Shannan Gilbert Found, death declared an accident. #2

[fred&edna]

I don't understand why you are so blind as to not seeing that as a viable option. Can you explain to me then, why it is NOT in your eyes?

It's simple. The person is freezing... Nerves are misfiring, brain thoughts are confused and so forth. She very well may have taken her damn clothes off believing she was overheating. I don't see how this common sense, and proven factor is a definate NO to you.

Everything I've read about paradoxical undressing states that the victims' clothing appears as a "trail" (quite often it's this trail of clothing that leads searchers to their victims) OR the clothing is scattered nearby the victim.

Because SG's clothing was found neither trailing her nor surrounding her, I cannot accept this as an option.

Links:
RE: Trail of clothing:
http://www.forteantimes.com/strangedays/science/2806/cold_cases.html

http://books.google.com/books?id=qp...oxical undressing "trail of clothing"&f=false

http://books.google.com/books?id=9XzBLvhe3WoC&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q&f=false


Map showing the distance between where SG's body was found and where her belongings were found:
http://s296.beta.photobucket.com/us...rders -NY-/Shannan-map.png.html?sort=6&o=187

 

[fred&edna]

Something to keep in mind that might be helpful, member AmandaReckonwith maintains a comprehensive collection of related media going back to December 2010 in a Photobucket album. We can't copy and paste the images here, but we can post the image links.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

And some links can be found in the Media and News thread. If we're lucky, the posters snipped the key 10% of the articles.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

I wish there was a way to "search" AmandaReckonwith's photobucket album (there's so much useful stuff there). Maybe it's possible to do a search and I just don't know how to utilitize it?? If so, lemme' know!

 

[twocuriouscats]

So, MP doesn't stick around because he's a pimp and the police are coming. Duh. That's what I've always thought.
Why doesn't he leave town or at least go underground for awhile if he's so concerned about getting busted?
Instead he's available for interviews with press and a lie detector test with LE.
He had been there with SG for hours - they should have made good money.
Did he leave without the money? Because he didn't want to get busted? I'm opening my mind to other possibilities - MOO of course.

 

[WINDSOR]

So, MP doesn't stick around because he's a pimp and the police are coming. Duh. That's what I've always thought.
Why doesn't he leave town or at least go underground for awhile if he's so concerned about getting busted?
Instead he's available for interviews with press and a lie detector test with LE.
He had been there with SG for hours - they should have made good money.
Did he leave without the money? Because he didn't want to get busted? I'm opening my mind to other possibilities - MOO of course.

As I have focused on MP a lot as a POI, let me address your comments.

He does not stick around for a number possible reasons
a) he is a pimp
b) he is a convicted felon
c) he is breaking New York state laws by assiting and profiting from the sex trade.
d) he potentially has handled the SG 'problem' and has no need to stay in Oak Beach.
e) he has taken all SG's money
f) he has SG in his vehicle and he does not want LE to see her.

After his return to Oak Beach on May 3 and discussions with resident(s), he knows that SG and her where abouts will not be an issue. He has lots of time to dispose of any incriminating evidence in his vehicle, and has an explanation for any evidence of SG DNA in his vehicle.

By not acting guilty, doing interviews (but not saying anything of substance) he knows that suspision is not being cast upon him.

He hides behind the fact that SG was a friend and source of income and he genuinely tried to help her, protect her and look for her.

Since JB says he did not pay SG any money, MP did not get any money from SG.

If and this is a big if, if SG did not want to give MP his share of her earnings, that would have made MP very mad. Mad enough to hurt her. Hurt her bad enough to cause her death. Remember MP's friend and SG's 'boyfriend' AD, broke her jaw severly when she 'upset' him.


MOO

 

[Justiceforever]

I'm on the fence @SG. I believe that either she died accidently or that she was killed by MP.

Your post Windsor has me leaning in the MP as culprit direction again.

Then I read PBs post @ MP having to fold up his SUV and put it in his pocket in order to chase her into the marsh without being noticed and that too makes sense.

:banghead:

Your last post was VERY convincing!

 

[fred&edna]

I'm on the fence @SG. I believe that either she died accidently or that she was killed by MP.

Your post Windsor has me leaning in the MP as culprit direction again.

Then I read PBs post @ MP having to fold up his SUV and put it in his pocket in order to chase her into the marsh without being noticed and that too makes sense.

:banghead:

Your last post was VERY convincing!

It's confusing IF we believe that MP spoke to GColletti and then simply drove away as it has been suggested. However, here are 2 reports of MP following Shannan. (Following after her is NOT the same as simply driving away)

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18559_162-20078763.html
Here colletti says, "All of a sudden, she took off, out from under the boat
...And he took off after her. And I yelled to him to stop. And he didn't and he followed her around that way."

http://bayridgejournal.blogspot.com/2011/01/body-dump-at-gilgo-beach.html
Colletti reportedly saw Gilbert hiding under his boat, where Pak approached her. She ran off, with Pak following her.

 

[fred&edna]

Here is a yet a third link about MP following Shannan:

http://www.maxim.com/true-crime/long-island-murder-mystery

"Just then Shannan bolted out from under the boat and ran toward the water. The SUV took off after her. And that was the last time anyone saw Shannan Gilbert alive."

It would be great if someone wants to post 1 (or even 20 links) to support the suggestion that MP simply drove away... then we truly have more to be confused about.

 

[fred&edna]

Lets agree to disagree without being rude ok?

I'm sorry you found my post rude. It's an old quote about "having an open mind" that I always thought of as humorous.

 

[CriminalMinds]

PB,
I was recently reading about another sk (I believe one who I haven't seen you mention, but I haven't read all of your posts) who also was disposing his victim extremely close to another sk's spot. So, I must admit, as crazy as it sounds to a lot of us, it happens. A lot!

indeed----just like it would seem crazy for 2 sk's to lived at some point within like 2 miles of each other, but I believe that is what is was for SHULMAN/RIFKIN

 

[LINative13]

I surf. In the winter. On Long Island. In the Atlantic Ocean. I have been cold before.

When you surf in February, you get out of the water when the hypothermia gets bad. Its not unusual for a guy to ahve to get carried to his car because his legs are numb. The LAST thing the absolute LAST thing I would think about is taking off my clothes while outside. I take my westuit, clostes off when I get in my car and the heat is running and you are out of the wind. If you are in the bad hypothermia, the wind is the worst part. You will leave your clothes on to protect from the wind,

I have been surfing over between 2-5 decades. Not once have I seen a hypothermia stricken person take there clothes off unless it was to get by a heat vent in a car, to put on fresh dry clothes, or to get in front of a fire.

And hypothermia is a very normal thing when you surf in february. 100% of the people in the water have it in less than an hour. Usually the begining stages start in 15 minutes. After you ride a wave....you got ice on your face, icecyles in your beard.

 

[hawkshaw]

I'm sorry you found my post rude. It's an old quote about "having an open mind" that I always thought of as humorous.

Gee, I thought it was funny. Do you mind if I use that quote when the occasion arises?

 

[CriminalMinds]

Margaret Schilling. She was a patient in an Ohio mental asylum.

well done, F&E

 

[Justiceforever]

Margaret Schilling. She was a patient in an Ohio mental asylum.

So were Fred And Edna......here's the link...

http://woodstermangotwood.blogspot.com/2013/01/fred-edna.html?m=1

:floorlaugh:

Sorry I couldn't help myself!

I'm still on the fence @ whether SG death was an accident though.

 

[fred&edna]

Gee, I thought it was funny. Do you mind if I use that quote when the occasion arises?

Use it freely (But I suppose, wisely, so no hurt feelings!)


And, I'm glad you followed LINative's bread crumb trail and found your way back to the forum.

 

[fred&edna]

So were Fred And Edna...

http://woodstermangotwood.blogspot.com/2013/01/fred-edna.html?m=1

:floorlaugh:

Sorry I couldn't help myself!

I'm still on the fence @ whether SG death was an accident though.

Why are you sorry?! It's damn funny.
If it's mental and humorous it's most definitely Fred&Edna!


I know what you mean about the fence-sitting... I REALLY do.

 

[Justiceforever]

Why are you sorry?! It's damn funny.
If it's mental and humorous it's most definitely Fred&Edna!


I know what you mean about the fence-sitting... I REALLY do.

I was sorry for getting OT...It was just to good to pass up! :floorlaugh:

But yeah I have to seriously wonder @ MP for the reasons that Windsor spoke @ in her last post.

 

[WINDSOR]

I'm on the fence @SG. I believe that either she died accidently or that she was killed by MP.

Your post Windsor has me leaning in the MP as culprit direction again.

Then I read PBs post @ MP having to fold up his SUV and put it in his pocket in order to chase her into the marsh without being noticed and that too makes sense.

:banghead:

Your last post was VERY convincing!

It is my strong opinion that MP never chased or followed SG into the marsh. I do not believe SG ever entered the marsh alive. Her body was placed there.

MOO

 

[Justiceforever]

It is my strong opinion that MP never chased or followed SG into the marsh. I do not believe SG ever entered the marsh alive. Her body was placed there.

MOO

SIt's plausible that he grabbed her she fought him, he killed her before or after driving off., and then came back later to dump her.

I can see that happening.

 

[deedee21]

It is my strong opinion that MP never chased or followed SG into the marsh. I do not believe SG ever entered the marsh alive. Her body was placed there.

MOO

GC waited for LE at the front gate. I dont think MP parked his car and went into the marsh to chase her. He probably left right away. He knew the cops were on their way.

 

[Justiceforever]

GC waited for LE at the front gate. I dont think MP parked his car and went into the marsh to chase her. He probably left right away. He knew the cops were on their way.

So after grabbing her and driving out of Oakbeach, she's probably fighting him and as soon as he has the opportunity he pulls over and kills her, desperate maybe to calm her down before anymore attention is brought to him? Makes sense.