PA PA - Bedford, 'Mr. Bones' WhtMale 30-35, 585UMPA, 30-06 rifle, gold dental wk, camping equip, Oct'58

[othram]

Bumping
@othram

Looking into it.

 

[Richard]

It has been 66 years since this Unidentified man's death.

 

[Magnum P.E.]

Bumping @othram

 

[Richard]

585UMPA

''585UMPA - Unidentified Male​

Artistic rendering of the victim; Victim's jeans, backpack, camping mess kit, and rifle case

Date of Discovery: October 9, 1958
Location of Discovery: Bedford Township, Bedford County, Pennsylvania
Estimated Date of Death: 1 year prior
State of Remains: Not recognizable - Partial skeletal parts only
Cause of Death: Self-inflicted gunshot wound to the head

Physical Description​

Estimated Age: 30-35 years old
Race: White
Gender: Male
Height: 6'2" to 6'6"
Weight: Unknown
Hair Color: Brown to dark brown, straight.
Eye Color: Unknown
Distinguishing Marks/Features: Robust build. Wore plastic contact lenses. Of European ancestry. Cranial vault described as being large, round and with a narrow nasal aperture.

Identifiers​

Dentals: Available. Gold dental work.
Fingerprints: Not available.
DNA: Available.

Clothing & Personal Items​

Clothing: From the initial 1958 report: Gray wool hunting socks with red top, blue denim dungarees with a wide black leather belt, white tee shirt, white jockey type shorts, black leather motorcycle type jacket with full length zipper and slant zipper pockets, and black "engineering" boots, length 12 5/8", width of sole 4 1/2", heel 3 1/4 ", top height 10 1/2", with buckles on the outside. Numerous articles of clothing found nearby. No hat was found.
Jewelry: None located.
Additional Personal Items: Right corneal plastic contact lens - specifications (Rx) knownBooks - two poetry and one science-relatedExtensive amount of camping equipment including a canteen and backpack. Most appears new with little to no indication of use.ToiletriesBlack wallet containing $38High-powered .30-06 Springfield rifle and gun caseAmmunitionBrass key with "Active 195 Avenue A" stamped on it. It had been duplicated by Active Locksmiths, 195 Avenue A, New York, NY, but this was a locksmith's stamp and the unidentified person is NOT ASSOCIATED with the property at this address.

Circumstances of Discovery​

The victim's partial skeletal remains were found in an wooded area approximately 1/2 mile north of the Pennsylvania Turnpike's Midway Service Plazas, in Bedford, and about 85 miles east of Pittsburgh. He had died from a gunshot wound to the head, but while authorities believe the gunshot wound was self-inflicted, they don't know if it was an accident or suicide.

Investigators believe the man was well off because of the gold dental work and the contact lenses, which were unusual for the time. The contact lenses were traced to a Chicago manufacturer and fitted by an Illinois physician, but there are no records of the buyer. The books suggest the victim may have benefited from higher education, or may have been a serious student of poetry or literature.

The rifle was sold in Fort Wayne, Indiana in 1939, but no further tracing of the gun's ownership could be found. The brass key hasn't been matched to any location. The dental work has yielded no matches.

While the victim appeared well-equipped for camping, investigators found no eating utensils nor food supplies.

Investigators do not believe the victim was from the Bedford area. Anecdotal information may connect this victim to the state of Kentucky: Prior to the victim's discovery, in September 1957, local police in Bedford Borough encountered a loitering man in possession of a rifle. This unidentified man said he was enroute from Kentucky to Canada.

Anthropologic examinations conducted in 1959 and again in 2003 revealed the victim to have been an adult male of European ancestry, likely between the ages of 30-35 with a living stature of about 6'4" (+/- 2").''

A very good case summary. There is one incorrect/ inaccurate statement, however. The rifle was actually a Remington 721A, chambered for the popular .30-06 Springfield cartridge. Since that model rifle first came out in 1948, it could not have been sold in 1939. It was still being produced and available in 1958. See my post number 800 in this thread.

While most of the camping items appear to be newly purchased and commercially made, the knapsack/ backpack is definitely of WW II US Army issue vintage. It is a rather odd or out-of-place item when compared with all the other new stuff. Only someone who already had such a knapsack - or someone familiar with one - would be likely to have one.

It has been over 66 years since this man's body was found. He remains unidentified.

 

[Magnum P.E.]

A very good case summary. There is one incorrect/ inaccurate statement, however. The rifle was actually a Remington 721A, chambered for the popular .30-06 Springfield cartridge. Since that model rifle first came out in 1948, it could not have been sold in 1939. It was still being produced and available in 1958. See my post number 800 in this thread.

While most of the camping items appear to be newly purchased and commercially made, the knapsack/ backpack is definitely of WW II US Army issue vintage. It is a rather odd or out-of-place item when compared with all the other new stuff. Only someone who already had such a knapsack - or someone familiar with one - would be likely to have one.

It has been over 66 years since this man's body was found. He remains unidentified.

They still can’t get the part about the rifle right, eh Richard?
I doubt we will see this one solved unless they do modern DNA and forensic genealogy. And no one seems to want to do that.

 

[Joykitty]

Hi everyone! I stumbled upon this and read the whole thing through. WOW! (It took me two days to do it)
I’m also interested in finding out who Mr Bones is and I see that some of you guys are willing to help fund the $5,000 to $10,000 to do it. I’d also be willing to chip in a few hundred.
I know that through DNA SOLVES we can chip away at it, but I didn’t see his case listed yet. There are several from PA there. Any word on whether LE will submit his case to them? I know he’s low priority considering he appears likely to be a suicide/accident with no family looking, but he was still a person who deserves an identity, and there is obviously some interest here.

 

[Magnum P.E.]

Hi everyone! I stumbled upon this and read the whole thing through. WOW! (It took me two days to do it)
I’m also interested in finding out who Mr Bones is and I see that some of you guys are willing to help fund the $5,000 to $10,000 to do it. I’d also be willing to chip in a few hundred.
I know that through DNA SOLVES we can chip away at it, but I didn’t see his case listed yet. There are several from PA there. Any word on whether LE will submit his case to them? I know he’s low priority considering he appears likely to be a suicide/accident with no family looking, but he was still a person who deserves an identity, and there is obviously some interest here.

Welcome to the rabbit hole!
LE seems to have no inclination to do the testing that would identify Mr. B. Maybe we should start a Go Fund Me, but I don’t know the rules on doing that. I will say that if the money was already there, there would be little excuse for not doing the DNA.
The suicide idea always seemed sketchy to me. Not dressed to be out there, brand new cooking kit, no food, but enough ammo to clear the area of all deer. And no abandoned vehicle nearby, so how did he get there in the first place? Having camped a lot (when my spine was younger) it seemed set up to me.
If someone can get Othram or somebody to take the case, I will throw in some money. This seems very solvable.

 

[Magnum P.E.]

I sent a message to DNA Solves (Othram) offering to cover a sizable piece of the cost of testing if they take the case. Maybe this will get the ball rolling.

 

[Magnum P.E.]

I received a reply from Othram. He said that they will look in to it but he does not think funding is required at this time.

I hope that if funding will help get this done that we would each kick in a small amount of spinach. I know I will, as soon as a mechanism for doing so is available.

 

[Magnum P.E.]

Here is a nice summary of the case. The dna tests done eleven years ago were comparisons of living relatives of Charles Conner to the CODIS database. No matches found, and I would not expect any. CODIS is great for matching people to themselves (i.e., matching a suspect to his own blood left at a crime scene, for example), but it is not very good for identifying remains.

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[Magnum P.E.]

Here is a nice summary of the case. The dna tests done eleven years ago were comparisons of living relatives of Charles Conner to the CODIS database. No matches found, and I would not expect any. CODIS is great for matching people to themselves (i.e., matching a suspect to his own blood left at a crime scene, for example), but it is not very good for identifying remains.

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A small correction: the dna comparisons were between Mr. Bones and living relatives of Charles Conner, using the CODIS tests of the time, which sampled only 7 loci, I believe. They have never done the modern testing and forensic genealogy.

 

[Warwick1991]

Identifying this man is long overdue. I will contribute if Othram is able to work on this case.

 

[cenazoic]

Seen in Cadiz on the exact same route that would have been used to get to Bedford area.

Add that to Conner’s killer being seen washing blood out of his sedan delivery vehicle exactly halfway between Lima and Bedford,

To me, this is a strong indicator that Mr Bones is not Conner. First, you (universal you) have him transported (dead) some 350 miles from the murder scene. Risky, but okay, I can buy that so far.

What I struggle with is the idea that Forsythe then drove ~125 miles back towards Indiana before washing the blood out of his car. If anything, this implies (to me) the probable general location of Conner’s remains.

We do have the connections to Chicago, Indiana, Kentucky, and Canada

Just to clarify - the reported hitchhiker wasn’t ever identified as Mr Bones, was he? If not, then KY/CAN are speculative only.

That is the old 6 STR test used for CODIS

(Caveat: not an expert, and possibly an idiot.) My (possibly very mistaken) understanding is that partial profiles can still be used to exclude someone, because the same markers will be present in the same locations as the full profile. So if Conner was compared to Mr Bones’ partial profile, and Mr Bones’ markers were not in the same locations as Conner’s, then he could be reasonably excluded as a match. Please feel free to correct this if I’ve got this bassackwards!

 

[Magnum P.E.]

To me, this is a strong indicator that Mr Bones is not Conner. First, you (universal you) have him transported (dead) some 350 miles from the murder scene. Risky, but okay, I can buy that so far.

What I struggle with is the idea that Forsythe then drove ~125 miles back towards Indiana before washing the blood out of his car. If anything, this implies (to me) the probable general location of Conner’s remains.



Just to clarify - the reported hitchhiker wasn’t ever identified as Mr Bones, was he? If not, then KY/CAN are speculative only.



(Caveat: not an expert, and possibly an idiot.) My (possibly very mistaken) understanding is that partial profiles can still be used to exclude someone, because the same markers will be present in the same locations as the full profile. So if Conner was compared to Mr Bones’ partial profile, and Mr Bones’ markers were not in the same locations as Conner’s, then he could be reasonably excluded as a match. Please feel free to correct this if I’ve got this bassackwards!

They compared Mr.B’s markers to a RELATIVE of Conner. As no first degree relative (parent, sibling) was available, they went a bit further. With the few loci tested, one would not expect a match. I don’t know the basis for the ruleout, but it is all moot point if a new sample is taken and forensic genealogy is done. We could know, and pretty quickly, who Mr. Bones is. No exhumation is necessary. People have offered to chip in to pay for the testing.
I agree on the highly unlikely scenario that someone would drive hundreds of miles with a dead body in the back of their panel truck, but hmm….
1) Demographics match (age, gender, size, hair color)
2) Rifle was bought in Ft. Wayne, Conner’s killer was banished down the road to Ft. Wayne by a judge. It is not far from Lima.
3) Forsythe was seen washing the blood out of his panel truck about halfway between Lima and Bedford on the direct route between the two.
4) A family member told me that according to family legend, Conner’s body was “Under a highway in Pennsylvania”. Possible source of this perhaps garbled story, Forsythe’s defense lawyer, who a few years after the killing defended Conner’s son in an unrelated matter. I found that strange that he did so.
I looked at hundreds of missing persons cases from the states surrounding Pennsylvania. Started with New York and worked my way clockwise to Ohio. In every case I found some reason to exclude the missing person: too short, circumstances wrong, etc. I found no reason to exclude Conner, other than the absurd idea that someone took a body that far. Absurd is not impossible.
Having said that, I agree that it is more likely that Mr. B. is someone else. But if we just do the testing, we will know.
I can’t explain the reluctance of LE to do the testing. Maybe they don’t want to set the precedent of spending a large chunk of spinach on these old cases. If one were conspiracy minded, one might speculate that someone powerful was involved in Mr.Bones’s demise and wants his identity unknown. (I don’t believe that, it would require too many people to stay quiet for too long).
I am getting old. I would like to know who Mr. Bones was before I join him in that big cardboard barrel in that heavenly evidence locker in the sky.

 

[Nate_Bro]

CANADA Thread 'Canada - Charles Baxter, 31, Hawarden, SK, 1 July 1939'

Feb 27, 2022

Charles Henry Baxter



Case Classification: Missing
Missing Since: July 1, 1939
Location Last Seen: Hawarden, Saskatchewan, Canada

Description:

• Date of Birth: November 15, 1908
• Age: 31 years
• Race: White/Caucasian
• Gender: Male
• Height: Unknown
• Weight: Unknown
• Hair Color: Unknown
• Eye Color: Unknown
• Nickname/Alias: Henry Baxter
• Distinguishing Marks/Features: Unknown
• Clothing & Personal Items: Unknown
• Identifiers: Unknown

Circumstances of Disappearance:
Baxter went...

• TheArtfulDetective
• Replies: 0
• Forum: Pre-1960's Missing

• 

 

[Warwick1991]

CANADA Thread 'Canada - Charles Baxter, 31, Hawarden, SK, 1 July 1939'

Feb 27, 2022

Charles Henry Baxter



Case Classification: Missing
Missing Since: July 1, 1939
Location Last Seen: Hawarden, Saskatchewan, Canada

Description:

• Date of Birth: November 15, 1908
• Age: 31 years
• Race: White/Caucasian
• Gender: Male
• Height: Unknown
• Weight: Unknown
• Hair Color: Unknown
• Eye Color: Unknown
• Nickname/Alias: Henry Baxter
• Distinguishing Marks/Features: Unknown
• Clothing & Personal Items: Unknown
• Identifiers: Unknown

Circumstances of Disappearance:
Baxter went...

• TheArtfulDetective
• Replies: 0
• Forum: Pre-1960's Missing

• 

I think Baxter is probably too old to be Mr Bones. Mr Bones was estimated to be 30-35 years old in 1958, meaning he was born circa 1923-1928. Baxter would have been 50. Mr Bones' clothing seems to be what a younger man would choose, especially the motorcycle jacket.

 

[TSC]

A small correction: the dna comparisons were between Mr. Bones and living relatives of Charles Conner, using the CODIS tests of the time, which sampled only 7 loci, I believe. They have never done the modern testing and forensic genealogy.

I am the relative of Charles Connor that was tested. I am related to Charles through females (mitochondrial DNA) On my maternal side, my great grandmother’s sister is Charles Connor. My older family members insist there has never been a DNA break as far as they believe. After all, I am related only by females so it is not likely of any secrets as far as parents ……

 

[Richard]

I am the relative of Charles Connor that was tested. I am related to Charles through females (mitochondrial DNA) On my maternal side, my great grandmother’s sister is Charles Connor. My older family members insist there has never been a DNA break as far as they believe. After all, I am related only by females so it is not likely of any secrets as far as parents ……

Welcome to Websleuths. I hope that you will receive answers in regard to your missing relative.

This case (Mr. Bones) is one which has had a lot of interest and followers over the years. Please add anything you can to the thread.

 

[Magnum P.E.]

I am the relative of Charles Connor that was tested. I am related to Charles through females (mitochondrial DNA) On my maternal side, my great grandmother’s sister is Charles Connor. My older family members insist there has never been a DNA break as far as they believe. After all, I am related only by females so it is not likely of any secrets as far as parents ……

TSC, you may have standing to ask for forensic genealogy to be done that we would not have. You should have the right to know if the remains in that barrel are your relative. I can’t imagine the basis for the rule out given the testing that was done. I am grasping at straws here. If Mr. B is not Charles Conner, he is somebody else, and we could know who if the correct testing is done.
Pennsylvania didn’t seem to care but Ohio seemed downright hostile about doing the testing. I have my theories as to why but won’t go into that here. I will say that Ralph Forsythe’s defense attorney was a real character and had some interesting protégés, that’s as far as I will go…

 

[Magnum P.E.]

A new program to identify UIDs in Pennsylvania.

PA-MUHR