South Africa - Martin, 55, Theresa, 54, Rudi van Breda, 22, murdered, 26 Jan 2015 #1

[L2L]

It occurs to me that there must be a number of people who could confirm the length of his hair at the time of the murder. Bianca for one. She went to the beach with him on the afternoon of the murders. Surely she would remember what he looked like. Can she be questioned over this now that she has appeared as a witness? The hair length arose after she had appeared. Also a neighbour's domestic worker who saw him sitting on the step of the house AS WELL AS the police and ambulance men who attended the murder scene.

Wouldn't the police have taken photos of HvB as soon as they were called after the murders as they did for OP. Nervous about Galloway's seeming reticence but hopefully she's just waiting to pounce. Desai gives me confidence that all will be right at the end!

 

[Interested Bystander]

Wouldn't the police have taken photos of HvB as soon as they were called after the murders as they did for OP. Nervous about Galloway's seeming reticence but hopefully she's just waiting to pounce. Desai gives me confidence that all will be right at the end!

I think they should have but it was the Defence Team's description of the length of his hair which did not add up and he was not arrested as far as I can make out but maybe they have. It is me being super suspicious. I would like to have seen the photo of him rather like we saw of OP and for it to be a notated image to ensure it showed when it was taken. He did see a doctor who thought his injuries were self inflicted so I guess there should be photos of his face as I think he had a couple of lumps there. Did the DT say the photo they showed in court was taken at the time or around the time?

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Thanks JJ and Estelle :tyou:

I'm as sure as OP shot Reeva that HvB is guilty. I'm a little fearful that he'll escape justice, he's a nasty piece of work and thinks he's so clever!
O knows what she heard and it was men arguing, 2 probably 3.

It's outrageous to think Martin would have a movie blaring loud fight scenes after 10 pm until 12 am, and on a MONDAY night, it wasn't a public holiday! Henri says he didn't hear an argument but how could he if he was watching a cinema experience of Star Trek 2?! As Tortoise posted, he wants it both ways, there was NO argument in his street on 26/27 Jan, 2015!

How convenient this happens on the night the Van Breda family is massacred! A couple of neighbours haven't lived there for a year and Mr Locke is elderly, so O stands alone having heard Martin and Rudi in their last moments alive. O asks why HvB didn't come to her for help? Million dollar question with the emphasis on the million dollars.

At least we the public can imagine what happened. There was a fierce dispute with HvB, he's a lazy so and so, would rather kill his family then get his act together!! He has a side that is rarely seen and only his closest family have witnessed it, and they're gone except for Marli. It's a scary thought should he start his own family and they defy him.

No wonder Janine Philander was wasting time, she thought it was a prank call. I owe her an apology for my scathing remarks about her inefficiency. HvB is a classic psychopath and couldn't mask his glee in making his fantasy come true, erasing his family. I hope Judge Desai sees him for what he is and can picture correctly how that night played out. (All my opinion)

 

[L2L]

Just thinking out loud...SA law hypothetical! What if a prosecution team doesn't satisfy a SA judge that they have provided sufficient evidence for him, the judge, (no jury in SA) to give a verdict of guilty, but he truly believes in his own mind that the accused is guilty, does he have to go by evidence provided & let the accused go or can he rule guilty solely based on what he thinks happened? Hope what I'm trying to say is clear!

 

[JudgeJudi]

I don’t put too much store in HvB not going to a neighbour for help. OP didn’t either, although he said he screamed from the balcony.

OH was an excellent witness, but we don’t know yet if there are others. There were a number of ear witnesses in OP, but in the end they didn’t assist the State due to the fact that there was a totally inept judge. Ear witnesses are all well and good, but any evidence, circumstantial or otherwise that doesn’t require inferences to be drawn will be more powerful.

Legally, all forensic evidence including DNA analysis, fingerprints etc. fall under the category of circumstantial evidence and only serve as partial proof of a criminal act.

The evidence doesn’t need to prove that HvB is absolutely guilty or guilty beyond question, but rather that there are no other logical explanations from the facts that anyone other that he could have committed the crime.

Judge Desai is absolutely across this trial and I very much doubt the tactics employed by Botha and Combrink will impress him. He’ll see them for what they are.

If HvB is found guilty, we all know what will happen next.

 

[JudgeJudi]

Day 13

Today's live news feed

The audio of Henri's call to emergency services is expected to be played in court today.

http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/live-van-breda-murder-trial-day-13-20170517

 

[PrimeSuspect]

I don’t put too much store in HvB not going to a neighbour for help. OP didn’t either, although he said he screamed from the balcony.

OH was an excellent witness, but we don’t know yet if there are others. There were a number of ear witnesses in OP, but in the end they didn’t assist the State due to the fact that there was a totally inept judge. Ear witnesses are all well and good, but any evidence, circumstantial or otherwise that doesn’t require inferences to be drawn will be more powerful.

Legally, all forensic evidence including DNA analysis, fingerprints etc. fall under the category of circumstantial evidence and only serve as partial proof of a criminal act.

The evidence doesn’t need to prove that HvB is absolutely guilty or guilty beyond question, but rather that there are no other logical explanations from the facts that anyone other that he could have committed the crime.

Judge Desai is absolutely across this trial and I very much doubt the tactics employed by Botha and Combrink will impress him. He’ll see them for what they are.

If HvB is found guilty, we all know what will happen next.

Mental health assessment? He has ptsd, depression, affluenza?

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Anthony Molyneaux‏ @AJGMolyneaux 21s21 seconds ago

welcome back to the triple axe murder trial. Henri is assisting with setting up speakers for emergency telephone call. @TimesLIVE



Tammy Petersen‏ @TammyPetersen87 3m3 minutes ago

Emergency call recordings are expected to be played in the Henri #VanBreda triple murder trial today. He is helping to set up the projector.

(HvB such a helpful lad! :facepalm: )

 

[JudgeJudi]

Emergency call recordings are expected to be played in the Henri #VanBreda triple murder trial today. He is helping to set up the projector.

http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/Ne...ay-13-20170517

 

[JudgeJudi]

No prime, appeals, all the way to the ConCourt if necessary.

 

[Estelle]

Star Trek 2 Into the Darkness

[video]https://yesmovies.to/movie/star-trek-into-darkness-1662/487614-8/watching.html[/video]

 

[JudgeJudi]

O/T but for the OP trial followers, here's the latest on Nel:

Bulldog’ Nel a bully buster

http://www.heraldlive.co.za/news/2017/05/17/bulldog-nel-bully-buster/

 

[Estelle]

Good summary of Van Breda Trial Day 12 – neighbour heard “shouting and arguing” - with some new comments of interest:

http://www.capetownetc.com/news/van...-heard-shouting-arguing/#sthash.B7cFWoRX.dpuf

 

[JudgeJudi]

Tracey Stewart‏ @Traceyams · 23s24 seconds ago

Judge Desai has arrived in court proceedings to begin

 

[JudgeJudi]

First clip is being played.

More technical issues.

Clip being played.

"I need an ambulance"

Gives address. Provides telephone number.

ER: Someone else can speak for you if you can't.

Henri: No, no it's fine.

http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/Ne...ay-13-20170517

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Anthony Molyneaux‏ @AJGMolyneaux 7m7 minutes ago @TimesLIVE

we are listening to the recording. Henri phones in and says he needs an ambulance. ER Philander asks where he needs an ambulance..Henri says 12 Goske Str. ER: what's your number?
Pause
ER: Someone else can speak for you if you can't.
Henri: no, no it's fine
Henri sounds out of breath when he starts call.

Henri: there's no one else in the house.
ER: I need contact number
Henri gives number
Henri repeats address. Henri sounds rushed but explaining clearly.
ER struggles with picking up address.
Henri says he's not sure how much more specific he needs to be.
ER picks up an address that's not correct.
Henri: please just send a couple of ambulances to that address then.
Henri is now trying to explain landmarks for ER to pick up his address.
He says Jamestown is a neighbouring suburb.
Henri: a man attacked my whole family. My sister is moving. I don't think rest are alive.


(interesting, HvB knew Marli was still alive)

 

[JudgeJudi]

Trouble as address is picked up in Milnerton. Henri sounds flustered.

He asks for an ambulance please be sent - "more than one ambulance".

Henri sounds uncertain when giving directions to the house. Identifies the R44, a nearby mall, a garage.

ER: Who is injured?

Henri: I think everyone. Everyone - four people. Three adults and one teenage girl.

[Why didn't he say his entire family! It sounds like he's talking about strangers]

Henri: A man attacked my whole family. My sister is moving. I don't think the rest are alive.

They have head injuries. I don't think they're conscious.

They ran away, family was attacked with an axe. I think I blacked out, I have just woken up.

http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/Ne...ay-13-20170517

 

[Estelle]

Anthony Molyneaux‏ @AJGMolyneaux 2m2 minutes ago

#vanbreda we are listening to the recording. Henri phones in and says he needs an ambulance. ER Philander asks where he needs an ambulance..

#vanbreda ..Henri says 12 Goske Str. ER: what's your number?
Pause
ER: Someone else can speak for you if you can't.
Henri: no, no it's fine

#vanbreda Henri sounds out of breath when he starts call.

#vanbreda Henri: there's no one else in the house.
ER: I need contact number
Henri gives number
Henri repeats address.

#vanbreda Henri sounds rushed but explaining clearly.
ER struggles with picking up address.
Henri says he's not sure how much more specific

#vanbreda he needs to be.
ER picks up an address that's not correct.
Henri: please just send a couple of ambulances to that address then.

#vanbreda Henri is now trying to explain landmarks for ER to pick up his address.
He says Jamestown is a neighbouring suburb.

#vanbreda Henri: a man attacked my whole family. My sister is moving. I don't think rest are alive.

#vanbreda Henri:I think they were attacked with an axe.I blacked out and only woke up now.Henri sounds troubled. Clear but sense of urgency.

#vanbreda Henri now begins to cry in court. More than ever before in this trial.

#vanbreda The ER person asks him to stay on line. The recording ends.

 

[Estelle]

Prime, you can do Anthony's tweets if you like.

 

[PrimeSuspect]

So HvB says in this recording, as in his statement, that he was unconscious (blacked out) for nearly 4 hours?! This has surely been tested by medical doctors. He was sitting with his dog at the doorstep, he didn't need immediate medical attention, one would expect head injuries or severe blood loss to go into a semi-coma for 4 hours?!

Could HvB have threatened Marli while she lay dying? HvB knew Marli didn't see him because he attacked her from behind?