Stain in Trunk May Show Outline of Child**REVISIT FOR READING*

[OneLostGrl]

I've always wondered where that sense of urgency was to find her from July 3 until the KC was actually confronted. Where did those weeks go? Is CA really that SCARED of KC that she let up for weeks? Must have been a pretty good game of hide-n-seek. JMO.

I keep thinking about the text she sent Casey something like "big problem, call me!" right before she decided to call LE.

 

[Clock's Tickin]

ITA!!! I fully believe either George or Cindy or both cleaned the hell out of that car. I'm not sold on the theory of George disposing of the body but I am certain they cleaned and vacuumed that car! Not to mention, Casey probably took a lazy little stab at cleaning, too. Thus the paper towels with evidence of human decomp.

KCs lazy stab may have even involved one of those side of the road car washes. It always bothered me that she made such a deal of ppointing out to TL where she had his car washed on the way home from the airport.

 

[Jolynna]

IIRC, someone (either LE or one of the forensic experts on TV) commented early on that the car / trunk had been remarkably clean, as if someone had recently cleaned it.

If George had had a chance to detail before July 15, there would not have been residue remaining to fester and reek. George also would have thrown away the bag of stinky (from the wadded up, maggot infested paper towels), fly-ridden trash in the trunk.

I don't doubt that George cleaned the car sometime between when George got it home on July 15 and when LE confiscated it.

jmo

 

[Jolynna]

Well, Cindy says she had Zenaida's phone number at home- wonder why she didn't call her?

Cindy did call RM's phone number once during the 31 days. The call was very quick.

I think Cindy thought she was calling Zenaida and when a guy answered..."oops".

I don't remember the thread where this phone call was discussed. But, the consensus was that Cindy was probably trying to find Zenaida then.

 

[Searchfortruth]

I asked this on the wrong thread will try again here. Last night on some CNN show I heard that a picture was not taken of the shape of a child's body in Casey's trunk. Sorry if this has been asked and answered before...but, is there such a picture ?

 

[Jolynna]

Well, something also transpired on or around July 3rd to make her send lee out to find KC as well.

Cindy had that week off. She expected to spend most of it with Caylee. She probably especially wanted to spend July 4th (Firework Day) with Caylee. That was the longest Cindy and Caylee had ever been apart.

jmo

 

[Jolynna]

I keep thinking about the text she sent Casey something like "big problem, call me!" right before she decided to call LE.

Cindy just found out KC's car wasn't in Jacksonville like KC said. It was going to cost a lot of money to get the car from the towyard. Most parents would consider that a problem.

This happened before Cindy tracked down KC or talked to Amy. Cindy hadn't found out that Caylee wasn't WITH KC yet. Cindy called LE after she found KC without Caylee. Despite what Cindy said on the phone to the dispatcher, Caylee was the reason she called, not the car. Cindy HAD the car back. According to Amy, when Cindy and Amy were headed to Tony's, Caylee was Cindy's greatest concern.

Except to find Caylee, there was NO reason for Cindy to WANT to get KC (imo). Shirley & Lee said George and Cindy were getting along during the 31 days. Cindy had confided the situation to Shirley and Shirley was telling Cindy to stop fretting and get on with her life.

 

[KenoshaKid]

I asked this on the wrong thread will try again here. Last night on some CNN show I heard that a picture was not taken of the shape of a child's body in Casey's trunk. Sorry if this has been asked and answered before...but, is there such a picture ?

Look at post 235 of this thread.

 

[sleutherontheside]

I went to the Caylee Daily site and looked at the photos. I can see the outline since someone traced around the enhanced stain images. I would not have been able to make them out otherwise. However, being OBJECTIVE, I can also argue that there may be nothing to them. So if they are brought in at trial in some manner, I doubt it will do more than provoke thoughtful consideration of the visual of Caylee, deceased, decomposing in a trunk. Something was decomposing in that trunk, the evidence presented will identify that "something" as Caylee. The enhanced photo will just top it off. A chocolate sundae is still considered by most people to be a sundae even if the cherry on top is on the side or ommitted entirely. The positive identification of this stain as an outline of Caylee will only serve as topping and isn't necessary to make the prosecutions case. IMO

I doubt it would ever be brought in by the prosecution as evidence, but I do think it may have it's place during the penalty phase when they can use it to evoke emotion from the jurors. While Andrea Lyons will be attempting to "humaize" KC and evoke sympathy for her, the prosecution will be advocating for a little girl who seemingly has no supporters in her own family. I think this is where the real case will be made.

 

[ZsaZsa]

I went to the Caylee Daily site and looked at the photos. I can see the outline since someone traced around the enhanced stain images. I would not have been able to make them out otherwise. However, being OBJECTIVE, I can also argue that there may be nothing to them. So if they are brought in at trial in some manner, I doubt it will do more than provoke thoughtful consideration of the visual of Caylee, deceased, decomposing in a trunk. Something was decomposing in that trunk, the evidence presented will identify that "something" as Caylee. The enhanced photo will just top it off. A chocolate sundae is still considered by most people to be a sundae even if the cherry on top is on the side or ommitted entirely. The positive identification of this stain as an outline of Caylee will only serve as topping and isn't necessary to make the prosecutions case. IMO

I doubt it would ever be brought in by the prosecution as evidence, but I do think it may have it's place during the penalty phase when they can use it to evoke emotion from the jurors. While Andrea Lyons will be attempting to "humaize" KC and evoke sympathy for her, the prosecution will be advocating for a little girl who seemingly has no supporters in her own family. I think this is where the real case will be made.

I hope it comes into evidence. As the old saying goes- A picture speaks a thousand words.

 

[cecybeans]

Well, if GA did find Caylee's body (which could have been in the empty wheel well) and dropped it off on Suburban road, I would think he would want it hidden in plain sight. He probably knew she would be arrested and keeping Caylee's body close by would also allow someone to find her while KC was in jail, thus confusing chain of custody, or perhaps allow contamination of the scene, which he knew would be useful.

It might also explain why information or "rumors" might have been leaked to strategic local people who would try to look for her. To me, GA had every reason to want Caylee's body found quickly and KC and JB could have no possible interest in finding it as long as a kidnapping scenario could be drawn out as long as possible. In fact, it would be a strike against KC if the body were found at all, since that would elevate "missing" to "murdered".

If KC confessed to an accident while she was in jail, which he may have been hoping she'd do when he tried to set up the visit with detectives on Aug 14, when JB was safely out of town, then she would not get a long sentence. If not, then he may have thought it would be difficult to prove KC placed her there. She was clearly angry at her parents in the jail visit when they asked for help in finding her. Almost as if she was saying "why are you asking ME?".

I think there is enough of a possibility this occurred to make it an alternate scenario; I haven't made up my mind yet altogether, however. And we just may never know the truth. As we all know, the truth and the Anthonys are strangers. Maybe more like enemies.

 

[ZsaZsa]

Cindy did call RM's phone number once during the 31 days. The call was very quick.

I think Cindy thought she was calling Zenaida and when a guy answered..."oops".

I don't remember the thread where this phone call was discussed. But, the consensus was that Cindy was probably trying to find Zenaida then.

When she was asked if she knew Zenaida, had ever met her, had ever spoken to her on the phone she insisted that she had her phone number at home. Knowing what we know of Cindy's persistence I would say that if she really had it she would have tried again. Of course we know when she was saying this that she was lying anyway..
If not, why hasn't she given LE the phone number as yet?

 

[LambChop]

If George disposed of Caylee, I believe Caylee would have been put further from the house, further off of the road, probably buried and that the car would have been detailed.


jmo

I believe it is impossible to detail a car that has had human decomposition in it. It was stink forever, especially when it rains.

 

[OneLostGrl]

KCs lazy stab may have even involved one of those side of the road car washes. It always bothered me that she made such a deal of ppointing out to TL where she had his car washed on the way home from the airport.

bold is mine

Me too!

 

[ZsaZsa]

I believe it is impossible to detail a car that has had human decomposition in it. It was stink forever, especially when it rains.

From documents we are seeing it sounds like it STILL stinks.
Yes, I am sure it will be totaled when this is all over.
I take my dogs to the lake all the time and consequently have wet dogs in my car a lot, I don't normally smell them,but when it rains.....sheesh.

 

[BondJamesBond]

My thoughts when I read the report on the stain - which by the way - I could make out clearly....was that perhaps it was the residue or the stain left by swimming pool chemicals.

If Caylee was soaking wet - i.e. she was drowned in the pool - and then put in the trunk, it is reasonable that the body outline could have been left by chlorine residue or whatever chemicals the As use in their pool.

FWIW...and hoping another WS w/ detailed knowledge can step in to confirm/debunk...but I seem to recall that we eventually saw some sign that G&C used a non-chlorinated agent for their pool (Baquacil?).

http://www.archchemicals.com/Fed/BAQCIL/Products/

Just a foggy memory...so don't hold me to it.

 

[celticthyme]

ETA in regard to what BJB mentions in preceding post

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/media/acrobat/2009-09/49548935.pdf

Pg 8644? container of baquacil pool chemical

Other interesting items I'd not noticed from the evidence forms were at the suburban scene: cigarette butts, and duct tape ( by itself)

 

[treeseeker]

FWIW...and hoping another WS w/ detailed knowledge can step in to confirm/debunk...but I seem to recall that we eventually saw some sign that G&C used a non-chlorinated agent for their pool (Baquacil?).

http://www.archchemicals.com/Fed/BAQCIL/Products/

Just a foggy memory...so don't hold me to it.

I remembered the Baquacil, also. I believe it was retrieved by LE in the December search of the A home? also a discussion about LA purchasing it online?

If you'll wade back a few pages, I posted a little on Baquacil and how it might affect luminol. I won't quote myself, since I already did once (don't want to get a reputation). I'll just pull up the links:

[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luminol[/ame]
(mentions copper will affect luminol)

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/5527506.html
(believe this means Baquacil contains copper)

http://www.claritywaterproducts.com/health.html
(talks about problems with Baquacil and mold growth in pools)

[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PAPB[/ame]
(article re the basic ingredient in Baquacil, mentions it destroys bacterial DNA)

 

[Truthwillsetufree]

I'm not sold on George getting rid of the "remains" either.. was just tossing out things I have thought about throughout this case. I'm not sold on anything in this case (including who killed Caylee) other than the dynamics and dysfunction of this family.

I am always open for new theories. I feel like I have read thousands and so many could make sense or "fit" the puzzle we are trying to put together without all the pieces. I like it when someone comes up with something else and gets me to thinking......

 

[nyvictoria]

If George had had a chance to detail before July 15, there would not have been residue remaining to fester and reek. George also would have thrown away the bag of stinky (from the wadded up, maggot infested paper towels), fly-ridden trash in the trunk.

I don't doubt that George cleaned the car sometime between when George got it home on July 15 and when LE confiscated it.

jmo

Even if George tried to clean the car before the 15th, the smell of human decomposition is nearly impossible to get rid of. It permeates everything and would probably continue to draw insects, even after cleaning. In fact, once it gets in your nostrils, it's there for weeks - literally!! I'm sure that car stinks to this day.

I completely agree and believe George (and possibly Cindy) immediately went to work cleaning out the car when they got it back from the tow yard. Perhaps George concentrated on the car and Cindy did the washing of the stinky items??