Australia Samantha Murphy, 51, last seen leaving her property to go for a run in the Canadian State Forest, Ballarat, 4 Feb 2024 *Arrest* #13

[Spectrix]

Isn't there some sort of law in Australia that a murderer isn't eligible for parole if no body is ever found in order to encourage murderers to work with authorities to locate the body?

Yes, commonly called "No body, no parole".

• Under section 74AABA of the Corrections Act 1986 (Vic), the Parole Board must not grant parole unless it is satisfied that the offender has:
  
  • Identified (or made reasonable efforts to identify) the location or last known location of the body;
  • Provided the place where the remains may be found, if known.
• This requirement is mandatory—not discretionary—meaning no cooperation = no parole.

 

[Trooper]

Isn't there some sort of law in Australia that a murderer isn't eligible for parole if no body is ever found in order to encourage murderers to work with authorities to locate the body?

It is a matter for each state to legislate, and all states in Australia EXCEPT TASMANIA have so legislated ., some slower than others ... no body, no parole. This particular murder occurred in Victoria, so that law will come into play down the track. As it stands , there are a few prominent cases where this recent law has been laid down on convicted murderers way after the crime and the conviction ... Chris Dawson comes to mind, and Keli Lane, , in NSW,

Queensland has had this law for some time, with various outcomes , one argument against it is the matter of someone wrongfully convicted, who has no hope of presenting the missing body.. Lindy Chamberlain would be in that category, and John Buttons of Western Au,,,,, it is not a guaranteed method of bringing closure to families or courts or hard working detectives , in one sense.

 

[Spectrix]

It is a matter for each state to legislate, and all states in Australia EXCEPT TASMANIA have so legislated ., some slower than others ... no body, no parole. This particular murder occurred in Victoria, so that law will come into play down the track. As it stands , there are a few prominent cases where this recent law has been laid down on convicted murderers way after the crime and the conviction ... Chris Dawson comes to mind, and Keli Lane, , in NSW,

Queensland has had this law for some time, with various outcomes , one argument against it is the matter of someone wrongfully convicted, who has no hope of presenting the missing body.. Lindy Chamberlain would be in that category, and John Buttons of Western Au,,,,, it is not a guaranteed method of bringing closure to families or courts or hard working detectives , in one sense.

I find this case quite intriguing in that very little is known about the accused and what evidence may tie him to the crime (at least in the public domain).
We've seen that there is a crash reconstruction expert retained as a witness, so we can guess that police believe a vehicular incident played a part. Aside from that, the victim's phone being found in a dam months after the arrest was made, and copious amounts of CCTV have been mentioned.

It's sure going to be interesting to find out what else they have on this gentleman to keep him locked up all this time.

 

[Trooper]

I find this case quite intriguing in that very little is known about the accused and what evidence may tie him to the crime (at least in the public domain).
We've seen that there is a crash reconstruction expert retained as a witness, so we can guess that police believe a vehicular incident played a part. Aside from that, the victim's phone being found in a dam months after the arrest was made, and copious amounts of CCTV have been mentioned.

It's sure going to be interesting to find out what else they have on this gentleman to keep him locked up all this time.

Interesting to me, is, he has never applied for bail. This is something everyone does... some actually get it, not often when accused of murder, but ..still , you have to apply to be in the lottery. He has not. Either he has not required it, or his Barristers have advised him against applying. Which means they think he is better off where he is...

For a stranger on stranger murder , VICPOL has told us, the goggle eyed public, a hell of a lot, for a very difficult genre of murder to solve, generally speaking.. we know the time she died, approx .8am that Sunday morning, we know where she died ( Mt Clear ) it has been specifically laid out that it was not a hit and run scenario, that she was 'attacked'. We can probably safely presume, with caution, that a vehicle was used in the transporting of her body, from Mt Clear, to S.O.M.E.W.H.E.R.E , and with a slide rule and a calculator, we can make a guess at how far he could have travelled , IF WE KNEW what appointments and arrangements he had for that day.

We know that Ms. Murphy had an appointment at around 11 am at an important ( her words ) Brunch with some women friends , some of whom put up the warning bell when she did not turn up as arranged ... so we know that from the time of her demise, till about 12, or even 12.30pm that day, from then on the search was on in earnest, the forest was full of police, firemen, SAS, Scouts, Guides, horseback riders, dogs, citizens, all on the lookout.

Which gave him only about 3 or 4 hours to dispose of her body, clean himself up, clean up the vehicle and the surrounds, in broad daylight on a hot Sunday morning, with folks out and about going on with their Sunday business..

 

[RobinCAL]

Australia Post in thread 'Samantha Murphy, 51, last seen leaving her property to go for a run in the Canadian State Forest, Ballarat, 4 Feb 2024 *Arrest* #9'

Apr 4, 2024

Timeline of Samantha Murphy's disappearance​

Sunday, February 4, 7am: Mum-of-three Samantha Murphy is last seen leaving her home on Eureka Street in Ballarat East heading off on a run.

7.16am: She is captured on a neighbour's CCTV wearing a brown singlet and black half-length leggings.

11am: Ms Murphy fails to show up at a planned brunch with family. She is reported to police as a missing.

Monday, February 5: Victoria Police launch a public appeal to find Ms Murphy. A search area is established just outside the suburb of Buninyong, about 14km from where Ms...

• RobinCAL

• 
• 

Just bringing the timeline post back around.

 

[sunspun]

Interesting to me, is, he has never applied for bail. This is something everyone does... some actually get it, not often when accused of murder, but ..still , you have to apply to be in the lottery. He has not. Either he has not required it, or his Barristers have advised him against applying. Which means they think he is better off where he is...

For a stranger on stranger murder , VICPOL has told us, the goggle eyed public, a hell of a lot, for a very difficult genre of murder to solve, generally speaking.. we know the time she died, approx .8am that Sunday morning, we know where she died ( Mt Clear ) it has been specifically laid out that it was not a hit and run scenario, that she was 'attacked'. We can probably safely presume, with caution, that a vehicle was used in the transporting of her body, from Mt Clear, to S.O.M.E.W.H.E.R.E , and with a slide rule and a calculator, we can make a guess at how far he could have travelled , IF WE KNEW what appointments and arrangements he had for that day.

We know that Ms. Murphy had an appointment at around 11 am at an important ( her words ) Brunch with some women friends , some of whom put up the warning bell when she did not turn up as arranged ... so we know that from the time of her demise, till about 12, or even 12.30pm that day, from then on the search was on in earnest, the forest was full of police, firemen, SAS, Scouts, Guides, horseback riders, dogs, citizens, all on the lookout.

Which gave him only about 3 or 4 hours to dispose of her body, clean himself up, clean up the vehicle and the surrounds, in broad daylight on a hot Sunday morning, with folks out and about going on with their Sunday business..

Excellent sum-up of all the relevant points.. and what it says to me is it sounds like the police think (they might say know) that the accused deliberately ran her down with a lethal result, and then moved her body away somewhere and hid it. And then I'd say went on about his business as usual.

I mean, what else could it be, considering the accident reconstruction expert witness inclusion along with the blunt statement by the police that it was not a hit and run. I can't think of any other possibility... if, that is, a hit and run means what I assume it does, which to me is when someone hits a person with a vehicle and runs away, leaving the injured person or their dead body where it is.

And if all this is correct, then it probably also must mean that it was all caught clearly on video. I reach this conclusion because of the mention of, as @Spectrix above put it, "copious amounts of CCTV" along with the fact that they were confident enough in the truth of their theory to have kept the accused locked up all this time, despite him having no known ties otherwise to the victim. And I feel like this is bolstered by the fact that, as @Trooper above points out, the accused has never applied for bail, although there may be other reasons behind that, I suppose.

So... deliberately ran her down and killed her. And hid her body and refusing to say where, thereby prolonging the agony of her family, depriving the victim of a proper burial, and unnecessarily adding tons of hard work to the job the police have to do. Wow. If they're right, what a horrible individual he is. I think I might prefer them to find her before he caves and gives up a location. I'd hate to see him become eligible for ANYTHING good by telling them. But of course, if they don't find her, I still hope eventually he confesses to the location. It must be so hard on her family, just knowing that she's still out there somewhere where she should never be.

 

[Trooper]

Excellent sum-up of all the relevant points.. and what it says to me is it sounds like the police think (they might say know) that the accused deliberately ran her down with a lethal result, and then moved her body away somewhere and hid it. And then I'd say went on about his business as usual.

I mean, what else could it be, considering the accident reconstruction expert witness inclusion along with the blunt statement by the police that it was not a hit and run. I can't think of any other possibility... if, that is, a hit and run means what I assume it does, which to me is when someone hits a person with a vehicle and runs away, leaving the injured person or their dead body where it is.

And if all this is correct, then it probably also must mean that it was all caught clearly on video. I reach this conclusion because of the mention of, as @Spectrix above put it, "copious amounts of CCTV" along with the fact that they were confident enough in the truth of their theory to have kept the accused locked up all this time, despite him having no known ties otherwise to the victim. And I feel like this is bolstered by the fact that, as @Trooper above points out, the accused has never applied for bail, although there may be other reasons behind that, I suppose.

So... deliberately ran her down and killed her. And hid her body and refusing to say where, thereby prolonging the agony of her family, depriving the victim of a proper burial, and unnecessarily adding tons of hard work to the job the police have to do. Wow. If they're right, what a horrible individual he is. I think I might prefer them to find her before he caves and gives up a location. I'd hate to see him become eligible for ANYTHING good by telling them. But of course, if they don't find her, I still hope eventually he confesses to the location. It must be so hard on her family, just knowing that she's still out there somewhere where she should never be.

Whatever it is that VICPOL has, be it visual, or audio, or witness narrative ( we have no idea if anyone saw the whole thing, it is not improbable that VICPOL would keep that dark from the press ) whatever they have shows, without a shadow of doubt as far as VICPOL is concerned , the delicate matter of INTENT.

Which divides murder from manslaughter or accidental death.

Because murder is a huge allegation needing credible jury-satisfying logic and rationale,, it cannot be some vague suspicion or theory. To get permission from the DPP to arrest and hold someone for murder the evidence must be awfully strong,, unarguable to a fine degree.

What VICPOL has is something, some way of conveying to a jury the intent of the killer towards the victim, some manner of action or statements, or claims, or eyewitness stuff, something recorded in sound , perhaps movement, maybe colour, the whole panorama of evidence that points to one person only as the perpetrator.

And whatever VICPOL has, the defence has, as per disclosure. So his barristers know as much as the detectives know, basically, So he knows what VICPOL has..

 

[Trooper]

I find this case quite intriguing in that very little is known about the accused and what evidence may tie him to the crime (at least in the public domain).
We've seen that there is a crash reconstruction expert retained as a witness, so we can guess that police believe a vehicular incident played a part. Aside from that, the victim's phone being found in a dam months after the arrest was made, and copious amounts of CCTV have been mentioned.

It's sure going to be interesting to find out what else they have on this gentleman to keep him locked up all this time.

As you say, very little known about the accused.... only that he is the youngest of 3 children, the older 2 being girls...that the girls were considered to be breezy and bright gals in the village, he was quiet and somewhat sullen, or distant... that he was privately educated at a Catholic school, that he played football regularly , his father being a coach of a famous team. He was well thought of at high school and much was expected of him by his friends, they thought he had genius attributes.. he became apprenticed to his father's electrical installation business, he had a long term girlfriend and he travelled a bit, Bali, NZ , etc, bits of AU, ....

He experimented with drugs of various genres,. alcohol, methamphetamines, hash, whatever, he was a shocking driver, he never seemed to grasp the requirement for restraint and adherence to road laws at all, or the wisdom of motorcycling stone sober and not in the grip of illegal substances. He would be fined and then get straight back at the wheel and be stupid again. These things , the idea of not doing dumb things were absent in his psyche. No known complaints of violence or thievery, or conspiracy stuff ...

 

[RobinCAL]

Whatever it is that VICPOL has, be it visual, or audio, or witness narrative ( we have no idea if anyone saw the whole thing, it is not improbable that VICPOL would keep that dark from the press ) whatever they have shows, without a shadow of doubt as far as VICPOL is concerned , the delicate matter of INTENT.

Which divides murder from manslaughter or accidental death.

Because murder is a huge allegation needing credible jury-satisfying logic and rationale,, it cannot be some vague suspicion or theory. To get permission from the DPP to arrest and hold someone for murder the evidence must be awfully strong,, unarguable to a fine degree.

What VICPOL has is something, some way of conveying to a jury the intent of the killer towards the victim, some manner of action or statements, or claims, or eyewitness stuff, something recorded in sound , perhaps movement, maybe colour, the whole panorama of evidence that points to one person only as the perpetrator.

And whatever VICPOL has, the defence has, as per disclosure. So his barristers know as much as the detectives know, basically, So he knows what VICPOL has..

Thank you for all the round up points !! Its been an interesting read.

IMO, It seems whatever evidence seemingly only covers the crime as the body has not been found.

I still find it weird the phone was not found with a body. As well as the clean up in general.

But obviously, they have something concrete to dismiss other ideas of a hit and run and call it an attack.
They had mentioned a car might be damaged and I think there was a debate earlier on if any debris from a car could have been found.

A bit of an off topic thing, but the idea the police said there was no danger for anyone else , especially to say that for a supposed stranger on stranger crime.

 

[BreakingNews]

I find this case quite intriguing in that very little is known about the accused and what evidence may tie him to the crime (at least in the public domain).
We've seen that there is a crash reconstruction expert retained as a witness, so we can guess that police believe a vehicular incident played a part. Aside from that, the victim's phone being found in a dam months after the arrest was made, and copious amounts of CCTV have been mentioned.

It's sure going to be interesting to find out what else they have on this gentleman to keep him locked up all this time.

Sorry I have missed the part about a crash reconstruction expert as a witness. Is this person a witness for the Prosecution or the Defence? Where was it reported?

 

[SouthAussie]

Sorry I have missed the part about a crash reconstruction expert as a witness. Is this person a witness for the Prosecution or the Defence? Where was it reported?

The Prosecution.


Prosecutor Raymond Gibson KC said during a court date for Stephenson in February this year, that police members and a DNA expert were among their list of eight proposed witnesses.

He said road crash reconstruction expert Robert Hay, a digital data expert, and phone data specialist Matthew Sorrell would be among them.

Major update in search for Samantha Murphy

The 51-year-old mum was last seen leaving her home for a run in February last year.

7news.com.au

 

[Trooper]

Sorry I have missed the part about a crash reconstruction expert as a witness. Is this person a witness for the Prosecution or the Defence? Where was it reported?

It is not usual for the defence to make public their witness list, in any case, not just this one. It very rarely happens, but it is a matter of course that the Prosecution puts up a witness list. They are not compelled to put up publicly every witness though.. They can keep some cards to their chest, but they cannot keep that info from the defence ..

 

[Spectrix]

And if all this is correct, then it probably also must mean that it was all caught clearly on video. I reach this conclusion because of the mention of, as @Spectrix above put it, "copious amounts of CCTV" along with the fact that they were confident enough in the truth of their theory to have kept the accused locked up all this time, despite him having no known ties otherwise to the victim.

(BBM)
I'm not so sure.

In early August 2024, at a committal mention hearing in Ballarat Magistrates’ Court, prosecutors asked for a twelve week adjournment, citing a brief of evidence containing an “unprecedented” amount of CCTV footage and other material.

I suspect that it might be quantity rather than quality, as such.
For example they might have hours and hours of circumstantial footage of Mr Stephenson drinking too much & dancing badly at nightclubs, scoffing greasy doner kebabs and walking past twenty different retail outlets at five in the morning in the vague direction of Mt Clear.

 

[Rocket333]

I mean, what else could it be, considering the accident reconstruction expert witness inclusion along with the blunt statement by the police that it was not a hit and run. I can't think of any other possibility...

I still find it weird the phone was not found with a body. As well as the clean up in general.

The reconstruction expert will probably draw a very sharp boundary around what did not happen, and what did not happen was a hit and run, so it’ll be about a physically active moment most likely captured on smart devices (phone & watch) which demonstrate intent and movement.

The phone and watch data will be a goldmine, especially with Dr Matt Sorrell managing it. The steady rhythm of a jog, maybe a well-worn loop Samantha had taken many times, until something changed. A pivot. A sprint. A sudden halt. If that data shows a shift in pace, direction, or heart rate at a key time, it’s not just metadata, it’s a minute-by-minute reconstruction of fear, flight, and/or confrontation.

Samantha’s phone may have been tucked into a pocket in her tights and overlooked at first and then disposed of later, maybe even tossed out of the window or from the side of the road into the dam during a panicked moment on the drive home. The phone is reported to have pinged at one point in the afternoon and may have tracked the whole journey, so it was always a liability. It was discarded in tact though, complete with the wallet and cards which suggests that it was done in haste and the dam location was possibly opportunistic. Like someone wanted it deeply buried but not smartly buried, and in a rush thought water meant destruction.

The police were visibly jubilant when the phone was recovered, maybe because they knew what this meant for a timeline. Maybe it corroborates something they were struggling to pin down, like a jog interrupted not by accident but by a deliberate, intentional act.

 

[marv hucker]

No known complaints of violence or thievery, or conspiracy stuff ...

Would we know if he’d done anything as a juvenile offender ? I believe not, but I could be wrong.

 

[BreakingNews]

Would we know if he’d done anything as a juvenile offender ? I believe not, but I could be wrong.

Usually they will keep past offences, if any, quiet until sentencing, if it gets that far. The jury are not allowed to know that information.

 

[Bats]

There is a hearing tomorrow in the Supreme Court.

Examination - s198B of
the Criminal Procedure
Act 2009

Daily Hearing List

Section 198B of the Criminal Procedure Act 2009 (Victoria) allows an accused person to apply for a court order to cross-examine a witness before the trial, under specific circumstances. This is often referred to as a "Basha hearing". The court must be satisfied that it's necessary to avoid a serious risk of unfairness at trial if the order isn't granted.

 

[Marg944]

There is a hearing tomorrow in the Supreme Court.

Examination - s198B of
the Criminal Procedure
Act 2009

Daily Hearing List

Section 198B of the Criminal Procedure Act 2009 (Victoria) allows an accused person to apply for a court order to cross-examine a witness before the trial, under specific circumstances. This is often referred to as a "Basha hearing". The court must be satisfied that it's necessary to avoid a serious risk of unfairness at trial if the order isn't granted.

I just like to see his name right underneath “Supreme Court”!

Daily Hearing List

The Daily Hearing List includes all matters scheduled to be heard in the Supreme Court of Victoria each day with times and courtrooms. It is available from 3:40pm, Monday to Friday, for the next sitting day with updates every 15 minutes until 6:30pm. It is updated again at 8:30am, 9:00am and...

www.supremecourt.vic.gov.au

 

[Trooper]

I just like to see his name right underneath “Supreme Court”!


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Daily Hearing List

The Daily Hearing List includes all matters scheduled to be heard in the Supreme Court of Victoria each day with times and courtrooms. It is available from 3:40pm, Monday to Friday, for the next sitting day with updates every 15 minutes until 6:30pm. It is updated again at 8:30am, 9:00am and...

www.supremecourt.vic.gov.au

Nice little twist going on here, Marg.. A Basha hearing is about wanting to cross examine a witness ( by the defence ) on the grounds of unfairness etc, before it goes to trial.

''''A Basha inquiry arises from the case of R v Basha (1989) 39 A Crim R 337, and as set out by Hamill J in the case of Qaumi (below), a Basha inquiry arises in situations where there is potential unfairness to an accused such as:

• Unserved statement/s of a witness;
• Ambiguity within the prosecution brief; and
• No committal hearing

The procedure is that a potential witness is called for cross-examination on a particular issue in the absence of the jury before potentially being called to give evidence before the jury. '''


Be very interesting to find out who this particular witness is, that Mr Stephenson and his barristers have taken such firm umbrage at!

If we go back, VICPOL put up 9 witnesses, I have to go back to check. but I think thats about right, .... among those are the techie chaps , who , in my opinion, hold some ace cards in this deck, hope it is not them!! wellllll we wait and see...

 

[fcavanaugh]

DBM. Wrong thread.