Rosie O'Donnell and Kelly Ripa...

[Nova]

If I were to go out and wear a t-shirt that said "Straight and proud of it",I'd be accused of being homophobic,while if a gay person did said same in the same respect(shirt that says 'gay and proud of it'),they wouldn't be accused of being heterophobic.

True, and anyone above the age of 7 should be able to figure out why.

 

[Nova]

I'm not sure if Kelly is homophobic or not, but she's got just as much right to her own feelings as Rosie or Clay do for their's. Its none of Rosie's business if she is, just as its not of Kelly's business if Rosie or Clay are gay.

Huh? Of course, Ripa has a right to homophobic feelings. (If she has them; I don't think this particular incident was about that.)

But if she is going to express them on national TV, then of course right-thinking people should call her on it. (Again, my personal impression is that O'Donnell misunderstood. But you seem to be arguing that even if O'Donnell read Ripa correctly, Ripa is allowed to make homophobic remarks without being challenged.)

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Huh? Of course, Ripa has a right to homophobic feelings. (If she has them; I don't think this particular incident was about that.)

But if she is going to express them on national TV, then of course right-thinking people should call her on it. (Again, my personal impression is that O'Donnell misunderstood. But you seem to be arguing that even if O'Donnell read Ripa correctly, Ripa is allowed to make homophobic remarks without being challenged.)

I don't think that Ripa was even in the neighborhood of thinking the way that Rosie was accusing her of. Rosie, in my opinion, is hypersensitive to it and should have checked out her facts before she opened her mouth.

 

[windovervocalcords]

I don't think that Ripa was even in the neighborhood of thinking the way that Rosie was accusing her of. Rosie, in my opinion, is hypersensitive to it and should have checked out her facts before she opened her mouth.

Yup. Activists tend to be finely tuned to their issues.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Yup. Activists tend to be finely tuned to their issues.

I agree and I think she's done a terrific job. But crying wolf isn't going to help her cause. It just makes her look militant. There are so many GLARING examples of homophobia, why she should zoom in on this misunderstanding seems petty and just makes her look like a bully. If Clay, or anyone else puts their hands on me, they'll be drawing back a stump and I could care less what their sexual orientation is.

 

[Nova]

I don't think that Ripa was even in the neighborhood of thinking the way that Rosie was accusing her of. Rosie, in my opinion, is hypersensitive to it and should have checked out her facts before she opened her mouth.

I agree, Jeana. (Though, as I posted above, there is always the possibility that O'Donnell knows "facts" the rest of us do not that may have influenced her snap judgment.)

I must have misunderstood your previous post. I thought you were saying that even if Ripa's remark were clearly homophobic, O'Donnell had no right to respond.

 

[Nova]

I agree and I think she's done a terrific job. But crying wolf isn't going to help her cause. It just makes her look militant. There are so many GLARING examples of homophobia, why she should zoom in on this misunderstanding seems petty and just makes her look like a bully. If Clay, or anyone else puts their hands on me, they'll be drawing back a stump and I could care less what their sexual orientation is.

You say "militant" like that's a bad thing...

 

[julianne]

I agree and I think she's done a terrific job. But crying wolf isn't going to help her cause. It just makes her look militant. There are so many GLARING examples of homophobia, why she should zoom in on this misunderstanding seems petty and just makes her look like a bully. If Clay, or anyone else puts their hands on me, they'll be drawing back a stump and I could care less what their sexual orientation is.

I agree with this, Jeana. This clearly wasn't about him being gay---and hey, for that matter, he has never outed himself, so for Rosie to take it upon herself to proclaim HIS sexual orientation, and then turn this into a homophobic statement, well, she's off her rocker on this one. I don't want ANYONE'S hand on my mouth for a many reasons, but their sexual orientation isn't on that list of reasons.

I used to like Rosie. Liked her before she "came out", and after she "came out". I like people who express their opinions proudly, but proclaiming that someone is gay when they haven't even proclaimed it themselves, and then labeling statements as "homophobic" when it's clear they aren't homopobic statements, isn't simply expressing their opinions. She stepped out of line, IMO, and if ANYTHING, I think she deserves to apologize to Clay for taking it upon herself to tell the world he is gay, since he hasn't done so himself.

Just seems like she likes to stir up controversy when there isn't enough spotlight on her. That's fine and dandy, if she feels she needs more attention, but don't bring innocent people along on the tirade.

With me, the turning point of me disliking her came about when she made fun of people with Epilepsy and even mocked their epileptic seizures on stage by "performing" one herself. Low blow. Not even funny. To me, she's a very angry woman as of late, and her anger boils over all too often. She could do some wonderful things if she fine-tunes her antics in dealing with others.

 

[Jeana (DP)]

You say "militant" like that's a bad thing...

Its all in the timing!!!

 

[Jeana (DP)]

I agree, Jeana. (Though, as I posted above, there is always the possibility that O'Donnell knows "facts" the rest of us do not that may have influenced her snap judgment.)

I must have misunderstood your previous post. I thought you were saying that even if Ripa's remark were clearly homophobic, O'Donnell had no right to respond.

People who consider race, religeon, sexual orientation, etc., without knowing anything else about a person make me sick. Rosie is in a position to do a lot of good for gay families. When she started those cruises for gay families, I thought it was billiant. However, that doesn't make it okay for her to take on the role of "champion" for people who are not even out of the closet. She may even do harm. We don't even know if Clay is gay. Most of us don't even care. For her to bring what he holds so personal to the national forefront was inexcusable. It isnt' and wasn't her place to say anything. If Ripa had come right out and made some horrible remark about homosexuals, then sure, I say let everyone, gay or straight come out and let her have it. But that's not what happenened. Not even close. I don't watch her show very often, but obviously she treats everyone pretty much the same or we've have heard something before now. I never watch the View, but I did for a few minutes this morning and Rosie never shut her mouth. I'd like to know who died and made her the Queen Diva of the show. I'd also like to see Clay put his hand over her mouth.

 

[Nova]

I agree with this, Jeana. This clearly wasn't about him being gay---and hey, for that matter, he has never outed himself, so for Rosie to take it upon herself to proclaim HIS sexual orientation, and then turn this into a homophobic statement, well, she's off her rocker on this one. I don't want ANYONE'S hand on my mouth for a many reasons, but their sexual orientation isn't on that list of reasons.

Could we please, please, please once and for all dispense with the notion that Rosie O'Donnell outed Clay Aiken? Whether or not Ripa's remark was homophobic, homophobic remarks can be directed at people who are not gay, particularly if those people are perceived to be gay.

Aiken has for years been the subject of homophobic remarks, on TV and all over the internet. He was outed, if at all, by men last year who claimed to have had sex with him and sold their stories to the tabloids.

 

[Nova]

People who consider race, religeon, sexual orientation, etc., without knowing anything else about a person make me sick. Rosie is in a position to do a lot of good for gay families. When she started those cruises for gay families, I thought it was billiant. However, that doesn't make it okay for her to take on the role of "champion" for people who are not even out of the closet. She may even do harm. We don't even know if Clay is gay. Most of us don't even care. For her to bring what he holds so personal to the national forefront was inexcusable. It isnt' and wasn't her place to say anything. If Ripa had come right out and made some horrible remark about homosexuals, then sure, I say let everyone, gay or straight come out and let her have it. But that's not what happenened. Not even close. I don't watch her show very often, but obviously she treats everyone pretty much the same or we've have heard something before now. I never watch the View, but I did for a few minutes this morning and Rosie never shut her mouth. I'd like to know who died and made her the Queen Diva of the show. I'd also like to see Clay put his hand over her mouth.

Golly, Jeana. Good thing I had already agreed with you. Imagine the rant if I hadn't!

 

[Jeana (DP)]

Golly, Jeana. Good thing I had already agreed with you. Imagine the rant if I hadn't!

But I'd still love ya! :angel:

 

[windovervocalcords]

Could we please, please, please once and for all dispense with the notion that Rosie O'Donnell outed Clay Aiken? Whether or not Ripa's remark was homophobic, homophobic remarks can be directed at people who are not gay, particularly if those people are perceived to be gay.

Aiken has for years been the subject of homophobic remarks, on TV and all over the internet. He was outed, if at all, by men last year who claimed to have had sex with him and sold their stories to the tabloids.

Nova--

Stop being so heterophobic!

(just kidding)

 

[julianne]

Could we please, please, please once and for all dispense with the notion that Rosie O'Donnell outed Clay Aiken? Whether or not Ripa's remark was homophobic, homophobic remarks can be directed at people who are not gay, particularly if those people are perceived to be gay.

Aiken has for years been the subject of homophobic remarks, on TV and all over the internet. He was outed, if at all, by men last year who claimed to have had sex with him and sold their stories to the tabloids.

Of course homophobic remarks can be directed at people who are not gay....any kind of remarks can be directed at anyone. In my opinion, I don't think it's just a "notion" that Rosie outed Clay. IMO, she clearly did out him, because she said that Kelly's remarks TO Clay were homophobic towards him. She implied that Clay was gay, she did all but come out and say he was gay.

I know that his sexual orientation has been a topic of banter for years....the ever present "Is he" or "Isn't he." I'm not aware of any men "outing" him to tabloids by claiming they had sex with him, and really could care less, but obviously Rosie is a much more higher profile person than these men. She's on a national talk show, and really injected something in the remark by Kelly that really wasn't there to begin with. I just think for someone like Rosie, who has emphatically stated time and time again that it doesn't matter whether someone is gay or straight, that she obviously thinks it matters enough to publicy proclaim Clay as being gay when he hasn't even done so. Regardless if some money-hungry men sold a story to a tabloid, the fact is that Clay hasn't felt the need to say so one way or another, and neither should Rosie.

I used to admire Rosie and her up-front attitude, but as of late she just seems to be quite a mean-spirited gal....it's a shame because I think if she just fine-tuned herself and her delivery, she could really be the voice that we need in this world.

 

[windovervocalcords]

Of course homophobic remarks can be directed at people who are not gay....any kind of remarks can be directed at anyone. In my opinion, I don't think it's just a "notion" that Rosie outed Clay. IMO, she clearly did out him, because she said that Kelly's remarks TO Clay were homophobic towards him. She implied that Clay was gay, she did all but come out and say he was gay.

I know that his sexual orientation has been a topic of banter for years....the ever present "Is he" or "Isn't he." I'm not aware of any men "outing" him to tabloids by claiming they had sex with him, and really could care less, but obviously Rosie is a much more higher profile person than these men. She's on a national talk show, and really injected something in the remark by Kelly that really wasn't there to begin with. I just think for someone like Rosie, who has emphatically stated time and time again that it doesn't matter whether someone is gay or straight, that she obviously thinks it matters enough to publicy proclaim Clay as being gay when he hasn't even done so. Regardless if some money-hungry men sold a story to a tabloid, the fact is that Clay hasn't felt the need to say so one way or another, and neither should Rosie.

I used to admire Rosie and her up-front attitude, but as of late she just seems to be quite a mean-spirited gal....it's a shame because I think if she just fine-tuned herself and her delivery, she could really be the voice that we need in this world.

Outspoken powerful women always take flack for being obnoxious. Outspoken east coast dykes even more so.

She's mouthy. Maybe she feels more vulnerable being so publically gay. Who knows?

 

[julianne]

Outspoken powerful women always take flack for being obnoxious. Outspoken east coast dykes even more so.

She's mouthy. Maybe she feels more vulnerable being so publically gay. Who knows?

Wind, I think that very well could be true. She probably feels like she has to remain "on guard" because of the negative attitudes that are still so pervasive in todays world regarding gay people. It's a shame that people can't focus their energy on things that really matter.... (meaning the people who find the need to publicly denounce people for loving those who they "shouldn't")

Shoot, you could've just completely changed my perception of her with that one sentence. If anything, it's certainly something to think about.

And, you are SOOOOOO right about outspoken powerful women always taking flack. One of my favorite sayings is "Mild mannered women seldom make history".

 

[akgal]

Has Clay Aikan put out a statement re: how he feels about Kelly's comment?
It would be interesting to know how or what he feels about all this.

 

[Nova]

that's something i've noticed about some gay ppl...not all of them, but some seem to predjudiced against str 8 ppl.

I went away for a few hours to make sure I responded appropriately: I seriously doubt you know what you are talking about.

Even those of us gay people who live in "gay ghettos" still function simultaneously inside the straight world. I'm not talking about being in the closet; I mean we have straight parents, children, friends, colleagues, etc.

To really be prejudiced against a group, you have to stand somewhat outside the members of that group. With almost no exceptions, gay people can't and don't have the "distance" to be prejudiced against heterosexuals.

Now, you may have heard the occasional joke about "breeders" or something similar. Those jokes are ironic and, frankly, defensive. We can discuss whether they are appropriate, but they do not reflect any true "prejudice" against our mothers, children, sisters, brothers, etc.

(ETA: To my everlasting sorrow, gay people are not exempt from the other prejudices of our day and time: racism, sexism, etc. We ought to know better and I cannot tell you how much it grieves me that all of us do not.)

 

[windovervocalcords]

I went away for a few hours to make sure I responded appropriately: I seriously doubt you know what you are talking about.

Even those of us gay people who live in "gay ghettos" still function simultaneously inside the straight world. I'm not talking about being in the closet; I mean we have straight parents, children, friends, colleagues, etc.

To really be prejudiced against a group, you have to stand somewhat outside the members of that group. With almost no exceptions, gay people can't and don't have the "distance" to be prejudiced against heterosexuals.

Now, you may have heard the occasional joke about "breeders" or something similar. Those jokes are ironic and, frankly, defensive. We can discuss whether they are appropriate, but they do not reflect any true "prejudice" against our mothers, children, sisters, brothers, etc.

(ETA: To my everlasting sorrow, gay people are not exempt from the other prejudices of our day and time: racism, sexism, etc. We ought to know better and I cannot tell you how much it grieves me that all of us do not.)

Classy post Nova--

I poked fun at (at your expense) at "heterophobia" because it's one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard.

When we start having maruading queers beating up, murdering or merely shouting slurs at straight folks we will have reached parity. Yuck--who wants that?

Next, we'll be hearing about the endangered species of heteros, who are so oppressed they cannot get married. They have to hide in the closet if they want to get promoted. They have to "proclaim" their sexuality because everyone assumes they're gay.