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[giagreen]

staged

Are you talking about JT? If so why do you say that? I am trying to figure more out about her and love to hear people's input.

 

[CriminalMinds]

Are you talking about JT? If so why do you say that? I am trying to figure more out about her and love to hear people's input.

yes, JT--feels like it was a calling card, so to speak--no attempt to hide it really, and in a spot where it was likely to be found

 

[PickleChris]

Spinning off topic a bit but have to post this. I spent a decent amount of time this weekend discussing the case with a retired detective from the 'area'. I'll leave it at that. He said way too many people were/are involved to even make a coverup or 'inside job' possible. If that were the case, very limited resources would have been used and the media would have been lucky to get a brief about a potential 'serial killer'. The second FBI entered the crime scene, you know it's not a coverup. I was told both departments (local and federal) usually try to point out flaws in each others investigations. - So something weird would have popped up.

Also a very interesting point. He believes this person is very similar to Rifkin. No big $$ guy, no fancy car, no promises of getting rich. Not local to the OB area but within a 30-45 minute drive max. Someone that hires (and pays) sex workers fairly often but doesn't kill all of them. This makes him either live in a small apartment, parents house, or a run down inherited house (busy spending money on hiring girls). Ocean Parkway is probably not his first dumping ground and its def not his last. OB4 are 100% connected, the others most likely not. Also stated that the burlap is straight forward. Landscaping, fishing, etc. It's a big clue that is going to be thought too far into.

Figured I'd share.

 

[hawkshaw]

He is certainly entitled to his opinion - the retired detective, that is. Pickle, ask your friend if he can explain the SG factor in the case. Does he believe SG is connected to the GB4.

This case does seem to have some unusual pieces to it. SG wasn't found until a cop and his dog appeared to have stumbled on to one of the GB4. By stumbled I mean it doesn't appear to have been a sanctioned search for SG. Another troubling thing about the GB4 find is the first body was found in the opposite direction SG was last seen to have gone. It makes one wonder if anyone was really looking for SG? Stranger things have happened. Sure, after the first body of the GB4 were found the SCPD really had no choice but to expand the search. Another 'accidental' find of another body(s) would be pretty much embarrassing. Now they have to find SG before someone else stumbles on her and found a noose around her neck or a knife stuck in where her heart used to be.

The FBI. Oooooh, that is scary. I told you the story where this gal went to them and told them her boyfriend was filling in a big hole in her backyard and when she asked him what he was doing he told her he was a hit man burying a body. They laughed her out of the office. But even a broken clock is right twice a day.

 

[PickleChris]

My opinion is they were doing a training exercise (I've heard this a few times before) and stumbled upon the first body - while prepping for the media release the thought quick to include SG to make it look like they never gave up on the search.

I'll ask what he thinks about the SG factor. Next time I might get him on here to start reading up a bit.

 

[deedee21]

My opinion is they were doing a training exercise (I've heard this a few times before) and stumbled upon the first body - while prepping for the media release the thought quick to include SG to make it look like they never gave up on the search.

I'll ask what he thinks about the SG factor. Next time I might get him on here to start reading up a bit.

The police said on day one a body was found during a training excercise. They were not looking for SG when the body was discovered. Is the Det. you spoke to the same one that sent a letter to Newsday?

 

[ELaudat]

Here is additional info on my theories:

IMO His "mission" is motivated by his hatered towards prostituetes.
He IMO possibly hates prostitutes because he feels that they ruin the lives of their loved once, husbands/boyfriends and children.
He IMO possibly saw himself as a victim of a woman who let him, and their children, down by choosing to become a prostituet
He IMO want to punish/eliminate prostituets and scare other girls/woman/mothers from become prostitutes.
I belive this is possibly what got him started, in Atlantic City
He IMO then became obsessed by the actual killing and the power it made him feel.
After the AC4 "mission" he possibly developed into a combined mission SK and a lust SK.
Both the AC4 and the GB4 murders seems, to some degree, to be ritualistic oriented, in the sence of:

I have a theory.

I'm very much a newbie, so forgive me if any part of what I write is misinformed etc, just thought I'd through my thoughts out there.

Due to the posing of the bodies, I believe it's possible that he didn't feel hatred towards the women but instead some sort of feeling of 'saving' them.

I also see this reflected of the placing or covering of the bodies in the burlap. Could this possibly have been used in a way of comforting or protecting the women?

I don't remember the exact place that I read this information, and again forgive me if I am mistaken but, I believe I read that there has been speculation of some kind of religious aspect regarding the position of posing and the burlap.

Could this killer be someone that was raised in a strict or even extreme religious way, and his conflicting feelings of sexual urge and devotion to religion have triggered him to kill?

This theory being based on the AC and GB killer being the same person.

On the other hand, the killer may have not hated prostitutes, but women in general. He may have a feeling of abandonment (or something of the sort) towards his mother. The prostitute aspect could simply be that they are easier to set up meets, and that's why his victims were prostitutes opposed to regular women.

And just to disclose, these are all just my own opinions and theories. Not fact or proven information.

 

[PickleChris]

The police said on day one a body was found during a training excercise. They were not looking for SG when the body was discovered. Is the Det. you spoke to the same one that sent a letter to Newsday?

Not the same one that sent the letter.

 

[hawkshaw]

Until such time I hear a reasonable explanation as to why the detective wrote the letter I will have to believe it is part of a cover up and attempt to misdirect the public.

 

[CriminalMinds]

Another troubling thing about the GB4 find is the first body was found in the ***opposite*** direction SG was last seen to have gone. .

this has always stuck with me, although we may have a different idea as to why this occurred--but a troubling point, nonetheless

 

[CriminalMinds]

This case does seem to have some unusual pieces to it. SG wasn't found until a cop and his dog appeared to have stumbled on to one of the GB4. By stumbled I mean it doesn't appear to have been a sanctioned search for SG.

indeed--but, by stumbled, *I* mean he let the dog out to piss, and sha-pow, body

 

[deedee21]

Did Brewer ever tell police who he and SG went to see in Oak Beach? They were gone for 15 minutes.

 

[giagreen]

Did Brewer ever tell police who he and SG went to see in Oak Beach? They were gone for 15 minutes.

Was it ever a fact that they went and seen anyone? Or has JB ever stated that they went and met anyone? I could think of a few reasons that they took that drive.

 

[PreciousDust]

Did Brewer ever tell police who he and SG went to see in Oak Beach? They were gone for 15 minutes.

Two weeks later, and my answer is still true:

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9633030&postcount=373"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[EBrown]

I've come to this case as a result of reading Lost Girls. There's an Oak Beach resident who many suspect of being the LISK (not sure if I can post initials/name). But this person has had a long term marriage. It seems like this would be unusual in that serial killers don't seem to be able to manage long term stable relationships (with romantic partners or, in many cases, their children). In the ones I can think of where there was a wife or long time girlfriend, the partner actually suspected the SK and did not defend him.

Rifkin was a loner, Ridgeway was married 3 times, Bundy had a girlfriend but she thought he was guilty, Dahmer was a loner, Gacy was divorced and never contacted his kids again after the divorce...

I'd be interested any anyone's thoughts on this.


E

 

[deedee21]

Some believe he knows something even if he is not the killer. Marii Glibert received a call from CPH. We all know by now what she claims he said. Bottom line. It happened or it didnt. Why would Mari make up the contents of that call? Perhaps Varrone would like to say the same about Mari that he did about CPH. Shes a story teller. Let him take a polygraph and put this all to rest.

 

[deedee21]

I think if the LISK is ever arrested, people that know him wont be surprised. I dont think the neighbors will say he" was such a nice man". I dont think they will say "I cant believe he would do such a thing." It was sadistic of him to call MB sister and say the things he did. I think by nature hes a SOB and treats people like crap. I dont believe he blends into society. Hes to evil.

 

[EBrown]

Some believe he knows something even if he is not the killer. Marii Glibert received a call from CPH. We all know by now what she claims he said. Bottom line. It happened or it didnt. Why would Mari make up the contents of that call? Perhaps Varrone would like to say the same about Mari that he did about CPH. Shes a story teller. Let him take a polygraph and put this all to rest.

CPH was not truthful about the call but people don't always correctly remember what they hear, especially when they're upset or taken off guard. As CPH is talking, Mari is saying in her head "Who is this guy?" "What is he talking about?" - she's taken off guard. In my work, people misremember/mishear important information, diagnoses, treatment instructions etc. all the time. When this happens, they usually get part of it, they remember words...

Could CPH have said "i have a lot of experience working with wayward girls. I wish my neighbors would have called because I could have sedated her. I have medication at home" Could that be received as "I have a home for wayward girls. I sedated her." I think it's possible, but because he lied about making the call, when he made the call and probably the content of what he said, he's got no credibility. I woudn't believe anything he said, but my gut says he doesn't really know anything.

I also haven't heard the Suffolk County Policy say that they had a psychiatrist listen to Shannan's 911 call. I don't think the police are qualified to determine if she sounded psychotic or was rational but terrified. People who are acutely psychotic tend to communicate in very specific ways. I hope they played the recording for a psychiatrist who was experienced in treating the acutely mentally ill and it wasn't just a bunch of detectives sitting around who decided she was psychotic.

E

 

[Theforeigner]

CPH was not truthful about the call but people don't always correctly remember what they hear, especially when they're upset or taken off guard. As CPH is talking, Mari is saying in her head "Who is this guy?" "What is he talking about?" - she's taken off guard. In my work, people misremember/mishear important information, diagnoses, treatment instructions etc. all the time. When this happens, they usually get part of it, they remember words...

Could CPH have said "i have a lot of experience working with wayward girls. I wish my neighbors would have called because I could have sedated her. I have medication at home" Could that be received as "I have a home for wayward girls. I sedated her." I think it's possible, but because he lied about making the call, when he made the call and probably the content of what he said, he's got no credibility. I woudn't believe anything he said, but my gut says he doesn't really know anything.

I also haven't heard the Suffolk County Policy say that they had a psychiatrist listen to Shannan's 911 call. I don't think the police are qualified to determine if she sounded psychotic or was rational but terrified. People who are acutely psychotic tend to communicate in very specific ways. I hope they played the recording for a psychiatrist who was experienced in treating the acutely mentally ill and it wasn't just a bunch of detectives sitting around who decided she was psychotic.

E

Great post! interesting input

 

[Justiceforever]

CPH was not truthful about the call but people don't always correctly remember what they hear, especially when they're upset or taken off guard. As CPH is talking, Mari is saying in her head "Who is this guy?" "What is he talking about?" - she's taken off guard. In my work, people misremember/mishear important information, diagnoses, treatment instructions etc. all the time. When this happens, they usually get part of it, they remember words...

Could CPH have said "i have a lot of experience working with wayward girls. I wish my neighbors would have called because I could have sedated her. I have medication at home" Could that be received as "I have a home for wayward girls. I sedated her." I think it's possible, but because he lied about making the call, when he made the call and probably the content of what he said, he's got no credibility. I woudn't believe anything he said, but my gut says he doesn't really know anything.

I also haven't heard the Suffolk County Policy say that they had a psychiatrist listen to Shannan's 911 call. I don't think the police are qualified to determine if she sounded psychotic or was rational but terrified. People who are acutely psychotic tend to communicate in very specific ways. I hope they played the recording for a psychiatrist who was experienced in treating the acutely mentally ill and it wasn't just a bunch of detectives sitting around who decided she was psychotic.

E

I agree with TF, great post. Welcome to WSs It's always nice to hear new perspectives!