PA PA - Ray Gricar, 59, Bellefonte, 15 April 2005 - #6

[pittsburghgirl]

JJ, thanks for the links to your blog. Your blog post shows why you are speculating that Feds are interested in RG's finances. However, it is far more likelynthat what your blogger friends have seen is a web crawler of some sort. Post-Patriot Act, Homeland Security and other federal agencies have broad authority to monitor all sorts of communications. Surely the federal government doesn't need to find articles on crime blogs. It is just as likely that the bloggers are the target or the posters on the web boards.o

 

[J. J. in Phila]

JJ, thanks for the links to your blog. Your blog post shows why you are speculating that Feds are interested in RG's finances. However, it is far more likelynthat what your blogger friends have seen is a web crawler of some sort. Post-Patriot Act, Homeland Security and other federal agencies have broad authority to monitor all sorts of communications. Surely the federal government doesn't need to find articles on crime blogs. It is just as likely that the bloggers are the target or the posters on the web boards.o

Not speculation. They are getting hit from those Departments.

Slamdunk got the hits only when he posted on the Gricar case. Politigal indicated that someone followed a link from a message board. Those are not webcrawlers, generally indexing pages. Further, why would Treasury be looking specifically at RFG? There is an answer, but you just don't like it.

Generally, people do web searches to gather information on what they are interested in. I do it for research, and I do google potential clients prior to taking them; many return the favor. Actually, that is how many find me in the first place. Somebody at Treasury and Homeland Security has been interested in the case.

BTW, the Bellefonte Police, et al., know exactly who I am. I know one thing in the Gricar file, my photo. I'm told that the verdict on me was "pristine."

 

[cloudbuster05]

The first 48 hours, it was possibly the best handled adult missing persons case I've heard about. In terms of searching for a body, and basically looking at suicide or murder, it was exemplary in the first weeks. Then, it seems to have stopped.

They went through the house, looking for signs of violence or a cleanup and didn't find anything. They polygraphed PEF; she passed. The polygraphed LG; she passed. The interesting is that there was absolutely no way LG could have been a suspect in his murder (or involved in his suicide).

My guess is "legacy protection." Some of what he held back could be viewed as damaging to RFG's reputation, if you think it's terrible if he left voluntarily or was with another woman.

JJ what is supposed to be so damaging may not of been the actions of Ray. Two people lived in the house and Im sure they had company in the past that was capable of the doing. That whole incident reminds me of what was planted on Luna's. Just saying.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

JJ what is supposed to be so damaging may not of been the actions of Ray. Two people lived in the house and Im sure they had company in the past that was capable of the doing. That whole incident reminds me of what was planted on Luna's. Just saying.

Nothing was "planted" on Luna.

LE held back on the Mystery Woman report. They obviously didn't want people to think RFG was with a woman (and he might have been). The also held back on the computer searches for several years.

 

[cloudbuster05]

Not speculation. They are getting hit from those Departments.

Slamdunk got the hits only when he posted on the Gricar case. Politigal indicated that someone followed a link from a message board. Those are not webcrawlers, generally indexing pages. Further, why would Treasury be looking specifically at RFG? There is an answer, but you just don't like it.

Generally, people do web searches to gather information on what they are interested in. I do it for research, and I do google potential clients prior to taking them; many return the favor. Actually, that is how many find me in the first place. Somebody at Treasury and Homeland Security has been interested in the case.

BTW, the Bellefonte Police, et al., know exactly who I am. I know one thing in the Gricar file, my photo. I'm told that the verdict on me was "pristine."

JJ on the other board you mentioned Homeland security but you also said the Treasury works for Homeland Security. So now on here you are passing on as fact that the Treasury is also looking at Rays case when in fact thats not factual its only your guess because the treasury department is a sublet of Homeland Security. Huge difference. We should stay as much as possible to facts and at least say that its possible. Ex: Could say" Maybe since Treasury is part of Homeland Security they could be looking at Rays finances."

 

[cloudbuster05]

Nothing was "planted" on Luna.

LE held back on the Mystery Woman report. They obviously didn't want people to think RFG was with a woman (and he might have been). The also held back on the computer searches for several years.

I won't say it. You know Im talking about Luna's puter, not the mystery woman. What you said inclines something much worse than the mystery woman. Okay we will have to leave it there at that.

 

[cloudbuster05]

With a checking of some things, walkaway can be greatly weakened. It would be absence of any reasonable ability to get out of Lewisburg.

In reality, there was nothing "convenient" about it. The police spent several weeks search for a body, and discovered nothing. The police checked his residence for any evidence of a crime, and found nothing.

It was, primarily, the witness sightings that put RFG outside of Lewisburg, days and weeks later, that generated the possibility of walkaway. It is the seeming lack of assets that generated the possibility of walkaway. It was RFG's interest in a prior walkaway case that generated the possibility of walkaway.

In short, it was the evidence that has generated the talk of walkaway.



He had been passing off cases. As noted (and noted by another poster prior to my joining) the amount of his pension would be hire if his employment would end prior to retirement. His daughter gets that.

Now, that is a possible motive.



The Treasury/Homeland Security link is noted here:
http://www.centredaily.com/2011/07/14/2834622/watching-the-watchmen-watch-us.html

It has come from two independent sources.

The standard for a declaration of death is PA is basically, "we have not heard from the missing person, and we have made a 'diligent inquiry' for the missing person." You can read about it here:

http://www.centredaily.com/2011/02/18/2529829/gricar-is-alive-legally.html#storylink=misearch

LE basically does not have a role in a declaration of death, in this case, except to indicate what they did in terms of the "diligent inquiry."

The blog was first posted in 2010. Further, in the other missing person case that RFG was somewhat interested in, Mel Wiley, the police determined he left voluntarily, but he was declared dead.

JJ, slamdunk on your above blog link said it was more Department of Justice. For those that are following closely its in the comments section on
http://www.centredaily.com/2011/07/14/2834622/watching-the-watchmen-watch-us.html
CS (commonsense) only said it was Homeland Security. She also had past visits from Harrisburg.

Since little attention was given to the DOJ visiting, what do they exactly handle?

 

[cloudbuster05]

Agencies under the United States Department of Justice DOJ

Attorney General
Deputy
Attorney
General
Justice Management Division · Criminal Division · National Security Division · Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives · Drug Enforcement Administration · Federal Bureau of Investigation · Federal Bureau of Prisons · National Institute of Corrections · United States Marshals Service · Executive Office for Immigration Review · Office of Attorney Recruitment and Management · Office of the Federal Detention Trustee · Office of Intelligence Policy and Review · Office of the Pardon Attorney · Office of Privacy and Civil Liberties · Office of Professional Responsibility · Office on Sexual Violence and Crimes against Children · Office of Tribal Justice · Professional Responsibility Advisory Office · United States Attorneys · United States Trustee Program · INTERPOL, U.S. National Central Bureau · National Drug Intelligence Center · United States Parole Commission · Office of Legal Counsel

Associate
Attorney
General
Office of Justice Programs · Office of Dispute Resolution · Office on Violence Against Women · Community Oriented Policing Services · Office of Information Policy · Foreign Claims Settlement Commission · Antitrust Division · Civil Division · Civil Rights Division · Environment and Natural Resources Division · Tax Division · Community Relations Service · Office of Legal Policy
Assistant
Attorney
General
Antitrust Division · Civil Division · Civil Rights Division · Criminal Division · National Security Division · Environmental and Natural Resources Division · Justice Management Division · Tax Division · Office of Legal Counsel · Office of Legal Policy · Office of Legislative Affairs

 

[J. J. in Phila]

JJ on the other board you mentioned Homeland security but you also said the Treasury works for Homeland Security. So now on here you are passing on as fact that the Treasury is also looking at Rays case when in fact thats not factual its only your guess because the treasury department is a sublet of Homeland Security. Huge difference. We should stay as much as possible to facts and at least say that its possible. Ex: Could say" Maybe since Treasury is part of Homeland Security they could be looking at Rays finances."

Well, I've very sure that I never said Treasury worked Homeland Security, period. There are separate departments.

I have said that there is one area of overlap, money transfers. And yes, the Department of Justice is also looking, but that is fully expected, since elements of them, the FBI, has been publicly involved since week after RFG disappeared.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I won't say it. You know Im talking about Luna's puter, not the mystery woman. What you said inclines something much worse than the mystery woman. Okay we will have to leave it there at that.

CB, I have absolutely no idea what "Luna's puter" is.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Agencies under the United States Department of Justice DOJ

Attorney General
Deputy
Attorney
General
Justice Management Division · Criminal Division · National Security Division · Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives · Drug Enforcement Administration · Federal Bureau of Investigation · Federal Bureau of Prisons · National Institute of Corrections · United States Marshals Service · Executive Office for Immigration Review · Office of Attorney Recruitment and Management · Office of the Federal Detention Trustee · Office of Intelligence Policy and Review · Office of the Pardon Attorney · Office of Privacy and Civil Liberties · Office of Professional Responsibility · Office on Sexual Violence and Crimes against Children · Office of Tribal Justice · Professional Responsibility Advisory Office · United States Attorneys · United States Trustee Program · INTERPOL, U.S. National Central Bureau · National Drug Intelligence Center · United States Parole Commission · Office of Legal Counsel

I would note the Federal Bureau of Investigation is on the list, and as indicated, they were involved since the first week. It is not strange. Note, however, that there are departments that deal with foreign situations, like INTERPOL.

 

[cloudbuster05]

I would note the Federal Bureau of Investigation is on the list, and as indicated, they were involved since the first week. It is not strange. Note, however, that there are departments that deal with foreign situations, like INTERPOL.

Also as noted is the Drug Enforcemeny Agency, and the Criminal Division and many others. You are picking just one of the many and leading it straight to walk away without looking equally at all the Departments they cover. I could make a pick toward foul play but that is misleading in nature. Im looking at all that they cover and seeing if any of those departments add up to something that makes sense. I think most viewers on here might also be doing the same before coming to a nonfactual conclusion.

 

[cloudbuster05]

I would note the Federal Bureau of Investigation is on the list, and as indicated, they were involved since the first week. It is not strange. Note, however, that there are departments that deal with foreign situations, like INTERPOL.

Once again that's just one of the many on what they cover.

 

[cloudbuster05]

CB, I have absolutely no idea what "Luna's puter" is.

LUNA"S COMPUTER. Im comparing on your post about what is worse than a woman that Ray may have been with. Although you was a bit cryptic we both know what that meant, although for legacy reasons and the fact that Ray may not be the one who put it there, we should leave that in cyberspace for now until it becomes factual.

 

[cloudbuster05]

Well, I've very sure that I never said Treasury worked Homeland Security, period. There are separate departments.

I have said that there is one area of overlap, money transfers. And yes, the Department of Justice is also looking, but that is fully expected, since elements of them, the FBI, has been publicly involved since week after RFG disappeared.

You never implied that in your blog but you have posted in another board that the Treasury is a part of Homeland Security. It's a stretch to say the Treasury department is looking at the Gricar case. It leaves the reader to think that is a fact when it is not. Thats what I meant.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

You never implied that in your blog but you have posted in another board that the Treasury is a part of Homeland Security. It's a stretch to say the Treasury department is looking at the Gricar case. It leaves the reader to think that is a fact when it is not. Thats what I meant.

Go back and read the blog. Someone at Treasury was visiting Slamdunk's site soon after he wrote something on RFG.

As for "Luna's computer," I don't see any relevance to the Gricar case.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Also as noted is the Drug Enforcemeny Agency, and the Criminal Division and many others. You are picking just one of the many and leading it straight to walk away without looking equally at all the Departments they cover. I could make a pick toward foul play but that is misleading in nature. Im looking at all that they cover and seeing if any of those departments add up to something that makes sense. I think most viewers on here might also be doing the same before coming to a nonfactual conclusion.

No, I just note that the FBI has been involved in the case since the first week. There involvement was more in a supportive role, as opposed to a direct investigative role. Continued interest is no surprise.

 

[cloudbuster05]

No, I just note that the FBI has been involved in the case since the first week. There involvement was more in a supportive role, as opposed to a direct investigative role. Continued interest is no surprise.

Continued interest would not be a surprise but what surprises me is how do you exactly know as fact that the FBI are now involved? Example: is there a ISP that comes up FBI? Im just trying to understand how you know it to be as a actual fact. TIA.

 

[cloudbuster05]

Go back and read the blog. Someone at Treasury was visiting Slamdunk's site soon after he wrote something on RFG.

As for "Luna's computer," I don't see any relevance to the Gricar case.

I see a possibility of at least a comparison to Luna's computer. It deals more with possible planting of certain material. Best to leave that in cyberspace as it is not yet a released known fact. If it ever does surface then we can discuss it.

 

[cloudbuster05]

The first 48 hours, it was possibly the best handled adult missing persons case I've heard about. In terms of searching for a body, and basically looking at suicide or murder, it was exemplary in the first weeks. Then, it seems to have stopped.

They went through the house, looking for signs of violence or a cleanup and didn't find anything. They polygraphed PEF; she passed. The polygraphed LG; she passed. The interesting is that there was absolutely no way LG could have been a suspect in his murder (or involved in his suicide).

My guess is "legacy protection." Some of what he held back could be viewed as damaging to RFG's reputation, if you think it's terrible if he left voluntarily or was with another woman.

Im talking about this post being cryptic. The last two sentences. "if you think it's terrible if he left voluntarily or was with another woman." Then you stopped. What would follow after that comment belongs in cyberspace because Ray may not be responsible for the ending thats missing on that sentence. I guess we will have to see if it becomes factual in the future. Yes it reminds me of Luna's computer, not as fact but just a mild possibility.