PA PA - Richard Petrone 35 & Danielle Imbo 34, Philadelphia, 19 Feb 2005 #2

[wenchie]

I haven't gone to South Street for soooo many years: the street used to be filled every evening, and all the little side streets would have foot traffic.

Is it really that dead now?

 

[OriginalJerseyGirl]

Sadly, South Street is completely different than we knew it in the 80's. Do you remember when the Navy ships would dock there and there'd be an odd combination of "punk rockers", break dancers and sailors (among us "regular" folk, of course)? That's all gone. Stores like "Zipperhead" have been largely replaced by chain stores like City Blue. Most of the things that made South Street so unique are long gone. It saddens me to no end. I spent every weekend night there when I was a teenager. We used to love to flirt with the sailors, look through records for hours in the dingy but amazing stores and then pause every couple of blocks to watch the break dancers on massive sheets of cardboard. People would walk around with purple hair, dozens of face piercings, tattoos galore - long before that was anywhere near the mainstream...

Parking still sucks though.

 

[OriginalJerseyGirl]

BTW, I was trying to recall the specific incident but for the life of me, I cannot. Do you remember years ago, there was some celebration on South Street - the restaurants & bars participated and it ended up being a melee? It was either Cinco de Maio or St. Patrick's Day - something like that. After that, no big celebrations were held on South Street. I can't remember if it's now banned or if the businesses just don't want the trouble. It's SUCH a shame. It was an amazing part of the Philadelphia in which I grew up. Now it's just another street with just more chain stores and just more people with attitude problems. Breaks my heart.

 

[wenchie]

Sadly, South Street is completely different than we knew it in the 80's. Do you remember when the Navy ships would dock there and there'd be an odd combination of "punk rockers", break dancers and sailors (among us "regular" folk, of course)? That's all gone. Stores like "Zipperhead" have been largely replaced by chain stores like City Blue. Most of the things that made South Street so unique are long gone. It saddens me to no end. I spent every weekend night there when I was a teenager. We used to love to flirt with the sailors, look through records for hours in the dingy but amazing stores and then pause every couple of blocks to watch the break dancers on massive sheets of cardboard. People would walk around with purple hair, dozens of face piercings, tattoos galore - long before that was anywhere near the mainstream...

Parking still sucks though.

I don't remember the Navy ships! I do remember going there in the mid-1970's to see "Pink Flamingos" at the TLA Cinema.....and then a few years later we would go to a club....Gendl's Lair.........is it still there?

 

[OriginalJerseyGirl]

Not that I know of. The TLA is still there, still offering alternative music (and other stuff too). I believe that that's where my daughter saw Echo & the Bunnymen a couple of years ago.

 

[BethInAK]

Thanks anniem15. http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/criminal_mind/forensics/imbo_petrone/1.html had some good info. Everyone reading this should check it out. It settles the issue of where Danielle's car was. This is significant I believe.

I have always believed that the Truck disappearing with the victims is consistant with a driving mishap and not consistant with a double murder. Apparently I am not alone in my suspicions. As I have learned more, I feel stronger about this. A double abduction/murder that night seems unlikey. My reasoning is as follows:

Danielle went into Philly with Richards mother. She had no plans to go anywhere with Richard; that came up at pretty much at the last minute. How would any "hit man" know where to find them? Someone suggested they followed them (all evening through the streets of Philly?) If they did, where would they do the deed? Not near State St. Valenitine said there were lots of people on the street. A friend of mine, from the area has confirmed that there would be crowds on the street Saturday night a midnight. Crimes can and do happen but a "hit man" would not select such a spot. The same would apply to anywhere between there and Mt Laurel. These are city or suburban streets. There would be plenty of cars around and cops, cruising for DUI's, would take notice of any accident, "staged" or not.

Danielle'd condo is a possible abduction site. Everything I've read suggests that LE believes it occured "on the way back to Mt Laurel", not at the condo. Since the initial focus of the investigation was seaching waterways and other possible "mishap" sites, I going to assume that nothing was found at the condo to indicate that it was a crime scene. Nothing of interest in the condo; nobody saw or heard anything etc. We now know Danielle left her car there. It wouldn't take a criminal genius to figure out she was probably with some guy. They wouldn't know who she was with, when she would get in or even IF she were coming back at all. Who would sit in their car for hours where any neighbor might take notice? Finally, I found he condo (Brittany Commons) on Google Earth. The "row house" type condo has no attached garage. Parking is perpendicular to the driveway with no roof or any other shelter. Anything unusual like an abduction or carrying two bodies fron the condo to a car would have to be done out in the open. Not an ideal spot.

Some have suggested that the "ex", a middle class mortgage broker with no criminal record would have the where-with-all to retain a Mafia type profissional "hit man" who would be able to pull this caper off inspite of the problems. I find this most improbable of all.

I think we, and LE (assuming they don't know something earth-shattering we don't) need to reopen the possibility of a vehicular mishap.

I originally believed what you believe - that the car was somewhere in the water. But over time, I've come to think differently - someone would SEE a car flying off the bridges between philly and NJ (these are very big and busy and have guard rails etc that would be decimated indicating a car went over).

I grew up in this area, and my family is a nice middle class jewish family. By calling a friend I could easily have third hand found someone who probably could refer me to folks who could help me with an endeavour like this. What is perplexing about that particular scenario is that someone should have talked by now.

 

[BethInAK]

I don't remember the Navy ships! I do remember going there in the mid-1970's to see "Pink Flamingos" at the TLA Cinema.....and then a few years later we would go to a club....Gendl's Lair.........is it still there?

Gosh yes - these are fond memories for me as well although my heydey was the late 80's. Grendls Lair was still there then -as well as the alternative cinema.

 

[BethInAK]

Sadly, South Street is completely different than we knew it in the 80's. Do you remember when the Navy ships would dock there and there'd be an odd combination of "punk rockers", break dancers and sailors (among us "regular" folk, of course)? That's all gone. Stores like "Zipperhead" have been largely replaced by chain stores like City Blue. Most of the things that made South Street so unique are long gone. It saddens me to no end. I spent every weekend night there when I was a teenager. We used to love to flirt with the sailors, look through records for hours in the dingy but amazing stores and then pause every couple of blocks to watch the break dancers on massive sheets of cardboard. People would walk around with purple hair, dozens of face piercings, tattoos galore - long before that was anywhere near the mainstream...

Parking still sucks though.

That is the South Street I remember.

 

[audrey77]

There are plenty of areas for the truck to enter the water into the river... Just under the Ben Franklin and at the shipping docks are just two areas. So easy. I couldn't imagine them going off of the big bridges.

 

[OriginalJerseyGirl]

I grew up in this area, and my family is a nice middle class jewish family. By calling a friend I could easily have third hand found someone who probably could refer me to folks who could help me with an endeavour like this. What is perplexing about that particular scenario is that someone should have talked by now.

But I think that in certain circles, you just don't talk. Period. Talking = dying.

 

[OriginalJerseyGirl]

That is the South Street I remember.

God, those were great times. I'm glad we have those memories.

 

[OriginalJerseyGirl]

There are plenty of areas for the truck to enter the water into the river... Just under the Ben Franklin and at the shipping docks are just two areas. So easy. I couldn't imagine them going off of the big bridges.

I'm not familiar with those areas. What would someone be doing under the Ben Franklin Bridge or at the shipping docks? I wouldn't imagine them safe places to be by choice at that time of night, especially at that time of year.

 

[audrey77]

Believe it or not, pre 9-11, people would PARK under the bridge... right near the entrance to NB I-95.

The docks are used by a lot of people civilian and government... Near Ikea... and it extends all the way down near the stadiums. Large trucks can even get in there...

There's also the Tioga Marine Terminal... and what was the status of the large high rises on Delaware Ave (or what ever the street is now called- Columbus?) right on the river? The land was probably cleared at the time... remember, the Rock Lobster right near there has mob ties as well. ;-)

 

[audrey77]

God, those were great times. I'm glad we have those memories.

I used to go there as a teen in the early 90's.... I loved Zipperhead! and there was some other store too... with all of the scrunchies or whatever in the display. It was either there or New Hope as teens

It was definitely hopping in the summertime. Now it's pretty commercial... with Rita's and stuff.

 

[kemo]

I think we"ve burned out the "hit man" issue. You buy it or you don't. It is time to reconsider the "driving mishap" possibility.

There seems to be two ways for a vehicle to drive into water: The driver can lose control near a body of water and drive in or, at night, a driver can drive right off a pier or wharf not realizing the roadway ended. (Ted Kennedy did this in Chapaquidick).
I associate the former situation with rual lanes. I would think most urban or suburban roads whold have some type of barrier that would at least be damaged if someone went off. Posters have indicated that there are no waterways between State St and Mt Laurel that are not well barricaded. There are definitly Piers and Wharfs along the Delaware in Philadelphia. Some right near State St. The question is "can anyone just drive out to these areas? and would R & D have had any reason to drive out on to them?" The only thing I can think of is Parking. Could they have parked off a main road and gotten confused trying to find a route out of the wharf area? Audrey77. were these the docks you mentioned? I can't see Rich getting lost on the way to the Bridge and driving off a pier .

Other than that, The only other explaination I can see is that they decided to go somewhere else. Atlantic City, The Jersey Shore, anywhere.

 

[audrey77]

I think we"ve burned out the "hit man" issue. You buy it or you don't. It is time to reconsider the "driving mishap" possibility.

There seems to be two ways for a vehicle to drive into water: The driver can lose control near a body of water and drive in or, at night, a driver can drive right off a pier or wharf not realizing the roadway ended. (Ted Kennedy did this in Chapaquidick).
I associate the former situation with rual lanes. I would think most urban or suburban roads whold have some type of barrier that would at least be damaged if someone went off. Posters have indicated that there are no waterways between State St and Mt Laurel that are not well barricaded. There are definitly Piers and Wharfs along the Delaware in Philadelphia. Some right near State St. The question is "can anyone just drive out to these areas? and would R & D have had any reason to drive out on to them?" The only thing I can think of is Parking. Could they have parked off a main road and gotten confused trying to find a route out of the wharf area? Audrey77. were these the docks you mentioned? I can't see Rich getting lost on the way to the Bridge and driving off a pier .

Other than that, The only other explaination I can see is that they decided to go somewhere else. Atlantic City, The Jersey Shore, anywhere.

Well... not just a mishap... a hit man could discard a truck easily into the river as well... At the beginning of the search they pulled out a ton of vehicles. They get dumped there for insurance fraud mostly (you know... report it stolen, etc).

 

[audrey77]

Columbus Blvd. All the way North.... and all the way South. I plotted it right next to South Street, but please note that you can't get right onto CB from SS. You have to go north or south a few blocks.

The Ben Franklin is north a bit... There are a few entrances to I-95 off of CB. And there is a huge entrance to the bridge at around 6th and Race streets (which is north)

BTW- Columbus Blvd used to be called Delaware Ave for a long time... so any prior mentions of it-- it's just ingrained in my head.

 

[audrey77]

Kemo.... remember it's South Street... NOT State Street. :blowkiss:

 

[anniem15]

You know I was reading this article in today's paper... http://www.nj.com/ap/stories/index.ssf?/base/national-107/121605504163420.xml&storylist=topstories about a woman with 5 dead spouses and how she had allegedly hired a hit man to kill her last husband so she could collect his insurance money. It got me wondering if Danielle and Joe had life insurance on each other. They have a child together and many couples especially after having children try to take care of wills and life insurance for the sake of the child. If Joe is responsible for this, he could have done it to collect on life insurance as well as not have to worry about spousal and child support.

On another note, if this old lady can hire a hit man to kill her hubby. I'm sure Joe could have done the same. I don't think it's that improbable.

As for the "driving mishap", I do think it's possible that they are under water somewhere but I think it's because someone put them there not because they accidentally drove off a pier or anything like that. I've seen the back and forth discussion from the people that know the driving route and am convinced that they didn't drive off a bridge either.

 

[kemo]

anniem15, Yea, people do hire "hit men" to kill thier spouses. In your example the woman had a long criminal history and the "hit man", if there was one, did a pretty basic job; he shot the guy in his house and apparently set it up like a suicide. The Rich and Dainelle case would have been far more elaborate. Also, if the motive was life Insurance, Joe Imbo really messed up because he will have to wait a minimum of seven years for Danielle to be declared "legally dead"

When you have a motive but no evidence of a crime (and I am not aware that there is any), we must consider the posibility that there was no crime.

Also, I stand corrected; it is South St.