Provisionary Serial Killer Pen Pal Discussion

We all have a morbid side to us if a SK interests us. As a kid I had headlines from the Manson case tacked up to my bedroom wall. The library would give me old issues of the L.A. Times before they were thrown out, mine for the asking. I'm not sure if they were microfilmed first.

I had California road maps as well with locations marked and circled. As an adult I have many SK books in my library and my friends get a laugh out of it, some borrow my books... Who has my Iceman book...?

Mr. Massapequa has taken things to the next level and contacted those SKs who are incarcerated. This is a matter of personal interest, no more no less. Maybe he should write his own book, this actually is how books are written, research is research and nothing beats information gleaned from those involved in an event. Look up case-study and grounded-theory of research methods.

We're all knee-deep in following true crime to one extent or another. I was glad to read your post. My ex thought my penchant for only reading non-fiction crime (and never novels) was a sick and morbid fascination that might lead to me doing something nefarious. In the end it turned out he did. Ya never really know.
 
Everything is monitored and recorded.. Whether it is Williams getting mail or Williams calling Josh.. or a "creepy penpal".
everything is recorded.(do you get the point yet?) everything is recorded...including the original interview done w/ Josh..the truth is known. I'm sorry but some of you are only qualified for the "king of public info award" or amateur profilers..or as Josh said "nobodys"..but I suppose you wouldn't believe he would say that either would you. You think I'm going to let LE or Josh and his crew in without recording ahead of time? Your only living out a fantasy if you actually think your comments about me are going to get you any closer to the LISK. <modsnip>
 
I'm guess that was aimed at me @NYPSM, at least partially. Let me address your post.

Yes I get it, so why don't you provide evidence to back yourself up rather than just state people are lying or spinning an angle? Genuine question since its all 'recorded'. I believe you that Josh probably called posters nobodies, because we are.

At least I am, i admitted I knew jack s*** about LISK or the Torso killer, or this very website until TKS. I have never been to those places mentioned in the show, I don't have a degree in Psychology or Criminology. I'm not a police officer, I've never actively followed a case before.

Therefore you can ignore my questions if your ego deems me unworthy. One simple DNA swab would prove your innocence though. Just saying.

As I said earlier, personally, and yes just from a 10 minute segment on a show, which would make me a nominee for the king of the public info award/armchair forum poster, I don't think you are LISK, that person 'seemed' to be able to gain trust through their persona. You don't come across very open.

Just my opinion, no offence intended.
 
Just to refresh my own memory- I just rewatched the segment that features the "mysterious pen pal." Most interesting for me was that JR sent a card 3 days after the LI girls were found. Looking logically on that fact alone and JR statement (IIRC)can you believe I made the news after 20 years? is a very interesting find. May speak to the level of "friendship" between the two folks. The ink hit the paper in a knee jerk fashion. Why would this be relevant to the recipient?


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We're all knee-deep in following true crime to one extent or another. I was glad to read your post. My ex thought my penchant for only reading non-fiction crime (and never novels) was a sick and morbid fascination that might lead to me doing something nefarious. In the end it turned out he did. Ya never really know.

Odd that my original post you quoted went "poof" somehow.

Anyway, I've been called out for my darker interests before and it took a while to feel for myself that my interest is normal. We are shaped by things we run across in our lives. For me with the SK thing it was the Manson murders and I started buying paperbacks of other cases as well.
 
Odd that my original post you quoted went "poof" somehow.

Anyway, I've been called out for my darker interests before and it took a while to feel for myself that my interest is normal. We are shaped by things we run across in our lives. For me with the SK thing it was the Manson murders and I started buying paperbacks of other cases as well.
(maybe because we're somewhat OT? At any rate, it was the Manson case that started me down this path, too!)
 
Just to refresh my own memory- I just rewatched the segment that features the "mysterious pen pal." Most interesting for me was that JR sent a card 3 days after the LI girls were found. Looking logically on that fact alone and JR statement (IIRC)can you believe I made the news after 20 years? is a very interesting find. May speak to the level of "friendship" between the two folks. The ink hit the paper in a knee jerk fashion. Why would this be relevant to the recipient?


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Are you sure Jr was quoted as saying that? He was arrested in 1993 which is 3 years before the earliest possible connection...that we know of anyway. Either total bs boasting or he's referencing old remains that he thought may have been his but probably weren't.


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Angela,
Thanks for concern -the Killing Season Interview w/ Josh and crew was an edited cut/paste job, but I was mislead and sought after for my segment. The actual interview and what aired on A&E was different naturally and he was looking to please viewers. The part where he stated LE and Feds were questioning me about the unsolved murders was BS.I never told him that, instead I explained that I was questioned a few times about "my corresponding with excessive amounts of murderers and serials. Never did the Dects ask about Giglo or have me come down for questioning. I knew Williams for years and although I have used usual techniques and approaches to help build further rapport with them (discussing morbid topics, sharing dark fantasies and poems etc I never once confessed to anything. This isn't the first time a serial lied and caused me problems hence my user name. A serial in past made the same claim but it didn't make A&E yet made it to the NY Post and Selim Agar the wanna be "15 mins of fame" LI crime reporter sent his army after myself and family as well as job yrs ago. However when you play with wild animals(murderers/serials etc) there's a chance you get bit. nautre of the game. I always say it could have made a interesting movie -an innocent man getting accused of the same unsolved murders by 2 separate serials -what's the odds?

Where is this NY Post article? Who was the serial killer who made the claim you stated?
 
Are you sure Jr was quoted as saying that? He was arrested in 1993 which is 3 years before the earliest possible connection...that we know of anyway. Either total bs boasting or he's referencing old remains that he thought may have been his but probably weren't.


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I don't have a link to MSM but had assumed that when the G4 were found some news outlet inadvertently (no SK is a celebrity) made mention of his name. Sorry for my lack of clarity. I was basing this post off of TKS.


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Clem, I typed a lengthy reply but it wasn't allowed through. Will just say that I'm not an expert in serial murder and don't claim to be an expert in anything. Getting 600 inmates to reply at least once (including serials, mass murder, gang leaders etc) doesn't make me an expert. I told Josh in interview I am no expert unlike much of this site where many think they are a profiler or a "professional". If anything I'm skilled with building a rapport with them - that's what I do, and combine it with psychology along with my own personal morbid curiousity.Profiling should be left to the professionals I feel (FBI).My personal opinions have probably been shared in the past. I don't see him getting caught but one's ego can be their own fate.I'd like to correspond with LISK whether he was in prison or just the two of us. I'd tell him how I was set up twice for his murders and feed off his replies.But to answer your question, I believe the theory that Gilgo is a dumping ground of more then one. However the LISk knew the bodies would be found eventually otherwise he'd handle things differently. I think its all a joke to him and wouldn't be surprised hes on this site laughing at us all..

You are as judgmental of others as you persecute them to be towards you. Shouldn't you feel that speaking and building a rapport with serial killers should be left to the professionals, the FBI. Killers who have nothing better to do behind bars then watch paint peel off the wall will correspond with others, and are notorious liars and storytellers, they are psychopaths as well as sociopaths. They lie through their teeth well.

'Feed off his replies' That is strange in itself and strange that you feed off these men who have caused tremendous suffering to victims and their families.

Hard for me to feel upset at a Serial Killer laughing at us (me) because his life is miserable and he has no soul or happiness. He can keep laughing. He has nothing and he is nothing.
 
I have bolded areas of intrigue. Where have your personal opinions been "probably" shared in the past. Sounds like you were able to connect with previous serials in large volumes. I would say I would live in fear of my life. Agree with too each their own. Any insights you have. I agree that the LISK reads and posts here in some way.


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If he wasn't reading the posts before, he is now!

I have some questions with NYPOSTSTALKEDME if he doesn't mind answering. When you are writing to these serial killers what is the topic of discussion? Are you discussing their crimes or their current lives or situation??
Have you noticed any type of commonalities? For instance, something like, most start killing in their early 20's or most had controlling mother's.
I understand you not wanting to profile but aside from morbid curiousity, there has to be some other type of purpose this is all serving.

I also want to know why you said you were mistaken twice for LISK since we only knew about one prior during the show.

. I for one do believe that you lying to them, that you're LISK, will make them trust you more and therefore be more open and vulnerable. Police men lie all the time to get information out of suspects.
 
If he wasn't reading the posts before, he is now!

I have some questions with NYPOSTSTALKEDME if he doesn't mind answering. When you are writing to these serial killers what is the topic of discussion? Are you discussing their crimes or their current lives or situation??
Have you noticed any type of commonalities? For instance, something like, most start killing in their early 20's or most had controlling mother's.
I understand you not wanting to profile but aside from morbid curiousity, there has to be some other type of purpose this is all serving.

I also want to know why you said you were mistaken twice for LISK since we only knew about one prior during the show.

. I for one do believe that you lying to them, that you're LISK, will make them trust you more and therefore be more open and vulnerable. Police men lie all the time to get information out of suspects.
Good questions. He must have some insight. I would like to know how these killers felt about their parents? Their past experiences with women.
 
Where is this NY Post article? Who was the serial killer who made the claim you stated?


A major in psychology? He has absolutely no insight into his malignant narcissism dripping from his posts and his shocking anger in response to a poster on your link is questionable. His reasoning and answers are what keeps him on the radar to investigators. Good thing that they have picked up on these cues. He making sense of things is not sense, it is suspect.
 
A major in psychology? He has absolutely no insight into his malignant narcissism dripping from his posts and his shocking anger in response to a poster on your link is questionable. His reasoning and answers are what keeps him on the radar to investigators. Good thing that they have picked up on these cues. He making sense of things is not sense, it is suspect.
You are assuming that is the same person. Its a reasonable assumption however given the posters technique (lack of pargraph structure) and dismissive tone to others.
 
Greetings and thanks for commenting here. With your background, it would be interesting - and quite elaborate- to compile all your psychological profiles ( assuming you did develop profiles of your pen pals) and to create a logarithm identifying patterns like motives, MO, signatures, locations, time components etc.. Have you thought about it?

-Nin
HE has already commented in an earlier post that he doesn't profile and thinks that should be left to the FBI.
Then he said he wouldn't be surprised if LISK was "sitting back laughing".
And to that comment I say, I don't know if he is laughing, but I sure as heck am...
HE is NOT a professional. HE doesn't profile. Yet uses the techniques that Profilers use when building a rapport with them like: "discussing morbid topics, sharing dark fantasies and poems etc" AKA building profiling knowledge. :silly: Just like the FBI did with Ted Bundy. So you cannot say you are not profiling, yet at the same time, say you use profiling techniques and not think that sounds a little... well... "off". Perhaps you didn't understand what you were saying?
And the absolute best comment..."what are the odds" comment had me rolling...
My main point here is that you possibly did not understand how that might be perceived from others.
Ted Bundy was not a "professional profiling FBI agent" either, yet the authorities came back to him more than once (what were the odds) for insight into the warped mind of a serial killer.
:laugh: "I don't like people walking around ogling me like I am some kind of weirdo, because I'm not." -Ted Bundy
 
Clem, I typed a lengthy reply but it wasn't allowed through. Will just say that I'm not an expert in serial murder and don't claim to be an expert in anything. Getting 600 inmates to reply at least once (including serials, mass murder, gang leaders etc) doesn't make me an expert. I told Josh in interview I am no expert unlike much of this site where many think they are a profiler or a "professional". If anything I'm skilled with building a rapport with them - that's what I do, and combine it with psychology along with my own personal morbid curiousity.Profiling should be left to the professionals I feel (FBI).My personal opinions have probably been shared in the past. I don't see him getting caught but one's ego can be their own fate.I'd like to correspond with LISK whether he was in prison or just the two of us. I'd tell him how I was set up twice for his murders and feed off his replies.But to answer your question, I believe the theory that Gilgo is a dumping ground of more then one. However the LISk knew the bodies would be found eventually otherwise he'd handle things differently. I think its all a joke to him and wouldn't be surprised hes on this site laughing at us all..

"LISk knew the bodies would be found eventually otherwise he'd handle things differently."
I am not even gonna go there. However I will say, that there are many databases to tap into to get info on how a serial killer operates... MR M. we don't have to be profilers that work has already been done for us, like in particular my college courses gave some insight into the mind of Ted Bundy and the Green River Killer. So when I say things like "the killer is going back and having sex with the dead bodies... this is not a just a hunch. there are a lot of similarities in Ted and the GRK and both of them had the same "hallmarks" of the LISK. He would not keep coming back to the same sight knowing a decomposing corpse is laying there in the open if he DIDN'T want to see it. It is the ultimate degradation of a human, to lay unburied, that says something about the killer, to "visit" the corpse... that says something as well... and to contact the victims family... now it REALLY says something about the killer. Just like Vernon Seitz went to the families an pretended to be a psychic, yet at the same time lots of photo's and clippings and VHS tapes were found in his home (after he died) of the very children bound and gagged, that were reported as "missing". So if some on this forum make a comment on things in particular its because most on here have done hours of research pouring over details. : ) And yes, this killer will be known. Everyday is just one day closer.
 
Josh might have picked up on the over inflated ego and played him by letting him think,"they are nobodies, but you are somebody," to keep him interested and talking. The 'spidey senses' are off the charts with how he has explained certain issues. It is understandable to want to help others and solve a mystery that could help others. I do, however, would think it was mighty strange if any of us had pictures of Shannon, the GB4, and Mods pictures hanging all over our walls.

To me, it seems like these killers are heroes like an athlete would be to someone else avid into sports. He balks and says this does not make him weird, well yes it does, but possibly in a dangerous way. I have felt my own addiction lately toward this case is weird, but also feel there is no danger in the weirdness because it is striving toward a positive goal.

There is no 'Serial Killer Whisperer,' and never will be, there brains are structured to never allow for anyone to get inside. However, there are those SK duos, who 'feed' off each other. Leonard lake and Charles Ng, two of the sickest pair of SKs, I felt nauseous and cannot red their story twice, killing a child in front of their parents is one the most evil crimes I have every read. The Hillside Strangulars were extremely brutal and evil too. Angelo was the less dominant, feeding off of Kenneth. I feel he may not have murdered if it wasn't for his cousin's influence.

The poster has a similar mentality of many of these guys, and that is he is smarter and better than everyone else. We are the simpletons. His anger. And, his fantasies of a movie should be made about him. He feels superior and, big big ego.

I agree with everything you are picking up Nomad.
 
Total red herring. To much time and brainpower wasted on this guy. He makes for good television, and that is why he was on the show. He is not the killer so why even think about it?
 
Total red herring. To much time and brainpower wasted on this guy. He makes for good television, and that is why he was on the show. He is not the killer so why even think about it?

The case abounds with red herrings. Which make for great drama and this is what people like to watch on TV. A show gets to a juicy part... cut to a commercial but they know the viewer is not going to change the channel.

An amateur interviewing a serial killer and expecting to get something usable is futile and more of an entertainment for the locked up killer than anything else. They will tell you want you want to hear and nothing more. This is what they do for sport.
 
The case abounds with red herrings. Which make for great drama and this is what people like to watch on TV. A show gets to a juicy part... cut to a commercial but they know the viewer is not going to change the channel.

An amateur interviewing a serial killer and expecting to get something usable is futile and more of an entertainment for the locked up killer than anything else. They will tell you want you want to hear and nothing more. This is what they do for sport.

Just bumping off your post here. I can totally see interest and the benefits of LE and the FBI talking to these caged animals on a personal level. I have absolutely not one ounce of sympathy for these murderers. They go out and take life away from others, devastate families and terrorize communities. TKS brings to my knowledge that there are websites that deal in sharing/selling old SK's letters, pictures. Just can't fathom this level of entertainment with such dark, deviant and evil material. SK are known by many because most rational people just cannot understand (and never will) why anyone could do what they have done. I don't get it but I do not think the pen pal is LISK.


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