Poll: Did Casey Really Keep Caylee in the Trunk Before Caylee Died?

[Beyond Belief]

yep, according to these directions here, it sounds like the whole seat goes down.
how to remove the backseat of a Sunfire

• Unlatch the rear seat back and tilt forward
• Unhook the outer side belt retractor from the rear seat back
• Remove the spacer from the right key pin
• Slide the seat back to the right and disengage the left key pin from the left key slot
• Slide the seat back to the left and disengage the right key slot from the right key slot
• Remove the seat back
• Press the seat cushion retainer to the rear with a screwdriver
• Lift the seat cushion up and remove it

Read more: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_do_you_remove_the_back_set_on_a_1998_pontiac_sunfire#ixzz1OHm1kpBK​

 

[leophoenix]

See if this helps.

 

[txsvicki]

Has it ever been said why Casey and Caylee spent quite a few nights with Ricardo over a 3 month period yet Cindy says Caylee never spent more than one night away from home? At least those nights while at his home Caylee wasn't being locked in a trunk or chloroformed, and neither spent the night at Tony's until Caylee was deceased. I'm just not sure when she was supposed to have been doing all the partying with Caylee in the trunk? She lied about jobs and probably about having to stay out very late or overnight, and didn't have to worry about taking Caylee until George went back to work. Even that worry was on Monday early evening and afternoons til Cindy got home.

 

[Zoe Bogart]

See if this helps.

This is quite helpful, but it looks like a lot of trouble. The baby's carseat would have to be moved first and that's not easy to do for a lazy person like Casey. She spent more time using her mental and verbal skills than she ever did using her muscles. Many of us assumed she didn't bury the baby in the backyard or the woods because digging just wasn't in her makeup. I'm thinking that's why she returned a clean shovel to the neighbor. She had planned to dig a grave but decided against it when she realized to make a hole of appropriate size would take too much physical power - best to save her energy for Tony.

I'm assuming also that the carseat would have been lovingly bolted in that backseat by George. Too much trouble for Casey to move it.

I still stand by my first thought, no way could the trunk have been a babysitter. It's too hot for a child to survive, even in Spring, it gets HOT inside a closed vehicle. In March, a child in my area died after being left in a closed vehicle. Just the other day a baby needed medical care after being locked in a car for about 30 minutes.

 

[The Farm]

I am just wondering something and I missed alot of the testimony by Blosie yesterday.......BUT did they examine/test the stain that was in the trunk? Obviously DNA would have been there?? They must have???

 

[Cailin Rua]

... she also had a mark on her lip like she had some kind of bo-bo. I've wondered also if they focused so much on chloroform that they didn't test for other things...I don't know, could be wrong!

Has it been mentioned that chloroform leaves a red rashy looking mark around the mouth? :waitasec:

 

[Cailin Rua]

Although Casey doesn't strike me as the type to do something as labor-intensive and uncertain as making her own chloroform just to get the baby to sleep. Much easier to just get sleeping pills/benzos for herself and then give a little to the baby.

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

I am just wondering something and I missed alot of the testimony by Blosie yesterday.......BUT did they examine/test the stain that was in the trunk? Obviously DNA would have been there?? They must have???

When a body decomposes it looses the DNA, is what I heard...

Below link shows the various stages of human decomp...

WARNING VERY GRAPHIC CONTENT​

http://www.environmentalgraffiti.com/chemistry/news-afterlife-human-corpse-stages-decomposition

 

[Chewy]

This is quite helpful, but it looks like a lot of trouble. The baby's carseat would have to be moved first and that's not easy to do for a lazy person like Casey. She spent more time using her mental and verbal skills than she ever did using her muscles. Many of us assumed she didn't bury the baby in the backyard or the woods because digging just wasn't in her makeup. I'm thinking that's why she returned a clean shovel to the neighbor. She had planned to dig a grave but decided against it when she realized to make a hole of appropriate size would take too much physical power - best to save her energy for Tony.

I'm assuming also that the carseat would have been lovingly bolted in that backseat by George. Too much trouble for Casey to move it.

I still stand by my first thought, no way could the trunk have been a babysitter. It's too hot for a child to survive, even in Spring, it gets HOT inside a closed vehicle. In March, a child in my area died after being left in a closed vehicle. Just the other day a baby needed medical care after being locked in a car for about 30 minutes.

I'm not getting all these statements about how difficult it would be to do and how the hot air would kill her etc.

As if the ONLY two options were that KC left her in the car all the time OR not at all.

I think people are over thinking this She left her in the car ONCE and it killed her.

I agree that she probably used chloroform on a regular basis to knock her out. Drugging a kid on a regular basis is dangerous and traceable. Anyone who has ever had to deal with a two year old can tell you about the crying to sleep and the tantrums. KC could just have knocked her out night after night.

People keep saying Caylee would have a fear of cars etc. Well not if she died the first time KC did it?

I think she used to drug her at home when she wanted to hang out with her boyfriends, she'd leave Caylee on the couch knocked out. Seemed pretty simple. No screaming and tantrums just out like a light.


One night KC decides to take it to the next level, see if she can get away with her sleeping through the night in the car. She cracks al the windows, and put Caylee in the trunk then undoes the carseat, folds down the back an just puts the car seat back in the car.

But that night Caylee dies.

 

[cuppy199]

IMO Caylee wouldn't necessary have a fear of the car if ICA was putting her in the trunk. If Caylee was chloroform first depending how much caylee inhaled for a small child that might knock them out longer then an adult. Could of been possible Caylee never woke up until ICA was removing her. I also remember reading some suggest ICA might of put duct tape on little sweet caylee's mouth and nose to keep the fluid from coming out so to speak. If that was the case why not put it in the other area's that which in fact would of leaked fluid. Just doesnt make sinse to me.:twocents:

 

[Sleuth5]

Totally MOO, of course, but even though I've read these discussions since the threads started back in 2008, the doc dumps, letters, etc. -- I just haven' seen anything that convinces me (or would as a juror) that there is evidence that she did this (before her death). Many have noted that cholroform is a terrible "mother's helper," and that much easier, more efficient, longer lasting and less dangerous measures were available to her. But I'm hoping the SAO will convince me because I'd love to see my gut feelings validated, if that makes sense.

 

[Gma Kat]

I still can't let my mind go there. I'm still clinging to hope that Caylee was unconcscious for whatever took her precious life and that the trunk was only to store her body after her death. So I voted unsure. Not that I don't think ICA was capable, I just desperately want to hold on to hope that even she's not that evil.

 

[one_hooah_wife]

I don't know what I believe when it comes to how, why or under what circumstances Caylee died. I struggle with wanting or needing to believe that Casey snapped, or made a horrible decision that led to Caylee's death. I do not, however, believe any part of the defense theory. After last night, I have felt physically ill. I had a dream. I am not psychic in the least but I do believe that dreams are a way for our subconscious to reveal things that our conscious mind can't comprehend or accept. I won't go into the dream as it was very dark. I will just say that the thought that I was left after I woke up was ... I bet somewhere in those woods there is an animal skeleton, with duct tape over the mouth and nose.

 

[Gma Kat]

Has it ever been said why Casey and Caylee spent quite a few nights with Ricardo over a 3 month period yet Cindy says Caylee never spent more than one night away from home? At least those nights while at his home Caylee wasn't being locked in a trunk or chloroformed, and neither spent the night at Tony's until Caylee was deceased. I'm just not sure when she was supposed to have been doing all the partying with Caylee in the trunk? She lied about jobs and probably about having to stay out very late or overnight, and didn't have to worry about taking Caylee until George went back to work. Even that worry was on Monday early evening and afternoons til Cindy got home.

IIRC RM mentioned how ICA left really early with Caylee and came back without her. Perhaps CA assumed ICA came home the night before with Caylee instead of just that early morning return. So ICA would sneak Caylee back home, make an excuse that she had an early day at the office, and slip back to RM's.....at least I think it was RM who said this........I also noted how careful CA was when stating she had never been separated from Caylee for more than 24 hours.....this could include overnight stays away from the home but not longer than 24 hours at a time away from the Anthony residence.....

 

[Gma Kat]

I don't know what I believe when it comes to how, why or under what circumstances Caylee died. I struggle with wanting or needing to believe that Casey snapped, or made a horrible decision that led to Caylee's death. I do not, however, believe any part of the defense theory. After last night, I have felt physically ill. I had a dream. I am not psychic in the least but I do believe that dreams are a way for our subconscious to reveal things that our conscious mind can't comprehend or accept. I won't go into the dream as it was very dark. I will just say that the thought that I was left after I woke up was ... I bet somewhere in those woods there is an animal skeleton, with duct tape over the mouth and nose.

I can believe that............

 

[Sleuth5]

I don't know what I believe when it comes to how, why or under what circumstances Caylee died. I struggle with wanting or needing to believe that Casey snapped, or made a horrible decision that led to Caylee's death. I do not, however, believe any part of the defense theory. After last night, I have felt physically ill. I had a dream. I am not psychic in the least but I do believe that dreams are a way for our subconscious to reveal things that our conscious mind can't comprehend or accept. I won't go into the dream as it was very dark. I will just say that the thought that I was left after I woke up was ... I bet somewhere in those woods there is an animal skeleton, with duct tape over the mouth and nose.

Now there's a genuinely chilling thought.

 

[cecybeans]

IIRC, RM indicated the one occasion in which ICA left in the middle of the night to return Caylee home (most likely on CA's insistence) but that many, many nights in February through April, she spent the night at RM's with Caylee sleeping in his bed. I'm thinking it may show that ICA had threatened to leave with Caylee and perhaps actually did during those months to punish CA for getting on her case about stealing and other things she was obviously putting them through at home. RM and others mentioned that ICA sometimes had a problem getting Caylee to go to bed. This was probably a big embarrassment to her, not to mention an inconvenience. It would seem bad enough to her that her friends had decided to stay home to be with her because she could not get her mom to babysit, but if ICA had to spend a lot of time wrangling her to go to sleep I can see where that might have been the start of the experimenting with drugs to get her to sleep quickly. Whether it was OTC stuff to begin with, or xanax that ICA lifted from CA (who wouldn't be taking xanax if you had a daughter that was stealing several hundreds of dollars each month from your bank account?), it would seem logical for this to be the beginning of using medication to quiet Caylee. RM insisted that Caylee slept on the other side of ICA in bed (and didn't seem concerned about her waking up in the middle of the night for any reason) and Amy remarked how Caylee had been able to sleep through parties on the sofa.

I don't see why ICA would need to put her in the trunk during those months when her friends were certainly willing to forego going out to stay home and keep ICA company (which according to Amy was at least a weekly occurrence and that CA would babysit otherwise). But when she left RM's after that last week she stayed there (June 9 - 14) she may have known perfectly well she wouldn't be able to do the same thing with Tony.

Maybe she was just improvising this time and gave her something in her car seat but it didn't knock her out fast enough. Maybe Caylee wouldn't cooperate and was crying. We can all see that ICA can really snap when she feels pushed into a corner and "frushtrated". Maybe she got furious it was taking too long, or afraid the crying would call attention to her and grabbed the duct tape while Caylee was still in her carseat, bound her face, then put her in the trunk. Obviously she didn't know or care what would happen next; she was only thinking of not being late for her Blockbuster date. I'm wondering when or if it even occurred to her to check the next day, seeing as she and Tony spent the day in bed. I only say this because, as evil as ICA can be, it never seems very well thought out in advance, but stuff made up on the spot to cover for her lack of impulse control. She doesn't seem very good at any kind of follow-up and many have remarked she pretty much lives in the moment.

I always thought her insistence on the kidnapping in those jailhouse tapes, even after an accidental swimming pool death was mentioned as an out, was because she knew perfectly well that either a tox screen or the way the duct tape was applied would blow that theory right out of the water if she ever led them to Caylee's little body.

 

[Betty Boop]

There was no reason to leave Caylee in the car trunk. RM welcomed both KC and Caylee into his bed 3 to 4 nights a week since February until June 9/10. KC had a pretend job so Cindy would watch Caylee nights she wanted to go out with the girls. According to KC's friends KC brought Caylee along to get-togethers sometimes. We've got pictures of Caylee at one at Amy's old house. We've got pictures of Caylee at Ricardos. Cindy says KC "worked" lots of nights and she watched Caylee.

The first week or so of KC and Tony's relationship, KC was bringing Caylee along during the days. Caylee went with Tony and KC when they went to the mall to pass out fliers. Caylee went with KC to take Tony to get his car picked up. Caylee went to subway with KC & Tony. Caylee watched cartoons with Cameron and played with Tony's drumsticks. Caylee went to the pool with KC and Tony and KC cooked for all of them. There are pictures of Caylee at Tony's.

I don't think Caylee would go to sleep in a car alone. She wouldn't even sleep alone in the Anthony house. It doesn't look like she would go to bed by herself at Ricardo's house either. I am sure KC would have preferred for Caylee to have slept on the sofa or air mattress instead of in bed with her and Ric.

IMO,Caylee would had to have been drugged not to insist on being in bed with KC. Caylee's hair showed no history of that.

I think KC was facing some challenges in June 2008. She had a new guy who didn't want Caylee staying overnight because his lifestyle wasn't child-fit. Cindy had just caught KC lying about the "No Clothes" party and was suspicious and watchful. Phone records show the Anthony house calling KC more than once at 3 a.m. in the morning when Cindy had Caylee and KC coming immediately home. Maybe Caylee was waking up, finding KC gone and throwing fits? There is LOTS of testimony from KC's friends that Cindy wanted KC to stay home more with Caylee.

The neighbors say there were fights. Lee says Cindy told him about a fight.

KC says she is a "spiteful *****". KC says somebody should have called LE and done something about her a long time ago.

I don't think KC locked Caylee in her car,ever. I think KC killed Caylee to keep Cindy from having her and to get away.

Caylee would not have survived with duct tape over her mouth for more than a few minutes. Duct taping over Caylee's mouth after death is not logical or reasonable. No other parent has ever done it. Talk to any homicide cop. Tape over the mouth and nose on a dead body means murder. Not necessarily cause of death, cause the perp could also strangle, stab or shoot as well as tape, but definitely deliberate murder.

I think KC got the murder over with as fast as possible and ran for Tony's.

This is a great post, definitely worth bumping to the top of this thread. Thanks!

 

[Reality Orlando]

I'm asking this question simply because the more I think about it the less I'm inclined to believe that even KC kept Caylee in the trunk of the car at any time before she was killed. I'm thinking it's Florida, extremely hot, even at night it can be stifling, especially inland, and I doubt that Caylee would have survived for hours, drugged or not, in the trunk of a car while KC partied. At Florida temperatures, any person would be dead after just a few minutes with very little air circulation. I don't know, it just doesn't seem plausible that Caylee would survive even one night in the trunk of a car. I DO wonder, though, what KC was doing with Caylee on the nights when it seemed that neither she nor her mother had Caylee.
So, please vote your answer and make your case. I'm curious as to whether or not others have re-thought this scenario.


..................................................................
PattyG adding: Please stay on topic of the thread!

I agree. According to Weather Underground the temperature on June 16, 2008 was 80.2 °F, the humidity was 73% and there was barely a breeze at 9:09 PM EDT. It's only early June and temps will be in the mid 90's this week. Even my pool water is already REALLY warm. I don't see a child surviving even a few hours in a trunk in FL in June.

 

[Tuffy]

I agree. According to Weather Underground the temperature on June 16, 2008 was 80.2 °F, the humidity was 73% and there was barely a breeze at 9:09 PM EDT. It's only early June and temps will be in the mid 90's this week. Even my pool water is already REALLY warm. I don't see a child surviving even a few hours in a trunk in FL in June.

I don't think Caylee was alive when she went into the trunk. I just can't see anyone, let alone a small child surviving in a trunk, in that type of weather, for any length of time.

Down here in the south, we have children die every year because they are left in cars during the summer.