Poll- Was the bag the Meter Reader saw in August the same bag he found in December?

[natsound]

Am I crazy? I heard somewhere, I thought yesterday on NG, that the meter reader confirmed that the bag he saw in August was the same bag found in December! I read the transcript and didn't see it. But I googled it, and one person on "scared monkeys" heard the same thing somewhere. Help!!

 

[kgeaux]

No, they're not incomplete. They might have cut off the dispatchers answering the phone but the WESH links do include them answering "911" or "sheriff's office."

He does tend to just start out talking with no preface about why he's calling but the calls are complete. There is NO mention of bags or foul odors.

It certainly wouldn't be the first time a reporter, especially a broadcast reporter trying to get the story out fast without doing adequate research, reported something as fact that was merely rumor.

Something is wrong, garden, if the calls aren't edited. Because if you click on the last link, the first thing you'll see is the written report of the call, and a grey bag is definitely mentioned. Nothing about an odor, though.

Also, in the 2nd call (on the 12th) something is very obviously blocked out......he says there is (blanked out) behind the tree there. Whatever is blocked out of that call has me scratching my head and wondering WHAT DID HE SAY that was important enough to block out, but so unimportant that responding officers looked at the report and said, :No need to respond. Cadavar dogs have already gone through"

I am really starting to wonder if there is anything in this case that is clearly black or white.

 

[kgeaux]

Why do we think the bag was black?? Is there a link for that? I had assumed it was black, but again - after reviewing the pictures, I am not so sure.

Because the meter reader said it was black. He saw a black bag and moved it, causing the skull to fall out. He said this on Nancy Grace, and I think I also heard it on the December 911 call.......although the NG show played the 911 call over and over in the midst of interviewing the poor guy, so it's possible I'm mixing up what he said on the show with what he said on the call. Clear as mud?? :blowkiss:

 

[Reannan]

Is this the photo of the garbage bag that was found with the remains? It appears to be either dark green or black in color.

Thanks Patty, but I have enlarged and somewhat lightened this black object, and it appears to be an old tree trunk.

 

[kgeaux]

It sounds as if Kronk is just a guy who was able to investigate where lots of people from other states WANTED to look.

I don't necessarily think it's important what the guy saw, either. (Although his insistance that it's "round and white" sure does make me wonder if he's trying to say "SKULL" without saying skull.....) What does matter is that the COPS saw nothing. If they did more than a very cursory search and didn't find the body or the round white thing, then the question arises: How did the cops miss it?

Here is a closer picture of the white object. I don't know what it is, but I don't think it is a flower.

I see it now, Reannan, and you're right, it's not a flower. It does look like it could be a white bag seen through the foliage, but I can't really tell.

Am I crazy? I heard somewhere, I thought yesterday on NG, that the meter reader confirmed that the bag he saw in August was the same bag found in December! I read the transcript and didn't see it. But I googled it, and one person on "scared monkeys" heard the same thing somewhere. Help!!

I heard that somewhere too. But I don't know how he'd know that. Unless the bag were in the very, EXACT same spot. And if it was, and LE missed it during the response to the third call when the meter reader was standing there to show them exactly where to look........well, can we say OJ trial? Because I think it will have a very, very favorable result for the defense and a very negative result for prosecutors if LE looked at a "round white" thing and didn't see it was a skull.

 

[Patty G]

Thanks Patty, but I have enlarged and somewhat lightened this black object, and it appears to be an old tree trunk.

OK ... thank you!

 

[natsound]

I don't necessarily think it's important what the guy saw, either. (Although his insistance that it's "round and white" sure does make me wonder if he's trying to say "SKULL" without saying skull.....) What does matter is that the COPS saw nothing. If they did more than a very cursory search and didn't find the body or the round white thing, then the question arises: How did the cops miss it?



I see it now, Reannan, and you're right, it's not a flower. It does look like it could be a white bag seen through the foliage, but I can't really tell.



I heard that somewhere too. But I don't know how he'd know that. Unless the bag were in the very, EXACT same spot. And if it was, and LE missed it during the response to the third call when the meter reader was standing there to show them exactly where to look........well, can we say OJ trial? Because I think it will have a very, very favorable result for the defense and a very negative result for prosecutors if LE looked at a "round white" thing and didn't see it was a skull.

Re: above in bold.... if the meter reader was standing there on Aug. 13 showing the deputy exactly where to look, and neither one of them saw the bag he saw two days earlier, then how can we blame police? How can this meter reader be so sure it's the same bag? Did LE show it to him after Caylee's remains were found? And he never mentioned a black bag during those 911 calls... but he says that's what he kicked on Dec. 11.

 

[gardenhart]

Something is wrong, garden, if the calls aren't edited. Because if you click on the last link, the first thing you'll see is the written report of the call, and a grey bag is definitely mentioned. Nothing about an odor, though.

Also, in the 2nd call (on the 12th) something is very obviously blocked out......he says there is (blanked out) behind the tree there. Whatever is blocked out of that call has me scratching my head and wondering WHAT DID HE SAY that was important enough to block out, but so unimportant that responding officers looked at the report and said, :No need to respond. Cadavar dogs have already gone through"

I am really starting to wonder if there is anything in this case that is clearly black or white.

Actually, what is says is a "gry bag on the swamp area NOI," whatever that means. And that isn't a police report, what on earth is it? The logo at the top is for Tiburon a something something company. Can't read all of it.

I still believe that the early reports of bags of many colors came from sloppy reporting.

 

[kgeaux]

Re: above in bold.... if the meter reader was standing there on Aug. 13 showing the deputy exactly where to look, and neither one of them saw the bag he saw two days earlier, then how can we blame police? How can this meter reader be so sure it's the same bag? Did LE show it to him after Caylee's remains were found? And he never mentioned a black bag during those 911 calls... but he says that's what he kicked on Dec. 11.

The meter reader was STILL seeing something on the 13th. Deputies were dispatched. What did they see?

LE did not have to show the meter reader the bag after Caylee's remains were found, Nat. The meter reader is the one who found the bag, who moved it, who saw the skull when it rolled out. I'm pretty sure he knows what color it was.

Actually, what is says is a "gry bag on the swamp area NOI," whatever that means. And that isn't a police report, what on earth is it? The logo at the top is for Tiburon a something something company. Can't read all of it.

I still believe that the early reports of bags of many colors came from sloppy reporting.

This is the written report of the 911 call, Garden. Do you suppose "gry bag" means anything other than "gray bag"?

Honestly, I don't remember any early reports of bags of many colors. The earliest report was that he saw a gray bag by the "side of the road." We didn't learn of this until December, of course, because no one knew of the August 911 calls before then. But the meter reader did say "black bag" in speaking of his discovery.

One of our members here sees a white bag, but I've never heard media call the bag white or many colors.

BTW: I think the report can be read as "gray bag on the swampy area not on intersection" I can't think of anything else NOI might mean, but surely there's something!

The second report shows that he mentioned a "large bag" but doesn't mention color.

I think it's safe to say the meter reader saw a bag, even if we don't hear it in the clips linked above. The first report makes it obvious to me that the bag was grey, but hey, it's ok to disagree!

 

[natsound]

The meter reader was STILL seeing something on the 13th. Deputies were dispatched. What did they see?

LE did not have to show the meter reader the bag after Caylee's remains were found, Nat. The meter reader is the one who found the bag, who moved it, who saw the skull when it rolled out. I'm pretty sure he knows what color it was.


This is the written report of the 911 call, Garden. Do you suppose "gry bag" means anything other than "gray bag"?

Honestly, I don't remember any early reports of bags of many colors. The earliest report was that he saw a gray bag by the "side of the road." We didn't learn of this until December, of course, because no one knew of the August 911 calls before then. But the meter reader did say "black bag" in speaking of his discovery.

One of our members here sees a white bag, but I've never heard media call the bag white or many colors.

BTW: I think the report can be read as "gray bag on the swampy area not on intersection" I can't think of anything else NOI might mean, but surely there's something!

The second report shows that he mentioned a "large bag" but doesn't mention color.

I think it's safe to say the meter reader saw a bag, even if we don't hear it in the clips linked above. The first report makes it obvious to me that the bag was grey, but hey, it's ok to disagree!

above in bold.. oops... DUH! my mistake there. :hand: I'm getting ahead of myself.

 

[gardenhart]

The meter reader was STILL seeing something on the 13th. Deputies were dispatched. What did they see?

LE did not have to show the meter reader the bag after Caylee's remains were found, Nat. The meter reader is the one who found the bag, who moved it, who saw the skull when it rolled out. I'm pretty sure he knows what color it was.



This is the written report of the 911 call, Garden. Do you suppose "gry bag" means anything other than "gray bag"?

Honestly, I don't remember any early reports of bags of many colors. The earliest report was that he saw a gray bag by the "side of the road." We didn't learn of this until December, of course, because no one knew of the August 911 calls before then. But the meter reader did say "black bag" in speaking of his discovery.

One of our members here sees a white bag, but I've never heard media call the bag white or many colors.

BTW: I think the report can be read as "gray bag on the swampy area not on intersection" I can't think of anything else NOI might mean, but surely there's something!

The second report shows that he mentioned a "large bag" but doesn't mention color.

I think it's safe to say the meter reader saw a bag, even if we don't hear it in the clips linked above. The first report makes it obvious to me that the bag was grey, but hey, it's ok to disagree!

Why doesn't the report have a sheriff's department logo instead of some company?

Of course it could mean gray bag in the swamp instead of gry bag on the swamp. I have no idea what NOI means. Maybe it's a grumpy bag, a grungy bag, if you want to be sarcastic.

I'm just saying there certainly was room for mistakes and lousy reporting here. Just as, in the first call, he says the intersecting road is Good Hope and then the dispatcher said Good Home when talking about Hopesprings.

And I don't understand why there's a company logo on this report. Does the county contract out its meter reading? He says he works for the county but I don't know. If so, did he call his company before calling police?

Surely the county doesn't contract out its dispatch calls and police reports?

 

[BellaPhia]

Why doesn't the report have a sheriff's department logo instead of some company?

Of course it could mean gray bag in the swamp instead of gry bag on the swamp. I have no idea what NOI means. Maybe it's a grumpy bag, a grungy bag, if you want to be sarcastic.

I'm just saying there certainly was room for mistakes and lousy reporting here. Just as, in the first call, he says the intersecting road is Good Hope and then the dispatcher said Good Home when talking about Hopesprings.

And I don't understand why there's a company logo on this report. Does the county contract out its meter reading? He says he works for the county but I don't know. If so, did he call his company before calling police?

Surely the county doesn't contract out its dispatch calls and police reports?

NOI.....Not of Importance.....

 

[Reannan]

Just to try and keep things clear - at least here on WS's - nothing is EVER going to be clear with this case; the white bag that I see is definitely there, but I now believe it may be a body bag or evidence bag that LE brought into the area. We have been discussing it over on the Crime Photo's thread as well. I wish the MR could tell us a bit more about what he saw!

 

[kgeaux]

above in bold.. oops... DUH! my mistake there. :hand: I'm getting ahead of myself.

No problem, sweetie. I've done it myself. More than once!

Why doesn't the report have a sheriff's department logo instead of some company?

Of course it could mean gray bag in the swamp instead of gry bag on the swamp. I have no idea what NOI means. Maybe it's a grumpy bag, a grungy bag, if you want to be sarcastic.

I'm just saying there certainly was room for mistakes and lousy reporting here. Just as, in the first call, he says the intersecting road is Good Hope and then the dispatcher said Good Home when talking about Hopesprings.

And I don't understand why there's a company logo on this report. Does the county contract out its meter reading? He says he works for the county but I don't know. If so, did he call his company before calling police?

Surely the county doesn't contract out its dispatch calls and police reports?

No, I don't want to be sarcastic. My point is that we do not hear everything that was said on the linked calls. There is information in the report that is not heard, so we cannot say that something was not said simply because we do not hear it. We never hear the MR say "bag" but that word is mentioned in two of the reports, so we know he said it. "gry bag" could mean grungy! But I betcha it means gray!

Interesting question about the contracting out. I know here when you dial 911, sometimes you get local emergency and sometimes you get a dispatch center in MISSISSIPPI! I wouldn't imagine anyone contracts out Police reports, but the reports in the link are simply little synopses of the calls.

NOI.....Not of Importance.....

AHHH, that makes sense! (MUCH more sense than "not on intersection!") Do you think the dispatcher decided the bag was not of importance because the MR said he wasn't sure if what he saw was significant? Because if NOI really does mean "not of importance" that's a pretty bold thing for the dispatcher to decide, isn't it?

 

[gardenhart]

No problem, sweetie. I've done it myself. More than once!



No, I don't want to be sarcastic. My point is that we do not hear everything that was said on the linked calls. There is information in the report that is not heard, so we cannot say that something was not said simply because we do not hear it. We never hear the MR say "bag" but that word is mentioned in two of the reports, so we know he said it. "gry bag" could mean grungy! But I betcha it means gray!

Interesting question about the contracting out. I know here when you dial 911, sometimes you get local emergency and sometimes you get a dispatch center in MISSISSIPPI! I wouldn't imagine anyone contracts out Police reports, but the reports in the link are simply little synopses of the calls.



AHHH, that makes sense! (MUCH more sense than "not on intersection!") Do you think the dispatcher decided the bag was not of importance because the MR said he wasn't sure if what he saw was significant? Because if NOI really does mean "not of importance" that's a pretty bold thing for the dispatcher to decide, isn't it?

Is this the report after the fact? After the response? Because in that case it could mean all that was found was a gray bag and it was not of importance.

I'll be darned if I'm going to go back and read all that stuff again, but I believe one of the stories said an officer responded but nothing was found but trash. I'm thinking that was after the third call, though.

BTW, I guess why I'm so adamant about this is if these news organizations are posting edited tapes, they ought to report them as such. That's extremely sloppy reporting. If the police are providing edited tapes, they should report that as well.

 

[elfie]

Here is a closer picture of the white object. I don't know what it is, but I don't think it is a flower.

From the perspective it is still a flower. The height, plus other flowers nearby verify this.

 

[Nosey Parker]

I was appalled at the ignorance of the dispatcher in those calls. My daughter started her LE career as an emergency dispatcher (in Canada they are civilian employees of the police departments). Her entry examination was extensive, including having to know the location of every major intersection in the region. The training and probation period was a year long. I'm sure that the disposition of the dispatcher had a lot to do with the response to those calls. Whoever was sent there had a very poor location description. The dispatcher should have spelt the street names back to the MM, and known the name of the elementary school without trying to pull up a map. I got the impression she did not even recognise the name Anthony, and the relevance to the calls.

 

[Edam]

I am of the impression that what he found in August was in a different location and was a different color than the bag in December.
It sounds like some people are convinced it was the same bag both times.
I know we don't know everything but I'd like to see what everyone thinks.

How is anyone supposed to know this? By guessing?

 

[MADJGNLAW]

She was rebagged and moved by Lee. The reason for the high 5. "l
Look close to home, same place as last time? " These are similar quotes of the coded conversation.

That is exactly what I have been thinking.

Not sure where to post this, but...

I also find the fact that the trail of bones has not caught anyone's attention. A trail is usually left behind so someone can find something or their way back. Animals would scatter through out the area, I noticed the flags were pretty much close together. If the body was moved then the bag may of ripped and that is why the bones were scattered? Any thoughts? :waitasec:

 

[pirate]

That is exactly what I have been thinking.

Not sure where to post this, but...

I also find the fact that the trail of bones has not caught anyone's attention. A trail is usually left behind so someone can find something or their way back. Animals would scatter through out the area, I noticed the flags were pretty much close together. If the body was moved then the bag may of ripped and that is why the bones were scattered? Any thoughts? :waitasec:

Those flags were color coded for various evidence- bones, footprints, other items of interest. We can't be sure each flag was where a bone was found.


As for the white item in that picture- don't forget that area was loaded with trash- it is known as a dumping ground for garbage. This could be something that someone else dumped there.