PA - Conner, 8, & Brinley Snyder, 4, found hung, later died, Kempton, 23 Sept 2019 *Arrest*

[Hippiemomof5]

No knots. Both ends had a swivel hook.

"...hanging approximately 3 feet apart from a plastic coated single wire cable with ends containing swivel eye snap hooks."

Search warrants served | Northwestern Press

I googled because I couldn’t picture what this meant. I think this is probably pretty accurate although size/length may vary.

 

[oviedo]

I googled because I couldn’t picture what this meant. I think this is probably pretty accurate although size/length may vary.

I hate to be graphic but how in the world does this logistically work? the hook end is wrapped around the neck and clipped then the lead is thrown over the beam and the other end is wrapped around the other neck and then what? if the 4 yr olds chair is kicked under the 8year old would need to hang on to the lead so she wouldn't fall to the ground and then wrap it around the neck - get up on the chair and then kick the chair over? I'm sure LE is trying to re-create this scenario to see if it is even possible but I just can't see how this works based on what we know. JMO

 

[TTF14]

I googled because I couldn’t picture what this meant. I think this is probably pretty accurate although size/length may vary.

This is exactly what I imagine it to be. I have one for my dog. Never thought to hang two people to death with it, but it would work quite well and would be "easy" because no knots would be required.

ETA: Oh wait, no it's not exactly what I imagined. Hold on and I will find a pic of what I have.

 

[TTF14]

I hate to be graphic but how in the world does this logistically work? the hook end is wrapped around the neck and clipped then the lead is thrown over the beam and the other end is wrapped around the other neck and then what? if the 4 yr olds chair is kicked under the 8year old would need to hang on to the lead so she wouldn't fall to the ground and then wrap it around the neck - get up on the chair and then kick the chair over? I'm sure LE is trying to re-create this scenario to see if it is even possible but I just can't see how this works based on what we know. JMO

Both ends have the same exact hooks/clasps. You make both kids stand on chairs while you wrap around one neck, clasp, then wrap and wrap and wrap around the beam to shorten the lead, then once you have the desired tightness/length, you wrap the other end's hook/clasp around the other kids' neck. Then you kick the chairs.

 

[TTF14]

https://www.amazon.com/AmazonBasics...ocphy=9007393&hvtargid=pla-371917692649&psc=1

 

[oviedo]

Both ends have the same exact hooks/clasps. You make both kids stand on chairs while you wrap around one neck, clasp, then wrap and wrap and wrap around the beam to shorten the lead, then once you have the desired tightness/length, you wrap the other end's hook/clasp around the other kids' neck. Then you kick the chairs.

Yes, I'm trying to work out how it's done with just the two children - no outside help. I'm discounting the 4 year old because of age/dexterity which just leaves the 8 year old. If we are to believe the story - how did he do this on his own is my question? If we can't make it work then there has to be a 3rd person which I'm sure LE is working out now. I also wonder how long they had to be hanging in order for any sort of revival to take place - I know when people drown it can be minutes and then revival with CPR - depending on the length of time they are underwater determines the amount of brain damage post-revival. I'm leaning towards a third person. JMO

 

[TTF14]

Yes, I'm trying to work out how it's done with just the two children - no outside help. I'm discounting the 4 year old because of age/dexterity which just leaves the 8 year old. If we are to believe the story - how did he do this on his own is my question? If we can't make it work then there has to be a 3rd person which I'm sure LE is working out now. I also wonder how long they had to be hanging in order for any sort of revival to take place - I know when people drown it can be minutes and then revival with CPR - depending on the length of time they are underwater determines the amount of brain damage post-revival. I'm leaning towards a third person. JMO

If there is no third person involved (BIG if), or even if there was, the scene could have even been prepared before-hand. Wrap the lead around the beam with both ends hanging, convince one child to get up on the chair, wrap the end around her neck, the second gets up on the chair, wrap the lead around his neck..... "One, two, three, let's kick the chairs and then we'll floating/flying!" 4 year old has no concept of how that would strangle her to death.

 

[Deleted member 278]

https://www.amazon.com/AmazonBasics...ocphy=9007393&hvtargid=pla-371917692649&psc=1

This is what I envision

 

[Deleted member 278]

If the children were sedated it would not be hard to hang them. You would sedate and carry child to already formed noose and drop their body. Add fallen chair for effect.

 

[Deleted member 278]

This a bad representation of what I think was done. Ends wrapped around necks and secured with clasps. Get rid of the ring and just put clasp around lead.

 

[TTF14]

This a bad representation of what I think was done. Ends wrapped around necks and secured with clasps. Get rid of the ring and just put clasp around lead.

Yep, me too.

 

[TTF14]

Yep, me too.

And if there was never a dog, who bought this lead? The 8 year old??? Highly doubtful.

 

[Deleted member 278]

And if there was never a dog, who bought this lead? The 8 year old??? Highly doubtful.

I think there was a dog but was given away before the murders. Yes, murders. That's what they are. No damn murder/suicide.

 

[CSIDreamer]

I think there was a dog but was given away before the murders. Yes, murders. That's what they are. No damn murder/suicide.

I agree. To use a tie out chain like that you have to have some basic knowledge of how weight works. What 8 year old is going to realize you need to wrap it more than once around a beam?

 

[Lamima]

If there is no third person involved (BIG if), or even if there was, the scene could have even been prepared before-hand. Wrap the lead around the beam with both ends hanging, convince one child to get up on the chair, wrap the end around her neck, the second gets up on the chair, wrap the lead around his neck..... "One, two, three, let's kick the chairs and then we'll floating/flying!" 4 year old has no concept of how that would strangle her to death.

<modsnip>

The dog...wonder if mom or 17 yo hung the dog from that rafter the same way. To kill it. Maybe it was a nuisance. And then they left the lead wrapped around rafter and hanging there so 8 yo did as quoted above. He wouldn't have had to wrap the lead as it was already there. Me thinks the dog is dead. The 8yo saw the dog hanged and mimicked it. Mom is now worried her actions (hanging dog and/or letting kids see that and/or leaving lead wrapped around rafter) may get her in trouble. Just one theory. This or outright murder by another party.

 

[Deleted member 278]

This. When I was around 7 a neighbor boy, same age-ish, talked me into letting him hang me like he saw on the cartoons. He took me to the woods and tied a rope around my neck and threw it over a tree branch and started pulling. My 12 year old brother saw and ran out to stop him. Not that the kid could hoisted me off the ground but maybe he could have. I had no idea it was a deadly game we were playing. Had no real idea what death was at that point.

The dog...wonder if mom or 17 yo hung the dog from that rafter the same way. To kill it. Maybe it was a nuisance. And then they left the lead wrapped around rafter and hanging there so 8 yo did as quoted above. He wouldn't have had to wrap the lead as it was already there. Me thinks the dog is dead. The 8yo saw the dog hanged and mimicked it. Mom is now worried her actions (hanging dog and/or letting kids see that and/or leaving lead wrapped around rafter) may get her in trouble. Just one theory. This or outright murder by another party.

IMO some people love their pets more than they love their children. Just my opinion that I don't think the dog was hung and that Conner mimicked it.

 

[Jealoushe]

IMO mom talking about bullying, etc. on the 911 call instead of dealing with the situation at hand, like I don’t know, trying to CUT HER CHILDREN DOWN raises giant red flags. How many times have we seen where the caller gave a bunch of extraneous information (reasons, excuses, background) to 911 those cases all ended up taking a same specific turn?

Agreed. This is a known phenomenon in 911 calls, where when the caller is the guilty party, they introduce an alibi in the 91 call. In this case it would be the "bullying". Very suspect. MOO.

 

[TTF14]

Agreed. This is a known phenomenon in 911 calls, where when the caller is the guilty party, they introduce an alibi in the 91 call. In this case it would be the "bullying". Very suspect. MOO.

Very, very, very, very, very, very, very! Coupled with not trying to get them down or at LEAST get the chairs back underneath them (if they ever supported them in the first place).

 

[oviedo]

Agreed. This is a known phenomenon in 911 calls, where when the caller is the guilty party, they introduce an alibi in the 91 call. In this case it would be the "bullying". Very suspect. MOO.

yep

 

[PunkCake]

I feel like a lot of people forget that 911 calls aren’t just conscripted. They are straight up recorded. Your tone, the background noise, any inflection or hesitancy, and certainly any inaccurate narrative.

Mentioning the bullying thing was an extremely pointless detail. We are trying to walk you through attempting to save a life and remaining calm enough to feed us information.
Aside from reporting a missing person/runaway (and even then) IMO I had no training emphasizing “do you know why xyz?”

You’re getting instructions. The 911 call will come out and may be damning because if she doesn’t sound on the verge of a mental break, she would have been given instructions on how to keep them stable until EMS comes. Even in gs victims/suicides, it may be clearly fruitless to attempt life saving measures but you will still be getting wound compression and cpr instructions.