South Africa - Martin, 55, Theresa, 54, Rudi Van Breda, 22, Murdered, 26 Jan 2015 #5

[Fluffykins]

Van Breda moved from Pollsmoor to Drakenstein prison

 

[Tortoise]

It's interesting, this business of denial and enabling. I'm thinking more of the uncles, particularly Martin's brothers here. I think it is common for families to not only deny, or see clear evidence objectively and all the lies, (think Oscar Pistorius and Christopher Panayiotou) but perhaps it's more than that - perhaps it's an innate sense of shame and failure that they ignored the warning signs and felt responsible for shaping the child.

In the case of Chris Porco his mother who had severe axe injuries to her head but was still miraculously responsive when the ambulance crew arrived, shook her head no when the detective asked her if it was her oldest son and nodded her head yes when he asked her if it was Chris. Yet after her recovery she became a hostile witness to the prosecution and denied that Chris would ever do such a thing. Fortunately they had other evidence, traffic cameras, that showed Chris driving there in his yellow Jeep at 2am and leaving again to drive back to his college just after 4am. He is so much like Henri, I watched a few of his prison interviews on youtube last night, he still maintains his innocence and says the police pinned it on him and never investigated anyone else. His mother is his biggest supporter and it makes me feel quite sick to see her hugging him, that she can't see through his act.

With Henri's girlfriend, my impression is that she was attracted to him because she has problems of her own. Outcasts or oddballs together kind of thing.

 

[Christelle]

I never feel a sense of finality after murderers are convicted. There's always lingering questions. Especially cases involving children murdering parents/siblings, or vice versa. A moment of anger can turn into a lifetime of regret.

 

[JudgeJudi]

HvB had been detained in the hospital section of Pollsmoor since his conviction two weeks ago. He will now be in the general population section at Drakenstein.

“Henri van Breda is a maximum offender and he will be assessed and sent to the appropriate institution at Drakenstein correctional facility,” says Delekile Klaas from the Correctional Services Department.

Henri van Breda moved from Pollsmoor to Drakenstein prison

Published in March: It houses medium A, Medium B and Maximum prisoners.
https://www.westerncape.gov.za/facility/drakenstein-correctional-services

Also published in March:

Drakenstein Medium B Prison- Paarl is one of SA’s worst prisons, coming in at No. 7. It’s a “working prison” situated in Paarl. Even though it’s surrounded by mountains and vineyards, the prison is rife with violence and it detains some of the most dangerous gang members in the Cape.

More notably the Numbers Gangs – the 26s, 27s and 28s (Cape Town’s most dangerous gangs). The Numbers Gang/ the Numbers Gangs (associated with different numbers in different prisons) is a prison gang with one of the most fearsome reputations in South Africa.

https://www.tyi.co.za/news/international/9-of-the-worst-prisons-in-sa/

[I’ve included publication date as some of the info on the internet is very outdated]

 

[Fluffykins]

Wow, JJ - it sounds like Henri is in for a rough time of it. I've just been googling Drakenstein Prison and read a few articles, none particularly pertinent or recent but ... wow ... it sounds like you'd be better off with the overcrowding at Pollsmoor than the violence at Drakenstein. I'm almost - but not quite - tempted to wish him good luck.

 

[JudgeJudi]

Wow, JJ - it sounds like Henri is in for a rough time of it. I've just been googling Drakenstein Prison and read a few articles, none particularly pertinent or recent but ... wow ... it sounds like you'd be better off with the overcrowding at Pollsmoor than the violence at Drakenstein. I'm almost - but not quite - tempted to wish him good luck.

Pollsmoor is SA's most notorious prison and is one of the most dangerous prisons in the world, with the Numbers Gang basically running the prison, and diseases spreading easily due to overcrowding is just one of the many problems this prison faces.

Go to the last link in my post above and watch the video. It's incredible.

 

[JudgeJudi]

O/T Anthony Bourdain committed suicide by hanging in his hotel room in Paris.

https://pagesix.com/2018/06/08/anthony-bourdain-dies-of-suicide-at-61/

 

[JudgeJudi]

It's always nice to have an answer from a real expert, unlike Kelly Phelps - none other than James Grant (from those who remember him from OP's appeals)

James Grant (@JamesGrantZA) | Twitter
#VanBreda must serve only 25 years before he becoming eligible for parole. Any sentence in addition to a single life sentence (where eligibility for parole arises at 25 years) must run concurrently with the first life sentence. (Correctional Services Act (s39(2))



Neo Lichaba @NeoLichaba28
Replying to @JamesGrantZA

So the maximum time, anyone can spend in a South African jail is 25 years? Pending the approval of their parole application, of course.

James Grant (@JamesGrantZA) | Twitter
Excellent question - no, a judge may sentence a person to longer, say, 30 years per count, and order that each sentence must run consecutively. The problem arises in respect of "life" sentences - because, as far as I am aware, someone can only die once.

 

[patCee]

I couldn't find the video on Pollsmoor Prison on JJ's link so went to YouTube.

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[JudgeJudi]

I couldn't find the video on Pollsmoor Prison on JJ's link so went to YouTube.

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It's definitely there patCee. It's the last link in #869 entitled 9 of the Worst Prisons in SA. You have to scroll a long way down to the very end and it is the same YouTube video you have above.

 

[L2L]

Pollsmoor is SA's most notorious prison and is one of the most dangerous prisons in the world, with the Numbers Gang basically running the prison, and diseases spreading easily due to overcrowding is just one of the many problems this prison faces.

Go to the last link in my post above and watch the video. It's incredible.

That's the scariest thing I've ever watched. No idea anything like that level of gang crime existed - both in and out of prison! Thanks for posting, JJ.

 

[patCee]

It's definitely there patCee. It's the last link in #869 entitled 9 of the Worst Prisons in SA. You have to scroll a long way down to the very end and it is the same YouTube video you have above.

Doh! I've found it now, didn't scroll to the end of the page.

 

[Estelle]

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[JudgeJudi]

That was most interesting Estelle. What an excellent rehabilitation programme. The food looked delicious and very nicely presented. Somehow I don't ever see HvB being let loose in a kitchen with knives and cleavers. I'm hoping he's never released back into society again. He doesn't deserve any chances for what he's done.

 

[Estelle]

However, HvB had cooking lessons after the murders so perhaps Botha suggested that his experience is needed at Drakenstein and that will be part of his rehabilitation program. LOL

But it would be a great risk to put him in the kitchen, wouldn't it?

 

[Estelle]

Tourists can visit Drakenstein Prison.

See History at what is now Drakenstein Prison in the FranschhoekValley
The Drakenstein Prison was where Nelson Mandela was being held when he was finally released. It is still a working prison, which is why it is somewhat ironic to see ATMs outside the gates. The road from the main gate into the prison is now paved. Mandela famously walked down that road in 1990 arm in arm with his then wife Winnie. It was a red dirt road then, and the couple were followed by men in suits, some other released prisoners, and some officials. The world's media stood outside the gates, and on that spot now is an extremely good statue of Mandiba. It is very moving to stand on that spot, and remember that momentous occasion.

Groot Drakenstein Prison (Victor Verster Prison), Paarl

 

[JudgeJudi]

The inmates who serve in the restaurant and work in the kitchen are all low security prisoners. With 3 life sentences + 15 years, HvB would have a snowflake's chance in hell of ever working in those surroundings. I don't believe he would ever be categorised as a low risk prisoner. As no motive is known, it would be fair to say that no-one could ever predict what might set him off again on a murderous rampage. How can you rehabilitate a person when you're unaware of their problem.

He met Danielle at the cooking school a year after the murders. He tends not to complete anything he starts, to wit university, the murders (with Marli surviving), and the culinary course (both he and Danielle dropped out). I consider him to be an extremely dangerous person, and probably a psychopath. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he stays there much longer than we expect. I'll never know but I can certainly hope.

 

[Jennifer17]

The inmates who serve in the restaurant and work in the kitchen are all low security prisoners. With 3 life sentences + 15 years, HvB would have a snowflake's chance in hell of ever working in those surroundings. I don't believe he would ever be categorised as a low risk prisoner. As no motive is known, it would be fair to say that no-one could ever predict what might set him off again on a murderous rampage. How can you rehabilitate a person when you're unaware of their problem.

He met Danielle at the cooking school a year after the murders. He tends not to complete anything he starts, to wit university, the murders (with Marli surviving), and the culinary course (both he and Danielle dropped out). I consider him to be an extremely dangerous person, and probably a psychopath. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he stays there much longer than we expect. I'll never know but I can certainly hope.

I remain convinced that he did not want to wait for his inheritance and thought that he deserved it all. To me, that motive is clear. He did not want to work or even study, he wanted it all to live a life of leisure and Danielle was there for the free ride too.

 

[Fluffykins]

I would really like to know who will decide whether HvB will be granted leave to appeal. Is it Judge Desai, or a panel, or what? If it is Judge Desai, I wouldn't be at all surprised if he didn't allow it. Like the man said, it's inescapable that Henri murdered (most of) his family, and I don't think he should be allowed to squander any more of Marli's inheritance on an appeal that is doomed to fail.

 

[Tortoise]

I remain convinced that he did not want to wait for his inheritance and thought that he deserved it all. To me, that motive is clear. He did not want to work or even study, he wanted it all to live a life of leisure and Danielle was there for the free ride too.

That suggests advance planning IMO, (I mean before the night in question) and I really don't think anyone would plan a murder like that, where they are left at the crime scene virtually unscathed during an axe rampage, with no signs of a burglary even. The argument and the murders taking place 3 to 4 hours later tells us this was a reaction. It may be that Teresa and Marli weren't involved in the argument, but I think by the time he decided to carry out this massacre he had already determined that he would leave no witnesses alive. I also think he left Marli to bleed out as long as possible before calling emergency services and did not expect her to survive.