OH - Pike County: 8 People From One Family Dead As Police Hunt For Killer(s) #34 *Arrests*

[Betty P]

Twenty years ago, a "successful" mid level commercial high grade marijuana operation may of yielded some relatively significant cash.

My impression, however, is that it is a very different market today. High grade marijuana is far more readily available as it is legal in a growing number of states and know how about producing it is no longer a "black art" obtainable only through word of mouth. Rather, detailed instruction are well, "a click away". Thus, the stuff no longer commands truly premium prices.

Then factor in that the operating costs of hi grade marijuana operations (expensive fertilizers, electricity for copious quantities of grow lights, heating, purchasing expensive lighting systems etc) can add up.

In addition, there is probably a big profit difference between being one of several mid level commercial wholesalers of an illegal substance and say, being the only wholesaler in an area after rivals have been uhmm...."eliminated" / intimidated and also controlling sales of the drug at the street level in the same area.

Thanks for this information. My impression of the Rhoden family grow op was that it wasn't producing a huge amount of profit, but was supplementing their regular income. All of the adults worked regular jobs. JMO, money from MJ was helping them fund their derby cars, buying a newer home for DR and the kids, etc. I also think CR1 and KR may have had an eye on establishing a legit commercial grow op if Ohio managed to legalize MJ. Recall a bill to legalize medical MJ was rushed through the Ohio House and Senate, signed by the gov just after the Rhoden murders.

Good points about a killer's possible motive to eliminate competition to increase profits. That's been discussed here before.

 

[Cryptic]

Thanks for this information. My impression of the Rhoden family grow op was that it wasn't producing a huge amount of profit, but was supplementing their regular income. All of the adults worked regular jobs. JMO, money from MJ was helping them fund their derby cars, buying a newer home for DR and the kids, etc.

My guess is that could have been pretty supplemental after profit sharing, possible personal dipping into the harvest, and operating costs were taken out. Then factor in declining wholesale prices for the “product” and the growers not having a local monopoly. In short, I suspect the CEO and the employees might have been disappointed, but not totally disenchanted with the venture.

 

[Betty P]

BBM
I think one or more, could too.

Tonight, I ran across a friend who I'd not quizzed about this case. Thus far, most say, off the bat; Someone sought, and got, payback. This was personal. Same response tonight. Someone had a vendetta against them, and they punished them. Possibly to make a point, too.

This wasn't spur of the moment, they sat around and thought about this, played it over, obsessed about it, tossed about how to cover their tracks, etc...



Pike County, Rhoden family: Scam artist using Pike County massacre, DeWine says



Ohio AG: Executions were "old-fashioned, calculated massacre" - CBS News

Someone hated these folks. Why?

Standard LE response from those who know drug wars, etc.:

Turf wars

Snitching

ETA: Drug trafficking is a business sector where anyone involved is an angry, mean, violent people. It's part of the job description.

Snitching is one of the worst things you can be of accused of in that biz, from what I understand. It will make people who've never met you furious, very frightened and willing to kill you.

 

[rsd1200]

Standard LE response from those who know drug wars, etc.:

Turf wars

Snitching

My friend is NOT, nor are any of my friends, LEOs.

 

[Betty P]

My friend is NOT, nor are any of my friends, LEOs.

Oops! Sorry for the confusion.

I was referring to people I've communicated with or interviews I've read.

 

[rsd1200]

My guess is that could have been pretty supplemental after profit sharing, possible personal dipping into the harvest, and operating costs were taken out. Then factor in declining wholesale prices for the “product” and the growers not having a local monopoly. In short, I suspect the CEO and the employees might have been disappointed, but not totally disenchanted with the venture.

Honestly, with all the work, the overhead, chance of blight and insect infestation, along with the chances of being caught w/200 plants, it doesn't seem it would be worth the risk of getting caught. Maybe, if it was something close to high end medical strains. However, mature plants are gonna weigh well over 20kg, and during that time period, would carry at least a two year sentence and possibly a hefty fine, I don't see it as a big money maker for them, if it were split between KR and CR1, after all was said and done. Maybe a third party got booted out and it didn't set well.

Also, if they got hit with trafficking charges, that would increase charges on them. It's one thing to get caught with illegal drugs of any kind, (I've no issue with weed at all, j.s., but the fed. govt. classifies it as Sched I, along with Heroin, while METH is a schedule II, go figure... ), but it's entirely another thing to be hit with trafficking.

Their used car thing, imo, could have been just as profitable, and legal. Some folks just like the game though.

 

[MittenScarpetta]

Honestly, with all the work, the overhead, chance of blight and insect infestation, along with the chances of being caught w/200 plants, it doesn't seem it would be worth the risk of getting caught. Maybe, if it was something close to high end medical strains. However, mature plants are gonna weigh well over 20kg, and during that time period, would carry at least a two year sentence and possibly a hefty fine, I don't see it as a big money maker for them, if it were split between KR and CR1, after all was said and done. Maybe a third party got booted out and it didn't set well.

Also, if they got hit with trafficking charges, that would increase charges on them. It's one thing to get caught with illegal drugs of any kind, (I've no issue with weed at all, j.s., but the fed. govt. classifies it as Sched I, along with Heroin, while METH is a schedule II, go figure... ), but it's entirely another thing to be hit with trafficking.

Their used car thing, imo, could have been just as profitable, and legal. Some folks just like the game though.

Speaking of trafficking, I’ve always understood any interstate trafficking that resulted in a murder or murders was immediately handed off and handled by the FBI.

Would it be safe to assume this case does not involve any interstate trafficking that directly lead to the murders since the FBI is not in charge of the case? Or am I mistaken?

 

[Dudly]

Speaking of trafficking, I’ve always understood any interstate trafficking that resulted in a murder or murders was immediately handed off and handled by the FBI.

Would it be safe to assume this case does not involve any interstate trafficking that directly lead to the murders since the FBI is not in charge of the case? Or am I mistaken?

Very good question...

 

[RAISINISBACK]

I've wondered about this. The Rs had their fair share of folks who they butted heads with, for lack of a better phrase, and, another poster mentioned that her sis said she thought the killers were afraid of the Rs. They could've had contact with some meth users, who were not going to be made out to be punks, or p*ssies.

BBM

Whoever killed the R's was invested in them emotionally as evidenced by the overkill. If it was a professional hit one shot to the head would have sufficed. Instead we have everyone receiving multiple shots except KR. That shows the killers were inexperienced and were unsure of their work. They shot everyone multiple times to make sure they were dead.

I have often thought of the phrase "wiping out a den of snakes" as being the frame of mind of the killers in this case. I agree the killers were afraid of the R's. I feel that in the killers mind the R's were like the big bad wolf that was impossible to fight against and win. It is like someone breaking into your house and instead of shooting them once, you empty the clip into them because you are afraid.

But if we go by fear alone then the logical deduction would be that CR1, GR, FR and KR would be the ones shot the most times since they were undoubtedly the strongest members of the group. While this held true for CR1, it did not hold true for GR, FR and KR.

I find it interesting that HG and DR were among those shot the most times. This would indicate that the killers were more physically afraid of these two women than they were of FR, GR and KR. Since that is not a reasonable assumption then the motivation to fire more shots into the two women was something other than just fear. That is why I feel that there was also hatred involved and maybe betrayal. Whoever killed the R's was terrified of CR1 physically but hated and felt betrayed by DR and HG.

KR was almost an after thought. The fact that they only shot him once would seem to mean they were the least afraid of KR and hated him the least and felt the least betrayed by him. In other words they didn't have the same intense feelings about him, but felt they had to kill him anyway, maybe to escape being caught.

IMO someone hated the R's and were afraid of them and felt betrayed by them. So the logical conclusion is the killers were someone very close to the R's, close enough to know and be afraid of what would happen if they crossed them. That is why I don't think it was "meth" users out for revenge for some imagined slight. It was deeper than that.

JMO


Someone hated the R's and were afraid of them and felt betrayed by them.

 

[rsd1200]

Speaking of trafficking, I’ve always understood any interstate trafficking that resulted in a murder or murders was immediately handed off and handled by the FBI.

Would it be safe to assume this case does not involve any interstate trafficking that directly lead to the murders since the FBI is not in charge of the case? Or am I mistaken?

They may be investigating and we'd not know. It won't be in the paper if they are looking at someone. No snark intended.

 

[kaykay543]

BBM

Whoever killed the R's was invested in them emotionally as evidenced by the overkill. If it was a professional hit one shot to the head would have sufficed. Instead we have everyone receiving multiple shots except KR. That shows the killers were inexperienced and were unsure of their work. They shot everyone multiple times to make sure they were dead.

I have often thought of the phrase "wiping out a den of snakes" as being the frame of mind of the killers in this case. I agree the killers were afraid of the R's. I feel that in the killers mind the R's were like the big bad wolf that was impossible to fight against and win. It is like someone breaking into your house and instead of shooting them once, you empty the clip into them because you are afraid.

But if we go by fear alone then the logical deduction would be that CR1, GR, FR and KR would be the ones shot the most times since they were undoubtedly the strongest members of the group. While this held true for CR1, it did not hold true for GR, FR and KR.

I find it interesting that HG and DR were among those shot the most times. This would indicate that the killers were more physically afraid of these two women than they were of FR, GR and KR. Since that is not a reasonable assumption then the motivation to fire more shots into the two women was something other than just fear. That is why I feel that there was also hatred involved and maybe betrayal. Whoever killed the R's was terrified of CR1 physically but hated and felt betrayed by DR and HG.

KR was almost an after thought. The fact that they only shot him once would seem to mean they were the least afraid of KR and hated him the least and felt the least betrayed by him. In other words they didn't have the s

Someone hated the R's and were afraid of them and felt betrayed by them.

I don’t think the killer was afraid of the women. But with the overkill there is obvious hatred and/or jealousy.

IMO this is a very personal killing which is usually done by people well known or related to the victims.

I don’t think it is a cartel etc. but I do think illegal drugs play into this. Even if it’s nothing more drug related than the killers were on meth. Drug culture is a different way of living

 

[kaykay543]

They may be investigating and we'd not know. It won't be in the paper if they are looking at someone. No snark intended.

I had read the FBI is helping in the case. But can’t remener now where I read that

 

[rsd1200]

I had read the FBI is helping in the case. But can’t remener now where I read that

The were as were other three letter depts. We won't be getting regular updates in the paper, on what they are doing though, and, I really doubt we'll know who they have talked to either, until this is all over. Unless those persons tell that they've talked to them. It's likely that most won't talk to them. They'll pull their time.

Agents with the U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration and FBI have also been called in to help with the case, he said.


DeWine declined to discuss if the expertise of Homeland Security might lend credence to early speculation that a Mexican drug cartel could be involved.

"The FBI has had some involvement, the DEA has had some involvement and that involvement is ongoing,'' he said during an hour-long interview at the Pike County Sheriff's Office. "Both agencies have assets and sometimes they have information that we do not have. And so it’s important for us to work closely with them and we will continue to do so. I know the FBI has been helpful, and contacts continue between our investigators and Homeland Security."

DeWine: Killers familiar with Rhoden properties

 

[Betty P]

Speaking of trafficking, I’ve always understood any interstate trafficking that resulted in a murder or murders was immediately handed off and handled by the FBI.

Would it be safe to assume this case does not involve any interstate trafficking that directly lead to the murders since the FBI is not in charge of the case? Or am I mistaken?

I'm not assuming anything in this case. It's possible the information about the crimes that DeWine and BCI are keeping so close to the vest also hasn't been shared with the FBI. I think, from scant info in the media, they've only had FBI run some lab tests. They may have told the FBI that it doesn't involve interstate trafficking. Seems a stretch since WV and KY are within a short drive of the crime scene.

Remember when it was reported that the W's were questioned numerous times after leaving Ohio for AK? JMO, that was federal agents using their trip to AK to get more info on the case. I don't think DeWine and BCI have shared much information with them.

 

[Betty P]

The were as were other three letter depts. We won't be getting regular updates in the paper, on what they are doing though, and, I really doubt we'll know who they have talked to either, until this is all over. Unless those persons tell that they've talked to them. It's likely that most won't talk to them. They'll pull their time.



DeWine: Killers familiar with Rhoden properties

Nearly 3 years on, I doubt any federal agencies, or many LE at all, are doing any investigating. BCI and PCSO are probably checking out any tips still trickling in, but they're probably not doing much more than that. MOO. IIRC, in the last communication with news media on the last anniversary, they said there was still 1 BCI officer still working on it and 1 officer from PCSO.

 

[MittenScarpetta]

I'm not assuming anything in this case. It's possible the information about the crimes that DeWine and BCI are keeping so close to the vest also hasn't been shared with the FBI. I think, from scant info in the media, they've only had FBI run some lab tests. They may have told the FBI that it doesn't involve interstate trafficking. Seems a stretch since WV and KY are within a short drive of the crime scene.

Remember when it was reported that the W's were questioned numerous times after leaving Ohio for AK? JMO, that was federal agents using their trip to AK to get more info on the case. I don't think DeWine and BCI have shared much information with them.

It does seem to be stretch. Not only because of the close distance to WV and KY, but because of CR1’s traveling to areas as far as Detroit for auto auctions. Could he have been traveling that far just for an auto auction? Absolutely. However, common sense says there was most likely more incentive to travel 5 hours away than some salvaged auto deals. The debt to profit margin doesn’t seem to be worth the hastle to travel that far to buy an auditioned car. Consider the cost of gas roundtrip, along with the cost to haul the purchased vehicle back, paying someone to go with him, spending an entire day on the road and/or in Detroit. Maybe I’m biased or looking at it from the wrong angle, but it just seems to be more of a headache to travel that far to make a little profit when all’s said and done. If it were me, there would have to be more incentive to waste a Saturday for a little profit. That’s JMHO. And from my perspective.

 

[rsd1200]

Nearly 3 years on, I doubt any federal agencies, or many LE at all, are doing any investigating. BCI and PCSO are probably checking out any tips still trickling in, but they're probably not doing much more than that. MOO. IIRC, in the last communication with news media on the last anniversary, they said there was still 1 BCI officer still working on it and 1 officer from PCSO.

I'd not doubt that they'd be very interested in the area, on both sides of the river. As much drug activity that there is in the region, Hwy 23 pipeline, Greenup, and Detroit, trips, add GR's history, and that of his mother and stepfather, and I'd not be surprised at all to learn that the Alphabet Boyz were still sniffing around.

 

[kaykay543]

Nearly 3 years on, I doubt any federal agencies, or many LE at all, are doing any investigating. BCI and PCSO are probably checking out any tips still trickling in, but they're probably not doing much more than that. MOO. IIRC, in the last communication with news media on the last anniversary, they said there was still 1 BCI officer still working on it and 1 officer from PCSO.

They did a huge search of Flying W Farm in Aug. Including BCI and Swat. The owner FW is the grandmother of JW.

 

[Cryptic]

Honestly, with all the work, the overhead, chance of blight and insect infestation, along with the chances of being caught w/200 plants, it doesn't seem it would be worth the risk of getting caught. Maybe, if it was something close to high end medical strains.

Some folks just like the game though.

I think that is a good assessment.

The big profit “glory days” of illegal marijuana growing when mid level wholesale producers of hi grade marijuana sold a rare product in a high demand market are gone. Sure, mid level illegal growers can profit, but the drug is far more readily available, then operating costs, profit sharing, risk of arrest, harvest “shrinkage”, and bad harvests make the profits nominal.

My guess is that mega level wholesalers and those who control entire supply chains do well. But they operate with the higher risks of arrest and violence from aggressive competitors. Likewise, those selling say, ultra-high grade plants as a specialized “supplier to suppliers” or those with high income clientele who are not inclined to beat the ‘hood or the backwoods for a cheaper wholesaler may still do relatively well.

When applied to the victims, I think the totality of the above diminishes the possibility of a motive based solely on drug profits. Even factoring Appalachian relativity regarding what constitutes a large sum of money, there just was no real money with the victim’s marijuana operation. Rather, the victims were largely in it as you said: “for the love of the “game” “. It is highly unlikely that anybody would the think “the game” at the victim’s level was worth eight lives (Cartels aside).

 

[Charliegizmo49]

I believe it was speculated to be 2 weeks prior. I have nothing to back that up with besides my own memory of public conversations. I do remember LM stating something in an interview or maybe I’m remembering wrong. I’ll have to go look at his interviews again.

The conflict began with her birth and was inflamed when another male came into the picture. Emotions ran very high with threats and domestic violence. All taken care of between the families. I don’t remember anyone expecting this type of outcome to settle it.