Retrieving wreckage from AirAsia Flight To Singapore- no survivors recovered #2

[gregjrichards]

:scared:

oh boy

Air Canada -

"Jazz airlines, Air Canada's regional affiliate, recently removed life vests from all of its planes – including those that fly over water – to reduce fuel consumption and save money."

"Safety cards in seat pockets will now direct passengers to use the seat cushions, which float.''

''Jazz planes criss-cross Canada and the U.S., flying over the Great Lakes and up the Eastern seaboard from Halifax to Boston and New York."

as long as they are fifty miles to a shore it's good OMG!

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2008/08/23/air_canadas_jazz_tosses_life_jackets.html

no life vests!!!!!!

That is terrible I wouldn't fly with them surely it's against regulations?

 

[CARIIS]

Wont cut and paste

Unrecovered recorders in aviation history

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unrecovered_flight_recorders

 

[CARIIS]

That is terrible I wouldn't fly with them surely it's against regulations?

THey are really like having a first aid kit in the trunk! Make one feel better, but in the big picture actually menaingless. Anything serious needs more than a band aid in the kit, and less stuff is not life threatening if a band aid is not put on the wound quickly!

They really have, in the jet age, saved few. In the prop gerneration their role was much more signifigant, becasue of the flight charactertics of props compared to jets as it relates to making a successful ditching in water. Props traveled slower and stall charactertics much different so there was a much greater liklihood , in a prop, of ditching somewhat successfullly!

Only three accidents were listed in this article wherein vests had some role:

Limiting the scope to wide-bodied passenger jets makes this question much easier to answer. There have probably been cases of helicopter, light aircraft and freighter crashes where life jackets have played a role, but they are hard to count.

Passenger jets do not typically make sucessful water landings. The typical result is either that everyone dies, or the aircraft comes to rest in very shallow water where life jackets are not relevant.
The bottom line is that a scenario where life jackets are helpful is certainly plausible, and has occurred a few times. It is likely, but cannot be said for certain, that a few people (maybe up to a dozen or so) have survived crashes who wouldn't have survived without the life jackets.

http://www.quora.com/How-many-lives...s-due-to-the-presence-of-life-vests-in-planes

 

[CARIIS]

:thud:


Ditching the vests "says to me that the financial circumstances of the airline industry are in such disarray that a 1 per cent cost is being considered worthwhile," says D'Cruz. "I think accumulatively, it's making air travel a relatively unpleasant experience." :yes:

And you know what is so repulsive here, is this year, at least in industrilzed nations aviation had its best year in years. KNow how? Nickel and diming everything - charging for baggage excess they made a fortune. When Spirit started that I thought it was a online hoax.

Its like a car dealer selling cars with three wheels. Sadly it took hold and soared. Charging for extras and fuel drop air carriers had a great year:

Airline profits are already expected to hit a record this year, and thanks to low fuel prices they should climb even higher in 2015, according to a report issued by the International Air Transport Association last week

baggage fees bring in nearly $1 billion per quarter for the industry, and change fees bring in more than $700 million on top of that.

[h=1]Airline stocks and profits soar thanks to oil plunge[/h]
http://money.cnn.com/2014/12/16/news/companies/airlines-jet-fuel-oil-prices/

 

[skibaboo]

AirAsia QZ8501: Flight attendant is first victim buried



The first victim of AirAsia Flight QZ8501, found in the Java sea after a crash on Sunday, has been laid to rest.

Officials earlier identified the remains as belonging to a female flight attendant called Hayati Lutfiah Hamid.

Ms Hamid, 49, was buried at a ceremony attended by family and friends in the Indonesian city of Surabaya.

:rose:

 

[MzOpinion8d]

Will authorities take DNA from the recovered bodies before they are buried for confirmation just in case there's ever any question of identity?

 

[emirates1957]

That is terrible I wouldn't fly with them surely it's against regulations?

Hi there Greg.....it is actually quite legal for an operator to do this. However it must meet certain conditions eg. where they are flying, and how far away they are from the ocean. What's not taken into consideration is ...what if they have to divert due to bad weather or go into a holding pattern. Not familiar with the routes they fly however. It would be interesting to have a look how close they are to a water body.

 

[Bravo]

I have flown Zipp and Jazz out of Toronto Canada. I'll look for a link to their route as soon as I get supper over.

 

[emirates1957]

Back at work today. Some food for thought. Our A320 Engineer (I have him hooked now). We have a deal - he provides me with technical information in exchange for my homemade lemon meringue pies. When he looked at the footage he was puzzled by the slide being deployed. Apparently it can only be deployed manually and not on impact. He would have thought more bodies would have floated to the surface by now, which would suggest that they are still belted in their seats. As the door is the strongest part of the A/C you would expect to see the fuselage in a million pieces.

 

[Bravo]

http://www.flyjazz.ca/en/home/aircanadaexpress/routemap.aspx

Jazz route map

 

[Intermezzo]

:scared:

oh boy

Air Canada -

"Jazz airlines, Air Canada's regional affiliate, recently removed life vests from all of its planes – including those that fly over water – to reduce fuel consumption and save money."

"Safety cards in seat pockets will now direct passengers to use the seat cushions, which float.''

''Jazz planes criss-cross Canada and the U.S., flying over the Great Lakes and up the Eastern seaboard from Halifax to Boston and New York."

as long as they are fifty miles to a shore it's good OMG!

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2008/08/23/air_canadas_jazz_tosses_life_jackets.html

no life vests!!!!!!

That is terrible I wouldn't fly with them surely it's against regulations?

Hi there Greg.....it is actually quite legal for an operator to do this. However it must meet certain conditions eg. where they are flying, and how far away they are from the ocean. What's not taken into consideration is ...what if they have to divert due to bad weather or go into a holding pattern. Not familiar with the routes they fly however. It would be interesting to have a look how close they are to a water body.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/jazz-removes-life-vests-to-save-fuel-1.720122

Emirates is correct..
unfortunately, This is not NEW news....Air Canada Jazz removed the life vest in 2008

The airline is operating withing Transport Canada Regulations for operating over water.

"Transportation Canada regulation stipulates only one means of floatation is required when operating flights within 50 nautical miles from shore and life vests for babies have not been removed,

The airline also adjusted some routes so that planes remain in the 50-nautical mile(90 kilometer) gov't limit..

 

[Intermezzo]

Back at work today. Some food for thought. Our A320 Engineer (I have him hooked now). We have a deal - he provides me with technical information in exchange for my homemade lemon meringue pies. When he looked at the footage he was puzzled by the slide being deployed. Apparently it can only be deployed manually and not on impact. He would have thought more bodies would have floated to the surface by now, which would suggest that they are still belted in their seats. As the door is the strongest part of the A/C you would expect to see the fuselage in a million pieces.

I have had the same thoughts...the majority of victims will be found in the plane

 

[Dion]

Will authorities take DNA from the recovered bodies before they are buried for confirmation just in case there's ever any question of identity?

The first lady was buried very quickly, so I hope they are taking dna and doing the usual tests, such as verifying they didn't drown (water in lungs) and ascertaining cause of death.

 

[newone]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/jazz-removes-life-vests-to-save-fuel-1.720122

Emirates is correct..
unfortunately, This is not NEW news....Air Canada Jazz removed the life vest in 2008

The airline is operating withing Transport Canada Regulations for operating over water.

"Transportation Canada regulation stipulates only one means of floatation is required when operating flights within 50 nautical miles from shore and life vests for babies have not been removed,

The airline also adjusted some routes so that planes remain in the 50-nautical mile(90 kilometer) gov't limit..

bbm: totally agree! I just didn't know so for me it was a ''wakeup'' call:scared:

flying Jazz to the Charlottes with potential ditching in those waters would rally SAR from Comox but that rough bit of water and hypothermia zero chance....MOO unless there were life rafts

travelling in the Atlantic provinces -- hop skipping through the maritimes involves flying over the Atlantic.....cold and choppy there too.

 

[Bravo]

Not to make light of this tragedy but I can picture every one of us flying now will board wearing a life vest LOL

 

[newone]

Not to make light of this tragedy but I can picture every one of us flying now will board wearing a life vest LOL

I agree or at the very least feeling under my seat for the vest! Seriously considering going to MEC for personal ELT

 

[Isabelle]

Not to make light of this tragedy but I can picture every one of us flying now will board wearing a life vest LOL

Will be traveling by boat, train or bus!

 

[newone]

Well the bad weather leaves us pinning most of our hopes on Singapore's ability to help with recovery of crash data ((thank you Singapore)) as they have sent the navy vessel capable of finding the black boxes which according to this article is the main priority of Indonesia at this time.

''Singapore's navy sent in an unmanned underwater vehicle capable of surveying the seabed to try to help pinpoint the wreckage and the all-important "black boxes" — the flight data recorder and cockpit voice recorder. Indonesian equipment in the search includes a minesweeper, a private survey ship that specializes in sea mapping and a vessel that can conduct 3D imaging and detect pings from the black boxes. Aircraft capable of detecting metal also were deployed.''

''Choppy conditions had prevented divers from entering the water Wednesday, and helicopters were largely grounded, but 18 ships continued to survey the narrowed search area.

Sonar images have identified what appeared to be large parts of the plane."


http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/airasi...id-passenger-is-1st-body-identified-1.2887949

 

[emirates1957]

So next time you fly and your wearing your L/J sitting next to another person in a L/J feel free to ask them if they are a WS member !!

 

[newone]

So next time you fly and your wearing your L/J sitting next to another person in a L/J feel free to ask them if they are a WS member !!

I'll be noticeable with my personal ELT in my hand and this jacket.

http://www.mustangsurvival.com/recreational/mj5244?division=recreation&country=25