cow:[/FONT][/FONT]

 

[Betty P]

You have been gracious to me in listening while
I drone on about my theories. :tyou:

There are are many knowledgeable posters like rsd1200 and others who have been number crunching on this thread since the beginning.

So Betty P I am going with the theory (I'm kinda weaseling out)the Rhodes had a local sponsor with deep pockets and very connected who acted as a cash machine to add liquidity and were helping expand their cash crop or your street drug of choice.

How this all fits I am not at all sure but your theory is as good as any others I've read. I am massaging it and trying to piece it togeather.

[FONT=.SF UI Text][FONT=.SFUIText-Semibold]Betty P I also would like to add and it's related to your post how did CRsr finance the huge newer buildings seen in the aerial shots.I would like to know if a local bank or say one in a neighboring county loaned CRsr the money. I'm pleading guilty to engaging in circular logic because it's like playing the 7 degrees from bbl link.[/FONT][/FONT]
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[FONT=.SF UI Text][FONT=.SFUIText-Semibold]I absolutely do not believe CrSr might have been trying to break away on his own. That wouldn't sit well to go from working for someone who had some lucrative investments to using those investments to go out on their own. [/FONT][/FONT]
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[FONT=.SF UI Text][FONT=.SFUIText-Semibold]What if the people higher on the food chain had a 'problem' with CRsr operations and used connections and knowledge of issues on a lower totem pole to incite anger and take care of his problem. More than once I have read speculation from locals saying they thought it was a distant family member perhaps even other locals who might have signed up.

:cow:[/FONT][/FONT]

Yes, I agree with pretty much all of this. CRSr and KR (who I think were the two running the operations with help from GR) were both busy guys, working multiple jobs (KR commuting to Columbus) while running their grow ops. They wouldn't have time, IMO, to break away and manage the whole operation on their own. I'm guessing they were more like "contractors" who controlled the product and production and wanted a decent price for their product. Like any small farmer.

Someone else was the big wholesaler handling more at the higher level. JMO, I've always been of the opinion there may have been more than one Big Boss in the area. Another I've been suspcious of is a well known family who has owned hundreds, if not thousands of acres in the area for decades. The big land owners have "land contracts" with many of the same local folks who have been busted in recent years for drug dealing and manufacturing. I've wondered if they run a sort of "sharecropping" system (for lack of a better term) where the drug makers/growers are allowed to live on the land, but must share a percentage of their profits with the landowners.

Were or are these big local wholesalers working with other organizations who handle shipping, delivery and the retail network? I get fuzzy on that part. Somewhere along the line, someone had the kind of connections that allowed them to call in a professional hit on the Rhoden family. I'm fuzzy there.

ETA: As for the "seed money" CRSr needed to build the new barn, etc., yeah, that had to have been provided somehow, from a bank or other loan. It doesn't appear he took out a mortgage on any of his real estate (IDK). that should show up in public records. He could have used it as collateral for a loan.

Someone also could have fronted him the cash to invest in the grow op in exchange for a cut of the revenue or profit. During the time CR Sr built the barn, he and his family were making ends meet, but were still very poor.

 

[Betty P]

Another scenario

As for other local growers/players inciting problems to make someone come after the Rhodens, my theory has been that someone else at their level on the totem pole, who was angry with them for some reason, sent a information (a false accusation, etc.) up the chain of command to bring down a professional hit.

What if a jealous or upset local stole MJ money or MJ from CRSr, then told the higher ups that CRSr was stealing from them?

Was part of this battle between two competing groups working at the big wholesale level?

Where do the people fit in who were busted with the huge grow op right after the Rhodens were killed? Who were they selling product to? Who knew about it?

 

[rsd1200]

[FONT=.SF UI Text][FONT=.SFUIText-SemiboldItalic]hone: now rsd1200 that's connecting the dots.

So let's see how I'm doing so far. I had read RW was at one time a DJ . And that is how some crony of his contacted him to find out if he would be interested in purchasing the BBL when it went into bankruptcy years years ago.So now I find out; he also manages his girlfriend JW music career. :flashback:

I need a scoreboard to keep this straight.

This is exhausting,so now we know the musically gifted girlfriend is in addition the owner of the LLC car business. Whew,stay with me folks and this Is the same [/FONT][/FONT]Scioto Rivers Car business [FONT=.SF UI Text][FONT=.SFUIText-SemiboldItalic]CRsr owned.

The Force is With Me :saber:

Please all of you if I have it confused please correct me. I have read so much about this dude I need a flow chart to keep it straight.

:cow:



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I'm going to have to dig a bit. I'm not sure that CR1 ever owned SRTC. I think it was formed by RW in 2013.

RW is listed as the contact for four other types of medical type facilities too. I'm not sure the data is correct though. it's odd.

 

[Betty P]

I'm going to have to dig a bit. I'm not sure that CR1 ever owned SRTC. I think it was formed by RW in 2013.

RW is listed as the contact for four other types of medical type facilities too. I'm not sure the data is correct though. it's odd.

Were these facilities that ever operated or had any revenue reports filed with the IRS or state of Ohio?
Referring to the medical type facilities. SRTC was a viable business for some time, as I recall. I even remember googling the location.

Also remember the elder W matriarch and patriarch had a similar business in their name.

 

[MizStery]

Yes, I agree with pretty much all of this. CRSr and KR (who I think were the two running the operations with help from GR) were both busy guys, working multiple jobs (KR commuting to Columbus) while running their grow ops. They wouldn't have time, IMO, to break away and manage the whole operation on their own. I'm guessing they were more like "contractors" who controlled the product and production and wanted a decent price for their product. Like any small farmer.
<snip>
ETA: As for the "seed money" CRSr needed to build the new barn, etc., yeah, that had to have been provided somehow, from a bank or other loan. It doesn't appear he took out a mortgage on any of his real estate (IDK). that should show up in public records. He could have used it as collateral for a loan.

Someone also could have fronted him the cash to invest in the grow op in exchange for a cut of the revenue or profit. During the time CR Sr built the barn, he and his family were making ends meet, but were still very poor.

Betty P I have been wrestling with this theory a while. Please indulge me a
little longer. I know I'm wearing on all of your goodwill.

My gut has said all along there was pressure on CRsr and his kids to take their involvement in 'the street or cash stuff' to the next level.

CRsr,Frankie and CRjr had good skills automotive,carpentry etc. I think if their 'street or cash crop sponsors' were threatening them to up their game 'they would absolutely refuse'. I cannot see them involved in the 'big league stuff'. I think they did some low level stuff to help make ends meet but DR would never tolerate her kids in the 'big league' stuff or stick around. She worked her self to death for her family.

Were there other locals that were in 'the big league stuff' and figured either they get CRsr to participate and if not the family was a liability. The message was here's what happens to you and yours if you don't do as your told.

:cow:

 

[rsd1200]

Were these facilities that ever operated or had any revenue reports filed with the IRS or state of Ohio?
Referring to the medical type facilities. SRTC was a viable business for some time, as I recall. I even remember googling the location.

Also remember the elder W matriarch and patriarch had a similar business in their name.

His email address alludes to health issues of feet/ankles, on the one, but the biz is stated as: Publishing of newspapers, journals and periodicals. The biz address is in a subdivision on Lake Erie. He's described as a "partner". The biz address was last sold, to the current owners, in 2004. (there's a dup of this one in the records).

He is prez of Southern Ohio Sports Med. The biz is health and medical. Only lists a P.O. Box in Peebles, and gives a phone number. The SIC is: Offices And Clinics Of Medical Doctors

He's prez of Southern Ohio Medical, Inc., in Bainbridge, too. The industry is described as: Medical and dental practice activities, Human health activities. There is no SIC code, and it has a physical location, but there's nothing there but a B&B, w/acres of farmland. Unless it's been built on the farmland, since google earth's last update? Oh, and it kinda between Pike, and Chillicothe, in the middle of nowhere.

I'd put links but not sure if I'm overstepping TOS at this level, so am erring on side of caution.

 

[rsd1200]

Betty P I have been wrestling with this theory a while. Please indulge me a
little longer. I know I'm wearing on all of your goodwill.

My gut has said all along there was pressure on CRsr and his kids to take their involvement in 'the street or cash stuff' to the next level.

CRsr,Frankie and CRjr had good skills automotive,carpentry etc. I think if their 'street or cash crop sponsors' were threatening them to up their game 'they would absolutely refuse'. I cannot see them involved in the 'big league stuff'. I think they did some low level stuff to help make ends meet but DR would never tolerate her kids in the 'big league' stuff or stick around. She worked her self to death for her family.

Were there other locals that were in 'the big league stuff' and figured either they get CRsr to participate and if not the family was a liability. The message was here's what happens to you and yours if you don't do as your told.

:cow:

Or, he stepped into it, and wanted out, demanded out, and that just doesn't happen. Believe me, I know. Not from personal experience, but from close family experience who didn't realize just what they'd gotten into, and a local fella got killed over wanting out after he thought he'd just make some fast money and get out. It's not getting in, it's getting OUT.

 

[Betty P]

Betty P I have been wrestling with this theory a while. Please indulge me a
little longer. I know I'm wearing on all of your goodwill.

My gut has said all along there was pressure on CRsr and his kids to take their involvement in 'the street or cash stuff' to the next level.

CRsr,Frankie and CRjr had good skills automotive,carpentry etc. I think if their 'street or cash crop sponsors' were threatening them to up their game 'they would absolutely refuse'. I cannot see them involved in the 'big league stuff'. I think they did some low level stuff to help make ends meet but DR would never tolerate her kids in the 'big league' stuff or stick around. She worked her self to death for her family.

Were there other locals that were in 'the big league stuff' and figured either they get CRsr to participate and if not the family was a liability. The message was here's what happens to you and yours if you don't do as your told.

:cow:

I think this is a viable theory, one we've discussed here before. The large local land owner I mentioned earlier has land contracts with many locals who have been busted for manufacturing, possession, etc. of the harder stuff. It's possible they wanted CR1 and others in the family to get involved, too. As you say, that was probably too much for DR. If they refused or tried it and backed out, they would be in big trouble.

Big question is, if they were approached to handle harder drugs by some local mogul, who was the big mogul the locals were working with?

And where does the local recreation company fit in with this?

 

[MittenScarpetta]

I’m a new poster to this thread and am trying my best to read all of the preceding threads. While I didn’t follow this case on ws, I did follow the case in the media and on other forums. I’m somewhat familiar with the surrounding area (not Piketon itself) in real life and also with the Appalachian culture. I know this case has MANY rabbit holes and am trying my best to not be confused by the numerous theories.

With that said, I do have a question and it may have been asked and clarified previously. If so, I apologize in advance.

In regards to DS finding KR, I’ve noticed a couple discrepancies. Again, these very well may have been cleared up previously, but I haven’t found the answer yet. I’m hoping some of you can help me clarify.

It was stated that KR would padlock his camper if he wasn’t there. It was also stated by DS that he found KR in bed. This leads me to ask this: if KR padlocked his camper when he was gone, I can’t imagine he would be asleep in his camper without it locked at night. KR was clearly asleep when he was murdered because he was in bed. He also must not have heard his attacker when they entered his camper because he was murdered in bed which gives indication that he never knew what was coming. So, with that said, is it possible the murderer was in the camper with KR Thursday night and KR perhaps was letting this person stay the night, unsuspecting that he was about to be murdered? OR did KR leave his camper unlocked because he was expecting DS to be staying the night, KR wanted to go to sleep, DS wasn’t there yet, so KR proceeded to go to sleep and left the door unlocked so DS could just come in when he got there?

If I’m remembering correctly, it was stated somewhere that the camper was unlocked when DS went to check on KR.

 

[Betty P]

I&#8217;m a new poster to this thread and am trying my best to read all of the preceding threads. While I didn&#8217;t follow this case on ws, I did follow the case in the media and on other forums. I&#8217;m somewhat familiar with the surrounding area (not Piketon itself) in real life and also with the Appalachian culture. I know this case has MANY rabbit holes and am trying my best to not be confused by the numerous theories.

With that said, I do have a question and it may have been asked and clarified previously. If so, I apologize in advance.

In regards to DS finding KR, I&#8217;ve noticed a couple discrepancies. Again, these very well may have been cleared up previously, but I haven&#8217;t found the answer yet. I&#8217;m hoping some of you can help me clarify.

It was stated that KR would padlock his camper if he wasn&#8217;t there. It was also stated by DS that he found KR in bed. This leads me to ask this: if KR padlocked his camper when he was gone, I can&#8217;t imagine he would be asleep in his camper without it locked at night. KR was clearly asleep when he was murdered because he was in bed. He also must not have heard his attacker when they entered his camper because he was murdered in bed which gives indication that he never knew what was coming. So, with that said, is it possible the murderer was in the camper with KR Thursday night and KR perhaps was letting this person stay the night, unsuspecting that he was about to be murdered? OR did KR leave his camper unlocked because he was expecting DS to be staying the night, KR wanted to go to sleep, DS wasn&#8217;t there yet, so KR proceeded to go to sleep and left the door unlocked so DS could just come in when he got there?

If I&#8217;m remembering correctly, it was stated somewhere that the camper was unlocked when DS went to check on KR.

:welcome: Good to have you here MittenScarpetta! Are you a fan of the Kay Scarpetta books? Me, too.

Good questions, and they've been discussed before. JMO, any of those scenarios are possible, given what we know. And we don't know much. LE has released very little information and most of what we do know about KR's death comes from the interviews DS did in the news media.

From my understanding of DS's interviews, the padlock was on the outside of the camper.

(Apologies, but I've been extremely busy in another thread here at WS today doing a lot of searching archives, finding links and cutting and pasting quotes for people arguing over a different case. So I'm taking a break from doing the old search, read snip, copy paste, etc.)

Somewhere back in those DS interviews, he may have said he saw the padlock unlocked on KR's camper door that morning. It would have to have been unlocked as the one he referred to was on the outside of the camper door and DS would not have been able to enter without a key. Was there another padlock or deadbolt or something on the inside of the door? We don't know, or at least I've never found any details on that.

Also, I think DS said KR kept one of his dogs inside for security, so that would have worked if he was sleeping with door unlocked.

So any of those scenarios you've proposed could be accurate. Some here have speculated that KR was talking to a visitor when he was shot. Was it a visitor from Thursday night? We can't know for sure because LE has redacted all the info from the autopsy reports that would otherwise give us an idea of KR's time of death.

All we know is that DS said he talked to KR the day before when they decided to get up early and work on cars Friday morning. Some have said that was unknown to other family members as his daughter thought KR had left for work Friday morning.

Feel free to cut and paste some details here if you wish. I'm too tired to do it right now, haha. There are some links in our Media & Timelines area

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/s...SCUSSION-Pike-Co-OH-8-Family-Members-Murdered