OR - Kyron Horman, 7 yo Second grader, Portland, 4 June 2010 - Part #14

[manybooks]

First, I am about a day and 3 threads or so behind, but I just checked in and viewed the press conference.
I noticed comments on the ladies holding hands in the video, and I do have one comment on that - it appears that FIRST - as soon as the 4 are standing still, Terri looks for/reaches for Desiree's hand. Desiree's hand isn't there at the moment (she's moving some hair out of her face?) and she seems unaware of this action. Two seconds later, Desiree puts her arm down and clasps Terri's hand.
It looks very much to me like the hand holding is a planned/scripted action.
I don't read anything into this at all, except that perhaps someone told them to do this, maybe they 'heard' that people on meessage boards mentioned apparent anamosity between the women after the first presser, or whatever, but the hand-holding totally appears a planned/staged move to me.
And FWIW, Both women do appear to be TRULY supported by their husbands in this conference.

Yes, I see what you mean. The bio-mom, Desiree, reaches over and takes Terri, the stepmom's hand, and holds her hand. Then they continue holding hands. Very nice to see these two women comforting and supporting each other.

http://www.kptv.com/video/23886770/index.html

 

[human]

...and there's always the possibility that a relative brought in by a recognized parent or grandparent, is an RSO.

That's why I believe schools should have security cameras. Your picture is a good ID, and it's a hands-off approach. Screening everyone as they walk in, to make sure they're not an RSO, is a cost that schools may not be able to absorb.

A camera works for less than a school secretarial staff. :angel:

I had a parent (in my job with the schools but not as a teacher this year) that was an RSO. He had custody of little daughter and brought her to school everyday.

According to child welfare, who I immediately called when I found out, he can do that in my state.

I bet there are all kinds of RSO parents out there. What in the heck do schools do about that?

I imagine that you can stop them from volunteering, but I doubt that you can stop them from coming to school.

 

[indicat]

I know for sure that no poster here means for any thing they speculate upon to be cruel. But it is always wise to put yourself in the place of an innocent mother of a missing child and say what would I consider cruel? For that matter, what about the innocent other children, it is THEIR mother being unjustly accused. Why would anyone claim to be so concerned about Kyron, yet purposely say things that will for sure cause those other children pain?

jmoo

I understand what you are saying and leave it at that.

 

[Pensfan]

Deputies have not confirmed this search has anything to do with Kyron per the link below. However, as a former local and current "Localish", IF this search is related to Kyron, I'm thinking they must have something (tip, info, evidence, pings, ??) to start the search with the Columbia as there are a few bodies of water/waterways in the area. Just my own thinking here. Not sure what to think anymore, just so sad that Kyron isn't home yet.

http://www.kptv.com/news/23896847/detail.html

Maybe it is as simple as this is an area that wasn't completely searched. LE utilizes formulas for where searching should occur for each type of crime.

From Applied Cognitive Psychology 19:105-121 (2004)
"The probability of locating an offender’s residence decreases with increasing distance from an offence, and takes the general form:

SEE PAGE 6 FOR FORMULA

where f(dij) is the likelihood that an offender’s residence will be located at a particular location, dij is the distance from the centre of the grid cell (i) to an offence (j), a is an arbitrary coefficient used to provide an indication of the likelihood of finding a home, e is the base of the natural logarithm, and c is an exponent that determines the gradient of the function (Levine & Associates, 2000; Taylor et al., 2002)."

http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...E0BVgU&sig=AHIEtbTDoByic7B26BVlfbvJEWE1I2YW9Q

 

[Snail]

I am a teacher and I keep trying to put myself in this teacher's position. Here are my thoughts:
She thought Kyron left with his SM for an appointment. She saw Kyron with his SM earlier, SM said he had an appt. (but she really meant on another day, teacher was confused) She thought nothing of him being gone, because she had a conversation with SM.
Typically when students have an appt. during the AM, they do not come to school, they go to the AM appt. and then just show up later. But this day was special, Science Fair. So in a teacher's mind it makes sense, Kyron came just for that part, and then left.
As for the jacket and backpack, there are plenty of times my students have forgotten or don't "pack up" because they know they will be back later after their appt. Not to mention, from pics I have seen backpacks and jackets are on hooks, not on the child's desk, so the teacher probably isn't always aware of whose stuff is hung up.

 

[Wendy101]

Respectfully shortened. Remember that there is an 18 month old child in this home. If something "happened" and there wasn't LE presence at this home, the public would crucify the FBI and Sheriff's Office. (Reasoning=One child is already "gone"; don't risk the life of another even if it might only be a 50% chance. Read profile involving filicide.)

Amen!! As I have stated before, we are witness to LE working at it's finest!!

 

[Calliope]

That also means that they were still being supervised at 8:45, get to the class room, get into groups, tour the exhibits until 10 or 9:45 and then regular class. That is my take on this.

I agree.

IF we're to believe the boy's interview, the teacher leading the group noticed Kyron missing when they got back to class, which would have been around 10ish. Hard to say when he could have gone missing; if all the kids were milling about, in hallways going from class to class I can see where he may have wandered off or perhaps lingered somewhere and got lost in the crowd and she wouldn't have noticed.

In any case, IF we're to believe what he said happened, then Kyron was present at least at the point when they were in their classes preparing to take the tour.

 

[For The Kids]

First, I am about a day and 3 threads or so behind, but I just checked in and viewed the press conference.
I noticed comments on the ladies holding hands in the video, and I do have one comment on that - it appears that FIRST - as soon as the 4 are standing still, Terri looks for/reaches for Desiree's hand. Desiree's hand isn't there at the moment and she seems unaware of this action. Two seconds later, Desiree puts her arm down and clasps Terri's hand.
It looks very much to me like the hand holding is a planned/scripted action.
I don't read anything into this at all, except that perhaps someone told them to do this, maybe they 'heard' that people on meessage boards mentioned apparent anamosity between the women after the first presser, or whatever, but ithe hand-holding totally appears a planned/staged move to me.
And FWIW, Both women do appear to be TRULY supported by their husbands in this conference.

I totally agree. On Fridays video Terri seemed on her own whereas yesterday she was getting a LOT more support from Kaine. Again Terri got lots of support both days from her husband,

 

[BeanE]

Early on, there was a little confusion as to when SM called BM. She called her in early afternoon- before bus time- and told her to start driving. I think that perhaps their plan/custom is to meet half way or thereabouts so that neither had to drive the full (500mile?) round trip. I wondered about that myself until I remembered my parents meeting their grandchildren half-way.
(I'm assuming that Kyron went to Desiree and Tony's home for his visits).

Could we have a link for the source for that info please?

TIA

 

[Tiki]

Angel, so sorry for your loss

Angel,
I'm so sorry you lost your son. My son died in 2006, and I had (still have) those feelings of guilt, even tho' he was a young adult and living on his own for several years.
We will live with that the rest of our lives, won't we? My heart goes out to you and to these two moms and every other parent who has lost a child.
:blowkiss:

sorry all, I know I'm OT . . .




.

 

[pufnstuf]

I doubt he was thrown from a bridge, but I don't doubt he may be in the river. Water burial has been used by perpetrators many times before.

Especially women.

 

[glasscastle]

This is the video from yesterday's presser - its this one where they are holding hands.

http://www.kptv.com/video/23886770/index.html

If you watch at the beginning, Terri reaches towards the bio-mom's hand and she moves away to push her hair behind her ear. I think it is interesting.

I am new, BTW. I have a seven year old child who goes to a different PPS school and this case makes me so worried. Today was a field day at her school and there were many family members all over, it seemed like it would be very easy to people to come and go unnoticed.

 

[Billylee]

Eight-year-old Tanner Pumala says the first person to notice Kyron Horman was missing was a substitute teacher who was taking a head count as the second and third grade class was re-assembling after visiting other classrooms for a science fair at Skyline School last Friday.

"And she was like 'oh no where's Kyron there's only five' and Mrs. Porter was like it's okay calm down, calm down he's probably in the bathroom or getting a drink of water and she said alright I'm going to leave and she left, " says Tanner Pumala.

Tanner is Kyron's deskmate in their combined second-third grade classroom. Tanner says Kyron was in school for at least an hour Friday morning and that he saw Kyron's step-mother leave the school without Kyron.


This whole scenario bugs me. WHO LEFT? The teacher?, The substitute? And why was there a substitute if the teacher was there? Perhaps it was a teachers aid and not a sub? And whomever left where did they go? Did they leave for the day? Did they looking for Kyron, find him and then leave for the day?
This bugs me. And it bugs me that Kyron's backpack was there and if the teacher stayed there that day, then how come she never reported Kyron missing when he didn't come back from the bathroom?

I know this is just a youngster talking, but why would they make that up? Out of the mouths of babes.......

 

[cluciano63]

Is this river the closest body of water to the school? If not, it seems unlikely they would be searching there today with a tip or a good reason. Not the day after ending the official search, IMO.

 

[BeanE]

It is quite obvious that the Science Fair pic was taken on the 4th - THAT DAY - but yet when asked about when that pic was taken in a presser, LE said "no comment" - WHY? Its obvious - so why the "no comment"? I remember that last week and it really threw me. So, thoughts on why LE would not comment on when that pic was taken when its very obvious of when it was?

They are not commenting on anything so that people won't take just a few uncommented things and focus on them. It's not working very well.

 

[CharlestonGal]

To be honest when LE say things like that...its going to make the public question the Step Mother. Ie if it wasnt taken that day it changes things...so I think the cops are being kinda stupid there

To be fair, the authorities are between a rock and a hard place. Their job is to solve this crime - not worry about image control for a particular person. They NEVER should have gotten involved in that and they NEVER should have held a press conference to say it was their idea the parents should go to the gym. They should have remained neutral. They've now created a situation in that they publicly shielded and made excuses for the family once; now people are going to speculate about why they are not protecting them from other things as well. Some will reach the conclusion, "Hmmmm....I guess there might be something to it if LE didn't jump out there and deny it."

I posted before that this kind of situation is a learning experience. The internet/mass media has changed everything and LE will get better at this as they learn the hard way. They are not image consultants. As we can see.

 

[BeanE]

emma's buttocks
fence​

:floorlaugh:

 

[Skully]

I am a teacher and I keep trying to put myself in this teacher's position. Here are my thoughts:
She thought Kyron left with his SM for an appointment. She saw Kyron with his SM earlier, SM said he had an appt. (but she really meant on another day, teacher was confused) She thought nothing of him being gone, because she had a conversation with SM.
Typically when students have an appt. during the AM, they do not come to school, they go to the AM appt. and then just show up later. But this day was special, Science Fair. So in a teacher's mind it makes sense, Kyron came just for that part, and then left.
As for the jacket and backpack, there are plenty of times my students have forgotten or don't "pack up" because they know they will be back later after their appt. Not to mention, from pics I have seen backpacks and jackets are on hooks, not on the child's desk, so the teacher probably isn't always aware of whose stuff is hung up.

All good points, but one little phone call could make the difference! That's all I am saying.... not blaming the school or teacher, just want to know how this broke down for other kids.

 

[Calliope]

IIRC, the principal said there was a field day scheduled for Thursday. I wonder if they noticed anything suspicious during that time? Someone unexpectedly missing (or present)?

 

[suzet]

I'm having two problems with time frames. :waitasec:

1. Left the school at 8:45 am? Well, actually, we only have SM's word on that. Imo, that does not make it fact. ....... Oh, ok, ....maybe she was mistaken about the time???

2. If the first morning bell rings at 8:35 am and the second/final morning bell rings at 8:45 am, as stated someplace in our million threads, why, if you arrive as early as 8:00 am to see the Science Fair, would you dally long enough to cause a child to be "barely on time/late" in getting to the classroom by waiting until 8:45 am, after most everyone is inside their classrooms and out of the hallway? So yeah, that 8:45 gets to me. ... especially since Kyron apparently never made it the extra distance down the hallway to his classroom as far as we know.

Now I am sure scads of you will say it's nice to take your time and leisurely stroll 45 minutes through the exhibits at a tiny school, or maybe a child needed to use the bathroom at 8:35 am, therefore, he might not make it to class 'til 8:45 am, or with the school's lax policy, what difference does it make anyway, but it's just something that's been bugging me, that's all.