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[PickleChris]

If the SCPD is investigating these "trinkets" - Why don't they just put a camera in the trees and review the footage? I honestly thought they were going to do this right after they found the GB4.

 

[hawkshaw]

The SCPD is still trying to deal with the Chief of Department's FBI investigation into his alleged civil rights violation. Many believe there is much more to this than meets the eye.

When Burke left the DA office for higher office his place was taken by a LT who went to Captain to Deputy Inspector in one day. A year later he became Chief of Detectives. All are Spota Alumni.

 

[Clem Snide]

If the SCPD is investigating these "trinkets" - Why don't they just put a camera in the trees and review the footage? I honestly thought they were going to do this right after they found the GB4.

Yeah. Maybe they have. You'd have to assume that he'd go back there at some point. The location has a special significance to him. Leaving trinkets reminds me of BTK. Didn't he leave a box of cereal somewhere that had a Barbie doll with a noose around it's neck inside? Wonder how he's enjoying prison.

I second NJGuy's post. Would love to have confirmation.

 

[Theforeigner]

This guy is local to the area and lives and works within a few miles of the dump site(s) -

He sometimes (or use to) work in or near the city- he may have changed jobs or transfered shortly after Melissa's disappearance as he felt there may be some heat. I also feel there was something more personal about Melissa. Perhaps he had a thing for her or knew her aside from her profession.

He is in his late 40's, married and has kids
His wife is "the boss" at home (like most men She's too good for him and they both know it. She stays with him because it's easier than starting over. She is the primary breadwinner. She has a way of controlling him when he begins to enter a rage. When she's not there to stop it, he becomes dangerous.
She knows he is dangerous but turns a blind eye since he is not abusive to her. He tales his anger toward his wife out on others. Some of the victims may resemble her

People are uncomfortable around him. Although they don't realize why, and most learn to ignore it or file it away.

He has stalking tendencies

He has a gross grandoise delusions.

He may suffer from MPD - people may notice how quickly his demeaner changes or he becomes enraged.

He uses his work as a means to control others. If he is in a power position at work, working beneath him is hell as he seeks out opportunitties to dictate personal lives as well as work life. He may often loses clients (or his job) due to his controlling nature and obsessive and sometimes angry nature.

His work gives him access to the use of numerous vehicles. He uses these vehicles to avoid having any evidence in his own vehicle and for protection in case anyone sees someone picking the girl(s) up

He travels Ocean Parkway often and may find opportunities to bring clients and friends along for a ride on the parkway- (you may wonder why you have gone that route - it's his way of taking a little credit and he may even discuss the case as they drive by the sites)

He may have changed jobs or transfered again shortly after the first of the bodies were found.

He gives clues to those around him. This may be because deep down he wants to be caught because he wants credit for the crimes. Or, it may be that he likes to feel he possess a jhigher intellect and feels he is proving that by dropping clues that nobody seems to catch on to. Someone out there could be putting the clues together

He has revisited the sites and has left clues or trinkets. Look for a meaning to items left at the crosses.
May have recently removed items from the dump sites.

He may have been killing for longer than anyone thinks. Dating back to his late teens or early 20's , either on Long Island or somewhere he went to school or work training. Look for similar style killings in groups of victims (3 or 4) that would have been near his age at the time. He was much younger and able to lure these girls back then.

He is not using the services of these girls prior to the fatal encounters. He would never have sex with an prostitute, He despises them and may have commented about this case or made comments that such women deserve what they got.

He may not be limited to escorts as he evolves once again. He feels there is the potential for entrapment by LE so may not use online ads for victims again. He may look for street level working girls or drug addicts or seek out any vulnerable woman alone at night.

At least one person has thought of him as a potential suspect and he has been looked at by LE already. He may still be on their radar

Hi Maingirl

may I ask you; is this info you posted about the killer that he;

"revisited the sites and has left clues or trinkets. Look for a meaning to items left at the crosses"

Is that FACT? or is it just a theorie of yours?

And if it is FASCT could you please share more details?

Thanks in advance...

TF

 

[Mountain_Kat]

This guy is local to the area and lives and works within a few miles of the dump site(s) - Agreed. I definitely think he lives close to the dump site. He could also work on LI, but I think it's equally possible that he works, or did work, in NYC.

He sometimes (or use to) work in or near the city- he may have changed jobs or transfered shortly after Melissa's disappearance as he felt there may be some heat. I also feel there was something more personal about Melissa. Perhaps he had a thing for her or knew her aside from her profession. Agreed. And that makes me wonder about the "older man" on LI that Melissa was "chummy" with.

He is in his late 40's, married and has kids Agreed, though I think he might also be in his 50's.
His wife is "the boss" at home Agreed. (like most men She's too good for him and they both know it. She stays with him because it's easier than starting over. She is the primary breadwinner. She has a way of controlling him when he begins to enter a rage. When she's not there to stop it, he becomes dangerous.
She knows he is dangerous but turns a blind eye since he is not abusive to her. He tales his anger toward his wife out on others. Some of the victims may resemble her

People are uncomfortable around him. Although they don't realize why, and most learn to ignore it or file it away.

He has stalking tendencies Agreed

He has a gross grandoise delusions. Agreed

He may suffer from MPD - people may notice how quickly his demeaner changes or he becomes enraged.

He uses his work as a means to control others. If he is in a power position at work, working beneath him is hell as he seeks out opportunitties to dictate personal lives as well as work life. He may often loses clients (or his job) due to his controlling nature and obsessive and sometimes angry nature.

His work gives him access to the use of numerous vehicles. He uses these vehicles to avoid having any evidence in his own vehicle and for protection in case anyone sees someone picking the girl(s) up

He travels Ocean Parkway often and may find opportunities to bring clients and friends along for a ride on the parkway- (you may wonder why you have gone that route - it's his way of taking a little credit and he may even discuss the case as they drive by the sites) Agreed

He may have changed jobs or transfered again shortly after the first of the bodies were found. Agreed

He gives clues to those around him. Very likely This may be because deep down he wants to be caught because he wants credit for the crimes. Or, it may be that he likes to feel he possess a jhigher intellect and feels he is proving that by dropping clues that nobody seems to catch on to. Someone out there could be putting the clues together

He has revisited the sites and has left clues or trinkets. Look for a meaning to items left at the crosses.

May have recently removed items from the dump sites.

He may have been killing for longer than anyone thinks. Dating back to his late teens or early 20's , either on Long Island or somewhere he went to school or work training. Look for similar style killings in groups of victims (3 or 4) that would have been near his age at the time. He was much younger and able to lure these girls back then.

He is not using the services of these girls prior to the fatal encounters. He would never have sex with an prostitute, He despises them and may have commented about this case or made comments that such women deserve what they got.

He may not be limited to escorts as he evolves once again. He feels there is the potential for entrapment by LE so may not use online ads for victims again. He may look for street level working girls or drug addicts or seek out any vulnerable woman alone at night.

At least one person has thought of him as a potential suspect and he has been looked at by LE already. He may still be on their radar

What I don't agree with is that he has anger issues that are obvious to those around him. In fact, I suspect that just the opposite is true. I don't think he's capable of expressing anger one on one with people. He's not in control in his real life, so in his fantasy life he gives himself the ultimate control...life or death. He lives out this fantasy with his victims. JMO

I also don't agree that he doesn't have sex with the victims. I think he does, and I think he kills them while he's having sex with them. I also think his work might have brought these women into his web. Again, JMO

 

[Aleph]

Hi Maingirl

may I ask you; is this info you posted about the killer that he;

"revisited the sites and has left clues or trinkets. Look for a meaning to items left at the crosses"

Is that FACT? or is it just a theorie of yours?

And if it is FASCT could you please share more details?

Thanks in advance...

TF

Is it a reference to those time out dolls or whatever they're called?

How would LE know that it's the killer leaving trinkets? Unless he's possibly leaving victims' belongings that are otherwise unaccounted for?

 

[deedee21]

Yeah. Maybe they have. You'd have to assume that he'd go back there at some point. The location has a special significance to him. Leaving trinkets reminds me of BTK. Didn't he leave a box of cereal somewhere that had a Barbie doll with a noose around it's neck inside? Wonder how he's enjoying prison.

I second NJGuy's post. Would love to have confirmation.

The only confirmation anyone can get is from the police dept. Thats not going to happen. I am curious about one thing though. Are the trinkets a clue to the identity of the killer? OR is there something about the trinkets that say its the killer who was here and not a passerby leaving items in memory of the victims?

 

[deedee21]

I was going to ask if the Robert Moses Causeway has cameras? But maybe the killer is coming from the west. Driiving around the loop at Jones Beach and heading East.

 

[deedee21]

Sounds completely plausible. The only question is how literal he was being when he said he wanted to watch her body rot. I suspect he didn't just dump them to forget about them, so I can certainly see him gaining some sick satisfaction from being able to view their dumping grounds while he worked.

Regardless, I'd put money on him returning to the sites and possibly pulling over to spend time with the bodies, even if he remained in the car. I suppose we've scoured all googlemaps and satelite images taken from that time? My memory is fuzzy.

The bodies are gone and now hes pulling over to leave items. He must be doing this in the middle of the night. Little to no traffic. Hes got ballz.

 

[deedee21]

Maybe all the girls ended up at Brewers house. Instead of paying them he killed them instead.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

Can we start posting links to information we state as facts, please? Otherwise, can we put this kind of info in the rumors thread? Not trying to be a buzzkill here, but this forum has rules for a reason.

 

[deedee21]

Can we start posting links to information we state as facts, please? Otherwise, can we put this kind of info in the rumors thread? Not trying to be a buzzkill here, but this forum has rules for a reason.

I did not state this as a fact. I said maybe.

 

[LISleuth]

Pat Brown discussing the Long Island Serial Killer on the Today Show, profiles him:

http://youtu.be/If26x-0LKvc

 

[hawkshaw]

If we knew what all the facts are we would know who killed the gals. There is really no such thing as a FACT. The closest one comes to it is the sun rises in the east and sets in the west. That you will not get out of this life alive. The rest is BS to a great extent.

Maybe they all went there and committed mass suicide.

SG is DEAD. There is a question if she was murdered or if she died from exposure or drowning. Or maybe someone murdered her.

 

[Clem Snide]

Ugh. Pat Brown. She's the worst. I'm pretty sure I could declare myself a profiler and have better insights than she does. In fact, why don't I do that? I am now a self proclaimed profiler. Tell the Today show that I'm available.

 

[Iluminada]

I like Pat Brown. I just read the first couple of pages and something gross occurred to me. The bodies were stomach down facing the east. Imagine the pose with the perp watching our beautiful sunrise on the eastcoast. Lots of dates end with this sunrise certainly not necessarily the pose or the death. But lets say this perp wanted to feel like he was on a date and it lasted all night till sunrise. He could then return before sunrise, before he heads to work and he can relive his date. Sunrise is between 5:00 am and 7:00 am depending on time of year. Who leaves the house for work at that time or perhaps it's someone who says he's going out for a run before work? I believe the killings happened at night and he returns early in the morning to relive. If he is a jogger, he lives close.

Sorry if I am restating what someone else has said.

 

[Iluminada]

Here is additional info on my theories:

I would like to add my thoughts on what I belive might connect the AC and the 4GB victims.


AC4, Nov 2006: 4 prositutes killed and dumped 4 in a row

GB4 2007/2010: 4 prositutes killed and dumped 4 in a row

IMO the AC4 and GB4 are significat lookalikes:

IMHO the killer possibly choose the GB4 victims through Craigs List, by LOOKS, because he wanted them to be look-alikes of the AC4 victims.

Kim Raffo- Amber Costello

Barbara Breidor- Maureen Brainer-Barnes

Molly Jean Dilts – Megan Waterman

Tracy Ann Roberts- Melissa Barthelemy



IMO the SK copied:

numbers of victims, 4 victims

sex of victims, all woman

type of victims, all prostitutes

looks of the victims

the way he killed the victims
the way he dumped the victims





I belive the AC4 SK was on "a mission"
I belive the GB4 SK is on "a mission"

IMO His "mission" is motivated by his hatered towards prostituetes.
He IMO possibly hates prostitutes because he feels that they ruin the lives of their loved once, husbands/boyfriends and children.
He IMO possibly saw himself as a victim of a woman who let him, and their children, down by choosing to become a prostituet
He IMO want to punish/eliminate prostituets and scare other girls/woman/mothers from become prostitutes.
I belive this is possibly what got him started, in Atlantic City
He IMO then became obsessed by the actual killing and the power it made him feel.
After the AC4 "mission" he possibly developed into a combined mission SK and a lust SK.

Both the AC4 and the GB4 murders seems, to some degree, to be ritualistic oriented, in the sence of:

AC4 murders:
motive- "a mission"
killed by: asphyxiation or strangulation or suffocation
remove shoes and socks on all 4 victims-leave them barefoot (possible religious meaning: "mourning")
remove all jewlery/cell phones/purses etc
place all 4 bodies- face down-heads to the east
place all 4 bodieis in a row
dump the bodies in a way so that they would be found pretty quickly
all 4 victims were mothers
all 4 victims were partly placed IN water (drainage ditch )

GB4 murders:
killed by: asphyxiation or strangulation or suffocation
motive- "a mission" + lust/power murder
Remove all clothes/jewlery/cell phones/purses etc.
I don't know if the bodies were face down or not, neither which way their heads were facing?
wraped all 4 naked bodies in burlap (possible religious meaning: penitent and atonement)
dumped Miss Barthelemy body in a way so that it would be found pretty quickly, knowing that the other bodies would be found as well.
"She (Miss Barthelemy ) was ” found a FEW FEET into the brush off the parkway, police said. ”)
2 victims were mothers 2 was not mothers.
all 4 victims were placed BY water
Thise 4 victims were SIGNIFICANT lookalikes of the 4 AC victims.

Personaly I doubt that the rest of the "Long island serial killer" victims/and Manorville victims, and Shannan Gilbert, are victims of the killer of the GB4 and/or the AC4 victims.

All, just my opinion of course.

Could these women have been copies of his own sisters? Killing his sisters twice, once in Atlantic City and then again on Long Island?

Once, sorry if this is old information. I'm new to this forum but don't want to lose my thoughts while reading everyones posts.

 

[Iluminada]

One more thing, the "dates" could have started at one of the beach houses or at the gate so no one could see and then continued on the beach where the woman were attacked and everything cleaned up by the ocean waves. The bodies could then be transported, perhaps not far, to the actual dumping grounds.

Now that I see that last comment I'm thinking that's even more gross, his sisters!

 

[silversurvivor]

as a life long resident of Long Island, there are a couple of things that flashed in my head as i was re-reading this thread (for the 3rd time = lol)
1. Ocean pwky in the middle of the night has been used since the '80s that i know of as a way to jones beach, western clubs like the old Malibu on lido beach and others in the city. people can speed knowing the cops are rarely there. i have been in vehicles i know were doing 100+ including motorcycles over the yrs. i have seen cars pulled over and never thought 2x about them. Occasionally you would see drunks puking or peeing on side of road. this is more winter months in my knowledge, as summer club scene heads east. it is very dark there and before hurricane Sandy the road was smooth. i havent been there since.

2. my other thought is that i work at a eastern farm for the fall festival season. the amount of burlap we have laying around and used as decoration is amazing. some of it is years old from the old potato sacks to brand new for this seasons tables and new decoration. it is simply there. i am sure it can be found at many other farms and farm stands as well. there are seasonal workers for the crops as well as fairs etc in many areas different times of the year depending on crops. there are old cellars and abandoned barns that cover the area too. (fairly close to manorville and the dump site there) there was also the ridge manorville fires April 2012 that burned 1124 acres and some structures. they were found to be set according to SCPD and fire depts.

idk if this helps anyone's theories or with local background. this just my experiences and background. my thinking is the old potato/root cellars would be good for "private time with a victim" esp if one were conveniently burned/destroyed by the fires... moo


map link of fire area look how close halsey manor rd is:

http://www.televisioninternet.com/news/pictures/suffolk-county-fire-map-2012.jpg

 

[CriminalMinds]

Pat Brown discussing the Long Island Serial Killer on the Today Show, profiles him:

http://youtu.be/If26x-0LKvc

haaaa pat brown-sorry, that was outloud