Protesters in Sweden trampled by police horses

[katydid23]

Thank You Scandinavian girl. So this Party, do they have any support from the public?

 

[scandinavian girl]

Thank You Scandinavian girl. So this Party, do they have any support from the public?

I never heard of them before but we have an election coming on in september and another party with nazi roots are making huge progress and right now it is likely the will be a part of our goverment.

 

[scandinavian girl]

another link in english
http://revolution-news.com/sweden-ten-injured-malmo-anti-nazi-demonstration/

 

[Lyra500]

You know, I'm looking at the horse body language. Notice that all the horses' necks are strained and waaaaay up, showing throats and chests clearly. The reins are tight on all the horses, too...and subsequent photos look like the horses are stumbling and tripping. One rider looks like he's struggling to stay aboard.

This is telling me that the horses stampeded. Which, for police horses, is pretty damned rare. *Something* set them off somehow. Again, pretty rare for police horses...their desensitizing programs are pretty strenuous and rigorous.

And also note that from what the photos show, the horses are doing their best to not step on the humans. Horses have an instinctive hesitation to step on people - not because they know they're people, but because it's poor footing (and tends to scream, which is problematic, LOL). While do see one horse stepping directly on a person, it also looks like it's trying to not put weight on that hoof.

...............snipped for brevity

I really wonder what happened - for one horse to spook and stampede is one thing; having a bad day, teeth issue, gear issue...but to have ALL of them go off? Energy must've been very high, and something *really* set them off.


I hope all victims and horses are all right. And yes, Nova, since 1650. LOLOL.

Best-
Herding Cats

Thank you for your interpretation of the photograph. I hope you don't mind my snipping to keep my post shorter.


BIB - I am afraid (to me at least) the film clip below posted by scandinavian girl does not appear to show horses stampeding - rather a quite deliberate and police controlled charge at the crowd.

another link in english
http://revolution-news.com/sweden-ten-injured-malmo-anti-nazi-demonstration/

I realise that the source is obviously a left wing website, but I don't think the film footage is staged in any way.

This really doesn't seem like an appropriate use of police horses and could easily have ended in one or more fatalities.

I find it really surprising - I am not an expert on Swedish society, but Sweden does have a reputation as a relatively liberal country. Riding rough shod over members of the public really does not fit with that image.

Scandinavian girl - what is the feeling in Sweden about this event?

 

[Herding Cats]

Lyra, I appreciate you putting footage up there.

After watching it a few times, and freeze-framing, I'm going to maintain that the horses were not under control of the riders. In the second pass, you can see the outriders (in the front) "see-sawing" reins, which is a common method to get your horse back "under you". And, also in the second pass, you can see rider elbows waaaaaay behind their body; another indication that the horses are "pulling" or "forward" on the rider. And third, you can see horses "gone side", meaning their hinds are putting out significant energy, while their fores are being semi-controlled and not allowing that energy through the full body, thus turning the horse sideways on the front half (it's hard to see, and harder to explain, but if you realize riders only have a small bit of control over their animals at any given point, and that control is only in the mouth via the reins and bit, you'll get what I mean. I call it "yoga at speed" when Tango has gone side, and it's one of my biggest indications that he's not listening to me or respecting my wishes. Usually I've figured that out a bit earlier, and I'm fighting for control and safety at that point. Told you Tango was a beanhead...)

In the first pass, (and I dunno if it's right to call them passes or groups; I can't tell if they're different horses and/or riders), when they are approaching the camera, you can see that all of them have "tight" reins, and all of their heads are high. Unfortunately, the camera swings away during the closest moments, but I also freeze framed theme both when the horses are approaching, and when they're leaving. When they're leaving, you can see that they've gone side again, and quite a bit of tail streaming - where they hold their tails out behind them, often seen while running, say, on a track - and in one freeze frame you can see one rider leaning way back using his arms and body weight to get the horse's attention, as well as another rider somewhat cockeyed in the saddle.

The horses are not running full out - some of them were listening to their riders partly - and they were cantering. But the speed does not indicate control; I've been out of control of my horse when we are just trotting along...control means having the horse 'underneath' you, listening to you, doing what you ask. These horses were cantering, and it was a decent clip of a canter, and on a cement street, which can be painful to the horse so they don't tend to like to do it. They weren't 4-beat galloping, or flat out sprinting...but they were definitely moving.

I stand by my original assessment. And I absolutely understand how folks would think this is deliberate...but most folks haven't been topside of a 1200 pound beastie who got frightened...I have been, many times (Tango was fairly untrained when I got him), and horses are much stronger and much more independent than people think.

This doesn't mean it was "right", or that the police should not be held accountable. I am surprised that they were using horses at this rally, as there were obvious things like rocks and bottles being thrown, and anyone who knows horses wouldn't trust their mount to not bolt. Especially in a group of horses - all it takes is one horse setting the others off, and away we go.

BTW, the above is why, whenever I rode in a parade, I always rode a different horse - Tango is NOT to be trusted to not spook, and to remain under me...so I have never put him in a situation which would give that chance to happen on cement...he often bolted (especially in those early years) in the arena, but arena dirt is much softer than concrete...

Again, my sympathies to those who ended up underneath. Not a place one would choose to be, given an option.

Best-
Herding Cats