Shannan Gilbert Found, death declared an accident. #2

Status
Not open for further replies.
I'm planning to write more on Shannan Gilbert this time putting the crosshair on my second fav detective Mr. Varrone who happens to be Amber's neighbor down the corner.

Just for warming up.

Does Michael Pak report to Alex Diaz telling him about Shannan calling 911? No.
The next day Brewer and Diaz go to the PD to report her missing. Does Brewer tell Shannan Gilbert called 911? No.

According to Mr. Varrone these are not suspicious.

So, how does Det. Varrone know about the 911 call? Does he look at Shannan's phone records (since he claims they have taken the incident seriously) and sees the last activity as the 911 call? No. They discover it by chance. I'll get to that.


Emre, in al respect, please keep the info correct/precise.

Detective Dominick L Varrone is/was NOT a "neighbor" of Amber Lynn Costell.

Detective Dominick L Varrone is listed, among other addresses, at: A St, West Babylon, and that is 0.7 miles (3 min) by car from Amber Lynn Costello.

Amber lived at
1112 America Avenue, West Babylon, NY
 
EMRE, I think you know how much I love 'coincidences' when it comes to SCPD, but I don't think this qualifies as one. Amber and Chief Varrone have to live somewhere.

On the other hand this is a coincidence that is more than a coincidence - and this is a fact:

Police bring in a burglar known as Peter G. He agrees to cooperate against a crime ring operating with impunity in Suffolk County. The leader of that crime ring was Joe C. Joe C was the neighbor of now-Chief of Department James B. From 1998-2002 they both lived on the same block only 4 houses apart.

About 2 weeks after the cops debrief Peter G they bring him to the DA office. This is where Joe C's neighbor James B runs the investigations for the DA. Peter G is murdered only 3 weeks later.

On 4/28/02, someone tries to shoot and kill Joe C at his home. They miss. Joe C is brought into a grand jury where he tells the DA that later that day a 'neighbor' came to his house and told him some confidential information where the car the shooters used was dumped. The 'Neighbor' was also able to tell his neighbor when and where the car was stolen ( 12/15/01, Apex Lane, Coram, NY.

When Joe C was asked if he knew the 'neighbor's name and his address, Joe C simply answered "NO."

Do you think this is just a coincidence, or do you think there is something more to this?

Do you think the 'neighbor' could have known this unless he was a police officer with the authority to ask the investigating detectives what was going on in his neighborhood. Or is it just a coincidence.

Do you think it is just a coincidence the murder of Peter G is still unsolved, now 12 years later?

Do you think it is also a coincidence that the detective that was charged with investigating this murder is the same detective that wrote the "SG 911" letter to Newsday stating he heard the tape and did not believe SG exhibited any indications she believed her life was in peril?

Do you believe in Santa Claus? How about the Easter Bunny?

How many times can you say 'coincidence ' before you start believing these aren't coincidences at all?

REMEMBER this: These are the same people that are supposedly investigating the Gilgo Beach murders? Can they be trusted to do a thorough investigation if they find evidence they can't explain without exposing their friends, or the friends of the politicians that live at Oak Beach?
 
So why is the FBI running the AC4 investigation (seems like it from FBI arresting stallworth) but haven't been doing the same for the LISK case?
 
Do you think it is a coincidence that the same cop heading the Gilgo Beach case is the same cop that was proven to have had a long standing relationship with a street walker that he met while a sergeant in the 1st Pct. That she had 27 arrests at that time for prostitution, drugs, and larceny, and this cop who has been hailed as the "Starsky" of that precinct didn't know his girlfriend was a street walker? <modsnip>
 
Emre, in al respect, please keep the info correct/precise.

Detective Dominick L Varrone is/was NOT a "neighbor" of Amber Lynn Costell.

Detective Dominick L Varrone is listed, among other addresses, at: A St, West Babylon, and that is 0.7 miles (3 min) by car from Amber Lynn Costello.

Amber lived at
1112 America Avenue, West Babylon, NY

and Amber Lynn Costello, last seen on September 2nd, 2010 in West Babylon, right around the corner from where I live, in fact.


http://legis.suffolkcountyny.gov/clerk/cmeet/ps/2011/PS050511.pdf
 
EMRE, I think you know how much I love 'coincidences' when it comes to SCPD, but I don't think this qualifies as one. Amber and Chief Varrone have to live somewhere.

On the other hand this is a coincidence that is more than a coincidence - and this is a fact:

Police bring in a burglar known as Peter G. He agrees to cooperate against a crime ring operating with impunity in Suffolk County. The leader of that crime ring was Joe C. Joe C was the neighbor of now-Chief of Department James B. From 1998-2002 they both lived on the same block only 4 houses apart.

About 2 weeks after the cops debrief Peter G they bring him to the DA office. This is where Joe C's neighbor James B runs the investigations for the DA. Peter G is murdered only 3 weeks later.

On 4/28/02, someone tries to shoot and kill Joe C at his home. They miss. Joe C is brought into a grand jury where he tells the DA that later that day a 'neighbor' came to his house and told him some confidential information where the car the shooters used was dumped. The 'Neighbor' was also able to tell his neighbor when and where the car was stolen ( 12/15/01, Apex Lane, Coram, NY.

When Joe C was asked if he knew the 'neighbor's name and his address, Joe C simply answered "NO."

Do you think this is just a coincidence, or do you think there is something more to this?

Do you think the 'neighbor' could have known this unless he was a police officer with the authority to ask the investigating detectives what was going on in his neighborhood. Or is it just a coincidence.

Do you think it is just a coincidence the murder of Peter G is still unsolved, now 12 years later?

Do you think it is also a coincidence that the detective that was charged with investigating this murder is the same detective that wrote the "SG 911" letter to Newsday stating he heard the tape and did not believe SG exhibited any indications she believed her life was in peril?

Do you believe in Santa Claus? How about the Easter Bunny?

How many times can you say 'coincidence ' before you start believing these aren't coincidences at all?

REMEMBER this: These are the same people that are supposedly investigating the Gilgo Beach murders? Can they be trusted to do a thorough investigation if they find evidence they can't explain without exposing their friends, or the friends of the politicians that live at Oak Beach?


I do think it's a coincidence, of course I don't think Varrone has got anything to do with the killings, I just emphasize that part to express my disappointment as to how far away he is from comprehending the reality even when the danger hit so close to home.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ffjXdpV-to#t=1218

Watch the above and hear Mr. Varrone say about the killer

"I think finding his area perhaps caused him to stop"

And read Several Bags Of Body Parts Found Near Queens LIRR Tracks
http://gothamist.com/2014/04/14/several_bags_of_bones_found_near_qu.php

I don't know if Varrone's words are wishful thinking, or mere stupidity or irresponsibility but I do know there's no reason for LISK crew who are possibly in their mid 40s to stop. They will just lay low for a while and refine their method. The danger is extreme. I strongly believe that they are the same persons who killed Eve Brown. That is; these guys are capable of sexually assaulting a 5 month pregnant woman, murdering and dismembering her and tossing the body parts in a dumpster area.

Since you are a detective I recommend you to watch Mr. Varrone's body language in that video. Especially when he starts to talk about the hot points on the case. I never saw such a chatterer body.
 
Given the fact that this was a ‘softball’ interview it seemed to me that Chief Varrone was very uneasy in that Q & A.
Did he lie? He probably did, not because he is a dishonest person, but because in such investigations there are always screw-ups no matter how good the detectives are. It goes with the territory. To deceive or deflect the truth, I don’t believe that was his intention.
He mentioned that the supervisors (Lt.Petrofsky) and others were the best the SCPD had to offer. From everything I heard of the LT is he was exactly that: A seasoned professional. Keep in mind that it was LT.P that replaced Lt.Fitzpatrick after LT F’s detectives embarrassed him by not responding to the Lucero murder scene. These ‘dedicated’ detectives refused to respond because then-PC Dormer took away a 2 HR OT perk to one detective a night to be assigned to take a call should a homicide come in after hours. No detective on that early morning was allegedly at home to pick up the phone. If Dormer only did one thing right in his reign as PC, that one was it.
Lt.Petrofksy was such a ‘good’ detective supervisor, according to Varrone that when Bellone took office and put James Burke in as The Chief of Department, Petrofsky retired and replaced by Fitzpatrick! The word was that this was a forgone conclusion: When Bellone took over and he made Burke the Chief, Petrofsky was going to retire. He was on borrowed time from the day he took over his assignment.
What also troubled me about Varrone’s interview was he seemed to take great pains to describe his role in that investigation as not much more than an administrator. He had to marshal resources etc., not oversee the most important murder investigation in Suffolk County’s history. It seemed to me that Varrone was trying to distance himself from the nuts and bolts of the case.
In my experience in the NYPD no Chief of Detectives I ever knew would be second seat to an investigation of this magnitude. And this guy said he was reporting his information to Dormer. Remember that by this time Dormer was a lame duck commissioner who was going to be replaced the second Bellone took office.
What also troubled me is when Varrone said he had other matters to deal with, e.g. the politics of the case. POLITICS? Sure in a case like this there is always an element of politics but none that should concern the Chief of Detectives. What exactly was Varrone talking about?
Then he praised the detectives for extending the search after the first of the GB4’s body was found. What else was they supposed to do? Were they to wait for another body, in this case 3, then 5 more and found by an outside party.
When Varrone opined that when the body of SG was found it didn’t appear to look as though she was murdered? He said that even though the M.E. could not find a cause of death and claims to this day they don’t know how she died. How could you possibly say otherwise when you really don’t know how she died? How can you say that after you find 10 other bodies and say they were homicide victims that were prostitutes found not far from the scene and say SG probably died of exposure?
Keep in mind the GB4 appeared to be killed and dumped with a plan. The killer(s) killed them on an off-site, packed them up and dumped them. In SG’s case it appears if she was killed she was killed after running away from her killer(s). They killed her without time to plan for her disposal and let the body stay where it was.
 
Keep this in mind when considering the validity of this investigation. About a year or so earlier, Dormer took the unprecedented step of moving out two of his most important detective units out from under the umbrella of the Chief of Detectives, and moved directly under the command of his office: Major Crimes Bureau and Intelligence Bureau. I think the answer to that is very simple: He lost control of his own detective bureau and sent a message ( probably Spota) that he, the PC was in charge of his detectives, not Spota. In other words, Dormer didn't trust his own detectives.
 
Given the fact that this was a &#8216;softball&#8217; interview it seemed to me that Chief Varrone was very uneasy in that Q & A.
Did he lie? He probably did, not because he is a dishonest person, but because in such investigations there are always screw-ups no matter how good the detectives are. It goes with the territory. To deceive or deflect the truth, I don&#8217;t believe that was his intention.
He mentioned that the supervisors (Lt.Petrofsky) and others were the best the SCPD had to offer. From everything I heard of the LT is he was exactly that: A seasoned professional. Keep in mind that it was LT.P that replaced Lt.Fitzpatrick after LT F&#8217;s detectives embarrassed him by not responding to the Lucero murder scene. These &#8216;dedicated&#8217; detectives refused to respond because then-PC Dormer took away a 2 HR OT perk to one detective a night to be assigned to take a call should a homicide come in after hours. No detective on that early morning was allegedly at home to pick up the phone. If Dormer only did one thing right in his reign as PC, that one was it.
Lt.Petrofksy was such a &#8216;good&#8217; detective supervisor, according to Varrone that when Bellone took office and put James Burke in as The Chief of Department, Petrofsky retired and replaced by Fitzpatrick! The word was that this was a forgone conclusion: When Bellone took over and he made Burke the Chief, Petrofsky was going to retire. He was on borrowed time from the day he took over his assignment.
What also troubled me about Varrone&#8217;s interview was he seemed to take great pains to describe his role in that investigation as not much more than an administrator. He had to marshal resources etc., not oversee the most important murder investigation in Suffolk County&#8217;s history. It seemed to me that Varrone was trying to distance himself from the nuts and bolts of the case.
In my experience in the NYPD no Chief of Detectives I ever knew would be second seat to an investigation of this magnitude. And this guy said he was reporting his information to Dormer. Remember that by this time Dormer was a lame duck commissioner who was going to be replaced the second Bellone took office.
What also troubled me is when Varrone said he had other matters to deal with, e.g. the politics of the case. POLITICS? Sure in a case like this there is always an element of politics but none that should concern the Chief of Detectives. What exactly was Varrone talking about?
Then he praised the detectives for extending the search after the first of the GB4&#8217;s body was found. What else was they supposed to do? Were they to wait for another body, in this case 3, then 5 more and found by an outside party.
When Varrone opined that when the body of SG was found it didn&#8217;t appear to look as though she was murdered? He said that even though the M.E. could not find a cause of death and claims to this day they don&#8217;t know how she died. How could you possibly say otherwise when you really don&#8217;t know how she died? How can you say that after you find 10 other bodies and say they were homicide victims that were prostitutes found not far from the scene and say SG probably died of exposure?
Keep in mind the GB4 appeared to be killed and dumped with a plan. The killer(s) killed them on an off-site, packed them up and dumped them. In SG&#8217;s case it appears if she was killed she was killed after running away from her killer(s). They killed her without time to plan for her disposal and let the body stay where it was.

I knew your eyes would catch more than mine did. I never noticed that "politics" part and of course the significance of it.

Looking at a perspective from 2004-2010 there's really not much to blame on SCPD for the dump jobs. The truth is if they actually did what they say they did in Shannan Gilbert case and found her within a day or two and not discover the bodies on the beach, they could be deemed a quite well functioning PD. Of course if the perspective is expanded to cover the period before 2004, the picture changes quickly.

What they have trouble with is that they are trying to extract a success story from every aspect of the case, but the "success" of discovery of the first four bodies is in fact the result of their failure in Shannan's disappearance in the first place. If it wasn't for John Mallia to do the initial search in Oak Beach and then connecting that experience to his discovery on the side of Ocean Parkway there would be 11 bodies (at least) lying undiscovered.

Another detail is, Varrone says they responded Mrs. Brennan's call within 15 minutes or so and Shannan was on the phone with State Police for 21 minutes. If SCPD did their job by sending a police officer on the scene, where's the State Police?

Sometimes people/victims have only the power to dial 911 and they can't even speak, they still get emergency teams. I believe Shannan can't tell where she is because she simply doesn't know where she is, not because she's delusional, she's just mumbling the road signs she saw on the way.

Shannan's call is automatically directed to Suffolk County PSAP. The first mistake is the operator redirecting her to State Police. Remember, it's not Shannan preferring SC PSAP, it's the automated system, in other words the tower tells the operator that she is in their jurisdiction, and I'm pretty sure that the operator had a functioning locator on his/her desk as well.

What happens when Shannan is redirected to State Police? Another dial time, another phone pick up time, another introductory session... It all counts time. If she was facing a real danger, all these seconds would mean a lot. And remember her earring was found on Brewer's doorstep. It's not questioned how the earring fell off.

And 21 minutes of hustling and running and no State Police officer shows up at the scene. Is it perhaps they located Shannan and saw she was on Oak Beach?

Add to that; Varrone says they can hear Gus Coletti speaking to Shannan and calling the police. If Varrone can her Gus, that means the State Police could hear him too. Means, there's actually a situation that needs to be handled.

Finally, nobody including Varrone puts an official timeline of Shannan's last minutes, despite they have almost everything in hand, if they do it will be crystal clear that Pak's story is shaky. Nobody asks Peter Hackett how he got Mari Gilbert's phone number on May 1st?
 
I knew your eyes would catch more than mine did. I never noticed that "politics" part and of course the significance of it.
My eyes are no better than yours. Go back and read it next week, next month, or next year and you will probably see something you haven't seen before.
 
"LAYING LOW"

That is exactly what happened in the murder of Peter G on 9/3/03. He gets murdered outside of a car repair/tow/body shop that was a major drug distribution spot for the owner, Joe C (Burke's neighbor) and a black guy named Eddie. I have reason to believe this drug location was in operation for at least a few years before the murder. Peter G gets murdered and I have to assume that all goes quiet/LYING LOW. A couple of years ago the owner gets arrested for running a coke and gambling enterprise out of that same place.

The initial charges that seemed to disappear is the owner was charged with threatening his girlfriend to keep her mouth shut as to what he allegedly told her about the Peter G murder.

Talk about an example of LYING LOW. And why not because who is going to stop them as long as they stay within the boundaries. Maybe it is because the owner is related to a 'bigger fish' the FEDS want to send back to jail. They know who they are, and I know who they are.
 
I suspect many WS folks are from out-of-state and don't appreciate the undercurrents of what goes on in Suffolk County. There is another ongoing case that is very curious as to how the SCPD/DA is handling. In some ways I believe it mirrors the GILGO BEACH case.

A very questionable person gets shot outside of his home/business. The fellow is the subject of several corruption investigations. The cops have video footage of the shooting and the car the shooter used when fleeing the scene. The video was not released to the public until a couple of months ago when the shooting occurred in February.

DA Spota had the victim's hospital records sealed. DA Spota had a lawsuit sealed. The lawsuit was motive enough for someone to shoot the victim.

Lt.Fitzpatrick (remember him) seemed to be in charge of the investigation? The problem was there were other units involved in the 'investigation', including Intel and the DA detectives. Every one seemed to be reporting to someone else other than the person that was supposed to be heading the investigation: Fitzpatrick.
 
Are the Feds investigating Suffolk County corruption? If not, why?
 
I do think it's a coincidence, of course I don't think Varrone has got anything to do with the killings, I just emphasize that part to express my disappointment as to how far away he is from comprehending the reality even when the danger hit so close to home.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ffjXdpV-to#t=1218

Watch the above and hear Mr. Varrone say about the killer

"I think finding his area perhaps caused him to stop"

And read Several Bags Of Body Parts Found Near Queens LIRR Tracks
http://gothamist.com/2014/04/14/several_bags_of_bones_found_near_qu.php

I don't know if Varrone's words are wishful thinking, or mere stupidity or irresponsibility but I do know there's no reason for LISK crew who are possibly in their mid 40s to stop. They will just lay low for a while and refine their method. The danger is extreme. I strongly believe that they are the same persons who killed Eve Brown. That is; these guys are capable of sexually assaulting a 5 month pregnant woman, murdering and dismembering her and tossing the body parts in a dumpster area.

Since you are a detective I recommend you to watch Mr. Varrone's body language in that video. Especially when he starts to talk about the hot points on the case. I never saw such a chatterer body.

At about 40 mins into the youtube video, Varrone says the GB4 could have been tortured...rumors have floated around here (W/S) that the girls were held for awhile - or were dumped one place and then moved...going to start a new thread to discuss this; do we already have one?
 
At about 40 mins into the youtube video, Varrone says the GB4 could have been tortured...rumors have floated around here (W/S) that the girls were held for awhile - or were dumped one place and then moved...going to start a new thread to discuss this; do we already have one?

Sometimes people confess to crimes that they did not commit. For several reasons. A confessor may be a psychopath, may be a death row inmate in Texas or a hired individual to take on a crime to protect some major asses. That is why LE holds back specific information about the crime to distinguish a serial confessor from a serial killer. We, the public, do not need to know whether they are strangled, tortured.

But there are other things that I believe LE must share with public. Like the tattoo of Jane Doe 2000, or the "burlap" material [It could make sense they held this back in the beginning, but after three years it is clear that they can not take this lead to anywhere] or the sound recording of the calls to Sis Amanda. The calls are tapped. If there's an officer out there who forgot to record a call he is wiretapping then I have a special medal for him. Yes, I certainly believe those sound recordings do exist.

My all time favorite Police Chief is Richard LaMunyon of Wichita. (I'm serious this time) In the eighties he made the sound recording of BTK public. Unfortunately it did not generate a feedback. But when you listen to Dennis Rader on the court, you can clearly hear BTK is him. I'll try to find the exact links and add them to this post.

Why don't they make the recordings public?

Just one question, did Johnny Terry aka Blaze get any sentence for promoting prostitution? If not, why?

EDIT:
This is BTK
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPbU6R63YMI#t=575

This is Dennis Rader
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPbU6R63YMI#t=472
 
At about 40 mins into the youtube video, Varrone says the GB4 could have been tortured...rumors have floated around here (W/S) that the girls were held for awhile - or were dumped one place and then moved...going to start a new thread to discuss this; do we already have one?

I've always thought even a step beyond that...that the killer keeps the bodies before dumping. When Emre suggested we look at the route megan walked out of the hotel....right next to the hotel is an abco refrigeration co..they make refrigerated vans etc....i wonder if the killer used a refrigerated truck/van like what they make?
 
Plumbing/Refrigeration and private cab companies have long been fronts for criminal enterprises. John Gotti was in the 'plumbing business'. One of the most corrupting influences in Suffolk County has been in the cab business for many years now. Guess what else that fellow has been doing?

NOW GET A LOAD OF THIS: Guess whose mother has been in both businesses since her son was a little whippersnapper? Started her refrigeration business way back in 1968, and the address was a private house in Ozone Park. Trouble is when you do an extended search of the location is you can find no evidence of that person living there other than the business incorporated.

Don't you just love the way how one can take simple facts and turn them into a conspiracy? I can make that Chief look like he killed Jesus if I was given the time to do it.
 
Plumbing/Refrigeration and private cab companies have long been fronts for criminal enterprises. John Gotti was in the 'plumbing business'. One of the most corrupting influences in Suffolk County has been in the cab business for many years now. Guess what else that fellow has been doing?

NOW GET A LOAD OF THIS: Guess whose mother has been in both businesses since her son was a little whippersnapper? Started her refrigeration business way back in 1968, and the address was a private house in Ozone Park. Trouble is when you do an extended search of the location is you can find no evidence of that person living there other than the business incorporated.

Don't you just love the way how one can take simple facts and turn them into a conspiracy? I can make that Chief look like he killed Jesus if I was given the time to do it.

Oh, I love conspiracy but Linzi's freezer angle didn't really touch my inner Alex Jones.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Staff online

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
86
Guests online
846
Total visitors
932

Forum statistics

Threads
626,003
Messages
18,516,291
Members
240,904
Latest member
nexy9522
Back
Top