Prior Vaginal Trauma

[my_tee_mouse]

I stand by exactly what I said...in general six-year-olds do not masturbate themselves with their fingers inserted. Nothing in your post discounts that. My statement comes from researching any number of peer-reviewed journal articles on the subject.

As for her wondering "what's down/in there?" or to wonder why or how she passes urine, I seriously doubt that a six-year-old plagued with infections would willingly insert anything into her vagina, as this would cause an extremely uncomfortable, burning sensation. I'm not going to get any more specific than that, but the females on this board know what I am talking about.

 

[ChuckMaureen]

It doesn't change my take at all. I have always believed the head bash happened in her bed because that is where she was being molested that night. And please don't forget when Patsy looked at the picture of the bed and said "I don't see any blood, do you?" Why in the name of God did she say that and why would the detectives not jump all over that statement? She knew that's where JB's head was bashed and for one fleeting moment thought there may have been a spot of blood left behind.

Hi, jkb,

One analyzes from different perspectives when one does not preconceive a guilt or innocence.

Therefore, the alternative....

I expect that was PR being a mom who lost her child to murder and wondering what explicitly was done to her child, and where.

"Where did she experience fright, fear, pain and eventual death"?

"What happend to my baby!?"

If ever I were to experience that situation (GF), I expect that is exactly what I would wonder about my murdered child.

 

[my_tee_mouse]

Hi, DeeDee249,

Please show me the phrase in my post that you claim offers my opinion that JBR "masturbated herself as she was being killed"?

... this is the 2nd time in which you inferred and announced an intent to one of my posts that does not accurately reflect actual content.

I cordially accept that members of these forums hold varying beliefs and opinions, that we opine and debate sensitive subject matter but I do not appreciate my commentary being negatively adorned with phrases or inferred intent which I never included, and then to be categorized as "vile opinion" after the adornment.

Apologies to all if this post is a TOS issue, but I will not let stand another poster morphing my commentary into something other than what is included and intended in my writings.

No hard feelings, as I understand the anger and pain that accompanies some of our experiences and now and again we slip and let that anger and pain spill over towards those with whom we might disagree.

I'm posting this simply as a reminder to us all, to please read carefully any post to which you desire to reply and be cognizant and thoughful of the content.

Yet again, someone implying that those of us who have experienced childhood sexual abuse are not capable of having clear, rational, untarnished thoughts on the subject and cannot speak of the subject without projecting our own "anger and pain." Insulting and totally nonsensical. I can't speak for the others who understand child molestation, but I will tell you that as for me, the only thing that has made me angry through this whole case discussion is this condescending attitude on the part of a few posters. What a cheap shot!

 

[ChuckMaureen]

I stand by exactly what I said...in general six-year-olds do not masturbate themselves with their fingers inserted. Nothing in your post discounts that. My statement comes from researching any number of peer-reviewed journal articles on the subject.

As for her wondering "what's down/in there?" or to wonder why or how she passes urine, I seriously doubt that a six-year-old plagued with infections would willingly insert anything into her vagina, as this would cause an extremely uncomfortable, burning sensation. I'm not going to get any more specific than that, but the females on this board know what I am talking about.

Males experience "burning" as well .. as any gender will confirm when soap enters, screams exit!

I was not attempting to dispel your comment. My intent is that I believe it is not correct to restrict observation of the situation to purely being in a sexual context.

As is typical with healing tissue, itching replaces pain after inflammation tolerates and subsides. I suspect JBR experienced the ebb and flow of inflammation and also the resultant itching after each crest.

A natural, satisfying action is to "scratch" an itch.

 

[ChuckMaureen]

Yet again, someone implying that those of us who have experienced childhood sexual abuse are not capable of having clear, rational, untarnished thoughts on the subject and cannot speak of the subject without projecting our own "anger and pain." Insulting and totally nonsensical. I can't speak for the others who understand child molestation, but I will tell you that as for me, the only thing that has made me angry through this whole case discussion is this condescending attitude on the part of a few posters. What a cheap shot!

Facts bear out my observation .. yet again. :angel:

 

[ChuckMaureen]

Yet again, someone implying that those of us who have experienced childhood sexual abuse are not capable of having clear, rational, untarnished thoughts on the subject and cannot speak of the subject without projecting our own "anger and pain." Insulting and totally nonsensical. I can't speak for the others who understand child molestation, but I will tell you that as for me, the only thing that has made me angry through this whole case discussion is this condescending attitude on the part of a few posters. What a cheap shot!

Hi, MTM,

You seem to assume I was referring only to your type of experience?

bubm

Originally Posted by ChuckMaureen

Hi, DeeDee249,

Please show me the phrase in my post that you claim offers my opinion that JBR "masturbated herself as she was being killed"?

... this is the 2nd time in which you inferred and announced an intent to one of my posts that does not accurately reflect actual content.

I cordially accept that members of these forums hold varying beliefs and opinions, that we opine and debate sensitive subject matter but I do not appreciate my commentary being negatively adorned with phrases or inferred intent which I never included, and then to be categorized as "vile opinion" after the adornment.

Apologies to all if this post is a TOS issue, but I will not let stand another poster morphing my commentary into something other than what is included and intended in my writings.

No hard feelings, as I understand the anger and pain that accompanies some of our experiences and now and again we slip and let that anger and pain spill over towards those with whom we might disagree.

I'm posting this simply as a reminder to us all, to please read carefully any post to which you desire to reply and be cognizant and thoughful of the content.

To wit ...

"..our experiences.." and "..we slip and let ..".

As you might note, I include myself by using those words, and I do not include for a specific type of experience.

Each of us experiences life with many issues along the way. I do not diminish or elevate one type over another, but I try to remain objective and be cognizant of how others react to my writings.

Condescending? No intent, here. But if you feel that I am then, either I am miscommunicating or you are unable to separate emotion from reasoning.

Just an observation. YMMV. :angel:

 

[joeskidbeck]

Hi, jkb,

One analyzes from different perspectives when one does not preconceive a guilt or innocence.

Therefore, the alternative....

I expect that was PR being a mom who lost her child to murder and wondering what explicitly was done to her child, and where.

"Where did she experience fright, fear, pain and eventual death"?

"What happend to my baby!?"

If ever I were to experience that situation (GF), I expect that is exactly what I would wonder about my murdered child.

BBM

Chuck, let me assure you of one thing. I never had a "preconceived notion" of what happened in that house. Like many others, I simply watched a news broadcast over the holidays in 1996 and was horrified to learn of this little girl's murder. For some reason this case bothered me very much from the beginning and I will tell you right now that for several years I believed an intruder came into that house and killed her. And a very devious, sexually perverted one, at that. Then when there was absolutely no evidence left behind by this killer and no arrest (or even a hint of one) was made, I started to do some research. I ended up going to lots of different places for information and believe it or not, I do have the intelligence to decide the difference between fact and rumors thrown around to deflect the guilt from where it should be. In short, I believed the Ramseys were innocent victims of a terrible crime for years until I educated myself about that crime and I now know that the only innocent victim in this case lies in a grave in Marietta, Georgia. I am not talking about Patsy Ramsey.
I don't know how long you have been studying this case and it does not matter, you are entitled to your opinion and I am not here to change it. Myself, and others here, are here for one reason, to discuss and just maybe learn that critical clue that will help bring her killer to justice. That's what it's all about. I won't belittle your comments or your theories and I expect the same in return. It's the same with everyone here, if you treat people with the respect they deserve, they will give it back and listen to your opinion as well as give it the consideration it deserves. But please don't assume that everyone here has preconceived notions, you would be wrong and your valuable opinion would then be disregarded.
Respectfully,
Becky

 

[SunnieRN]

Um, they don't usually have your name tattooed on, so I can't see how you would know whose they were.

Males experience "burning" as well .. as any gender will confirm when soap enters, screams exit!

I was not attempting to dispel your comment. My intent is that I believe it is not correct to restrict observation of the situation to purely being in a sexual context.

As is typical with healing tissue, itching replaces pain after inflammation tolerates and subsides. I suspect JBR experienced the ebb and flow of inflammation and also the resultant itching after each crest.

A natural, satisfying action is to "scratch" an itch.

There is one problem with yout theory. Jon Benet had tissue that was currently inflamed as well as showing chronic inflammation. Her tissue was not in a recovery phase.

The autopsy did not discuss scratching within her tissue. It did show chronic abuse. Chronic sexual abuse. Since this was chronic, the million dollar question, is by whom?!

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

Hi, MTM,

You seem to assume I was referring only to your type of experience?

bubm



To wit ...

"..our experiences.." and "..we slip and let ..".

As you might note, I include myself by using those words, and I do not include for a specific type of experience.

Each of us experiences life with many issues along the way. I do not diminish or elevate one type over another, but I try to remain objective and be cognizant of how others react to my writings.

Condescending? No intent, here. But if you feel that I am then, either I am miscommunicating or you are unable to separate emotion from reasoning.

Just an observation. YMMV. :angel:

I'm enjoying reading your posts, and agree that emotion is a clouding factor.

 

[SunnieRN]

I'm enjoying reading your posts, and agree that emotion is a clouding factor.

Hmmm, that may explain ever morphing IDI theology also. Thanks for the insight HOTYH.

 

[BBB167893]

No, you're making the assertions, therfore you need to prove they are photos of JBR. Where did they come from, how do you know, and why did they have them? How did they arrive at them by legal means?

That's easy: the autopsy. We know there were autopsy photos, if for no other reason than Dr. McCann talked about them.

Who's word did you take? BPD?

I have no reason not to.

 

[BBB167893]

So, no, there is no evidence any stick was ever inserted in her vagina. Thought so.

We seem to have a breakdown in communication. Where did yout get THAT from what I posted?

 

[ChuckMaureen]

There is one problem with yout theory. Jon Benet had tissue that was currently inflamed as well as showing chronic inflammation. Her tissue was not in a recovery phase.

The autopsy did not discuss scratching within her tissue. It did show chronic abuse. Chr

Chronic iflammation.

The well-groomed (at pageant level) 6 year old had moderate-length fingernails, as evidenced in autopsy photos.

The act of "scratching" an itch does not always involve actual scratching .. often a rigorous surface rub is extended across itchy area(s).

 

[BBB167893]

How dare IDI postulate a foreign faction as was both stated and implied by someone in writing, who knows more about this subject than all of us combined.

Lets instead continue to imagine what happened.

Speaking purely for myself, I RESENT that, HOTYH.

 

[BBB167893]

Oh I'm sorry, there not just any photos they are THE photos. These wouldn't be the same photos acquired by the tabloids? The Globe maybe?

Even if they were, what difference would it make?

Because BPD has no 'panel of doctors that determined prior abuse'. And if they don't, nobody does.

Thats pure fiction hogwash.

I don't suppose you have any proof of THAT, either?

 

[SunnieRN]

Chronic iflammation.

The well-groomed (at pageant level) 6 year old had moderate-length fingernails, as evidenced in autopsy photos.

The act of "scratching" an itch does not always involve actual scratching .. often a rigorous surface rub is extended across itchy area(s).

Your use of the word surface is telling, since the chronic abuse is in regards to the erosion of the hymen. Not the same.

 

[BBB167893]

and agree that emotion is a clouding factor.

BOTH ways.

 

[ChuckMaureen]

Your use of the word surface is telling, since the chronic abuse is in regards to the erosion of the hymen. Not the same.

Hi, SunnieRN,

Everything has a "surface" in dimensional space.

 

[SunnieRN]

Facts bear out my observation .. yet again. :angel:

Sorry, but I've never known an angel to be cold or callous. As for emotions, any person that is emotionally vested in this case, shows emotion in regards to posts that can trigger anger, frustration joy and disgust. Some just have a more eloquent method of description than others.

I am curious if you have read through this thread, or just jumped in. Many here have invested time and effort to find the answers and information that has been presented.

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

Even if they were, what difference would it make?



I don't suppose you have any proof of THAT, either?

It can be easily inferred.

What you're suggesting is that BPD has factual credible knowledge of prior abuse of JBR. This would mean that BPD is not announcing to the public for public safety that the have an unsolved case of child sexual abuse where JBR was the victim.

Is this another conspiracy theory, where the PD knows of crime on a child and keeps their mouth shut? There's a lawsuit in here somewhere.