Russia Attacks Ukraine - 23 Feb 2022 #9

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Despicable.

From first link, rbbm.

“When you hear women testify about Russian soldiers equipped with Viagra, it’s clearly a military strategy,” Pramila Patten, UN Special Representative on Sexual Violence in Conflict, said in an interview with AFP on Thursday.

She added that many cases involved children and also said that the true number of victims was likely to be far higher than official figures suggested because sexual crimes are often “under reported.

“There are many cases of sexual violence against children who are raped, tortured and sequestered,” Patten said.''
 
  • #584
This and no other is the root from which a tyrant springs: when he first appears he is a protector. - Plato

The tyrant will always find a pretext for his tyranny. - Aesop

When the government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. - Thomas Jefferson

Those who deny freedom to others deserve it not for themselves. - Abraham Lincoln

You can’t separate peace and freedom because no one can have peace unless he has freedom. - Malcolm X

Those who can give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. - Benjamin Franklin

Whatever is my right as a man is also the right of another, and it becomes my duty to guarantee as well as possess. - Thomas Paine

The liberties of none are safe unless the liberties of all are protected. - William O. Douglas

Liberty for wolves is death to the lambs. - Isaiah Berlin



Here’s the thing — the world cannot just sit back and let Putin do whatever the hell he pleases to win this war (take away the sovereignty of another country by force, target infrastructure of no military value, torture, rape, and murder civilians trapped in occupied territory, separate children from their families and deport them to Russia). Because if we don’t stop him now, he’s not stopping there. And then China and North Korea and whoever else will think they can get away with doing the same. And then we will all be like “Sayonara, Thailand! See ya on the flip side, South Korea!” And well… I’m sure you can see where I’m going with this.
BBM

Should ww3 start then, is that what people want? If the US gets directly and majorly involved more than we already are, nuclear war could be inevitable IMO.

None of this excuses that ukr soldiers are torturing, murdering, raping etc, Russian soldiers and citizens and yet few people seem to talk about that.
 
  • #585
From first link, rbbm.

“When you hear women testify about Russian soldiers equipped with Viagra, it’s clearly a military strategy,” Pramila Patten, UN Special Representative on Sexual Violence in Conflict, said in an interview with AFP on Thursday.

She added that many cases involved children and also said that the true number of victims was likely to be far higher than official figures suggested because sexual crimes are often “under reported.

“There are many cases of sexual violence against children who are raped, tortured and sequestered,” Patten said.''
Viagra does have other uses, specifically in a warzone.
 
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BBM

Should ww3 start then, is that what people want? If the US gets directly and majorly involved more than we already are, nuclear war could be inevitable IMO.

None of this excuses that ukr soldiers are torturing, murdering, raping etc, Russian soldiers and citizens and yet few people seem to talk about that.
OF COURSE, nobody wants WWIII. I haven’t seen anyone on WS suggest the US get directly involved either. There are other ways to help Ukraine and ensure Putin doesn’t achieve his goals — which is exactly what the US and many other countries are already doing. It’s important that we KEEP doing it.

Do you have a link to support your claim that Ukrainian soldiers are torturing, raping, and killing Russian soldiers and citizens? I’m aware of several reports that involve the mistreatment of Russian POWs, but the torturing, raping, and killing of Russian citizens is certainly news to me.


Commission member Pablo de Greiff told reporters the team had “found two instances of ill-treatment of Russian Federation soldiers by Ukrainian soldiers. ... We have found obviously significantly larger numbers of incidences that amount to war crimes on the part of the Russian Federation.”



The sad reality is that there will always be some soldiers who act unethically during wartime — on both sides. And I’m sure it’s not always easy for Ukraine to do the right thing when they’ve captured the men raping and killing their women and children. Mistreating prisoners of war is never okay or justified, but I’m not surprised it occasionally happens.

OTOH, the bad acts committed by Russian forces are both plentiful and widespread. The most recent report from the UN Human Rights Commission really speaks for itself:

WARNING: GRAPHIC DESCRIPTIONS

As for violations against personal integrity, we were struck by the large number of executions in the areas that we visited. The Commission is currently investigating such deaths in 16 towns and settlements. We have received credible allegations regarding many more cases of executions, which we are documenting further.

Common elements of such crimes include the prior detention of the victims as well as
visible signs of executions on bodies, such as hands tied behind backs, gunshot wounds to the head, and slit throats.

Witnesses provided us with consistent accounts of ill-treatment and torture, which were carried out during unlawful confinement. Some of the victims reported that after initial detention by Russian forces in Ukraine, they were transferred to the Russian Federation and held for weeks in prisons. Interlocutors described beatings, electric shocks, and forced nudity
, as well as other types of violations in such detention facilities.

In the cases we have investigated, the
age of victims of sexual and gendered-based violence ranged from four to 82 years.

The Commission has documented cases in which children have been raped, tortured, and unlawfully confined. Children have also been killed and injured in indiscriminate attacks with explosive weapons.


 
  • #589
<snipped for focus> There are other ways to help Ukraine and ensure Putin doesn’t achieve his goals — which is exactly what the US and many other countries are already doing. It’s important that we KEEP doing it.

I do think it is time that the U.S. government explain to the American people what the actual goals are in their continuing to send billions of dollars to the Ukraine government. What are our goals? And at what cost? And what are the risks?

With the possibility of a nuclear war, IMO it's time to pressure the countries that are actually at war to negotiate, whether the Ukraine and Russia like that or not.
 
  • #590
Viagra does have other uses, specifically in a warzone.
Wow, had no idea!
2008
''The Afghan chieftain looked older than his 60-odd years, and his bearded face bore the creases of a man burdened with duties as tribal patriarch and husband to four younger women. His visitor, a CIA officer, saw an opportunity, and reached into his bag for a small gift.

Four blue pills. Viagra.

"Take one of these. You'll love it," the officer said. Compliments of Uncle Sam.

The enticement worked. The officer, who described the encounter, returned four days later to an enthusiastic reception. The grinning chief offered up a bonanza of information about Taliban movements and supply routes — followed by a request for more pills.

For U.S. intelligence officials, this is how some crucial battles in Afghanistan are fought and won. While the CIA has a long history of buying information with cash, the growing Taliban insurgency has prompted the use of novel incentives and creative bargaining to gain support in some of the country's roughest neighborhoods, according to officials directly involved in such operations.''
 
  • #591
Two recruits opened fire at a Russian military training ground in the Belgorod region near the border with Ukraine on Saturday, leaving 11 people dead and 15 injured.


 
  • #592
I do think it is time that the U.S. government explain to the American people what the actual goals are in their continuing to send billions of dollars to the Ukraine government. What are our goals? And at what cost? And what are the risks?

With the possibility of a nuclear war, IMO it's time to pressure the countries that are actually at war to negotiate, whether the Ukraine and Russia like that or not.
Sorry, I read this and actually laughed out loud. Seriously?

Like the United States government ever explained the costs ans goals of Vietnam?

Like the United States government ever explained the cost, and goals of Afghanistan?

I agree, there seems to be an unlimited blank check to Ukraine right now. No one seems to care, as long as United States service members are not involved...so far.
 
  • #593
OF COURSE, nobody wants WWIII. I haven’t seen anyone on WS suggest the US get directly involved either. There are other ways to help Ukraine and ensure Putin doesn’t achieve his goals — which is exactly what the US and many other countries are already doing. It’s important that we KEEP doing it.

Do you have a link to support your claim that Ukrainian soldiers are torturing, raping, and killing Russian soldiers and citizens? I’m aware of several reports that involve the mistreatment of Russian POWs, but the torturing, raping, and killing of Russian citizens is certainly news to me.


Commission member Pablo de Greiff told reporters the team had “found two instances of ill-treatment of Russian Federation soldiers by Ukrainian soldiers. ... We have found obviously significantly larger numbers of incidences that amount to war crimes on the part of the Russian Federation.”



The sad reality is that there will always be some soldiers who act unethically during wartime — on both sides. And I’m sure it’s not always easy for Ukraine to do the right thing when they’ve captured the men raping and killing their women and children. Mistreating prisoners of war is never okay or justified, but I’m not surprised it occasionally happens.

OTOH, the bad acts committed by Russian forces are both plentiful and widespread. The most recent report from the UN Human Rights Commission really speaks for itself:

WARNING: GRAPHIC DESCRIPTIONS

As for violations against personal integrity, we were struck by the large number of executions in the areas that we visited. The Commission is currently investigating such deaths in 16 towns and settlements. We have received credible allegations regarding many more cases of executions, which we are documenting further.

Common elements of such crimes include the prior detention of the victims as well as
visible signs of executions on bodies, such as hands tied behind backs, gunshot wounds to the head, and slit throats.

Witnesses provided us with consistent accounts of ill-treatment and torture, which were carried out during unlawful confinement. Some of the victims reported that after initial detention by Russian forces in Ukraine, they were transferred to the Russian Federation and held for weeks in prisons. Interlocutors described beatings, electric shocks, and forced nudity
, as well as other types of violations in such detention facilities.

In the cases we have investigated, the
age of victims of sexual and gendered-based violence ranged from four to 82 years.

The Commission has documented cases in which children have been raped, tortured, and unlawfully confined. Children have also been killed and injured in indiscriminate attacks with explosive weapons.


Here is one link for you

 
  • #594
Fwiw..
March 2022
Daniel Boffey in Lviv
''Video footage purporting to show the torture of Russian prisoners of war is being investigated by the Ukrainian government.

The film, which has not been verified, appears to show Ukrainian soldiers removing three hooded Russians from a van before shooting them in the legs.


The Ukrainian military commander Gen Valerii Zaluzhnyi accused Russia of staging the videos.

“The enemy produces and shares videos with the inhuman treatment of alleged ‘Russian prisoners’ by ‘Ukrainian soldiers’ in order to discredit the Ukrainian defence forces,” Zaluzhnyi said.''

''Oleksiy Arestovych, an adviser to the Ukrainian president, Volodymyr Zelenskiy, said: “We are a European army, and we do not mock our prisoners. If this turns out to be real, this is absolutely unacceptable behaviour.”

“Currently, no one can confirm or deny the veracity of this video,” he said. “It’s not known where it’s happening, or who the participants are.”

The Kremlin spokesperson Dmitry Peskov said the “monstrous images” needed to be legally assessed and for those who took part to be held responsible.''
 
  • #595

Putin has been biding his time, until winter hits. Europe better hope that "global warming" makes for a warm winter. This winter could hit Europe, UK, very hard without access to Russian gas.

 
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