Scientists Warn of Melting Ice in Arctic

  • #21
I believe science. Especially scientists that are respected and that do good research. They spend many hours and years observing, making records and coming to conclusions. If alot of scientists concur, and they don't have some kind of personal agenda (like their report has to come out a certain way to please someone or their funders), then I tend to believe the research.

I think China and other industrial countries should have to join in with us on environmental initiatives or agreements - but since we lead the world and have more resources than many, we should be leading the world and setting down the plan to combat global warming and pollution.
 
  • #22
On a related note....

Death of the world's rivers
Disaster warning from UN as investigation reveals half of the planet's 500 biggest rivers are seriously depleted or polluted


The world's great rivers are drying up at an alarming rate, with devastating consequences for humanity, animals and the future of the planet.

The Independent on Sunday can today reveal that more than half the world's 500 mightiest rivers have been seriously depleted. Some have been reduced to a trickle in what the United Nations will this week warn is a "disaster in the making".

From the Nile to China's Yellow River, some of the world's great water systems are now under such pressure that they often fail to deposit their water in the ocean or are interrupted in the course to the sea, with grave consequences for the planet.

Adding to the disaster, all of the 20 longer rivers are being disrupted by big dams. One-fifth of all freshwater fish species either face extinction or are already extinct.

The Nile and Pakistan's Indus are greatly reduced by the time they reach the sea. Some, such as the Colorado and China's Yellow River, now rarely reach the ocean at all. Others, such as the Jordan and the Rio Grande on the US-Mexico border, are dry for much of their length.

Even in Britain, a quarter of the country's 160 chalk rivers and steams - such as the Kennet in Wiltshire, the Darent in Kent, and the Wylye in Wiltshire - are running out of water because too much is being abstracted for homes, industry and agriculture.

This week an influential UN report will officially warn the world's governments of an "alarming deterioration" in the planet's rivers, lakes and other freshwater systems. Klaus Toepfer, the executive director of the United Nations Environment Programme, told the IoS yesterday that the state of the world's rivers is "a disaster in the making".

The UN's triennial World Water Development Report, compiled for an international conference in Mexico City which opens on Thursday, warns that "we have hugely changed the natural order of rivers worldwide", mainly through giant dams and global warming. Some 45,000 big dams now block the world's rivers, trapping 15 per cent of all the water that used to flow from the land to the sea. Reservoirs now cover almost 1 per cent of land surface.

The UN report says that demand for them "will continue to increase", but recommends that they should be barred from the world's remaining, undammed "free-flowing" rivers.

The United States has dismantled 465 dams in recent years, mainly for environmental reasons. But last week, in an abrupt U-turn, it signalled that it was about to embark on its biggest dam-building campaign in decades, when the Washington State legislature passed a bill to allow the federal government to build a series of dams on the Columbia, the West's largest river.

Global warming is endangering even the rivers that have largely escaped damming.

The relatively untamed Amazon was hit by its most serious drought on record last autumn. And salmon are dying in Alaska's Yukon River - the world's longest undammed watercourse - because its waters are getting too hot.


http://news.independent.co.uk/environment/article350785.ece
 
  • #23
So are there some who will say the pollution of rivers is a natural occurence also?

"Earth in the Balance" - which way will we choose to go in the next decades? The earth, our children and grandchildrens' futures will be decided by our decisions and commitment to those decisions and sacrifices.
 
  • #24
Marthatex said:
I believe science. Especially scientists that are respected and that do good research. They spend many hours and years observing, making records and coming to conclusions. If alot of scientists concur, and they don't have some kind of personal agenda (like their report has to come out a certain way to please someone or their funders), then I tend to believe the research.

I think China and other industrial countries should have to join in with us on environmental initiatives or agreements - but since we lead the world and have more resources than many, we should be leading the world and setting down the plan to combat global warming and pollution.

http://www.sepp.org/NewSEPP/Medieval_Warm_period_and_Little_Ice_age.htm

http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache...medieval+warm+period&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=6


http://www.junkscience.com/news/robinson.htm
 
  • #25
...And some of them were fools

Who were making plans and thinking of the future
With the energy of the innocent
They were gathering the tools
They would need to make their journey back to nature

While the sand slipped through the opening
And their hands reached for the golden ring
With their hearts they turned to each other`s heart for refuge
In the troubled years that came before the deluge...

Jackson Browne
 
  • #26
Maybe So said:

Haven't checked all these sources, but the "Oregon Institute of Science & Medicine" would be dubious at best.

6 employees, only 1 paid - he's the owner, Dr. Robinson, used to be partners with Linus Pauling whose vitamin C theory was eventually debunked.

This group is known for their eccentric work.

Check out http://www.sourcewatch.org

And your first source is the Center for the Study of Carbon Dioxide and Global Change.

Yes, Exxon gave them $65,000 between 1998 and 2003. Wikipedia cites strong ties to the fossil fuels industry, in fact they are connected to "Greening Earth Society" which is a front group for a petroleum society.

These are the "scientists" President Bush listens to, I'm sure. We need to listen to scientists who are reputable and not working for special interests.
 
  • #27
Thanks for the background info, Marthatex. It is so important to "Know the source"!
 
  • #28
  • #29
  • #30
Miami, New Orleans Face Warming Threat

"One point stands out above all others, and that is that a modest global warming may put Earth in the danger zone for a major sea-level rise."

(CBS/AP) Low-lying communities like New Orleans and Miami could face increasing peril as melting polar ice raises the ocean to levels not seen in thousands of years. By the end of this century, Arctic temperatures could reach as high as 130,000 years ago, when the oceans were 13 to 20 feet higher than now, according to research appearing in Friday's issue of the journal Science.

Already changes are being seen in Greenland, where glaciers are sliding into the sea at an alarming rate, reports CBS correspondent Jerry Bowen. Most troubling, Bowen reports, is that the changes are caused by just a one- or two-degree increase. But, that's the difference between freezing and melting.

These melting glaciers are adding more water to the sea, Bowen reports, and sea levels are rising far faster and sooner than expected. According to another new study, every 40 hours, Greenland pours as much water into the ocean as Los Angeles uses in an entire year. And it is one more finding that has scientists recalculating the day when sea levels may threaten the world's coastal population centers.

That doesn't mean the water would rise 20 feet by 2100. It's more likely to be 3 feet or so, the researchers say. But it would launch a process that would continue for long after, and even three feet could affect populated areas around the planet and increase the potential damage from storms.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/03/23/tech/main1434479.shtml
 
  • #31
Polar shift: Melting ice, quakes and higher seas---Studies in Science say changes tied to warming are faster than expected

Greenland and Antarctica are seeing faster than expected warming that triggers glacial quakes and has the potential for a sharp rise in sea levels, according to three peer-reviewed studies published Thursday. Warming temperatures are causing glaciers the size of Manhattan to trigger quakes, and computer models indicate that by 2100 the poles could be as warm as they were 129,000 years ago — when melting ice sheets caused sea levels to rise up to 20 feet (6 meters) higher than today.

The studies didn’t predict how much sea levels might rise by 2100, but the work shows warming at a faster rate than estimated by the U.N. climate body, which expects up to a 34-inch (88-centimeter) rise by 2100.

The comparison to 130,000 years ago does not mean the researchers are predicting a 20-foot ocean rise, because the warming in ancient times was caused by changes in Earth’s tilt and orbit. But even small increases would still be enough to wipe out some islands and cause massive coastal changes around the world. “Although the focus of our work is polar, the implications are global,” Bette Otto-Bliesner, a National Center for Atmospheric Research scientist who co-wrote two of the studies, said in a statement. “These ice sheets have melted before, and sea levels rose. The warmth needed isn’t that much above present conditions.”

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11975255/
 
  • #32
Consider me the village idiot but I have a question. How much of global warming is natural? I know that our environment changes naturally. Afterall, we did have an ice age.

Before, I upset someone, I am concerned about the issue which is why I ask. I just haven't researched it.



JMHO
 
  • #33
tennessee said:
Consider me the village idiot but I have a question. How much of global warming is natural? I know that our environment changes naturally. Afterall, we did have an ice age.

Before, I upset someone, I am concerned about the issue which is why I ask. I just haven't researched it.



JMHO

http://www.geocraft.com/WVFossils/ice_ages.html

"Approximately 99.72% of the "greenhouse effect" is due to natural causes -- mostly water vapor and traces of other gases, which we can do nothing at all about. Eliminating human activity altogether would have little impact on climate change."


Yes global warming is occuring. Yes global warming will cause various global problems.

Yes pollution also needs to be stopped on all levels that we can put a stop to it ....in case anyone thought that just because I think global warming is natural that I was saying that pollution and emmissions are a-okay with me...they are not.

But can we stop global warming or are we to blame for global warming? I am of the opinion that it is gonna happen in cycles no matter what.

As you say we did have an ice age on the planet and it warmed up and the huge glasiers melted away without man's being to blame for that warm up. To believe that no other global warm ups are ever going to happen on their own just doesn't make sense to me.
 
  • #34
Marthatex said:
Haven't checked all these sources, but the "Oregon Institute of Science & Medicine" would be dubious at best.

6 employees, only 1 paid - he's the owner, Dr. Robinson, used to be partners with Linus Pauling whose vitamin C theory was eventually debunked.

This group is known for their eccentric work.

Check out http://www.sourcewatch.org

And your first source is the Center for the Study of Carbon Dioxide and Global Change.

Yes, Exxon gave them $65,000 between 1998 and 2003. Wikipedia cites strong ties to the fossil fuels industry, in fact they are connected to "Greening Earth Society" which is a front group for a petroleum society.

These are the "scientists" President Bush listens to, I'm sure. We need to listen to scientists who are reputable and not working for special interests.


Be very careful about Wikipedia. This is an online source that anyone can edit at any time. I have pulled things from it for my classes but no longer do. I was reading something to my class and the F word appeared. As I said, anyone can add to articles at any time. Anyone.

As for global warming, I find it very unlikely that we humans are the cause. Think how long this ole earth has been here. America wasn't even born until 1776! Industry and transportation via cars, planes, etc. are very new developments in the life of Mother Earth.


Eve
 
  • #35
michelle said:
This kind of stuff scares me. All i need to do now is watch "The day after tomorrow" and i will really be scared....:eek:
Do watch it.........;)
When it first came out, it wasn't a block buster hit...2 years ago this summer...
I saw it the first week.
However, it's turned into a very popular flick now......
 
  • #36
tennessee said:
Consider me the village idiot but I have a question. How much of global warming is natural? I know that our environment changes naturally. Afterall, we did have an ice age.

Before, I upset someone, I am concerned about the issue which is why I ask. I just haven't researched it.



JMHO
Not to worry, it's probably only a matter of life and death that we stop doing things to contribute to global warming. In other words, even if it is part of a climate change, we shouldn't be doing things geared towards seeing how fast we can accelerate the change.

All scientists/meteorologists, are all now very surprised at HOW FAST THE RATE OF CHANGE of global warming IS INCREASING. It is much faster than they had previously all theorized.
 
  • #37
I however am more concerned about Yellowstone volcanic eruption potential, IF it happens the prediction is that it will cover a 600 square mile radius which includes ME, with a thick layer of volcanic ash!

I am prepared to hop in my car and head waaaaay south of here, the minute I get the word. I have a Yellowstone alert that keeps me posted on activity.

About global warming, today I made the mistake of leaving my house in the heat of Friday evening commuter escapees. Car after car after car after car, in this rather small town, on what is usually a rather quiet street. I watched the people in the cars to size them up and try and figure out who they were and why they were burning up gas.

My mind became expansice while sitting there waiting for my TURN, about the entire world that is equipped with gas burning engines, going here and there with gay abandon making some 'special' people extremely wealthy.

I listen intently to the experts explain the technicalities and causes for global warming, they do sincerely believe what they are saying. Somehow I do believe that the natural order of things, has cared for the same concern for a very long time and handled it. BUT have we indeed reached a juncture where it will not be taken care of by natural order?

I do believe that I will not see it in my lifetime IF there is to be yet another disaster. The problem seems to be HOW to pre fix and solve it before it becomes crystal clear to all that doom is headed in our direction.

Life is a gift, and gifts can be costly.


.
 
  • #38
Buzzm1 said:
Not to worry, it's probably only a matter of life and death that we stop doing things to contribute to global warming. In other words, even if it is part of a climate change, we shouldn't be doing things geared towards seeing how fast we can accelerate the change.

All scientists/meteorologists, are all now very surprised at HOW FAST THE RATE OF CHANGE of global warming IS INCREASING. It is much faster than they had previously all theorized.

Well, I find that many people (not all) who believe that the USA or even just MAN in general is to blame for global warming still have their 2 cars (often gas guzzling SUVs), still heat their houses fossil fuels or burn wood in fireplaces etc, still live in houses made of primarily forest products and still own furniture also made from trees. Still own products that are produced through industries that pollute. Many people also earn their livings working for those companies or corporations that contribute to polluting the air or deforesting the planet........I don't know many who are willing to sacrifice their homes, their comforts, or their jobs to solve the problems....not many want to go back to walking or bicycling everywhere they go.

Actually I would love it if I was allowed to keep a horse in my backyard instead of using a car.....I'd go for that. I'd also be willing to drive an electric car or run my house with solar panels if I could afford such things. But I still don't think it would cool down the planet even if everyone switched over to such non polluting ways.
 
  • #39
If sea levels rise as some scientists predcit, then humans cannot stop it. The Earth is far more powerful in its natural ability than humans are, at least for now. Maybe in 10,000 years we'll be advanced enough to control weather, global warming, and quite possibly the strength of an entire star...but that's purely dreaming.

We may indeed be contributing to global warming, but we're not the cause. The Earth's orbit around the Sun, the Sun's orbit around the center of the Milky Way, the Sun's 11 year period of heating and cooling, the undulations of the Sun through the center 'plane' of orbit around the center of the galazy, all contribute far more to Global Warming than humans.

We are just here for the ride. Either worry about it until you can't take it anymore or grab a surfboard and hang 10.

:croc:
 
  • #40
Camper said:
I however am more concerned about Yellowstone volcanic eruption potential, IF it happens the prediction is that it will cover a 600 square mile radius which includes ME, with a thick layer of volcanic ash!

I am prepared to hop in my car and head waaaaay south of here, the minute I get the word. I have a Yellowstone alert that keeps me posted on activity.

About global warming, today I made the mistake of leaving my house in the heat of Friday evening commuter escapees. Car after car after car after car, in this rather small town, on what is usually a rather quiet street. I watched the people in the cars to size them up and try and figure out who they were and why they were burning up gas.

My mind became expansice while sitting there waiting for my TURN, about the entire world that is equipped with gas burning engines, going here and there with gay abandon making some 'special' people extremely wealthy.

I listen intently to the experts explain the technicalities and causes for global warming, they do sincerely believe what they are saying. Somehow I do believe that the natural order of things, has cared for the same concern for a very long time and handled it. BUT have we indeed reached a juncture where it will not be taken care of by natural order?

I do believe that I will not see it in my lifetime IF there is to be yet another disaster. The problem seems to be HOW to pre fix and solve it before it becomes crystal clear to all that doom is headed in our direction.

Life is a gift, and gifts can be costly.


.

Because of the high gas prices of the current time. Being told that it was because their is more demand than their is gas.... I too was looking about me one day at all the drivers in all the vehicles. I marvelled at the number of us running around in vehicles. Most of the vehicles, no matter how large, contained only one human occupant. I saw a Hummer, dozens of big extended cab pickups, dozens of 4X4 SUVs (that will never ever be taken into any type of off road setting) so many large vehicles carrying one guy or one gal to the grocery store or to work. I wondered how much gas would be save if people drove economical vehicles again. It seems like somewhere along the line many people stopped worrying about how many MPG they were getting and once again started buying vehicles as status symbols instead of as basic economic transportation. Lots of people I guess can afford to spend that kind of money for their gas but for us it is a hard ship. We no longer drive anywhere that we don't need to and most trips to town are made when they will take care of half a dozen errands rather than just one.

We do need to reduce the comsumption of gas whereever possible to both reduce the price and reduce pollution.
 

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
72
Guests online
2,316
Total visitors
2,388

Forum statistics

Threads
633,062
Messages
18,635,794
Members
243,395
Latest member
VeeTee(AU)
Back
Top