OR - Kyron Horman, 7 yo Second grader, Portland, 4 June 2010 - #17

[SoCalSleuth]

Hi, I have heard that on the news twice now. I can't imagine them reporting this if it isn't what is going on.

I am trying to get thru to them but their line is continually busy !!! ;}

I don't see anything unusual at all about a DA or DA Investigator being at the home, especially when you have the media chomping at the bit. IMO, there are so many different reasons they could be there, it doesn't have any bearing on whether or not the family is involved.

 

[pufnstuf]

yes, i agree with you. remember the poor meter reader in the ca case? people thought he was guilty of something as well. sad. i do however, think the wording of some of the media reports are to blame. if you haven't been following closely from the beginning, it sounds suspicious that LE would tow a white truck and search his house. even though we here know, the truck needs repairs and his area was searched because of his tips.

Jim Kelley's house was searched? He hardly lives across the street from the Hormans.

 

[Calliope]

It doesn't say they arrived at the school at 4:18, just that in the scanner chatter, the LEO first mentions Terri's presence at the school at 4:18. So all we know is that they arrived at the school sometime between 3:30 at the bus stop and 4:18 when the LEO confirms a presence.

Just to bounce off your post...


FWIW, the scanner chatter doesn't indicate that 4:18 is when parents arrived. I think that is an erroneous assumption.

From the transcript alone, we have NO idea when the first officer(s) arrived at the school, nor do we know when the parents arrived or if they were present when LE arrived. Please note too that much of it was transmitted through another channel. The conversation at 4:18 - 4:20 appear to be two officers telling each other what task they're about to do (or have done).

You simply can't take that little bit of information and assume the parents didn't arrive until 4:18.

 

[MsFacetious]

Respectfully snipped. BBM. This is great advice. I have a 4 year old that is autistic. He weighs around 35 pounds. He often drops like that when he doesn't want to do something and it is extremely hard on my back. It is next to impossible to pick him up when he is kicking and throwing a tantrum. I would say most abductors are not going to want to deal w/ such behavior.

My 6 year old is the same size as Kyron. 3"8, 50lbs. She does this when she throws a tantrum. *I* could abduct a child doing this who wasn't more than 60ish pounds. But that is because I have had training in how to safely restrain, pick up and move a child doing that. A typical person would hardly even know where to start on how to try to pick them up without getting kicked, hit, bitten or head butted. This can really be VERY effective.

I loved my mother in law's eye rolling, claims that we were "exaggerating" and how she would have "no problem" dealing with a tantrum. (She only weighed 40lbs then.) Until my daughter threw her first tantrum for her. I backed off and said, "Here, I'll let the professional handle this one." She tried for 30 minutes and couldn't even get a grip on her because she kept getting kicked away. I walked over and had her picked up and moved in 60 seconds.

I am 5'1 and 105lbs. My MIL is twice my size. It would not matter what size the abductor was in my opinion, if it required moving a child throwing a fit like MY daughter...they would have to know what they were doing. It is entirely possible that they would be UNABLE to abduct the child, not just unwilling. :twocents:

 

[seeking truth]

A first inclination would be to panic, and then, having the bus driver immediately reacting and contacting the school will alleviate that for a few minutes, until the news comes back from the school end to say "We never had him marked as present here today" whereby the panic sets in again and thrusts out any complacency and ease with a situation which COULD have had an innocent answer (he missed the bus; he got a ride from another parent, etc etc....even if either is out of character for the child). Once the secondary panic sets in, it sounds like the Horman's were at the school as quickly as they possibly could get there. The road is twisty and turny all the way to the school and I cannot imagine you can go full bore around those curves. Once arrived, the next stage of alarms were sent out.

Meanwhile, the school has done its check of roll call, talked to the teacher whose room Kyron would be in, and have established something they can tell LE, who are now also alerted and making their way to the school, as well as to the home, where LE has requested one of the parents be when they get there, or Kyron is miraculously appeared.

It just isn't always that someone failed to do something in the beginning; sometimes it is that their hope and prayers are that the child is misbehaving in a manner that will be worth a talking to, and not a 12-day and counting search. KWIM?

Debs, I agree with you and and understand where all the posters are coming from as far as what to do when a child doesn't return home on the bus. Those close to me, including my many children, have told me I panic too much, and too quickly. They remind me of this even as they are reaching adulthood and beyond. So, it is just my first thought to call 911 and then start doing all I can. Not saying I am correct, just panic-y.

I realize I must come across as judgmental regarding what we know of the Horman's actions, or lack of action. It is hard to separate emotionally.

 

[Kimster]

All the "coincidences" in this are just mind boggling to me.:banghead:
I have not really decided what I think happened and I go back and forth every hour it seems, but man the coincidences are just driving me nuts.

I feel your pain. :banghead: Just when I think I've figured out what could have happened, a monkey wrench gets thrown into the theory. That is why I haven't been posting much lately.

I'm just hoping for a miracle and Kyron is found alive and safe somehow! It can happen!

 

[lilcatt]

:cat:
Why are we sluthing him? I am so confused

 

[Jaxson]

Nothing weird about it. They DID attend the vigil, but remained seperate because they don't know these strangers, but they know the people at the gym. They are friends with the owners and feel safe there. I wouldn't feel safe at a vigil that could be filled with all the people posting they think SM did it.

 

[raeann]

Can anyone clarify the teacher/sub situation the day Kyron went missing? I've been surfing articles and I can't nail it down. From what I'm reading it sounds like the main teacher was there in the morning and left and a sub came in? Does anyone have confirmation on the teacher/sub day of the science fair?

The school spokesperson said there were no subs at the school that day. Most likely, the boy interviewed misinterpreted or just thought that the parent volunteer was a sub. That is the person who left after helping the kids tour the exhibits as far as we know now.

 

[gwenabob]

:cat:
Why are we sluthing him? I am so confused

We shouldn't be. I think people just wanted his address at first so they could place the suspicious truck siting on the map. I don't think the man has any bearing on this case whatsoever except that he volunteered at the beginning that he saw a white truck on his street twice and it was suspicious to him.

 

[pufnstuf]

:cat:
Could someone please tell my who Mr. Kelly is and what his position is at the school. Thank you in advance.

Mr. Kelley was interviewed by the media about Kyron missing. He lives approximately a half mile from the Horman house. He was interviewed by the media, and he said that he saw a white truck come down his dead-end road at about 3PM the day Kyron went missing, and then later that night, at 2AM, he saw the truck again. But a woman on the road let her dog loose, and the truck left.

That's the sum total of Mr. Kelley's involvement in this case.

About the white truck, there was a white truck taken from the Horman residence today on a roll-back truck. However, there is nothing to suggest that the Horman truck was the same that Mr. Kelley saw.

 

[raeann]

Nothing weird about it. They DID attend the vigil, but remained seperate because they don't know these strangers, but they know the people at the gym. They are friends with the owners and feel safe there. I wouldn't feel safe at a vigil that could be filled with all the people posting they think SM did it.

The video linked above shows the SM and dad sitting out among the group of people inside the church. Perhaps the media who said they were in a separate room was referring to some other family members, such as the mom and SD and grandparents being in the separate room.

 

[txanmom]

Jim Kelley's house was searched? He hardly lives across the street from the Hormans.

oops, now i'm confused. i thought it was his house and area that was searched because of the tip. sorry. and i've been reading everything. another person's house was searched?

 

[BeanE]

Thanks BeanE (again!) I didn't understand about the 4:18 time for Terri. I am probably still not getting this all straight in my mind, but I'm not sure how you are coming to your way of thinking in this instance: You state that they may have gone to the school expecting to pick up Kyron and be on their merry way. Yet, by 3:46 the school was calling 911. They (Kaine and Terri) must have known by this time that the school personnel could not locate Kyron. Do we know if they ever made their own call to 911?

Is is possible to make a verifiable time line? I mean do we have enough information that is verifiable regarding what the Hormans' movements were as soon as the bus driver spoke with them?

Because the school called 911 upon discovering that they couldn't account for Kyron, doesn't mean they told the Hormans that. The Hormans may have been enroute to the school, expecting Kyron to be there, then arrived to find out that the school hadn't located him, but instead called 911.

Whereas a number of articles have said Terri called 911, I've been unable to find anything from the LE statements/documents that supports that. I generally rank LE statement/documents higher so far as accuracy/reliability than articles. That's why I think, despite the news reports, that Terri did not actually call 911.

We also have Kaine's email in which he said the Hormans called 911 "in concert" with the school. I'm not sure (physically) how one would do that. Perhaps upon reaching the school, the secretary with the Hormans on speaker phone called 911? I don't know.

I'm still chewing all this over, now that we've put more of the pieces all in one place.

I think we can put together a timeline for this time period, which would at least give us points at which we can say we know this person was here, we know this person called that entity, etc. It helps me to look at things on a timeline because whereas it won't tell me what did happen, it usually tells me a few things that couldn't have happened, and helps me get a better feel for what is most and least likely to have happened.

 

[gwenabob]

oops, now i'm confused. i thought it was his house and area that was searched because of the tip. sorry. and i've been reading everything. another person's house was searched?

Yes. A neighbor who lives across the road from the Hormans. NOT Mr. Kelly.

 

[For The Kids]

:cat:
Could someone please tell my who Mr. Kelly is and what his position is at the school. Thank you in advance.

Mr Kelly doesnt work at he school. He is someone who reported seeing a white truck the afternoon Kyron disappeared and also during the early hours of the morning which apparently he thought was suspicous. He said the white truck was being driven by a woman.

 

[Calliope]

Mr. Kelley was interviewed by the media about Kyron missing. He lives approximately a half mile from the Horman house. He was interviewed by the media, and he said that he saw a white truck come down his dead-end road at about 3PM the day Kyron went missing, and then later that night, at 2AM, he saw the truck again. But a woman on the road let her dog loose, and the truck left.

That's the sum total of Mr. Kelley's involvement in this case.

About the white truck, there was a white truck taken from the Horman residence today on a roll-back truck. However, there is nothing to suggest that the Horman truck was the same that Mr. Kelley saw.

Mr. Kelley also stated they searched the specific area, making it sound like he notified the police about what he'd seen. Which would mean he was interviewed by LE.

 

[SusieMom]

I hope you're right; I don't believe anyone can take much more of this.

On another note, I have a simple observation, do with it what you will. We have learned the sm took Kyron to school that morning and they were there at roughly 8 AM. I believe the picture was taken about 8:15 AM, could be off a minute or two. The point is - SM being there so early would have been able to get a "choice" parking spot as opposed to those who came later or those who had to park in the street.

Simply an observation.

just discussing the early time, in my situation, (I am a SAHM to 2 year old and also have a son who just finished first grade) when I am needed at school for a short time and can't bring my little one along (which is normal per school policy, exceptions are rare) I will try to do it as early as possible. Why? Because instead of trying to figure out childcare, my Dh will just either go into work a bit later than usual, or work from home for an hour if that's possible, keeping our daughter with him till I'm done. In fact, at times, he has even driven to the school with me and sat with DD in the car in the parking lot till I was done (school is on his way to work so that makes sense for us) Unless you have a regular sitter/relative or have some sort of drop-in day care arrangement, early morning babysitting coverage is actually pretty hard because most SAHM's rely on other mommy friends, and they are more likely busy getting their own kids off to school.

Like Kaine Horman, my Dh is a professional, an engineer, and he generally doesn't have much trouble working around an hour or so, its not like he has clients or patients or is involved with customer service. He just blocks off his schedule so that there are no meetings that he's expected to attend and takes however much leave time it requires, or covers it with flex-time.
For us, its the easiest solution.

 

[For The Kids]

Nothing weird about it. They DID attend the vigil, but remained seperate because they don't know these strangers, but they know the people at the gym. They are friends with the owners and feel safe there. I wouldn't feel safe at a vigil that could be filled with all the people posting they think SM did it.

In all honesty I doubt that most of the people that were there were strangers. In addition these were people who cared about Kyron and wanted to show support to his family.

 

[scandi]

I don't see anything unusual at all about a DA or DA Investigator being at the home, especially when you have the media chomping at the bit. IMO, there are so many different reasons they could be there, it doesn't have any bearing on whether or not the family is involved.

Hi SoCalSleuth, I finally got the news room and spoke with a lady who said, Yes, she had heard that too on the UPDATE.

When I asked why they didn't repeat this info on the 11am broadcast she said they use different scripts for their broadcasts and that doesn't mean what wasn't repeated is not true.

So I asked her if they had learned anything new about this. She said no, just that the DA's office is hanging {yes, she used that word lol} out at their house quite a bit now. Then she said of course, they aren't going to tell us anything more than that until something changes or breaks in the case.