SC - Nine killed in Emanuel AME Church shooting, Charleston; Dylann Roof charged #2

[Wagara]

I am local and have raised my children in Charleston. I am originally from a midwestern town-where I am reading people spew ugliness and conspiracy towards this community. It is bizarre, they have never even been to this community-but want to spread a negative and hurtful message almost provoking confusion and paranoia.

I love this state and the people of this state for their strength and character. I am very glad to know the people in my community-and thank them all for their class and genuine kind hearts. When I have gone out into the community since this tragedy I feel kindred spirits and not hate brewing. We are joining with compassion for each other, not division. Just one of the many things that make South Carolina great!

JMO

I haven't spoken to anyone who who feels anything other than sorrow and pain at these murders and the lives lost. Seems to me there is disgust in some quarters that all heck hasn't broken loose. The local papers/TV stations are being accused of baiting for coverage. I guess no chaos is bad for the news business.

 

[Queen Bee]

Rev. Clementa Pinckney funeral arrangements set

COLUMBIA, S.C. (AP) -- Funeral plans have been made for South Carolina state Sen. Clementa Pinckney, one of nine victims in the shooting massacre at a Charleston church.

A Nov. 22, 2010 photo shows the Rev. Clementa Pinckney at Emanuel AME Church in Charleston, S.C.(Grace Beahm/The Post and Courier via AP)

http://www.abcnews4.com/story/29369832/rev-clementa-pinckney-funeral-arrangements-set

 

[katydid23]

I am pretty sure people could find examples of racism and violence all over the United States; they wouldn't need to wait until nine black people were massacred in a church. Saying that people are "secretly pleased" about a mass murder is insulting and disturbing. Apparently being outraged and realizing that this massacre shows that racism is still an issue in America means that you are "hooray!" about people being brutally murdered.

I'm pretty sure this case isn't sparking outrage and generating media attention because it fits the narrative that all Southerners are violent racists. Mass murders always get huge media attention, but I guess when the victims are black, there must be a different reason?

I am not sure why anyone would be "pleased" about this massacre considering it will change absolutely nothing.

I am NOT saying anyone is secretly pleased about the murders. I think you missed my sarcastic point. Which was that some seem to THINK southern whites feel that way. JMO

 

[katydid23]

I find your implication to be highly offensive. Can you show us one post here where the member is suggesting that Southern Whites are secretly pleased about these murders?

You would seem to be characterizing members you disagree with quite unfairly.

here is an example of what I am reacting to:


"There was nothing outrageous in his manifesto. These are comments I constantly see posted on the Internet, on mainstream websites. The obsession with "black on white" crime is a big one. His views are accepted by a large percentage of Americans."

 

[Montjoy]

I will backtrack a bit. I am exaggerating and being a bit flip. But there have been elements of some characterizing whites in the South as vile racists. JMO

Saying that there are some racists in South Carolina is not at all the same as "characterizing whites in the South as vile racists."

The way the whole line of discussion developed was that it was discovered that the shooter was racially motivated, and is a proud racist. Racism does not develop in a vacuum, nor is it natural. So the question is asked -- how did he come to accept these views? It has then been noted that there are a large number of hate groups per capita in South Carolina. Many who have lived there have also said that in their experience, there is no shortage of racists there. The flag is seen as a symbol of enduring racism by many, and it is embraced by many racists, so it has been mentioned as well.

But nowhere does any of this imply that "whites in the South are vile racists". Some are, but nobody is saying that everyone is.

And to suggest that people here think that some are 'secretly pleased' about the murders is, I think as eileenhawkeye put it, disturbing. I think that dismissing it as being 'a bit flip' is likewise disturbing.

JMO.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

It seems sarcasm is acceptable for some and not others. jmo

 

[mysteriew]

Are you serious? He was arrested on gun charges. So there certainly is evidence of that.

After Oklahoma City bombing, McVeigh's arrest almost went unnoticed

I've never read that he killed anyone with a gun, either in the Murray building or out. Could you point me to where I could read about that?

 

[Queen Bee]

I am NOT saying anyone is secretly pleased about the murders. I think you missed my sarcastic point. Which was that some seem to THINK southern whites feel that way. JMO

i'm southern, born and raised, and i'm white, and i'm utterly heartbroken and grieving that this would happen again within my lifetime........when will we stop killing one another for no other reason than hate? i dream of that day..........i pray for that day.......i hope my children live to see it for now i fear i won't and i already mourn the death of that hope i carried :rose:

 

[KaaBoom]

And the judge NEVER said no one should be concerned with the families of the victims. In fact, he made sure each and every family was allowed to have a member stand up and speak on national TV.

I think you are misrepresenting what the judge did and said. JMO

Charleston County Magistrate James Gosnell Jr told the court on Friday: 'We have victims - nine of them. But we also have victims on the other side. There are victims on this young man's side of the family.'

Outrage after Charleston judge tells relatives of murdered churchgoers that the killer's family are VICTIMS... as it is revealed he was once reprimanded for using the n-word in court

There is no evidence that any of his family members have been the victims of anything. The judge's bizarre comments are so far out of line, it's ridiculous. If you believe that any judge would come to the defense of a black suspect's family like that... :facepalm:

 

[KaaBoom]

Ok. Well the first one was being investigated as a prank and the second is related to Islamic extremism. Which I would personally put into a different category than the young solo attackers being talked about here. But that might be a whole other argument.

It's called, grasping at straws.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

I've never read that he killed anyone with a gun, either in the Murray building or out. Could you point me to where I could read about that?

I may be mistaken, but I think this is what KaaBoom was referencing (BBM):

As McVeigh reached into his rear pocket for his driver's license, his windbreaker tightened, and Hanger noticed the bulge of a shoulder holster under his left arm. McVeigh was wearing a loaded Glock pistol and had a 6-inch knife on his belt.

"My gun is loaded," Hanger recalled McVeigh telling him as Hanger grabbed the bulge under the jacket.

"So is mine," the trooper responded, putting his own gun to McVeigh's head before arresting him for unlawfully carrying a concealed weapon. If he hadn't spotted the bulge, he would have let McVeigh go with a ticket.

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-oklahoma-city-bombing-20150419-story.html#page=1

 

[mysteriew]

Did a public official (see: judge) ask for public sympathy for Wint's family? I am not sure why you are comparing Internet commentators with a judge. It actually makes me raise my eyebrows that you keep bring up this case (pointing out that a black man tortured four white people) in a thread about nine black people killed by a white man who wrote a racist manifesto saying why he did it. It is making me a bit uncomfortable as I am not seeing how the cases are similiar at all.

I cannot think of any judge asking for sympathy for a suspects family. But then I also cannot think think of any judge allowing family impact statements at a bond hearing either. That could actually be seen as prejucial since he allowed the family to discuss the impact of the crime before the guilt was determined.

 

[mysteriew]

I may be mistaken, but I think this is what KaaBoom was referencing (BBM):



http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-oklahoma-city-bombing-20150419-story.html#page=1

Oh so he didn't use a gun? He just owned a gun.

 

[Wagara]

Very true. And often certain cases 'resonate' because they fit certain narratives that people want to sell. And I feel like some people are doing so here with this case. Trying to sell the narrative that Southern Whites are racists ....enough said.

Not trying to sell...putting it in a bag and trying to give it away!

 

[KaaBoom]

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/15/world/asia/man-stabs-22-children-in-china.html?_r=0

BEIJING (AP) — A man wielding a knife wounded 22 children and one adult outside a primary school in central China as students were arriving for classes on Friday, the police said.

And not one of those children died. The exact same day that 26 died at Sandy Hook Elementary School.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Oh so he didn't use a gun? He just owned a gun.

You're right, of course. I deleted my post. I misunderstood the question. My apologies.

 

[katydid23]

Murder cases get a wide range of attention, sympathy, and outrage. Even when people deny it, it is clear that some cases (for whatever reason, the victim, how many there were, how they were killed) resonate with more people.

Also "Who cares about the manifesto?" Um....it tells us the motives of a mass murderer. I am not sure why you acting like it is irrevelent.

In some ways, imo, the manifesto is irrelevant.
Tonight, seven people were shot in Detroit, and seven more were shot in Philly. Random spree shootings. Does it matter if the killer wrote a manifesto before he began spraying the street with bullets?

You have to have HATE in your heart if you can open up on a crowd of people in a park and start shooting at them with an automatic weapon. JMO

 

[mysteriew]

ETA: It actually looks like I am not far off the mark. Here is someone saying that a large percentage of Americans are in agreement with Roofs violent diatribe.

This is what I hate! One person commits an act, makes a statement and suddenly he is the spokesman for every white person. He is not speaking for me! I decry what he did. I object to what he said. I believe he should be tried and if convicted should be subject to the laws of the state up to and including the death penalty. Is that enough or do I need to apolige because this person, a total stranger to me, a person that I do not agree with also happens to share my skin color?

 

[katydid23]

And not one of those children died. The exact same day that 26 died at Sandy Hook Elementary School.

But he still attacked them. And there have been killings in China by knife point. Not as many die, true. But there is violence in other countries. Guns or not, people find a way.

 

[katydid23]

I cannot think of any judge asking for sympathy for a suspects family. But then I also cannot think think of any judge allowing family impact statements at a bond hearing either. That could actually be seen as prejucial since he allowed the family to discuss the impact of the crime before the guilt was determined.

EXACTLY. The judge was getting ready to introduce the families of all of these victims who were brutally killed. So he took a quick second to include the killers family by saying they were being swept up in the tragedy as well, which is true. THEY TURNED HIM IN.