Reasons why you think it could be suicide

[bourne]

If I had proof or evidence of a crime, I would want to immediately provide that to LE. That's all I meant.

Hey, I agree 100% on this!

 

[MaybeNotToday]

Hey, I agree 100% on this!

This conversation began with the example of a hacker finding evidence of a crime. That should be turned into LE immediately right?

 

[MyBelle]

Can you link this, please?

Thanks,

Salem

search warrant: http://ftpcontent.worldnow.com/kfmb/misc/warrant_41290.pdf

media story: http://www.cbs8.com/story/15527592/state-attorney-general?clienttype=printable

Dr. Brad Peterson said he did not feel the visible injuries to the child were consistent with the cardiac arrest and brain swelling he experienced, the detective wrote.

Peterson expressed concerns that suffocation may have occurred prior to the fall, according to the search warrant.

 

[bourne]

This conversation began with the example of a hacker finding evidence of a crime. That should be turned into LE immediately right?

You just posted above that you *understood* (in your own word "realize" in post #574) that this isn't an either/or scenario. By definition, that means the hacker evidence could be provided to BOTH LE and the WDS or any other legal suit the Zahaus pursue. You do know that you can make DUPLICATES of hacker materials, right? This is not like splitting a child into two in the King Solomon riddle. (I'm not being snarky but stating a factual analogy).

 

[MaybeNotToday]

You just posted above that you *understood* (in your own word "realize" in post #574) that this isn't an either/or scenario. By definition, that means the hacker evidence could be provided to BOTH LE and the WDS or any other legal suit the Zahaus pursue. You do know that you can make DUPLICATES of hacker materials, right? This is not like splitting a child into two in the King Solomon riddle. (I'm not being snarky but stating a factual analogy).

I really don't think we are going to work out our miscommunication. I'm just not expressing what I mean.

 

[MaybeNotToday]

Ok, deep breath for me and I'll try it again because it's just nagging me.

I'm asking: If the Zahaus think they are already in the receipt of new evidence that will blow this wide open, why have they not turned it over to LE? Wouldn't that be the most expedient way to trigger a new criminal case? Or is it possible that they already have turned it over and we just don't know? What would that mean in terms of the civil case?

Maybe I shouldn't have skipped the AZ lawyer thread.

 

[kittychi]

Ok, deep breath for me and I'll try it again because it's just nagging me.

I'm asking: If the Zahaus think they are already in the receipt of new evidence that will blow this wide open, why have they not turned it over to LE? Wouldn't that be the most expedient way to trigger a new criminal case? Or is it possible that they already have turned it over and we just don't know? What would that mean in terms of the civil case?

Maybe I shouldn't have skipped the AZ lawyer thread.

I know you have been asking this for awhile, I have this same question.

I can only surmise the following:

IIRC, Anne Bremner met with Sheriff Gore way back when (nov. 2011?). I believe she thought she had new info warranting re-opening Rebecca's case. She was denied. I'm wondering if Rudoy is keeping his cards close to the vest, not wanting to risk spilling the beans and getting denied again.

Those are just my personal thoughts and recollections, and am just taking a wild guess on the course the Zahaus would take if they do have something.

 

[Gilgamesh]

I know you have been asking this for awhile, I have this same question.

I can only surmise the following:

IIRC, Anne Bremner met with Sheriff Gore way back when (nov. 2011?). I believe she thought she had new info warranting re-opening Rebecca's case. She was denied. I'm wondering if Rudoy is keeping his cards close to the vest, not wanting to risk spilling the beans and getting denied again.

Those are just my personal thoughts and recollections, and am just taking a wild guess on the course the Zahaus would take if they do have something.

I am sure that they have lost any trust in Sherriff Gore and his cronies.

 

[DeDee]

BBM 1 and 2 - It is relevant because it was never proven. They didn't even bother to show that they proved it by examining Jonah's phone records. Instead they took his word for it. That is HEARSAY not proof.

Since when is taking someone's word for it "investigation?"

They also did not prove that RZ was the one who listened to and erased the voicemail on her phone at 12:50.

Also from your link: "The message, whatever it was, is forever erased," Bremner said. "They're pinning this entire suicide conclusion on a phone message that no one has ever heard."

This is, perhaps, one of reasons why the Z team received the cease and desist letter from JSs attorney.

"The message, whatever it was, is forever erased," Bremner said. "They're pinning this entire suicide conclusion on a phone message that no one has ever heard."

RE the phone message that AB states "no one has ever heard", well, RZ heard it and then erased it. Perhaps RZ did not want anyone else to learn the contents of Jonah's message.

It is highly doubtful that DS or NR had RZs pass code for that performing that function just as much as it is doubtful that JS would lie about making the phone call to RZ knowing LE could obtain ph records.

jmho

 

[MaybeNotToday]

I know you have been asking this for awhile, I have this same question.

I can only surmise the following:

IIRC, Anne Bremner met with Sheriff Gore way back when (nov. 2011?). I believe she thought she had new info warranting re-opening Rebecca's case. She was denied. I'm wondering if Rudoy is keeping his cards close to the vest, not wanting to risk spilling the beans and getting denied again.

Those are just my personal thoughts and recollections, and am just taking a wild guess on the course the Zahaus would take if they do have something.

Thank you for your polite response. So they can save evidence (not take LE) to present in civil case? I can completely understand them not wanting to take it to LE for fear of being shot down. I just didn't know you could hold something to use in a civil case and how that wouldn't tarnish the evidence. Chain of custody and all. It's obvious I am not an expert in this stuff. (Which makes rude responses to my honest inquiry very confusing for me) thank you again for taking the time with me.

 

[MaybeNotToday]

This is, perhaps, one of reasons why the Z team received the cease and desist letter from JSs attorney.




RE the phone message that AB states "no one has ever heard", well, RZ heard it and then erased it. Perhaps RZ did not want anyone else to learn the contents of Jonah's message.

It is highly doubtful that DS or NR had RZs pass code for that performing that function just as much as it is doubtful that JS would lie about making the phone call to RZ knowing LE could obtain ph records.

jmho

In my recollection, there seemed to be many unconfirmed statements Bremner was making very publicly. There seemed to be no end in sight. I have heard she was trying "to get traction" as if that's an excuse for trashing (IMO) innocent and grieving persons?

 

[bourne]

In my recollection, there seemed to be many unconfirmed statements Bremner was making very publicly. There seemed to be no end in sight. I have heard she was trying "to get traction" as if that's an excuse for trashing (IMO) innocent and grieving persons?

BBM Link to MSM wherein that was published.

 

[MaybeNotToday]

BBM Link to MSM wherein that was published.

I'm sorry- I meant to say I heard it from other posters. But I don't know which poster on which thread in which forum or what year. So just consider it something I completely lied about.

 

[MyBelle]

In my recollection, there seemed to be many unconfirmed statements Bremner was making very publicly. There seemed to be no end in sight. I have heard she was trying "to get traction" as if that's an excuse for trashing (IMO) innocent and grieving persons?

There has been a lot of "spin" in this case, I agree. Remember, Dr. Peterson told LE that the description of Max's incident did not fit his visible injuries? I believe the same thing could be said for Bremner. I think she was told a version of events and initially she had no reason to not believe it was true.

JMO

 

[Betty P]

This is, perhaps, one of reasons why the Z team received the cease and desist letter from JSs attorney.




RE the phone message that AB states "no one has ever heard", well, RZ heard it and then erased it. Perhaps RZ did not want anyone else to learn the contents of Jonah's message.

It is highly doubtful that DS or NR had RZs pass code for that performing that function just as much as it is doubtful that JS would lie about making the phone call to RZ knowing LE could obtain ph records.

jmho

We don't know if RZ heard the message or erased it. There's no evidence the message was sent, considering there is no record of it. All we have is JS's word.

It remains a rather shocking fact in this case that the decision to conclude RZ's death was due to suicide was based on non-verifiable evidence.

 

[DeDee]

We don't know if RZ heard the message or erased it. There's no evidence the message was sent, considering there is no record of it. All we have is JS's word.

It remains a rather shocking fact in this case that the decision to conclude RZ's death was due to suicide was based on non-verifiable evidence.

We have JSs word for it as well as AT&Ts explanation as to why the ph call would not appear on RZs billing statement.

LE did not conclude the death as a suicide based on non-verifiable evidence. There is ample evidence and all of it linked to RZ by fingerprints and DNA.

RZ wanted to implicate others in her death, perhaps, erroneously thinking that no one would possibly believe that she would hang her naked self outdoors at the mansion. In the beginning, I thought she was murdered, too. However, after researching the case, I could not overlook nor misinterpret the compelling evidence.

I believe she planned her suicide before the mysterious phone call from JS. I think RZ knew that she was in troubled waters and had made her decision by the time she boarded her dog, Ocean.

Oh, but RZ couldn't board Ocean when she first wanted to bc she had neglected to have Ocean properly vaccinated.

jmho

 

[MyBelle]

We don't know if RZ heard the message or erased it. There's no evidence the message was sent, considering there is no record of it. All we have is JS's word.

It remains a rather shocking fact in this case that the decision to conclude RZ's death was due to suicide was based on non-verifiable evidence.

BBM. LE had evidence of the exact time the message was received. JS not only confirmed he sent it, he told LE about the content. He had no reason to lie about any aspect of it and at the time, he had no idea whether LE could retrieve it.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

We have JSs word for it as well as AT&Ts explanation as to why the ph call would not appear on RZs billing statement.

LE did not conclude the death as a suicide based on non-verifiable evidence. There is ample evidence and all of it linked to RZ by fingerprints and DNA.

RZ wanted to implicate others in her death, perhaps, erroneously thinking that no one would possibly believe that she would hang her naked self outdoors at the mansion. In the beginning, I thought she was murdered, too. However, after researching the case, I could not overlook nor misinterpret the compelling evidence.

I believe she planned her suicide before the mysterious phone call from JS. I think RZ knew that she was in troubled waters and had made her decision by the time she boarded her dog, Ocean.

Oh, but RZ couldn't board Ocean when she first wanted to bc she had neglected to have Ocean properly vaccinated.

jmho

BBM. I agree and think the phone call was the final straw, not the beginning of her decision. I think Dr. Peterson was questioning the description of the accident long before the hospital contacted CPS and, in turn, Jonah was demanding answers from RZ.

imo, the reason she boarded the dog was because she was moving out at Jonah's request.

JMO

 

[IQuestion]

We have JSs word for it as well as AT&Ts explanation as to why the ph call would not appear on RZs billing statement.

LE did not conclude the death as a suicide based on non-verifiable evidence. There is ample evidence and all of it linked to RZ by fingerprints and DNA.

RZ wanted to implicate others in her death, perhaps, erroneously thinking that no one would possibly believe that she would hang her naked self outdoors at the mansion. In the beginning, I thought she was murdered, too. However, after researching the case, I could not overlook nor misinterpret the compelling evidence.
BBM above: Thank you for sharing your intial thoughts that Rebecca's death was a murder. It would require SO MANY COINCIDENCES for Rebecca to also plan to have NR at the property that night. She could Never have known DS's cell phone pings would only indicate the location of the phone, not the owner. Nor would she have known AS's first words to the 911 caller would be "Got a girl, hung herself." Because that would mean, despite Rebecca's efforts to make her death look like a murder, this incredibly intuitive visitor from Tennessee, could see through the guise with his first sentence to the 911 operator?? And, how could Rebecca have known NR was going to show up at the property, or that a passer-by would id DS as also being at the property? I don't think my doubts makes me unkind, it just makes me wonder why there are so many strange coincidences.I believe she planned her suicide before the mysterious phone call from JS. I think RZ knew that she was in troubled waters and had made her decision by the time she boarded her dog, Ocean.

Oh, but RZ couldn't board Ocean when she first wanted to bc she had neglected to have Ocean properly vaccinated.
To say "neglected proper vaccination" sounds harsh and like more criticism of Rebecca. Perhaps California kennels, have different requirements for boarding dogs than Arizona?
jmho

I read a lot of negative statements made about Rebecca's actions after the accident, and I still wonder what the first responding officer did from the time he arrived on the scene until the paramedics arrived. I wonder why or if he attempted CPR and if not, why not? Did he just stand there, or through training, knew not to move the injured child because of possible neck injuries?Maybe the paramedic report was a short summary with some details inadvertanty ommitted?
If you thnk Rebecca was trying to "frame" someone else....isn't it BIZARRE there were 2 knives, 2 paint brushes, 2 cups....Hmmm, those darned coincidences just keep mounting, huh?

 

[kittychi]

BBM. LE had evidence of the exact time the message was received. JS not only confirmed he sent it, he told LE about the content. He had no reason to lie about any aspect of it and at the time, he had no idea whether LE could retrieve it.

JMO

BBM1 - Please refresh my memory...what was the evidence? TIA

BBM2 - I am not claiming to know if he made the call or not, but if he did not make it, then he knew it couldn't be retrieved.