Found Deceased Spain - Esther Dingley, from UK, missing in the Pyrenees, November 2020 #1

[Grouse]

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I didn't get the impression money was a major worry for them. The BBC article said they managed on a combination of savings, renting out their house and casual work and that they acknowledged they were in a fortunate position to be able to do that. They bought decent hiking gear, and they were planning on upgrading the campervan again (although I gather campervans don't usually depreciate much in value if looked after) Our Motorhome | Esther & Dan - Adventuring Together - Life, Love, Health & Travel

From reading their background info on their website About Us | Esther & Dan - Adventuring Together - Life, Love, Health & Travel they weren't extravagant, they were savers by nature, and had worked and saved hard for 10 years. Depending on their incomes that could have been a sizeable amount to fall back on if you are frugal with it.

 

[Grouse]

Yes absolutely 100% certain same place and time, same sunlight directions when you break the photo directions down. We are relying on him though for the 22nd don't forget. SM shows the 21st she posted. He said she whatsapped a photo on the 22nd, yet the photo's were all on facebook and Insta on the 21st, he is admin on the facebook page too so he will have definitely known of the posts.

On Insta, you can only post 10 photos per post done at one time, on FB you can post a lot more photos on one post at one time. No doubt she'll have taken 50 selfies at the top, she seems to be constantly taking photos for some reason when you scroll through the 1,000's of photos she has uploaded all over the place.

Seems crazy keen on living a SM life but doesnt appear to be sponsored by equipment nor does she promote any goods so as far as her being an influencer type to make a living out of all this, she probably doesnt earn a penny. Instagram don't pay people with 5k followers to upload a bunch of photographs.

<modsnip: Not victim friendly>

That's possibly very significant. So basically the photo that was Whatsapp'd to Dan on 22nd and cited as her last location/timeframe, was possibly actually taken and posted on 21st?( I'm not on instagram so not been able to see it), yet there are supposedly witness statements that she was on that peak on 22nd?

Looking back through the Facebook posts again it's very striking to me that Esther posted every day (except one, 12th November) from the first post she made about being in the Pyrenees, made on 7th November, up until the 19th when she mentioned the male hiker. After that there are only posts that look like they were made by Dan. I don't see any from Esther on facebook on 21st.

Another thing I've noticed that's a bit odd (but probably nothing) is that loads of the photos are actually mirror images (as seen by logos on her bike, and the osprey logo on her rucksack).

Edit: realising now that these discrepancies of photo dates and message times could of course also be if someone has else her phone. Could have gone up the mountain on sunday and sent saturday's picture?

 

[Grouse]

Just took a better look at this photo https://www.facebook.com/estheranddan/photos/pcb.1475330215997689/1475329269331117 and I can see now not just the person in the distance, but what also appears to be a person in the foreground (was obscured before by the banner at the bottom of the screen when I wasn't signed in to Facebook) , dark blue waterproof with hood up and looking at a phone or tablet, maybe photographing something on the ground.

 

[Normal Norm]

I could be reading too much into Esther's recent Facebook posts, but I get the impression that all is not well with her at the moment. Could it be that she needs a break from her current lifestyle and / or relationship? Let's hope that her disappearance is nothing more than that, and that she turns up safe and sound in her own time.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

 

[Grouse]

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It looks as though their lives were about to change anyway, guess that will have had a bearing on how they were feeling - "from 1st January 2021, UK citizens will only be able to stay for 90 days in every 180 days in the Schengen Area. " according to Motorhoming in Europe After Brexit

 

[Zoomy]

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The other thing that sprung to mind at the beginning was an injury or attack by a wild animal. Brown bears were introduced to the central Pyrenees in the early 2000's and there are apparently now 60, although no attacks on humans have ever been reported. Or possibly a Deer could have charged at her, and I have just read a blog by an expert hiker of the Pyrenees who said the Chamoise are known to sometimes jump off the side of the paths and could be a possible danger to hikers. ED had also posted photos on facebook of what appear to be animal tracks, and she has questioned what animal had left them, and has mentioned a brown bear. It wouldn't surprise me at all if she were hoping to see one!

 

[hitthenick]

That's possibly very significant. So basically the photo that was Whatsapp'd to Dan on 22nd and cited as her last location/timeframe, was possibly actually taken and posted on 21st?( I'm not on instagram so not been able to see it), yet there are supposedly witness statements that she was on that peak on 22nd?

Looking back through the Facebook posts again it's very striking to me that Esther posted every day (except one, 12th November) from the first post she made about being in the Pyrenees, made on 7th November, up until the 19th when she mentioned the male hiker. After that there are only posts that look like they were made by Dan. I don't see any from Esther on facebook on 21st.

Another thing I've noticed that's a bit odd (but probably nothing) is that loads of the photos are actually mirror images (as seen by logos on her bike, and the osprey logo on her rucksack).

Edit: realising now that these discrepancies of photo dates and message times could of course also be if someone has else her phone. Could have gone up the mountain on sunday and sent saturday's picture?

Yes Grouse. The photo was taken together with all the others at the pic de sauvegarde summit at the same time. Studying the mountains and the directions she is pointing to and the sunglasses reflections coupled with cloud formations and ground etc, it's taken with the others.

She posted them all on media on 21/11 except that photo she sent him which ( allegedly ) he received the day after on the 22/11 - I am not sure I believe that she sent it on the 22nd nor do I believe she climbed the same mountain, wearing the same kit and taking more pictures on the 22/11 and coincidentally, the cloud formations etc were the very same as the day before - impossible!!

You mention someone else having her phone - I can definitely see that as a possibility - then this person sent the photo to DC on " behalf " of Esther. Seems a tad far fetched but stranger things have happened.

I'd like to know for definite he received the picture on his phone on that day (22nd ) from Esther's phone and I am sure that aspect will be investigated/confirmed quite sharpish. If it is true that he did get it on 22/11, could it have been someone else using her phone who sent it - we may never know this answer by the way. It would be interesting if his movements were triangulated too.

 

[RickshawFan]

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I have snipped the above paragraph from the longer post for focus.

One of my biggest concerns in ED's recent writing is how much she talks herself into doing things she feels very uncomfortable doing, "pushing the limits", going "beyond her comfort zone", persuading herself minute by minute to do something her being is screaming at her, "That's a VERY bad idea".
This is a cliché idea that a person should be deliberately going "beyond their comfort zone", especially when it's not an inch beyond their current limits, but miles.
What seems to be lost on ED is that very often our beings know what's best. There are very intelligent reasons for our beings to call us back from going over the edge; it's called self-preservation. "Going beyond your comfort zone" to walk into wild places with winter coming on, otherwise deserted by COVID, risking hypothermia on a moment-to-moment basis, with high potential for an accident in and of itself.... That's not "going beyond one's comfort zone". It's crazy.

 

[RickshawFan]

It's a common backpack, I posted a photo of it, discontinued model now. Exos 58 it is. They have one each. His black and green, hers is grey and red. Various other colourways are/were available.

A photo for you

I remembered it clearly last night. That model was so hideous, no one wanted to buy it, lol.
ED's is also fitted onto her butt muscles instead of clamped on her hip bones. This may account for her moving slowly (she says she's a slow poke, which may be self-effacing drivel, but may be for real). In the old days, packs were designed to sit on those muscles, but not for the last 15 years or so, because the old method impeded walking.

 

[Grouse]

Yes Grouse. The photo was taken together with all the others at the pic de sauvegarde summit at the same time. Studying the mountains and the directions she is pointing to and the sunglasses reflections coupled with cloud formations and ground etc, it's taken with the others.

She posted them all on media on 21/11 except that photo she sent him which ( allegedly ) he received the day after on the 22/11 - I am not sure I believe that she sent it on the 22nd nor do I believe she climbed the same mountain, wearing the same kit and taking more pictures on the 22/11 and coincidentally, the cloud formations etc were the very same as the day before - impossible!!

You mention someone else having her phone - I can definitely see that as a possibility - then this person sent the photo to DC on " behalf " of Esther. Seems a tad far fetched but stranger things have happened.

I'd like to know for definite he received the picture on his phone on that day (22nd ) from Esther's phone and I am sure that aspect will be investigated/confirmed quite sharpish. If it is true that he did get it on 22/11, could it have been someone else using her phone who sent it - we may never know this answer by the way. It would be interesting if his movements were triangulated too.

@hitthenick this has a potentially massive bearing on things, given that we are being told in the news she sent it to him at around 17:00 on 22/11/20. Was there anything else posted with the pictures on 21st, any accompanying text?

Key questions here are

1) confirmation as you say that he received the picture on 22nd

2) any exif data in the photo itself to prove when it was taken (I think that data gets removed by whatsapp though but there may be options if Facebook were to co-operate?)

3) those witnesses that saw her on the top of Pic Sauvegarde - did they get the day wrong? Were there witnesses from 21st up there?

4) I read somewhere that they determined her phone was there at that time (data and gps) and was then turned to airplane mode - if that is the case it seems very suspicious in light of these pictures, could have been someone else with her phone

 

[RickshawFan]

Esther revealed the existence of the man in a Facebook post on November 19, saying they met by chance at the peak of a mountain, before hiking down together.

She said she had accepted a lift from the man back to her camper van, which was later found abandoned in the Spanish town of Benasque.

The meeting happened just three days before Esther was last seen, and police believe the man may hold vital clues about what happened to her.

She wrote: 'It was the first time I'd seen anyone else for almost two days and as this kind fellow hiker took some photos the weather blew in...

'I had the option of staying at a great caban, even had a mattress, but it was only 2pm or going down with my fellow hiker and getting a lift.

'He'd take me further up the valley so I could continue my planned tour to another refuge, or back to the camper.

"There will be more days in the hills!" I said to the little part of me that didn't want to go back just yet.

'This was about making it easy on myself. It would be warm and sunny back at the camper and here was someone willing to take me...
Police investigating missing Esther Dingley 'are seeking a man who gave the solo hiker a lift' | Daily Mail Online

Could this FB entry have been written by someone else?
What does ED's story look like if we take the "I met a fellow hiker who gave me a lift" anecdote out?

 

[astheworldfallsdown]

Could this FB entry have been written by someone else?
What does ED's story look like if we take the "I met a fellow hiker who gave me a lift" anecdote out?

Possibly no fellow hiker at all? JMO

 

[Mimi in London]

Does anyone know a way of viewing the BBC Breakfast interview with DC again, now it has been deleted from iPlayer?

 

[Sillybilly]

Please do not speculate about the victim's mental health.

There is nothing to substantiate such speculation and it has certainly not been expressed as a concern by law enforcement or others who know her.

 

[Seni]

Intensa búsqueda de la excursionista britanica desaparecida en el Pirineo


Translated snippet:


“The Olympic skier Martí Vigo del Arco, and a friend with whom he ascended Salvaguardia on Sunday 22, could be the last people who saw Esther, 37 years old. “It would be around three in the afternoon and we were already going down, she was going up, heavily loaded, with a very large backpack. We stopped and she asked if we had a piece of fruit or something fresh, but we had nothing left. She kept going up, the temperature was good and it was sunny. There was very little snow on the top ”, Vigo del Arco details by phone.


The athlete calculates that she (Esther( would have around an hour and 20 minutes to reach the peak of Salvaguardia and points out that at that time in the afternoon all the people were descending, that he did not see anyone else uphill”.

 

[Andreee]

Esther revealed the existence of the man in a Facebook post on November 19, saying they met by chance at the peak of a mountain, before hiking down together.

She said she had accepted a lift from the man back to her camper van, which was later found abandoned in the Spanish town of Benasque.

The meeting happened just three days before Esther was last seen, and police believe the man may hold vital clues about what happened to her.

She wrote: 'It was the first time I'd seen anyone else for almost two days and as this kind fellow hiker took some photos the weather blew in...

'I had the option of staying at a great caban, even had a mattress, but it was only 2pm or going down with my fellow hiker and getting a lift.

'He'd take me further up the valley so I could continue my planned tour to another refuge, or back to the camper.

"There will be more days in the hills!" I said to the little part of me that didn't want to go back just yet.

'This was about making it easy on myself. It would be warm and sunny back at the camper and here was someone willing to take me...
Police investigating missing Esther Dingley 'are seeking a man who gave the solo hiker a lift' | Daily Mail Online

Just took a better look at this photo https://www.facebook.com/estheranddan/photos/pcb.1475330215997689/1475329269331117 and I can see now not just the person in the distance, but what also appears to be a person in the foreground (was obscured before by the banner at the bottom of the screen when I wasn't signed in to Facebook) , dark blue waterproof with hood up and looking at a phone or tablet, maybe photographing something on the ground.

and person taking the photo? or tripod camera.

 

[PommyMommy]

I think this may have been discussed but I wanted to bring the video here for anyone who hasn't seen it. (Posting with a mod's permission as it is not MSM.)

NOV 11, 2020
Wadham couple Esther Dingley and Dan Colegate describe why they are #WadhamProud this Wadham GivingDay2020

 

[astheworldfallsdown]

Intensa búsqueda de la excursionista britanica desaparecida en el Pirineo


Translated snippet:


“The Olympic skier Martí Vigo del Arco, and a friend with whom he ascended Salvaguardia on Sunday 22, could be the last people who saw Esther, 37 years old. “It would be around three in the afternoon and we were already going down, she was going up, heavily loaded, with a very large backpack. We stopped and she asked if we had a piece of fruit or something fresh, but we had nothing left. She kept going up, the temperature was good and it was sunny. There was very little snow on the top ”, Vigo del Arco details by phone.


The athlete calculates that she (Esther( would have around an hour and 20 minutes to reach the peak of Salvaguardia and points out that at that time in the afternoon all the people were descending, that he did not see anyone else uphill”.

Did she have no food with her that she had to ask for fruit or something fresh? Is it odd to be heading uphill at that hour when it would be heading for dark?

 

[Auntie_Seagull]

Intensa búsqueda de la excursionista britanica desaparecida en el Pirineo


Translated snippet:


“The Olympic skier Martí Vigo del Arco, and a friend with whom he ascended Salvaguardia on Sunday 22, could be the last people who saw Esther, 37 years old. “It would be around three in the afternoon and we were already going down, she was going up, heavily loaded, with a very large backpack. We stopped and she asked if we had a piece of fruit or something fresh, but we had nothing left. She kept going up, the temperature was good and it was sunny. There was very little snow on the top ”, Vigo del Arco details by phone.


The athlete calculates that she (Esther( would have around an hour and 20 minutes to reach the peak of Salvaguardia and points out that at that time in the afternoon all the people were descending, that he did not see anyone else uphill”.

It seems Esther summited really late, at around 4:20 pm. The sunset was at 5:30 pm and remember that in the valleys it gets dark before the sun finally sets. Taking it all into consideration there is no way Esther was able to get down before it got dark. I have to say that, not to blame her, of course, that I start to doubt in her experience. I mean summiting in late afternoon and hauling a huge, heavy backpack for a relatively short trip are rookie mistakes. Anyway, her descending from Salvaguardia in darkness makes a fall, or getting off the trail a giant possibility.