Patsy Ramsey is reportedly very ill.

  • #41
ISPTRAX said:
Anyone? Anyone? It certainly can't be for financial reasons like other killing mothers.

who knows? it never makes any sense to me when a parent kills their child...even if they offer a "reason."

here are some possible scenarios, though do not take this as my endorsement of any particular theory...
1-burke killed JBR, possibly by accident, and the parents staged to save their only remaining child. while i understand he couldn't be prosecuted under the colorado children's code, i doubt the ramseys knew that on 12/25/96.
2-patsy became enraged over a bed-wetting incident.
3-john was abusing JBR and patsy snapped.
4-the cancer recovery created a lot of tension around the house, and again, patsy snapped.

are you really going to dismiss evidence because you can't comprehend why a parent would kill a child? can you understand why anyone kills anyone? i certainly cannot...
 
  • #42
Voice of Reason said:
where do you get this information from?

here's where i got mine...a chat with steve thomas. think of him whatever you'd like, but i bet he knows more than you do about this case.

crimeADM: How soon on December 26 did the FBI become involved?

stevethomas: good Q, as Patsy on LKL suggested they weren't there. The FBI was involved from the early hours of the case, an FBI agent was at the house shortly after the body was found, the FBI was in the bpd sitroom during the morning while it was being investigated as a kidnapping. FBI wa sin early, despite Ramsey assertions otherwise.

Thank you very much, VoR. I guess I can't buy the Patsy snapped scenarios very well. But the whole "Burke did it" theory has always made a lot of sense. I'm sure there was a lot of jealosy of JB.
 
  • #43
Voice of Reason said:
where do you get this information from?

here's where i got mine...a chat with steve thomas. think of him whatever you'd like, but i bet he knows more than you do about this case.

crimeADM: How soon on December 26 did the FBI become involved?

stevethomas: good Q, as Patsy on LKL suggested they weren't there. The FBI was involved from the early hours of the case, an FBI agent was at the house shortly after the body was found, the FBI was in the bpd sitroom during the morning while it was being investigated as a kidnapping. FBI wa sin early, despite Ramsey assertions otherwise.


ST wasn't even there on 12/26/96 and came onto the case 3 days later.
 
  • #44
ISPTRAX said:
Not to change the subject and forgive my ignorance on this case. But for those that say Patsy's guilty of JB's murder, what in the world would her motive have been? Just curious -- seriously.

IMO People believe Patsy killed her daughter because Steve Thomas deliberately leaked confidential information to make them believe it (Vanity Fair article). It was his scenario that she was the murderer, he says she was enraged over JB's bedwetting.

:rolleyes:
 
  • #45
Seeker, the following is from the site pasted below...I think:

"Prognosis is clearly related to several key features of a woman's cancer, most importantly stage and grade. Stage defines the extent of disease. For the overwhelming majority of women with ovarian cancer, the disease is advanced. Survival for Stage III or IV disease is 15-20% at five years. When fortunate enough to find the disease when it's confined to the ovary, survival for Stage I disease is 80-85%. Grade describes the pattern of growth as seen under the microscope. Grade 1 cancers have a pattern of growth similar to that of normal tissues, and these cancers grow more slowly and are more likely to do well. Grade 2 and 3 cancers have a very disordered pattern of growth and consequently, are more unpredictable in their behavior. The woman who has Stage 1 Grade 1 disease is likely to be cured by surgery alone."

I studied this matter of Patsy's alleged stage IV ovarian cancer several years ago myself. I could find nothing to prove that her cancer wasn't stage IV. I assume that the Grand Jury could have looked into this matter with their subpoena powers if they felt it was relevant to the murder investigation, which, it probably wasn't and isn't. Of course, if you were convinced that she couldn't have survived stage IV for so long, then you might be justified in believing that, once again, Patsy lied, and that must mean she killed her daughter. My guess is that in order to be thus convinced you'd have to be a medical professional; preferrably an oncologist, working at NIH with those experimental treatments that Patsy, once again, alleged she underwent.

Not only don't we know that Patsy had stage IV ovarian cancer, we don't even know whether she was in the least bit sick, or has had any recurrences--I think two have been reported thus far? Recurrences with advanced ovarian cancer are common according to the literature.

To recap the above quote, in case you didn't read it, the prognosis depends on basically three disease-related factors--the stage of the cancer; the grade of the cancer; and the histology (cell type). Response to treatment varies widely among patients--some do well, some do poorly, some respond moderately.

The American Federation of Gynecology and Obstetrics (according to the literature) uses the TNM classification: T=extent of tumor; N=lymph node involvement; M=metastasis. They grade malignant tumors as follows: 0= carcinoma in situ (usually can be cured with surgery); I, II, III, varying degrees of more extensive disease--greater tumor size and/or spread of cancer to NEARBY lymph nodes and/or spread of cancer to nearby organ/s. Type IV= spread of cancer to another organ or organs (presumably not nearby). In Patsy's case she had a golf-ball size tumor behind her pelvis (according to her) that (according to her doctor) may have developed since her radical hysterectomy. She doesn't say which organ, if any, that tumor had attacked. They used it as a marker during the chemo. She says she was informed by the same doctor at the same time that she had stage IV, rather than the stage III that the Atlanta doctors had diagnosed, based on a finding of cancer in lymph nodes under her collar bone, far removed from the site of the primary tumor. Don't we all trust in what our doctors tell us.

As for comparing Gilda's illness with Patsy's illness (Gilda was one of my favorites and I was very saddened by her death, as were many), as I stated before, and will repeat, we don't know how advanced Gilda's cancer was when it was first diagnosed. It's not uncommon for ovarian cancer to be misdiagnosed, as it was initially in Patsy's case, and to be well advanced before a proper diagnosis is made. Since we don't have access to Gilda's medical records, nor Patsy's, we can't say for certain that either of them had stage IV cancer, according to your own observation. Gilda was Gilda and Patsy is Patsy; two separate and distinct individuals, each with her own unique response to cancer treatment. Maybe prayer does help in some psychosomatic way.

I've found many sites on the web which report that women have survived stage IV ovarian cancer for many years after having been diagnosed with it and treated for it. Of course, I have no way of determining the veracity of these reports.

My two cents...














http://www.sleh.com/sleh/Section004/index.cfm?pagename=Ovarian Cancer
 
  • #46
Casshew said:
Hi Tricia, thanks for the update on Patsy.


omg cass! your siggy is soooo funny. leave it to poco!

i'm slowly changing forums, don't know which way to turn on this one yet.
 
  • #47
And how many murders has Steve Thomas solved? I don't have any faith in anything he says.
 
  • #48
I will probably get chewed out by my forum friends who believe otherwise, but i dont believe Patsy killed Jonbenet- and I dont believe anyone in the family had anything to do with it


I read not long ago Patsy was doing fine and was in remission, but than again i read that from the "STAR" :hand:
 
  • #49
Anniegirl-
There are alot of us who agree with you!
 
  • #50
bensmom98 said:
Anniegirl-
There are alot of us who agree with you!
Yes, there are many of us who agree. I think it's time that we stand up together and voice our opinions. I have seen too many people persecuted without just cause, mostly because of false rumors.
 
  • #51
dottierainbow said:
Yes, there are many of us who agree. I think it's time that we stand up together and voice our opinions. I have seen too many people persecuted without just cause, mostly because of false rumors.

:D :D :D :D :D
 
  • #52
dottierainbow said:
What people who were trying to solve the case? The police didn't even give the house a thorough check over. How many kidnappings or murders had they solved? Did they ask for help from the F.BI right from the beginning?

The F.B.I. was on the scene from day one. It's John Ramsey who refuses to deal with the F.B. I. ala a polygraph.

No one will deny that the police made mistakes, however, the Ramseys made themeselves look like they had something to hide by their actions.

I feel 100 percent confidant in saying one or both parents has guilty knowledge of their daughter's death. The evidence is clear.

If Patsy is truly sick then she needs to clear her soul of the lies she has been telling. Of the attempt to point fingers at innocent people when she knows they had nothing to do with the death of JBR.

I am not certain of too many things in my life. This time I am. I don't know what happened that night but Patsy does. Whether she did it or not.

I hope she eases her burden and tells someone.
 
  • #53
:waitasec:
 
  • #54
I think the police botched the investigation for fear of someone with Immunity from Prosecution who's infiltrated and messed up the much-maligned renegade agency, (maligning probably justified if they "trained" Bin Laden and Osama and did a lot of things to unsuspecting citizens, they've been sued for a lot) and that the R's are acting suspicious because they have to cover for this guy too. Until he gets caught, which he will, for something else, maybe treason, if he's running terrorism thru OBL.

There's been an unusual amount of reference to the Psalms, Father Rol maybe knowing who it is too. (A failure in religion, hates beauty queens and calls the humblest musicians "stars" needing humbling, jmo and maybe personal experience. And a phrase familiar to me was used in the Patricia Letters, "so very much", if I remember correctly.) I think Father Rol passed away? Anyone remember how? Was he a "man who knew too much"?
 
  • #55
Eagle1 said:
I think the police botched the investigation for fear of someone with Immunity from Prosecution who's infiltrated and messed up the much-maligned renegade agency, (maligning probably justified if they "trained" Bin Laden and Osama and did a lot of things to unsuspecting citizens, they've been sued for a lot) and that the R's are acting suspicious because they have to cover for this guy too. Until he gets caught, which he will, for something else, maybe treason, if he's running terrorism thru OBL.


Are you saying you think the police deliberately avoided arresting anyone? I thought Thomas was all fired up to arrest Patsy. This person who has immunity from prosecution; who is he; the perp? The renegade agency; that's the BPD? Who is it that trained BinLaden? Aren't BinLaden and Osama one and the same? Who is it that's been sued?

Eagle1 said:
There's been an unusual amount of reference to the Psalms, Father Rol maybe knowing who it is too. (A failure in religion, hates beauty queens and calls the humblest musicians "stars" needing humbling, jmo and maybe personal experience. And a phrase familiar to me was used in the Patricia Letters, "so very much", if I remember correctly.) I think Father Rol passed away? Anyone remember how? Was he a "man who knew too much"?


An unusual amount of reference to Psalms in the ransom note? Would you mind elaborating? Who is it that has failed in religion? How is it possible to fail in religion? Who is it that's calling the humblest musicians "stars"; etc.? This phrase which is familiar to you; "so very much"; was that used in the ransom note? It was also used in the Patricia letters? You can never know enough about religion, right?

Thanks in advance.
 
  • #56
blueclouds said:
well put....

I'm so very tired of this ole song and dance that so many BELIEVE 1000% that SHE MUST be guilty. She's not. She's guilty of maybe hiring a lawyer too soon because they weren't looking anywhere else but I cannot fault them for that in the end. Leave this woman alone already please.


YES
YES
YES
YES!!!!
:woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo:
 
  • #57
No!

No!

No! :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
 
  • #58
Tricia said:
I feel 100 percent confidant in saying one or both parents has guilty knowledge of their daughter's death. The evidence is clear.


I agree, but I don't think Patsy murdered JonBenet.

Just a side note:

Today from Ruth Lunsford, slain Jessica's Lunsford's grandmother:

"Among the flowers and cards was a pillow from Patsy Ramsey, the mother of missing JonBenet."
 
  • #59
Sorry, Red Chief, I just now am getting back to this, would probably edit my little expose if I could, someone nobody would dare name, even if they knew. I was just defending the probably-innocent. Time will tell. Patsy may know but wouldn't be able to tell. The person who was phoning her during the Grand Jury, imo, is all I can say right now. Just maybe it's someone who's caused trouble for me behind my back in the past, because I may have recognized a trademark phrase in the Patricia Letters, not getting into it yet, could not prove it and sociopaths often fool people so much that they actually have powerful friends and positions. My fam wouldn't let me say anything either, if I wanted to stick my neck out and could prove it. Patsy can't either. Probably nobody would believe her.

I believe she said in the Patricia Letters, which obviously I think she wrote, that her family thinks it best to get along with someone and wouldn't let her say anything. It's not crystal clear whether she knows the name, and if she said anything more direct than the anonymous Patricia Letters, who'd believe her anyway? I think eventually he will be caught for something else.
 
  • #60
What are the Patricia Letters?
 

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