Identified! OK - Seminole, WhtMale 1561UMOK, 16-30, off I-40, Dec'78 - Jean Vincent

[honesty]

Thank You carbuff for finding that information. I am not that savvy at finding things like that.

Ontario Canada is the home office of the company that's way North of Oklahoma But a good ways East as well. If our Doe came from Ontario he did some major traveling and was headed back East (sans being found on the south side of the interstate).

I have entered the Providence of Ontario many times through Michigan. There may be other port od entries that I am not aware of as I have only crossed over from Detroit. Either way.... I will start looking at missing men from Canada. Thanks again for finding that information.

 

[carbuff]

I found an address for the manufacturer, Sunbeam Shoes, at 750 Elm St
Port Colborne, ON, L3K 5W1 Canada

That's on the north shore of Lake Erie just beyond Niagara Falls, so if he was heading back to that part of Canada, he might have taken either the route through Detroit to cross at Windsor, or via I-90 to cross at Niagara Falls. Map: https://goo.gl/maps/IuNB1

I haven't been able to find any information about where the shoes were distributed but I did find archived newspaper articles from Ontario and Quebec. This Montreal Gazette article from 1975 includes photos of three executives: http://news.google.com/newspapers?n...FQxAAAAIBAJ&sjid=-6EFAAAAIBAJ&pg=3565,1404837

Also, I noticed that while Doenet gives 6 months as the postmortem interval, Namus says 9 months, which would put it back into March and definitely sweater weather.

 

[honesty]

We must have been reading the sites at the same time! I also noted the difference in the approximate time the remains had been there.

I am trying to find a way to look closer at the jewelry to see what is on those coins. I was thinking they look kind of like coins, possibly catholic coins?

It says a DNA sample is available but not submitted. I wonder why it has not been submitted?

I really wish we had more clues. We have a photo of the jewelry and the boots, I wish we had one of the sweater as well and a tag to look at.

Here is something that I do know from my travels to Canada, I will use the Levi's as an example. Locals told us that Levi jeans were very expensive there. Mind you this was late 90's into the 2000's when we traveled up there and talked to locals in our travels. I am sure they were viewed as expensive in the 70's as well. So if he was from Canada he may have come from a upper middle class or better family.

 

[carbuff]

We must have been reading the sites at the same time! I also noted the difference in the approximate time the remains had been there.

I am trying to find a way to look closer at the jewelry to see what is on those coins. I was thinking they look kind of like coins, possibly catholic coins?

It says a DNA sample is available but not submitted. I wonder why it has not been submitted?

I really wish we had more clues. We have a photo of the jewelry and the boots, I wish we had one of the sweater as well and a tag to look at.

Here is something that I do know from my travels to Canada, I will use the Levi's as an example. Locals told us that Levi jeans were very expensive there. Mind you this was late 90's into the 2000's when we traveled up there and talked to locals in our travels. I am sure they were viewed as expensive in the 70's as well. So if he was from Canada he may have come from a upper middle class or better family.

I'm thinking he may have come from the US near the Canadian border -- Detroit area or Buffalo area -- where it's easy to go back and forth and he might have bought the boots on the Canadian side.

I've run into two common reasons why DNA is complete but not submitted. Usually it's just waiting on paperwork somewhere, but some LE jurisdictions don't actually make the submission until there's a request for it -- Massachusetts, where I live, frequently does that.

I enlarged the photo with the cross and coins. The one on the right is a US buffalo nickel, which people sometimes carry for good luck. You can just make out United States of America on top and Five Cents on the bottom, but it's very worn. I thought at first it was a keychain but I see traces of a mounting on the other side that makes it look like it might have been a bracelet.

I'm not sure what the middle one is. I don't see any writing. I thought at first it might be a krugerrand or the older South African schilling, but the antelope is facing the wrong direction (attached).

 

[carbuff]

Not sure this link will work. Hopefully it will take you to the enlarged version of the jewelry photo. https://identifyus.org/en/medias/full/7498

 

[honesty]

Thank you for the link. That helped a lot, as well as this time I used my ipad to view it which makes it easier to zoom in for me.

I really like the idea of this doe living close to the border and crossing over back and forth. A lot of teens like to do that on weekends for fun.

Looking at the coins, they both look quite worn. I remember people keeping the buffalo nickels for good luck. The other coin is really hard to figure out. I spent the past couple of hours looking at coins and vintage necklaces with putting in different search terms. I am not sure how the quarry gave me this, but I wonder if the coin was his zodiac symbol. I am looking at Capricorn in particular. Which would have been the sign at the time of discovery. The Capricorn animal in some of the examples I am looking at looks similar to the shilling you were looking at.

I am not into astrology, and I am not sure how that came up in my search but it is interesting to ponder. It seems different artists depict the sign differently.
Amazon.com: Mystical Sun Sign Horoscope Zodiac Pendants Necklace with Swarovski Crystal, Usa, Capricorn / December Birthstone in Pewter with Antique Finish: Cora Hysinger: Jewelry

 

[carbuff]

Oh, good find! I think you're right.

 

[sidneyia]

I definitely think it's a Capricorn medallion. It looks very typical for cheap zodiac jewelry from the 70s. The goat is usually depicted with a mermaid tail, but sometimes it has a normal goat body.

 

[honesty]

Can a medical person help out here? Can anyone tell me in easy terms what this means?

Septal apertures of distal humeri

IF I am understanding this correct that is a fracture in a join such as a elbow or a knee.

And IF I am correct in assuming this there is a MP I think we should look at. He is not on the rule out list.

Here is the link to the MP on DoeNetwork..

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/2068dmon.html

Name: Gerry Gascon
Missing since June 2, 1978 from Sudbury, Ontario, Canada
(This is Canada, the providence where the boots were manufactured in)
(this puts him in the 6-9 month time frame)

•Age at Time of Disappearance: 25 years old
(Age fits with the 16-30 years... doe and namus has different estimations)

•Height and Weight at Time of Disappearance: 5'9"; 140 lbs.
(Height fits)

•Distinguishing Characteristics: Shoulder length brown hair, blue eyes.
(Hair color fits, we do not know eye color)

•Marks, Scars: He has a scar on his left knee.
(I wonder which knee his scar is on and which knee our doe has the fracture on)

Circumstances of Disappearance
Gascon was last seen in Sudbury, Ontario on June 2, 1978.
He had been a patient at Algoma Hospital in the City of Greater Sudbury between May 25 - June 2, 1978. He was released on June 2nd, and has not been seen or heard from since. He was from the Walden area.
Police investigation to date cannot rule out the possibility that Gerry has been a victim of foul play due to the duration of time since he went missing.
_________________________________________________________________________

The hospital he was discharged from was a series of hospitals that are now big hospital. I am still digging for information to see if the Algoma campus was a general hospital or a psychiatric and or substance abuse hospital..

 

[carbuff]

side by side of Gary and the UID. The pictures aren't from the same angle so it's a little hard to tell, but he looks like a very good possible to me.

 

[honesty]

That is the only photo I could find of Gary on the internet. And its really not a very good photo.

I am still trying to figure out what Algoma treated. All I really keep coming up with is information on upgrades to the hospital group. It is a little frustrating.

 

[carbuff]

I think you should go ahead and submit him. He looks like a very solid possibility.

 

[honesty]

I will do that. Thank You.

 

[honesty]

Possible match submitted for Gerry Gascon.

 

[rainwater]

Bumping.

 

[carbuff]

Sadly, there are no new ruleouts for this UID as of today (12 November 2015). But his DNA is now "Status: Sample submitted - Tests complete."

https://identifyus.org/cases/4887

Jean Vincent has been added, too. I see he was mentioned upthread.

This is the full list:

Anthony Allen 1962 Arkansas
Steve Arrowood 1956 North Carolina
Steven Chait 1951 New York
ANDREW EWING 1956 California
Jay Pringle 1959 Oregon
JEAN MICHEL VINCENT 1958 Oklahoma

 

[bootscallahan]

This man was found dumped near Interstate-40 in Seminole County, Oklahoma in 1978. He was 16-20 years old, was about 5'8", and had died about nine months prior. The only two clues I found worthwhile were a Capricorn sign necklace and his shoes. They are "BeeJays" brand. The only thing I can find on them is that they are Canadian. The company is headquartered in Ontario, as seen here. You can see the logo on that page and the logo on the Doe's shoe is very similar, just without the maple leaf. Perhaps there's a family in Ontario who had a son or brother leave one day to hitchhike to California or Las Vegas and was never heard from again. Are there any Ontario missing persons who might fit this description? He'd possibly been born between 1958 and 1962 and likely in December or January (if he was in fact a Capricorn).
Possible Match?
Jean Vincent was a Capricorn. He was born in 1958 (making him 20 when this Doe was found). He lived in Ontario but had gone to New Mexico and then Arizona before he lost communication with his friends and was never seen again. He had gone there to look for a job. The shoes the Doe was wearing appeared to be work shoes/boots. To get from Arizona or New Mexico to the east coast, you'd take I-40 East, which is where this Doe was found dumped. Vincent was 5'6" and our Doe was estimated at 5'8". Finally, aside from the hair, I think the reconstruction of the Doe looks similar to Vincent.
And here is a map showing Vincent's last known whereabouts, where he said he was going, and where the Doe was found.
I called the Missing Persons unit of the Ottawa Police Service. A constable took down all the information and had me email them all the reasons why I think it's worth a look. He didn't seem too enthused, but that's understandable. I bet they get a lot of crackpots. I've emailed the Seminole Police Department, the Office of the Chief Medical Examiner, the chief of the Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation, and the detective in Ottawa assigned to the case. He replied:

Thank you for your interest and obvious extensive research. I can advise you that we are aware of the information you provided and are currently working with the Oklahoma State Police on the matter. If/when a positive match is made I’m sure the OSP will make that information public.

The unidentified case manager at the Oklahoma Office of the Chief Medical Examiner has acknowledged my email, although I don't think she's very excited about it:

I did. I was deciding what to do about it. It will wait. Websleuth / attorney, great.

 

[Raging Ranter]

Great work! This potential match looks entirely plausible, and the timeline fits perfectly. The only real difference is "reddish brown" hair for the UID, and "brown hair" for Jean Vincent. However, after 8 months in the elements, it would be very easy for brown hair to become bleached and discoloured from the sun.

I vaguely remember the "Beejays" fad in the late 70s. In Canada at least, they were as popular as Hush Puppies, which were also the rage at that time.

 

[Bill_Rodgers99]

Hello. I was just looking at the NamUs entry (NamUs UP: 4887) and a Jean Vincent with a DOB of 1958 is listed.

It would have been nice if the authorities in either Canada or Oklahoma had told you this immediately, if this is the same Jean Vincent.

Check out the exclusions list: https://identifyus.org/cases/4887

 

[bootscallahan]

Hello. I was just looking at the NamUs entry (NamUs UP: 4887) and a Jean Vincent with a DOB of 1958 is listed.

It would have been nice if the authorities in either Canada or Oklahoma had told you this immediately, if this is the same Jean Vincent.

Check out the exclusions list: https://identifyus.org/cases/4887

Thank you. The NamUs page that his Doe Network profile linked to did not list the exclusions, so I went forward assuming no one had been excluded. Damn.