Oscar Pistorius Defense

[DebinGA]

One of the worst facts for OP is Mangena's "rods" clearly showing OP changed his aim during the pause after the first "hip" shot. The DT hired at least 2 ballistics experts. Thomas "Wollie" Wolmarans, if we believe Roger Dixon, seems to have been the bat v. gun/OP v.RS screams "sounds" expert and Jannie Van der Westhuizen seems to be the ballistics/blood spatter expert. IIRC Dixon described both experts and their wives being present for the outside "sound" test.

Van der Westhuizen's website: http://www.wescoforensics.co.za/specialised_forensic_firearms_and_tool_mark_examinations%20.html

Tom "Wollie" Wolmarans site: http://www.ballisticforensic.co.za/index.html [nothing about being a sound expert]

It's really inexplicable why Roux scheduled Dixon to follow OP and testify to things he had little if any knowledge about, given actual expert VdW.

 

[shane13]

OP denied shooting a robot--or planning to,

Sam Taylor implies Fresco also fibbed about it.
But didn't he get immunity for things?
Or maybe just the Tasha's incident?
.
http://newday.blogs.cnn.com/2014/03...t-gun-out-of-car-without-warning-judge-hears/

"...On Friday, Pistorius' ex-girlfriend Samantha Taylor testified about the sunroof shooting incident, saying the two men laughed and joked about shooting a "robot," a traffic light, before the gunfire. Fresco denied those claims....}

Forensics: I think you have this as sunroof incident.
So I guess no addition, unless you wish to add "robot"?

 

[shane13]

What happened with Oscars sore shoulder and them supposedly swapping sides of the bed that night?

This is an important point.

Did OP really have a shoulder problem?
And relatedly, did he really wear a medical pain patch? I have been unable to see it from that side photo.

He certainly seems to have had no problem bashing in the door [great vibrations passing through him I can tell you] and also carrying RS about and down those stairs.

 

[Nausicaa]

Foensics:
Great job.

one thing I spotted i believe is not quite correct.

"* That hollow points aren't the only type of ammunition used in his firearm (Courtesy of DebinGA)"

IIRC OP merely said that ammo fit his gun.
it was someone here who added that that gun only takes hollow point ammo.
I later proved the error in that by posting a wiki article that listed the ammo that gun takes besides hollow pts.

But I do not believe it was Op who said "only.' He just said that ammo fits his gun. Actually a true statement in as far as it goes.

Shane, he didn't say "only". But he answered the question why he used that ammunition by saying "It is the type of ammunition used for my firearm".

That answer is entirely meaningless if it is just one of several types of ammunition used for his arm, as he well knows is the case. So taken in context his answer implies, falsely, that his gun is specifically or exclusively intended for hollow-nosed ammunition.

 

[Karmady]

Shane, he didn't say "only". But he answered the question why he used that ammunition by saying "It is the type of ammunition used for my firearm".

That answer is entirely meaningless if it is just one of several types of ammunition used for his arm, as he well knows is the case. So taken in context his answer implies, falsely, that his gun is specifically or exclusively intended for hollow-nosed ammunition.

Someone just posted what they say is a verbatim quote and his answer was:

"It's ammunition used for my type of firearm."

 

[Giles]

This is the Vanity Fair article from June 2013 featuring Hilton Botha:

http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/2013/06/oscar-pistorius-murder

Thanks for the link. That was a fascinating read...

 

[Nausicaa]

Someone just posted what they say is a verbatim quote and his answer was:

"It's ammunition used for my type of firearm."

I'm using the reported text and quite happy to be corrected if someone has a link to the video. It makes scant difference to my point. As an answer to the question he is implying that he didn't make a choice of lethal dum-dums as the gun calls for that ammunition.

To my knowledge there is no such thing as a gun that can only fire dumdums and they are the more expensive option.

 

[sleuth-d-]

just looking at the oldwage cross-exam on mrs stipp.

he goes slowly through the window lighting with her. as if he has 'trapped' her with the toilet window having light within it and yet the bulb was not working. she sticks to her story. i think this makes her more credible.

dixon later showed how a small opening of the door, and therefore a small opening within the door, would allow ambient lighting into the toilet area. gotta love dixon.

[not keen on the oldwage habit of asking a question, and then turning his back as the witness answers.]

via youtube: Oscar Pistorius Trial: 24 Monday 2014, Session 1

also op watch at start of this sequence: frustrated pad attack at 17:48.

 

[Viper]

<RSBM>

IMO, OP shooting Reeva at about 3:15:51 is supported by Col. van der Nest's testimony regarding blood spatter analysis and arterial spurts on the stairway walls and the sofa in the downstairs lounge.

<RSBM>

BIB Even if you back the time of the Standers and Baba arriving from 3:25 back to 3:22, that is still too much time for Reeva's heart to still be beating.

A woman typically has about 4.5 liters of blood, a larger man has about 5 liters. The heart pumps +/- 5 liters of blood though the body every minute when the body is at rest, it can pump up to 5 times that amount (25 liter per minute) when a person is physically active. The amount of time from when she was killed to when she was brought down the stairs was at least 7-9 minutes.

To believe that Reeva's heart was still alive and pumping blood as she was carried down the stairs, you would have to believe that her severed arteries "selectively" bled only on the staircase. Why would they not bleed on the duvet? Or on the pathway from the bedroom to the staircase? Or while OP was standing at the top of the staircase waiting (there would have been a blood pool there)?

The body can do only so much to stop the bleeding of two severed arteries. Typically when an artery is severed the victim or someone near him immediately applies enough pressure to stop or slow the hemorrhaging, but that did not happen. The blood evidence points to Reeva, and her heart, having died in the WC.

We are being asked to believe that Reeva's brain had died, her breathing had died, but her heart stayed alive and kept pumping blood throughout her body for 7, 8, 9, and up to 22-25 minutes. Here is an image of a woman that obviously bleed to death over a period of time. Please note the massive amount of blood loss. That is what bleeding to death looks like. And yet we are supposed to believe that Reeva bled to death without bleeding very much. !!!Warning, very graphic image of a murder victim and massive blood loss!!!

http://www.documentingreality.com/forum/attachments/f10/262006d1302117992-before-after-_sc08659.jpg

Please compare that graphic murder scene to the one that we are discussing, here:

http://juror13lw.files.wordpress.com/2014/04/10.jpg


Sorrel I just spoke to the Director of Crime Scene Investigation at my local police department in Texas. I encourage you and others to pick up the phone and do the same; these are very polite professionals that do not mind handling a question from a curious citizen. She said the following:

"It depends on how much time had passed since her heart stopped beating, but any force against the body could eject blood from the gunshot wounds. CSI is a "subjective" science, not an "exact" science. Nothing is definitive at the crime scene and mistakes in identifying patterns are common."



ETA: I corrected the one broken link.

 

[shane13]

Someone just posted what they say is a verbatim quote and his answer was:

"It's ammunition used for my type of firearm."

Thank you karmady!

I well explained all this with several posts in the last few hours.
And indeed with one a few days ago listing the wiki article showing that that gun takes other than hollow points.

The only issue i raised now is that op never said "only."
Of course, he was evasive, but his statement was not a lie.

 

[lithgow1]

Does anyone else think that OP has made a tactical blunder with the highway shooting and Tasha's testimony? The former looks very fake because of his inability to have it confirmed and latter looks even worse as in addition to having witnesses deny his version of events he also stuck to the 'I didn't have my finger on the trigger', which on the face of it looks ludicrous. I just can't see any benefit to putting those stories before the court when it seems all they would do is help to cast doubt on his overall honesty and credibility.

 

[Viper]

Here is more medical information; remember that Dr. Stipp said Reeva's eyes appeared dry and milky or cloudy as soon as he saw her:

Quoted from the link below:

"The eyes often exhibit some of the earliest postmortem changes, as a result of stoppage of capillary circulation and settling of red blood cells. If the eyes remain open, a thin film or cloud can be observed within minutes on the surface. "

http://www.defrostingcoldcases.com/g...rval-evidence/

 

[Gbtaketwo]

Thank you karmady!

I well explained all this with several posts in the last few hours.
And indeed with one a few days ago listing the wiki article showing that that gun takes other than hollow points.

The only issue i raised now is that op never said "only."
Of course, he was evasive, but his statement was not a lie.

I wonder if that was OP being evasive and being economical with the truth or whether his defence team had envisaged this question and coached him how to answer it .
It is odd that Nel didn't challenge him on this point more . Maybe he will deal with it when the defence ballistics guy gives testimony.

 

[shane13]

Does anyone else think that OP has made a tactical blunder with the highway shooting and Tasha's testimony? The former looks very fake because of his inability to have it confirmed and latter looks even worse as in addition to having witnesses deny his version of events he also stuck to the 'I didn't have my finger on the trigger', which on the face of it looks ludicrous. I just can't see any benefit to putting those stories before the court when it seems all they would do is help to cast doubt on his overall honesty and credibility.

I agree with you, lithgow.
Ultimately it's probably about desperation.

Tasha's; if he did not want to admit guilt, he had to invent a cockamamie story.

But the highway shoot and then not remembering who took him home etc was very poor. Pehaps I have a theory on this too. JMO.

He may have had someone going to lie and say he drove him home, but that person at the last minute changed his/her mind.

 

[shane13]

I wonder if that was OP being evasive and being economical with the truth or whether his defence team had envisaged this question and coached him how to answer it .
It is odd that Nel didn't challenge him on this point more . Maybe he will deal with it when the defence ballistics guy gives testimony.

Well OP for once was not lying. only someone here said that that gun takes only hollow points.

And I've said several times here too that Nel has let OP off the hook on some important matters.

E.g. Nel coild have come back and Qed him; "I know that gun Mr P.
It takes regular bullets. Why did you search out these rare extra-lethal black talons?

What could Oscar say at that point?

Like: "Milady, if someone were coming after me to harm me, I would want to stop them cold, or OTOH, if my beloved GF were threatening to call the police because I imprisoned her or assaulted her, I'd have to stop her cold too."

Point being Nel indeed had some good Qs coming, but chose not to.

We will see how it ends up.

 

[lithgow1]

I agree with you, lithgow.
Ultimately it's probably about desperation.

Tasha's; if he did not want to admit guilt, he had to invent a cockamamie story.

But the highway shoot and then not remembering who took him home etc was very poor. Pehaps I have a theory on this too. JMO.

He may have had someone going to lie and say he drove him home, but that person at the last minute changed his/her mind.

I wondered about that too shane - it would be easy (though risky perhaps) to have someone say 'Yeah that was me'. Maybe his mates are sick of covering for him, especially now its escalated to a murder charge.

 

[shane13]

I wondered about that too shane - it would be easy (though risky perhaps) to have someone say 'Yeah that was me'. Maybe his mates are sick of covering for him, especially now its escalated to a murder charge.

Well I was thinking more of the possibility of a sib.

I've pointed out that in his autobio, his brother wrote that "i'd give my left nut for you."

 

[DebinGA]

What areas of contention are left for Roux's ballistics expert to clear up at this point, since the order of shots, angle of shots, position of Reeva when first hit, general area OP fired from, etc., seem to be pretty much settled imo? Is whether OP's gun requires intentional trigger pulling for each bullet fired contested? In other words, how might another ballistics expert help OP? Unless the expert can convincingly show OP didn't reposition himself or his gun after the first shot, OP is sunk imo.

 

[crasshopper]

After some light reading on blood spatter I've learned that blood Cast off has a single characteristic "tail" which indicates the directionality of the movement producing the cast off, with the only exception the satellite stains which have a "tail"in the opposite direction. While cast off spatter could yield an arc the horizontal translational direction of travel would be indicated by the "tails" of the bloodstains.

If the body were held completely still at the top of the stairs and OP jiggled her up and down the blood stain "tails" would indicate that change in direction, some with a tail pointed vertically up, and some with the "tails" pointed down. Add some angular momentum or horizontal movement of the body to the up and down "jiggle", because OP was rushing, and the direction of the bloodstain and tail would be oblique.

That does not appear to be demontrated in the evidence pictures available of the suggested area of arterial spurting.

This is based on reading but I may try to confer with the local PD.

 

[homegirl]

it would be the best place to shout for help, in her situation, locked in that toilet. roux was at pains to describe how unlikely it was that ms burger heard screams from a closed toilet. and yet she was so confident that she did.

the window was also a possible escape route for rs, that might lead op to think there was no alternative but to shoot. [jeans on the ground directly below the toilet window]

op described a window slamming against the frame. the bathroom window doesn't slam open. maybe he did slam the toilet window shut at some point during 'cleanup'.

shame nel didn't ask him if the toilet window was open, op might have said 'i don't remember'.

BBm I have wondered about that window and about what Reeva was doing in the WC for all of those minutes besides screaming in fear. It seems to me that she would at least open the window to scream for help. I did note that the blinds in the WC were drawn up about half way, the same as the blinds in the bathroom window.

I would also like to know if her cell phone could get a signal in the WC. If she had it with her, I would think that she would have called for help.

You are right that OP would probably say that he didn't remember if the window was open. Nel questioned OP very briefly about where things were in the WC and the bathroom. He put a photo on the courtroom monitor and asked him where things were. OP said that he did not remember where the bat was,where he put the phones, where exactly the gun was, or where anything else was in the bathroom.

Nel did not question OP about where on the WC floor the keys were, but OP pointed out where Reeva was, and said that Reeva's cell phone was where the plank was. When asked where the plank was, he said he didn't remember.