Poll: Did Darlie Routier murder her children?

[Goody]

I had just one little speck of doubt until I read the words in Cami's post that "Damon was gasping for breath and died in the paramedics arms...."

wrong wong wrong! I'd be holding my babies so close and damn NO would they be in someone elses arms for those final moments. I don't give a crap if he was trying to help I'd just march myself into the anbulance with my child in my arms!


How sad.

One of the big criticisms of Darlie was that she did not hold Damon as he lay injured and dying. In fact, neither parent held neither boy. I think it was because of the criticisms that her story about her care of Damon kept getting bigger, encompassing more actions by her. First, she bent over and placed a towel on his back before going to Devon and Darin, then she stooped to place it there and comfort him, then she knelt down next to him and placed it and spent a little more time with him, and then after the trial she lifted up his shirt and placed the towel under there. Never does she claim though that she wrapped him in her arms. Her descriptions along with everyone else's place her several feet away from him for the majority of the time. She supposedly talks to him, but the physical contact is not there. That shocks most mothers.

 

[Dani_T]

I agree completely!! Officer Walling (the first on scene) testified that he told Darlie several times to tend to the children. She just stood there.

Just a small correction for the newbies- Officer Waddell was actually first on the scene followewd about 2-3 mins later by Walling. The W's and K's get as confusing as the D's!!!

 

[cappuccina]

..the elements of the crime meet almost all of the elements that LE looks for in a case of a "staged" familial homicide; the MacDonald case, and the Ramsey case also fall into this category:

"Red Flags Indicating Staging

Crime Classification Manual

Inappropriate items taken from the crime scene if burglary appeared to be the motive. The crime scene was staged to appear as though burglary was a motive (drawers pulled out, contents dumped, etc.) but nothing of value was taken from the scene.

Did the point of entry make sense?

Did the perpetration of this crime pose a high risk to the offender? If an intruder perpetrated this crime, he did so at high risk for detection.

Excessive trauma beyond that necessary to cause death (Overkill)

The offender will often manipulate the victim’s discovery by a neighbor or family member.

The offender often has a few wounds of a non-lethal nature, even though others in the house are not only murdered, but have a large number of wounds. (Overkill)"
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Sources for the above information include, but are not limited to:

John E. Douglas, Ann W. Burgess, Allen G. Burgess and Robert K. Ressler Crime Classification Manual (New York. Lexington Books 1992)
[ii] Vernon J. Geberth, Practical Homicide Investigation (New York CRC Press, 1996). Pg. 359
[iii] John E. Douglas, et al, Crime Classification Manual (New York. Lexington Books 1992) Pg. 252-253
[iv] Ibid Pg. 254-255

 

[OriginalJerseyGirl]

But in the Ramsey case, wasn't JonBenet sexually assaulted?

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Just a small correction for the newbies- Officer Waddell was actually first on the scene followewd about 2-3 mins later by Walling. The W's and K's get as confusing as the D's!!!

Thanks darlin!!!

 

[Jeana (DP)]

But in the Ramsey case, wasn't JonBenet sexually assaulted?

Yes. It was a good post, but I personally don't believe in the Ramsey's guilt.

 

[OriginalJerseyGirl]

I don't remember many of the details of the case at this point but I do remember feeling 100% convinced that they were both innocent.

 

[cappuccina]

...LE uses in cases where one family member is murdered by another....In the JBR case, the sexual assualt probably a part of the "staging", and occurred AFTER her mother hit her in the head with the flashlight....

In the DR case, there was no assault, but like JBR, there was definitely "overkill", as well as some of the other signs that point to a family member havong committed the crime, just like in the Jeffrey MacDonald case as well (also some similarities with the Diane Downs case). The sexual assault as a part of the staging, which the perpetrator does to try and point evidence away from themselves or another family member was also found in the Sheppard case, where it was made to look like a sexual assault case, but, was not, in fact, that..

All of this is just my opinion...

 

[Goody]

But in the Ramsey case, wasn't JonBenet sexually assaulted?

I don't think they have ever proven that one way or the other. There was some activity in the vaginal area, but some say it was part of the staging to make the crime look like sexual assault while others claim it was the act of pedophile who hid in the house until he could have his way with her.

 

[SUSANSTARR]

Darlie is 100% innocent. I have followed this case very closely from Day One. I believe Darin had something to do with it. After he admitted to speaking with people just THREE DAYS before the killings about hiring someone to burglarize the house for the insurance money, that sent up a huge red flag for me.

Ifeel she is innocent too. I would not have been able to convict on what they had in evidence. I never figured she did the bruising to herself. I think if her husband had anything to do with it, she would have said something by now. If she knew he had done something. I think alot of her problem is she is not likable to other females. I feel she dosn't like them and it shows up in her aditude. This would bleed over into the jury. Not concience, but un concience. I got on this when it frist happened because I used to live in that town many years ago. I had a run in with one of the small store owners . He was creepy!!!!Sorry about the spelling, I have to get ie spell check again.

Susie from Texas

 

[OriginalJerseyGirl]

Thanks for your responses Goody & Cappuccina. Like I said, I don't remember many of the Ramsey details, (and I don't want to go on about it in this forum since this is about the Routiers). But as far as a sexual assault to cover the crime, I am aware that this happens in many instances. However, it was reported widely on the news a few weeks back that DNA was recently found that doesn't match either of the parents. There's a feeling in a lot of people that have spoken on the case since then that this will lift the suspicion from the parents once & for all. I guess what I'm trying to say is that until this new "evidence" is investigated, we don't really know if these cases are similar at all.

Was JonBenet a victim of overkill? I didn't see it as overkill.

 

[Hopeful One]

Ifeel she is innocent too. I would not have been able to convict on what they had in evidence. I never figured she did the bruising to herself. I think if her husband had anything to do with it, she would have said something by now. If she knew he had done something. I think alot of her problem is she is not likable to other females.

I totally agree!! I think she is not likeable to other women and she didn't react and grieve the way people wanted her to.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

I totally agree!! I think she is not likeable to other women and she didn't react and grieve the way people wanted her to.

Frankly, I live in the area and I must say that I'm not sure how familiar you are with Texas women, but Darlie was a little less than average in the looks department and as far as "finances" go, for that area (the other side of the tracks), they were barely holding their own and were about to lose their home and business. NOT the kind of thing that many of the people I know would be envious of. I don't think any women had any problem with her looks. From what I've heard though, plenty of them thought she was a beotch who thought her chit didn't stink. Maybe that's the reason they didn't like her??????

Moreover, Darlie DID NOT act the way a grieving person would, but then neither did Kevin Fox, Scott Peterson or Cindy Lynch's husband, but you don't seem too have any problems accepting that fact. Why is that?

 

[Goody]

Thanks for your responses Goody & Cappuccina. Like I said, I don't remember many of the Ramsey details, (and I don't want to go on about it in this forum since this is about the Routiers). But as far as a sexual assault to cover the crime, I am aware that this happens in many instances. However, it was reported widely on the news a few weeks back that DNA was recently found that doesn't match either of the parents. There's a feeling in a lot of people that have spoken on the case since then that this will lift the suspicion from the parents once & for all. I guess what I'm trying to say is that until this new "evidence" is investigated, we don't really know if these cases are similar at all.

Was JonBenet a victim of overkill? I didn't see it as overkill.

My point was only that it has yet to be proven one way or the other. So far there has been no official clearing of the parents or naming even an unknown suspect based on that DNA that I know of. So I am going to wait and see what happens.

 

[Goody]

I totally agree!! I think she is not likeable to other women and she didn't react and grieve the way people wanted her to.

How can you say that? Darlie had a lot of female friends.....Mercedes, Karen, Basia, and several others their names I've forgotten. She even hosted that girls night out thing once a year, was going on vacation with girlfriends, paid mortgages for girl friends, etc., etc. I think she had more female friends than the average female does, so I don't think you can pin her troubles on other women.

 

[Goody]

Ifeel she is innocent too. I would not have been able to convict on what they had in evidence.

So what do you do with the blood evidence on her shirt? The fiber evidence on the bread knife? The bloody fingerprint that she can't be ruled out on?

I never figured she did the bruising to herself. I think if her husband had anything to do with it, she would have said something by now. If she knew he had done something.

Just because she didn't do the crime alone doesn't make her innocent. I think she had help, too. I also agree that if she were innocent that she would have told what she knew about Darin, which she hasn't, and she would have gotten her memory back by now. Traumatic amnesia not caused by physical trauma and brain damage is rarely ever permanent and generally comes back within six months. Not only has hers not, but she wants us to buy the Mutt and Jeff black intruder duo that she unearthed in one hypnotic session. It was so successful she decided never to do it again, I guess. No sense in learning everything you can when you are on a roll. LOL!

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Not only has hers not, but she wants us to buy the Mutt and Jeff black intruder duo that she unearthed in one hypnotic session. It was so successful she decided never to do it again, I guess. No sense in learning everything you can when you are on a roll. LOL!

LOL Which number story was that one Goody, I can't remember! LOL :bang:

 

[jaeger]

I also question Darlie self-inflicting wounds on her neck like that -- I think it was 2 cm from her carotid? I can't believe she could do that and be sure she'd miss an artery in her neck, plus she seemed pretty vain, why create such a scar?

She was vain, but she was also willing/able to become "the victim" when necessary to get what she wanted (i.e., the "rape" incident). And, as others have pointed out, her face and those expensive remained unscathed. Imagine someone is on top of you, trying to cut your throat, and you are fighting him off - don't you think something below or above the target area (such as your face and chest) is going to get injured in the struggle?

 

[Goody]

LOL Which number story was that one Goody, I can't remember! LOL :bang:

aahahahahah! Who knows? When you are always in edit, it is hard to keep track of all the changes. I keep waiting for Bear the Hungarian bodybuilder to surface or maybe that 300 pound (Chinese wrestler? ) that Darin cooked up. hahahahaha!

 

[Goody]

She was vain, but she was also willing/able to become "the victim" when necessary to get what she wanted (i.e., the "rape" incident). And, as others have pointed out, her face and those expensive remained unscathed. Imagine someone is on top of you, trying to cut your throat, and you are fighting him off - don't you think something below or above the target area (such as your face and chest) is going to get injured in the struggle?

Besides, how deep would one have to go to cut the artery on your neck? Not very. That's why her injury was just a slash and not a stab wound like the boys had. It wasn't supposed to go deep enough to hit anything life threatening. Stabbing herself in the torso was just too risky. Too many organs floating around in there. Better to slash the neck area and make it LOOK like she wouldn't have the guts to do such a thing. And that plastic surgeon was just a few dollars away. Peanuts when you go thru money like Darlie did. LOL!