Ohio Bill Would Make Abortion Illegal Without Paternal Consent

[IrishMist]

Thanks, Nova.

No matter what people might tell me, one could never make me think what I chose was the wrong choice.

Amen, sistah. The ones that try to convince you otherwise are more worried about themselves than about you.

 

[Autumn2004]

Boy, SCM sure had you pegged.

Thanks Im getting misty here talking about her.

 

[Autumn2004]

I'm sure that's where I get my general life attitude-- you can't control the wind, but you can adjust your sails...

I agree completely you cant control your past but you are definitely in charge of your future.

 

[j2mirish]

I am pro all human life, as is every other pro choice person I have ever met. Perhaps other types exist - I just haven't met them.

Additionally I am pro allowing individual women to decide what to do with their bodies.

I do not find the two positions exclusive. I don't see a pregnant woman as a black and white moral canvas. The decision to keep or abort a pregnancy is mulit-layered, colored with innumerable shades of grey and extremely personal.

IMHO, it is too complex to legislate effectively without throwing women's rights out the window.

I believe the rights of an adult pregnant woman supercede the rights of a 3- month old fetus which cannot survive without the mother who is carrying it. The choice as to what to do with the fetus being supported is between the individual woman and God.

wow-- that is the "discussion" in a nutshell as far as I am concerned--
I agree with every word you typed.

 

[j2mirish]

Thanks, Nova.

No matter what people might tell me, one could never make me think what I chose was the wrong choice.

that is because it was your choice, and for you- a good one...enough said....the point is- it was your CHOICE :blowkiss:

 

[GraceBlue]

I do my cousin, he wanted the baby even though they had broken up. She got mad at him over something small at school and had an abortion. It tore him up so badly over it that he committed suicide.

I definitely know one thing my daughter is going to know, if she gets pregnant and doesnt want to raise it, I would gladly adopt the child if she wanted me too. I dont want her to feel she would have to abort it .

I am sorry about your cousin. I'm sorry he felt suicide was the answer to his problems.

That's great that you will gladly adopt your daughter's child if she ever got pregnant. You're too good. But no one is forcing her to have an abortion, if the guy who got her pregnant asks her to have an abortion, its her right to say "no" and that's what being pro-choice is all about. Its about being able to make a choice for your body and yourself.

I'm confused here though? I thought pro-lifers believe women should face the consequences of their actions and accept responsibility for getting pregnant in the first place? My question is, how is taking in your daughter's baby going to teach her to be responsible for her actions?

 

[southcitymom]

I'm confused here though? I thought pro-lifers believe women should face the consequences of their actions and accept responsibility for getting pregnant in the first place? My question is, how is taking in your daughter's baby going to teach her to be more responsible?

I can't speak for all pro-lifers, but I don't think the majority of them want a woman to carry a child to term in order to teach the woman responsibility. IMHO, that would be a fairly insane way of thinking.

I think most pro-lifers want the woman to carry the child to term because the alternative in their eyes is murder. I don't think they care much if the woman gives the child up for adoption to her mother or a stranger or leaves it at a hospital nursery - they just want the fetus to become viable at all costs.

 

[sherri79]

I can't speak for all pro-lifers, but I don't think the majority of them want a woman to carry a child to term in order to teach the woman responsibility. IMHO, that would be a fairly insane way of thinking.

I think most pro-lifers want the woman to carry the child to term because the alternative in their eyes is murder. I don't think they care much if the woman gives the child up for adoption to her mother or a stranger or leaves it at a hospital nursery - they just want the fetus to become viable at all costs.

well said. i know you may not agree but thank you for explaining it in a clear way.

 

[Rino]

I am pro all human life, as is every other pro choice person I have ever met. Perhaps other types exist - I just haven't met them....I believe the rights of an adult pregnant woman supercede the rights of a 3- month old fetus which cannot survive without the mother who is carrying it. The choice as to what to do with the fetus being supported is between the individual woman and God.

To me this reads as complete contradictions. And, as pointed out earlier it is not necessary to make this religious. As well as most pro-choice do not consider the aborted a child- simple the possibility of one.

Additionally I am pro allowing individual women to decide what to do with their bodies.

Fair enough, you can't have two beings with equal rights occupying one body. One may automatically have veto power over the other = pro-choice. One may not choose veto power = pro-life.
To be fair, to use the life of the mother is a red herring, it is the life of the fetus that is the abortion issue (again, other than life threating health of the mother).

I do not find the two positions exclusive. I don't see a pregnant woman as a black and white moral canvas. The decision to keep or abort a pregnancy is mulit-layered, colored with innumerable shades of grey and extremely personal.

IMHO, it is too complex to legislate effectively without throwing women's rights out the window.

In bold, I do.
Other than that I agree with the rest of your sentiments posted here. The law would be wrong in-so-much that the father is many a reason why a woman choosed to terminate. "The Godfather" comes to mind

 

[tennessee]

Thanks I love her dearly , I was slipping into depression dealing with infertility when she was conceived, she saved my life. I have changed my outlook on so many things because of her.

She is the reason why I became a vegetarian and look at every food for the value of nutrition instead of what sounds good. I want to be here to enjoy her and I want to give her the healthiest and best start I can. She is very easy to love, she is a very good 3 year old girl. She is a very sensitive sweet little girl and Im proud to be her mommy. She is my one goal I have in my life. My mom would never have done some of the things I would do for my daughter, she has told me this and she really respects me as a mom. As much as Im prolife if my daughter decided to have an abortion I would go with her to make sure she was safe, same way with tattoos, or anything else. I dont want her to feel like she needs to hide it, there is so much evil in the world I would feel responsible if I sent her into it alone.

Infertility sucks! We tried really hard for almost five years for a viable pregnancy. Luckily we found the right doctor and he helped make our family complete. I know just how much you love your daughter because I am the same way with my children.

Do you want the option of abortion to be there for your daughter? To me, that is what directs my feelings.

Amanda, my daughter, is 17. As much as I hope and pray that she won't become pregnant until she is ready, that is all it is. If she did find herself in that situation, I would help her explore all of her options. I really, really love babies so I wouldn't mind if she did go through with an unplanned pregnancy. However, I also know what it is to be alone through a pregnancy and being the one with all of the responsibility, the one looked down upon because you have a child out of wedlock. (Even though a heck of a lot of people doing the looking were pregnant before they married.) If she chose to have an abortion, I would understand and support her decision.

It don't think it is an easy decision for anyone. I am just glad the option is available.

 

[Nova]

I'm sure that's where I get my general life attitude-- you can't control the wind, but you can adjust your sails...

I've been waiting for years to hear that concept put so clearly. Thank you and could you please call me every day and repeat it? I need the reminders.

 

[IrishMist]

I've been waiting for years to hear that concept put so clearly. Thank you and could you please call me every day and repeat it? I need the reminders.

Sure. My time zone or yours??

 

[Nova]

I can't speak for all pro-lifers, but I don't think the majority of them want a woman to carry a child to term in order to teach the woman responsibility. IMHO, that would be a fairly insane way of thinking.

I think most pro-lifers want the woman to carry the child to term because the alternative in their eyes is murder. I don't think they care much if the woman gives the child up for adoption to her mother or a stranger or leaves it at a hospital nursery - they just want the fetus to become viable at all costs.

At last, we disagree! Sorry, but I think you're being too generous.

I have no doubt some anti-choice advocates are only concerned about the welfare of what they believe to be a human life (and we see posts from such people here).

But on the whole, this is a Puritanical country and lots of folks just want to see people punished for having fun. Which is why they see no contradiction in being "pro-life" and also pro-death penalty.

 

[Nova]

Sure. My time zone or yours??

Since you're not always clear about which time zone you're in, maybe we'd better use mine.

 

[IrishMist]

Since you're not always clear about which time zone you're in, maybe we'd better use mine.

Yes, that might be the best idea.

 

[sherri79]

At last, we disagree! Sorry, but I think you're being too generous.

I have no doubt some anti-choice advocates are only concerned about the welfare of what they believe to be a human life (and we see posts from such people here).

But on the whole, this is a Puritanical country and lots of folks just want to see people punished for having fun. Which is why they see no contradiction in being "pro-life" and also pro-death penalty.

people can be extreme on both sides. i have read of a doctor in Sweden who thinks it is ok to kill a child 1 month after it is born if it is deformed in anyway. i have seen people argue that abortion on the day before the due date is ok for any reason because it is not a person. i have heard people say a child is the punishment for sex so the mother should suffer and raise the child to "pay" for her sin. i honestly think most people are more moderate on both sides. my guess is that most people on the pro choice side think it should not be used for birth control. it should not be done in 2nd or 3rd term unless the mothers life is in danger. it should not be done to select the sex of a child. my guess is most people on the pro life side fell exceptions should be made in the case of rape or incest or danger to the mother. to assume that the other side is full of fanatics is short sided. so are you shocked we disagree? :blowkiss:

 

[Maral]

At last, we disagree! Sorry, but I think you're being too generous.

I have no doubt some anti-choice advocates are only concerned about the welfare of what they believe to be a human life (and we see posts from such people here).

But on the whole, this is a Puritanical country and lots of folks just want to see people punished for having fun. Which is why they see no contradiction in being "pro-life" and also pro-death penalty.

I don't normally disagree with you, Nova (although we've always disagreed on the abortion issue). But I do believe that the vast majority of anti-choice advocates are only concerned about the welfare of what they believe to be a human life, not just some, as you say.

And, for the record, I think it is a major contradiction for anyone to state they are "pro-life" and "pro-death penalty".

 

[Nova]

Maral and sherri, I hope you know I was very much thinking of both of you when I qualified my remarks about motivations behind opposition to abortion. I probably should have gone all the way and listed your hats.

I am by no means discounting the fact that many people have carefully reasoned and principled objections to abortion.

But I think it is naive to underestimate the effect of our Puritanical traditions on American views. Were folks less fundamentally anti-pleasure, we would have sensible drug laws and equitable treatment of sexual minorities. There's no reason to believe that--in many, many cases--opposition to abortion comes from a more enlightened point of view.

 

[Maral]

Maral and sherri, I hope you know I was very much thinking of both of you when I qualified my remarks about motivations behind opposition to abortion. I probably should have gone all the way and listed your hats.

I am by no means discounting the fact that many people have carefully reasoned and principled objections to abortion.

But I think it is naive to underestimate the effect of our Puritanical traditions on American views. Were folks less fundamentally anti-pleasure, we would have sensible drug laws and equitable treatment of sexual minorities. There's no reason to believe that--in many, many cases--opposition to abortion comes from a more enlightened point of view.

Okay, Nova, I see what you are saying, and I totally agree with you. :blowkiss:

 

[OneLostGrl]

I can't speak for all pro-lifers, but I don't think the majority of them want a woman to carry a child to term in order to teach the woman responsibility. IMHO, that would be a fairly insane way of thinking.

I think most pro-lifers want the woman to carry the child to term because the alternative in their eyes is murder. I don't think they care much if the woman gives the child up for adoption to her mother or a stranger or leaves it at a hospital nursery - they just want the fetus to become viable at all costs.

Or in a dumpster or flushed down a toilet at birth or kept in a suitcase in a closet or cooked in a microwave or tossed in a clothes dyer for a half hour or beaten to death for cying for a bottle in the middle of the night... I could go on and on- all of us here at WS read the sick f^cking things these "parents" do to their children after they are born.

At all costs. HA!

"They" (pro-lifers) don't care at what cost these babies become viable! So long as that strangers baby isn't aborted, they can sleep at night! Go back to their little families and forget about the new life that is going to be be stomped out in the days or weeks or years to come! But hey, it wasn't aborted!

I'm sorry, I don't agree! If socety is going to continue to kill their children (and they will) I'd rather it be before they are born, before they can breathe on their own, live on their own.. before they come into the world and depend on a "mother" to love and care for them. Before they have to live through years of abuse, physical and mental, before they are neglected and starved and thrown away.

I can sleep at night! Since having my own abortion and becoming stable on medication, I have began to take these children in... these poor poor children who's parents chose not to "murder" them before they were born. Some of these kids don't even know how to use a knife and fork. Some of these kids have scars on their bodies that make me break down and sob like a baby. Some of these kids have not only been harmed but have harmed others because it is all they have ever known! One of the kids I took in through the state was sent back to his mother and less than a week later was in the hospital because of "mom"!

Sorry- I DO think abortion is right and just and I'd rather know a child died before ever suffering and sometimes suffering is a given. These kids will never be normal, they never had a friggin' chance and THAT to me, is worse than murder!!