South Africa - Martin, 55, Theresa, 54, Rudi van Breda, 22, murdered, 26 Jan 2015 #3

[Interested Bystander]

Maybe! :blushing: She was running the show, which was interesting.

She certainly did that. She has what I call a "little girl voice" and reminds me of someone called Sandra Dickinson in her younger days but I don't doubt, in any way, that she is very knowledgeable. I hope she can stand up to the rather rude Botha.

 

[JudgeJudi]

I wonder what is going on. Henri thrown in the towel - Nah!

Is it just me who thought Otto was a little bit flirty on the stand?

It's a huge day in SA as they're having a vote of no confidence in President Zuma in parliament and massive marches are taking place. Maybe we should have one in Oz re our PM. It's a worldwide phenomenon ... people don't trust their pollies any more.

 

[Tortoise]

While we wait! Did anyone notice how HvB kept rolling something (a pencil?) through his right hand fingers for much of the testimony? Reminded me of Humphrey Bogart in his memorable performance as the paranoid Capt. Queeg in The Caine Mutiny where he continually rolled 2 metal balls together during his court martial!

Yes I saw that. I didn't see a pencil, just his right hand fingers constantly moving. Even while he was drinking from a water bottle with his left hand.

 

[L2L]

Yes I saw that. I didn't see a pencil, just his right hand fingers constantly moving. Even while he was drinking from a water bottle with his left hand.

At one stage I think I saw something shiny in his hand.

 

[Tortoise]

The thing I find confusing is the DNA found in the shower. Otto said blood is more resistant to soaps than other DNA sources, but I had been led to believe that unless a certain type of bleach is used it is virtually impossible to remove traces of blood. What did we hear about luminol testing? If the luminol test didn't give a positive result Botha will probably argue it wasn't blood.

 

[Tortoise]

It's started

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isanK_92al4&feature=youtu.be

sound seems poor

 

[Tortoise]

Combrink cross examining

They have sound problems

 

[JudgeJudi]

The thing I find confusing is the DNA found in the shower. Otto said blood is more resistant to soaps than other DNA sources, but I had been led to believe that unless a certain type of bleach is used it is virtually impossible to remove traces of blood. What did we hear about luminol testing? If the luminol test didn't give a positive result Botha will probably argue it wasn't blood.

This will explain more.

http://www.exploreforensics.co.uk/detecting-evidence-after-bleaching.html

 

[JudgeJudi]

Sharlene Otto is soooo relaxed in court. I doubt Botha will ruffle her feathers at all.

 

[PrimeSuspect]

https://twitter.com/Traceyams

Adv Combrink is cross-examining Otto this morning, focus on SOP's- Standard Operating Procedures

Otto: SOP tell's you what to do step by step, troubleshooting guidance. If you follow those steps you will get usable result if process is not followed the result will not be used

Otto: Changes in set up at laboratory do occur in these cases we will need to write up a deviation- we note a deviation occurred

Combrink: when dealing with SOP wrt an admin aspect you cannot deviate but if it is identified and amended it won't cause negation

Otto: I hear what you saying but its difficult to speak M'Lord. I am the end user, getting a result that has been through process if I get an all clear from that sample I have no reason to believe SOP's have not been followed

Combrink: I understand if SOP has not been followed that exhibit will be negated

 

[JudgeJudi]

Tammy Petersen ‎@TammyPetersen87

Henri #VanBreda looks over at chief forensic analyst Lt Col Sharlene Otto who's expected to be cross examined today. Court start at 11:30.

http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/N...secutor-as-van-breda-trial-continues-20170808

 

[PrimeSuspect]

https://twitter.com/Traceyams

Otto: I will go so far as to say, considering chain of custody, if we receive exhibit not properly sealed we will not analyze it

Combrink: if I am a sloppy analyst and deal with barcoded tube and put it in my pocket and take it home-accidentally Next morning I bring it back and remember it in my pocket hand it over,it still has the barcode on it but chain of custody broken?

Otto agrees that would be a break in the chain. Admin SOP's extremely important there is always possibility of contamination which is why we have SOPs in place to follow

Combrink: is there a reason you only follows certain aspects of standards?

Otto: Iso standards have clauses and measurability where population genetics are not dealt with

Combrink :how can you determine if the SOP's have been followed? U said you are the end user, you don't analyze or isolate yourself

Otto: I am not present in lab during analysis but because SOP's put control measures and checks in place we know that as the sample moves through the process, quite a bit of control measures will be put in place, then we accept that this is a usable result because this sample has passed all the control and quality guidelines

 

[JudgeJudi]

Advocate Matthys Combrink to cross examine.

Combrink asks if SOPs not followed, that exhibit will not be tested? Otto says SOPs is like a user manual. If you dont follow steps correctly, the result will not be usable.

If SOP procedure not followed, do you note it? Combrink asks. Otto says should it happen that due to work pressure of change in set up, usually a deviation is written to that SOP, and once signed and dated, they work accordingly.

http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/N...secutor-as-van-breda-trial-continues-20170808

 

[JudgeJudi]

Otto says SOPs are intricate, should one of the things not be there, doesn't mean result is invalid.

Chain of custody being questioned. If SOP not followed, its a big problem and will be negated, Combrink asks. Otto says should an unsealed exhibit be received, it won't be analysed.

Otto says she isn't present in lab when analysis takes place. But because SOPs put control measures and checks in place, they know that as that sample moves through the process, control measures and guidelines in place to allow a result as sample passed all other controls and quality guidelines.

http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/N...secutor-as-van-breda-trial-continues-20170808

 

[JudgeJudi]

Henri looks like he's twiddling with a ring in his fingers.

 

[PrimeSuspect]

https://twitter.com/Traceyams

Combrink: But how do you know whether SOP's followed? Lets say there was contamination, lab assistant didnt wear gloves?

Otto: then I would pick up his DNA? Combrink, lets say there wasn't enough DNA

Combrink's expert interrupts him. Desai asks about personnel data.

Otto says every person entering is loaded onto that database with out chemistry being so sensitive if you don't work gloves with help of the examination database we would register issue do a corrective action

Combrink: if you don't see eliminations, surely that whole batch needs to be negated

Otto: thats what happens in the lab, we have no control over what happens to those samples before the lab so if something like that is picked up in the lab, it must go.

Desai-do you check the footage regularly? Otto: we do

 

[JudgeJudi]

Combrink asks if person wasn't wearing gloves, would it still be included (even if corrective measures taken)? Otto says if it's not picked up by supervisors or cameras, and find a breach, none of the samples will then be used.

The batch will then be redone, Otto confirms.

If there is a problem, they can go back to check the footage. One can check the way the analyst handled the sample.

So if SOP not followed, result has to be discarded? Yes, Otto says.

http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/N...secutor-as-van-breda-trial-continues-20170808

 

[PrimeSuspect]

haha, Sharlene Otto is putting it to Combrink, come up with a scenario, he's beating around the bush. He's an annoying little prat! She's such a delight to watch, loves her job!

 

[JudgeJudi]

Otto says it depends on the seriousness of the breach. If pixels aren't correct, data analysis still perfect, still have a result.

Only way she picks up if SOPs not followed, there is a failure in negative or positive control, samples switched, contamination, Otto will be able to pick it up.

If it's picked up, then the result can't be used and test has to be redone.

Otto says if there had been a non-conformance registered and corrective action applied and redone, there is no reason why final result can't be used.

http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/N...secutor-as-van-breda-trial-continues-20170808

 

[Interested Bystander]

So the lab is not accredited. I see where he is going now.