State v Bradley Cooper - March 22, 2011

[ncsu95]

I know, I know. But it's moving so painfully slow. My greatest fear is that the jury is going to be fast asleep when the wow factor is presented.....and hopefully by the prosecution.

My greatest fear is there is not going to be a wow factor in this case.

 

[ncsu95]

I agree with you! It's not the job of the prosecution, judge, jury, etc. to provide us with compelling television. Whatever evidence the prosecution has was sufficient to convince a grand jury to return an indictment. Clearly we've only seen random bits and a lot of tedious tracking of chain of custody, witness testimony about Brad and Nancy's behavior, etc. The jury (and we) will ultimately decide this on the whole of the evidence, not the bits and pieces.

There is a MUCH lower burden of proof for a grand jury to indict.

 

[SleuthyGal]

Based on the description a few posts ago, it's very unlikely to have the death band since she wasn't "rotting" at that point. The defense could actually use the lack of a "death band" if it is her piece of hair as evidence that the hair couldn't have been from transporting a body.

From a forensic hair analysis page

"You can tell if a hair has come was someone who is dead. At the proximal end of the hair ie the root end you get was is called a postmortem band, I call it a death band, some call it a putrid root. Studies state that it will take at least 7 days for this band to form. The band can only be formed while the hair is still adhered. The black band is thought to come from all the bacteria and enzymes from the decomposing body.

If a body (that has been dead for at least 7 days ) is moved by a suspect eg in a car etc, if hairs are shed they may have the tell tale death band."

-----------

Nancy's body was found, autopsied, and sent for cremation by the time 7 days postmortem arrived. Nancy's body was likely dumped within 3 hrs of her being killed (based on lividity on her right forehead).

 

[otto]

That was a bad answer for the prosecution since it had been at least 1.5 weeks (if I remember correctly).

It was completely the wrong answer. I get the impression the prosecution wants the jury to believe that here was no gas spill and that Brad cleaned the trunk because Nancy was in there. I also got the impression they want the jury to believe that Nancy dented the inside of the trunk. It's simply ridiculous.

That answer supported the possibility that gas spilled, Brad cleaned it, and there would no longer be a smell - throws out all testimony about cleaning the trunk to hide evidence.

I'm beginning to wonder what's going on here. I get the impression that many people, especially in Nancy's circle, were convinced that Brad was guilty because he was a bad husband. Now we see the prosecution waving their arms and saying that he was a bad husband and ... and police did a thorough job ... and they have nothing. Is the jury going to see that so far this is nothing, or are they indoctrinated to believe Brad is guilty simply because they are from the "guilty" community?

 

[ncsu95]

I agree with you! It's not the job of the prosecution, judge, jury, etc. to provide us with compelling television. Whatever evidence the prosecution has was sufficient to convince a grand jury to return an indictment. Clearly we've only seen random bits and a lot of tedious tracking of chain of custody, witness testimony about Brad and Nancy's behavior, etc. The jury (and we) will ultimately decide this on the whole of the evidence, not the bits and pieces.

But it is the job of the prosecution to keep the jury engaged. We're 2 weeks in and they haven't presented anything actually linking Brad to the crime. Does the jury go home each night and wonder if tomorrow is the day they will finally give us some concrete evidence that he did this?

 

[traveler]

The spilled gas in the trunk...what would Brad have used the gas for? Did he have a lawn mower?

 

[ncsu95]

Plus you wouldn't vacuum gasoline out. It evaporates, leaving a smell behind, but it doesn't leave flotsam behind like dirt and grass and leaves that need to be vacuumed.

Unless you put something down that absorbs the gas and then vacuum that up. Sort of like the stuff you use when you spill oil. Or the stuff gas stations use when gas is spilled. Not saying he did that, but that's what I would do if I spilled gas in my vehicle.

 

[ncsu95]

We have no idea how long Nancy lay in that house dead before she was taken to that site and dumped either.

I guess we'll find out if it has a death band or not. If it doesn't does that mean he didn't kill her? (I'm being sarcastic with that question). If it does, that would be a damning piece of evidence if it was her hair.

 

[ncsu95]

From a forensic hair analysis page

"You can tell if a hair has come was someone who is dead. At the proximal end of the hair ie the root end you get was is called a postmortem band, I call it a death band, some call it a putrid root. Studies state that it will take at least 7 days for this band to form. The band can only be formed while the hair is still adhered. The black band is thought to come from all the bacteria and enzymes from the decomposing body.

If a body (that has been dead for at least 7 days ) is moved by a suspect eg in a car etc, if hairs are shed they may have the tell tale death band."

-----------

Nancy's body was found, autopsied, and sent for cremation by the time 7 days postmortem arrived. Nancy's body was likely dumped within 3 hrs of her being killed (based on lividity on her right forehead).

Thank you. I guess we can quit talking about it now.

 

[NCEast]

But it is the job of the prosecution to keep the jury engaged. We're 2 weeks in and they haven't presented anything actually linking Brad to the crime. Does the jury go home each night and wonder if tomorrow is the day they will finally give us some concrete evidence that he did this?

I was just about to say the same thing. All of the burden of proof is on the prosecution and if the jury has a combined IQ of 200 they have already seen that nothing is playing out.
I was watching, again, the child custody depositions last night and caught myself wondering if he actually did NOT do it. A first for me.

 

[otto]

We have no idea how long Nancy lay in that house dead before she was taken to that site and dumped either.

She was snacking and drinking at a party until just after midnight (it can't be said that she stopped eating at 7 or 10), and there was nothing in her stomach except some onion remains (normally takes longer to digest). Her alcohol level (0.6) wasn't high (after 6 beer/wine drinks) but could be consistent with naturally produced alcohol from decomposition. She should have had a higher alcohol level after that many drinks.

I haven't seen anything to suggest that she was murdered as soon as she arrived at home, and the door to her being murdered at around 7:30 am seems to still be wide open.

 

[otto]

The spilled gas in the trunk...what would Brad have used the gas for? Did he have a lawn mower?

Who knows. We know he didn't use the lawnmower, but maybe he was thinking about it and bought some gas ... then spilled it and forgot about the lawn.

 

[otto]

I guess we'll find out if it has a death band or not. If it doesn't does that mean he didn't kill her? (I'm being sarcastic with that question). If it does, that would be a damning piece of evidence if it was her hair.

If it takes 7 days for the death band to occur, and if a hair like that from Nancy was in the car, then it was planted.

 

[SleuthyGal]

I personally believe Nancy was murdered somewhere between 3am and 4am. Why? Long enough for food to digest, but not so long that an onion fragment wouldn't still be in her stomach.

Brad said lights were on at his house around 4am. He claims it's because Katie woke up, but that doesn't mean it's true (and we know Brad lies). I think he started his cleanup then and I think it was right after he murdered Nancy.

And, because lividity on Nancy's forehead shows she was in a downward position when blood pooled there (i.e. the way her body was found at the dump site), she was dumped within a couple or so hrs of her death.

That would put her dumping right around 6am-ish.

 

[SleuthyGal]

If it takes 7 days for the death band to occur, and if a hair like that from Nancy was in the car, then it was planted.

It takes at LEAST 7 days. Nancy was cremated after the M.E. released her body. Nancy was killed 7/12. The autopsy was completed on 7/15 by 1pm. She was likely cremated before 7/19 (i.e. before 7 days post mortem).

 

[ncsu95]

She was snacking and drinking at a party until just after midnight (it can't be said that she stopped eating at 7 or 10), and there was nothing in her stomach except some onion remains (normally takes longer to digest). Her alcohol level (0.6) wasn't high (after 6 beer/wine drinks) but could be consistent with naturally produced alcohol from decomposition. She should have had a higher alcohol level after that many drinks.

I haven't seen anything to suggest that she was murdered as soon as she arrived at home, and the door to her being murdered at around 7:30 am seems to still be wide open.

Did someone hijack your account? After Mrs. Rentz testimony, I thought you moved into the 100% guilty category. It was definitely compelling testimony...but now we are back to the nothing.

 

[otto]

I personally believe Nancy was murdered somewhere between 3am and 4am. Why? Long enough for food to digest, but not so long that an onion fragment wouldn't still be in her stomach.

Brad said lights were on at his house around 4am. He claims it's because Katie woke up, but that doesn't mean it's true (and we know Brad lies). I think he started his cleanup then and I think it was right after he murdered Nancy.

And, because lividity on Nancy's forehead shows she was in a downward position when blood pooled there (i.e. the way her body was found at the dump site), she was dumped within a couple or so hrs of her death.

That would put her dumping right around 6am-ish.

These isn't any proof that she was murdered at that time. Today we heard about fake pink fingernails and the house, but Nancy lived there so if there was a fake nail that belonged to her somewhere on the floor ... it doesn't prove anything one way or the other. With all the remarks about the car, there is nothing to prove that a piece of grass or hair got onto the wheel well one day or another. The missing screw from the license plate seems to contradict logic ... suggesting that Brad removed his license plate to drive around with a body in the car.

The prosecution has a story, but the story stretches the imagination and still makes no sense.

 

[LyndyLoo]

I guess we'll find out if it has a death band or not. If it doesn't does that mean he didn't kill her? (I'm being sarcastic with that question). If it does, that would be a damning piece of evidence if it was her hair.

JMOO but I doubt there would be any deathband of the hair found on Brad's trunk lid..I think he scooted her over to the developement site long before that would be noteable..however, under microspope..they may very well see startings of such....We have to remember Nancy was last seen July 12th and was found July 15th.....I doubt very much Brad would have kept her body in his trunk very long..JMOO of course..Sorry I have my dates not so accurate..but I think I have the time lapse right..

Etd..to change the dates

 

[otto]

It takes at LEAST 7 days. Nancy was cremated after the M.E. released her body. Nancy was killed 7/12. The autopsy was completed on 7/15 by 1pm. She was likely cremated before 7/19 (i.e. before 7 days post mortem).

So the hair tells us nothing except that Nancy was around the car at some time, not necessarily at any time related to her murder.

 

[raisincharlie]

All the non-evidence today was "we tested it and found nothing". The only things really collected were some dirt by his shoes, her shoes and the couple of hairs. None of that seemed likely to amount to anything in my opinion.

What did they collect in your opinion (that was discussed today) that would incriminate Brad? The one thing they could have collected that might be relevant was the shopvac bag...but CPDs and CBBIs finest chose not to collect that.

They did not say they found "nothing", they said they did not find blood in the items tested for preliminary id. Unlike you, I don't have an opinion, I will actually wait to hear what the lab folks who performed the actual testing have to say, their results are after all, the results that actually matter. Strangulation seldom involves blood...as to what incriminates Brad that might have been discussed, no telling since the results of the actual testing have yet to be testified to.