Small Details that are interesting in the Cooper Harris case, #1

[EvilSoup]

IMO, using words like toasted, cooked, baked, broiled etc...when referring to a baby is outrageous.

Which is why people who do this to their children are all the more odious.

Physiologically speaking, those terms are accurate. It is horrific.

Meanwhile, dad takes pics of his penis. Nice.

 

[DeDee]

Thank you for the correction. JRH was searching for age of consent laws in GA and not for surviving prison life.

What did he think would happen during those six minutes when he was avoiding LE who had asked him once to drop the call and come speak to them yet he chose to refuse? That is brazen behavior toward sworn officers during an emergency situation.

When JRH was asked the second time to drop his call, instead of complying, he cursed at the officer. Hence, his cell phone was taken away and he was placed into handcuffs and left alone in the back of a patrol car. Wouldn't he expect to be arrested if he refused to cooperate; or if he refused to obey orders from officers responding to an emergency regarding the hot car death of his son?

moo aatj

After conceding the issue of Ross Harris researching "life in prison", I remembered seeing several references to the same issue in earlier pages in the threads that had been discovered on [modsnip]'s Reddit acct.

Tonight, a few moments ago, Dr. Drew tweeted this:

Retweeted by Ben McRea

Dr. Drew ‏@DrDrewHLN · 18m
Justin Ross Harris allegedly searched "hot car death" and "how to survive in prison." #HotCarDeath

Just for clarification ~ moo

 

[EvilSoup]

I don't think anyone is saying he is not responsible, but some people think he did it on purpose and some don't.

Gotcha. So why does it matter if Cooper were buckled or unbuckled? How would that affect accident vs. intentional? RH and LE both acknowledge that Cooper WAS strapped in.

I know some folks believe it was an accident. That is fine. But I fail to see how the state of the buckling supports either theory.

Cooper died from being locked in a hot car. Would being unbuckled make it seem more accidental? Not seeing that, but often I don't "see" points until someone defines them, so I want to hear your theory on this.

 

[Kip]

Too bad that so many viewers, including myself, were deeply disturbed by the 30 seconds and this 30 seconds influenced my perception of RH's guilt.

Look, I don't like witnesses who play around with facts and treat them like they don't have an absolute relationship to reality. Time on a video camera is absolute- not relative. Common sense is not exaggerating on the witness stand. I, too, hope this prevails.

I was the opposite. To me, the 30 seconds is meaningless. There are just too many possible explanations for taking 30 seconds to get out of the car.

I felt the same about the "I was dreading looking at him comment."

If I were on the jury and those two facts were presented as evidence of guilt, I'd think the prosecution was really reaching and it would make me wonder about the strength of some of the other evidence.

 

[hopingicanhelp]

I guess if the cops actually saw CH fully buckled in his car seat, then the rest of the story makes absolutely no sense--the cops weren't there when it was reported that RH took CH out of his seat, laid him on the floor of the car, and then put him on the road/driveway. How would LE know CH was fully buckled? I just have a need to know which statements are based on fact and which statements are based on assumptions when it comes to LE testimony used to incarcerate and sentence people. Even if the CFA video showed RH putting CH into his car seat, does it give enough detail to show fully buckling the child? The seat was facing the rear--were the cameras at the back of the parking lot to give a full view of what was going on in the car? This is why I question "a unanimous statement from all sides"...because it's not logical.

Hey, EIO (hey, did you do that on purpose?) -- the ME will be able to testify to strap marks on CH's little body... outside of that, it's like this:

If RH didn't buckle him in this day, why not? Did he suddenly forget that? Did he have a reason.. if so, why?
If he intended for CH to roam the vehicle until death, then just... wow -- either he wanted him to "die trying" to get out or... who knows?

No... he either forgot CH like he states or it was premeditated -- either way, he made a POINT of telling LE that he strapped CH in "tight"; it was the wrong carseat; and in 7 hours NOTHING (CFA cup, daycare email, text with LH about "picking up my buddy") jogged his memory... nothing... and that's outside having found information about kids dying in hot cars and everything else that anyone can choose (or not) to consider viable evidence..

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

I've seen it stated repeatedly.
I'm looking for the actual source of the statistics. Thank you for the links, but they're not what I'm looking for. I was interested in the year the study was done, where, and under what conditions and methodology used.

I'm not implying you have a duty to find the original source. I'm simply curious and don't arbitrarily believe statistics unless I understand the source.

Where's the study?


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If you want to examine the data, one example of a query you can make is "studies on car seat safety".

Just an example of what's available for you:

www.nhtsa.gov/people/injury/research/ Resources: http://www.nhtsa.gov/people/injury/research/misuse/pages/5Refs.html

It seems much of this information is government or university-based.

 

[gngr~snap]

I am confused as to why some posters believe Cooper was not strapped in, and whether they think that Ross failed to buckle the straps or that Cooper unbuckled himself?? To my knowledge almost all of the toddlers who have died in hot cars were found strapped into their seats, so I'm not sure why this is so hard to believe. ???

I personally think that if Cooper were NOT buckled in, he would have laid down in an effort to get more comfortable rather than getting back into the car seat and dying there.

IMO that is the only reason we even have a story from Ross.
IMO the police asked him why the straps were so tight on Cooper. They saw the livor mortis. His skin would have been blanched pale where the straps were and it would have been obvious at that time as it doesn't just go away within minutes.
At that point there has to be a story.
A ridiculous one at that. Buckle him so thought and kiss him in case Cooper gets killed. Isn't that the whole point of the car seat ? A rear facing seat in the middle of the back seat? I mean we are talking a whole 1-2 mile drive from CFA to daycare.
Isn't it really more likely the Ross would die and Cooper would live to have the kiss memory?

It all hooey IMO

 

[SStarr33]

Gotcha. So why does it matter if Cooper were buckled or unbuckled? How would that affect accident vs. intentional? RH and LE both acknowledge that Cooper WAS strapped in.

I know some folks believe it was an accident. That is fine. But I fail to see how the state of the buckling supports either theory.

Cooper died from being locked in a hot car. Would being unbuckled make it seem more accidental? Not seeing that, but often I don't "see" points until someone defines them, so I want to hear your theory on this.

The only point is that we don't have the facts [modsnip]

 

[tlcya]

IMO, using words like toasted, cooked, baked, broiled etc...when referring to a baby is outrageous.

IMO slow roasting your child with some feeble "I forgot" is what is outrageous. But that's just me. We seem to be different like that.

 

[SStarr33]

IMO slow roasting your child with some feeble "I forgot" is what is outrageous. But that's just me. We seem to be different like that.

Add roasting to that list.

 

[Linda7NJ]

According to the detective's testimony, RH did call LH first, but got no answer. Hmmm, but based on what's been reported lately, how do we even know this is true?

Seems you're expecting someone to go back in a time machine to witness, record ...with no less than high definition cameras... from 5 angles, in full surround sound stereo.....

Sorry. Ain't happening. We must use common sense, logic and the evidence


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[Evie Ivy Over]

But how do you know if LH was referencing the question of "telling too much" regarding the car seat at all?
We don't know what she was referencing. Maybe she was just asking him in a general sense. Maybe she was referring to their insurance policy on CH? There's a lot of things she may have had in her mind when asking him that question but we don't know if it had anything to do with the car seat.

No one knows what she meant by that comment...the possibilities are endless. I would rather exhaust all the more "benign" explanations than to jump to demonic conclusions. That's all...

 

[hopingicanhelp]

According to the detective's testimony, RH did call LH first, but got no answer. Hmmm, but based on what's been reported lately, how do we even know this is true?

What we knew at PCH was what was available at the time --

Stoddard mentioned that some texts were not in RH's phone but appeared on other apps -- as though he deleted them from phone but they were continuing to generate & sync in other apps.... at the time of the PCH he was still waiting on phone records and other subpoenaed documents... all he could get was what was reflected on RH's phone (not yet deleted) at the time...

Which if you think about it -- defense atty brought up the text to LH re picking up his "buddy"... Stoddard hadn't seen it, ADMITTED it would be relevant to the case... WHY wasn't it on RH's phone? What was he hiding? Why didn't he volunteer THAT information to Stoddard during interview to research instead of waxing poetic on what a wonderful and protective father he was?

It the sum of the parts... and I've had bad encounters with LE just like you have, but I need to understand why you accept this AJC article as gospel while immediately discounting Stoddard... can ya break it down for me? TIA!

 

[Cinnamon]

i've been away for a couple of days, so I haven't caught up on the thread. Apparently, there's been discussion about 30-seconds vs 15-seconds (per the AJC article: Questions on police account of Harris case, Updated: 6:18 p.m. Friday, July 18, 2014 | Posted: 12:00 a.m. Saturday, July 19, 2014).

IMO, 30-seconds, 15-seconds, or 10-seconds, whatever, that is irrelevant to me!!! The article does not change my opinion of JRH's guilt. Quoting my own post on "That One Key Piece of Guilty Evidence" thread:

The prosecutor's words in his final testimony/closing for probable cause. Paraphrased, bbm:

"...Judge, one of the most important things you have is your common sense and reasoning. You have the pictures, you heard the detective, you see where that carseat is..."

(Prosecutor's closing starts at approx. 2:55:10) at link:
http://www.wildabouttrial.com/one_off/misc-courtroom-video-archive/

'Nuff said. Moo.

Original post: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ce-of-Guilty-Evidence&p=10763355#post10763355

For me, it is simple. ITA with the prosecutor, "common sense and reasoning". IMO, there is NO way anybody could sit in that tiny vehicle and NOT see or feel Cooper in his carseat. Moo.

 

[Lovejac]

"3 out of 4 Car Seats are Not Used Correctly"

http://blog.usa.gov/post/91059214885/three-out-of-four-car-seats-are-not-used-correctly

While I don't agree with parents who are not fastidious in the use of car seats for their children, I don't know if we're prepared to slap child abuse and neglect charges on all of these people....

I don't consider the car seat as a tool in a murder plot in this case.

But did any of those 3 out of 4 kids in those incorrectly used car seats wind up baking to death in a car? If so, then heavier charges than child abuse and neglect should be filed. JMO

 

[EvilSoup]

The only point is that we don't have the facts and people here, and possibly LE, are making things up.

Like I stated previously, I place my trust in LE and not a man who espouses his faith in God and marriage while sexting with underage girls. Which is a crime, btw.

Ross is a proven liar. I have no proof that Stoddard is one.

Logic says believe what is not only obvious, but what comes from a reputable source.

But we will apparently "agree to disagree". If you know what I mean. illowfight2:

 

[Lovejac]

I'm not putting a lot of stock in the fact that RH cursed the cops when they told him to get off the phone. Once, my car was hit from behind, and I was in the middle of a phone conversation with my son at the time the cops arrived at the scene. They literally screamed at me to get off the phone--vein popping, spitting, screaming at me to hang up the phone. All I was doing was letting my son know I was going to be late coming home from work because of the accident. If I were in a situation where my son was dead, I would probably have screamed obscenities at them, too...I still tell the story of how disrespectfully the cops talked to me that day, and that was at least 15 years ago.

I am so sorry the cops treated you that way. That was totally unfair.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

i've been away for a couple of days, so I haven't caught up on the thread. Apparently, there's been discussion about 30-seconds vs 15-seconds (per the brother's AJC article).

IMO, 30-seconds, 15-seconds, or 10-seconds, whatever, that is irrelevant to me!!! The article does not change my opinion of JRH's guilt. Quoting my own post on "That One Key Piece of Guilty Evidence" thread:


Original post: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ce-of-Guilty-Evidence&p=10763355#post10763355

For me, it is simple. ITA with the prosecutor, "common sense and reasoning". IMO, there is NO way anybody could sit in that tiny vehicle and NOT see or feel Cooper in his carseat. Moo.

BBM

The AJC article was not written by Ross's brother nor was it solely about his point of view. He is quoted in the article but saying it's "the brothers article" is not an accurate description in my opinion.

 

[Lovejac]

How does anyone know whether CH was actually strapped all the way in? Has that information been reported?

First I've heard of this! :scared: What did I miss? Can someone point me in the right direction?

 

[EvilSoup]

Add roasting to that list.

Yeah.

I don't have a list.

Not gonna add that to my non-existent list.

I just have this wall of lies and bad acting and the tip-of-the-iceberg physical evidence. And boy howdy. That's a whole lotta "nope" conscience. IMO.