Supreme Court Nominee

[kaen]

And yet, it is political.

The entire situation is political, we don't have to "go political" on something that already is.

Unless she can PROVE what she claims, this is a last minute witch hunt. He doesn't have to prove anything, SHE made the claim and it's up to her to provide validation.

No, it is not political for me. By bringing up political figures, it begins to angle for this thread to close. We don't need to go there is all I am commenting on. This is a case about an accusation and to drag it into political is the wrong from a moral perspective as I see it. This woman's experience is not unlike many women who stayed silent whether you think Kavanaugh did it or not. It is awful to me that under the guise of how we fall politically we justify condemning one and not the other. That is not how I roll. Wrong is wrong.

Years ago (and, today in some parts of the world) young girls would be paid a dowry and be married off to an older man at 10 or 11. Not right then, not right now. I don't care your religion or politics. This Kavanaugh issue is the same to me.

 

[human]

Yale fraternity fun

https://yaledailynews.com/blog/2018...photo-from-kavanaughs-time-shows-dke-hijinks/

 

[Deleted member 39678]

This whole situation is political. JMO

 

[sorrell skye]

And according to her, there was another person present ("PJ"), and yet he (Patrick J. Smyth) says the event in question, never happened.

I don't know who this "P.J." person is. I've been following this story from day one and I've not heard of anyone by that name associated with this story.

Mark Judge is the other named person who was allegedly in the room. He went to school with Kavanaugh.

Mark Judge authored a book, titled "Wasted: Tales of a Gen X Drunk".

From the article (linked below):

Judge wrote the book "Wasted: Tales of a Gen X Drunk," where he details his experiences of extensive drinking while attending Georgetown Preparatory School.
Judge writes that he is "shocked" about what he got away with in high school -- recalling beach parties that hundreds of people would attend.
At another point he describes his high school as "positively swimming in alcohol."

Kavanaugh classmate Mark Judge details parties in writings - CNNPolitics

I'm not surprised he claims to not remember the incident in question if he was "wasted" that night. He may have been so intoxicated that he truly doesn't recall what happened.

If so, he is not absolved of his civic responsibility to testify. One can't help but wonder if he's afraid to testify under oath before the Committee is because he doesn't want to answer questions regarding the culture at Georgetown Prep that he described in his book.

Mark Judge is undoubtedly aware that his 'confessional' book recounting the rampant alcohol abuse of underage drinkers (alcohol abuse in which he regularly partook, according to his book) at his high school seriously undermines his credibility as a witness in this matter, which is likely why he refuses to testify under oath before the Senate Judiciary Committee.

 

[kaen]

Unless she can PROVE what she claims, this is a last minute witch hunt. He doesn't have to prove anything, SHE made the claim and it's up to her to provide validation.

And, she doesn't get the privilege of setting her demands...she made the claims, very serious claims, and the investigators of those claims (the gov't.) sets the parameters for investigation, not her and her lawyers.

There have been tens of thousands of women who have been raped, attempted raped and more by men. It is unfortunate to me that anyone would say unless you prove it, it didn't happen. Women, young and old, who have been attacked hid in the shadows because of judgement of their behavior, their clothing, or society norms. I don't want women to have to go back. There are too many examples of women who tried to stand up and were not listened to . Too many examples of women who thought they were at fault for going to a party, drinking a beer. Too many.

IN this case, she did make a claim, she took a lie detector test. It is her word against his. There is not a way to gather physical proof at this point. I will ask if this man will take a lie detector test.

In my opinion, she can set terms. She did't get to set the terms that night many years ago but she has every right to assert some terms now. It is unfortunate that many will deride her as a liar when they don't know.

As a rape crisis counselor for many years, I watched women and men struggle to come to terms with what happened to them. Very rarely did a person lie. Their memories were off. Details were off. But, for the most part, the experience was real and all the memories were altered due to trauma, a trauma that should never happen to anyone. A trauma that should never be belittled by anyone. If you don't believe me, volunteer and go on a middle of the night call to the hospital and watch as person goes through a self-judgment process as a way of avoiding the judgment of others.

 

[kaen]

Unless she can PROVE what she claims, this is a last minute witch hunt. He doesn't have to prove anything, SHE made the claim and it's up to her to provide validation.

Your opinion is your opinion. Mine is mine. Neither of us should ever expect that our opinions are facts unless we have a link to prove it.

 

[BingoBongo]

You've got to be kidding. Every accusation of this nature has to be proven. That's why we have rape kits,otherwise we end up with a lot of Duke University LaCrosse problems.

 

[BingoBongo]

I don't know who this "P.J." person is. I've been following this story from day one and I've not heard of anyone by that name associated with this story.

Mark Judge is the other named person who was allegedly in the room. He went to school with Kavanaugh.

Mark Judge authored a book, titled "Wasted: Tales of a Gen X Drunk".

From the article (linked below):

Judge wrote the book "Wasted: Tales of a Gen X Drunk," where he details his experiences of extensive drinking while attending Georgetown Preparatory School.
Judge writes that he is "shocked" about what he got away with in high school -- recalling beach parties that hundreds of people would attend.
At another point he describes his high school as "positively swimming in alcohol."

Kavanaugh classmate Mark Judge details parties in writings - CNNPolitics

I'm not surprised he claims to not remember the incident in question if he was "wasted" that night. He may have been so intoxicated that he truly doesn't recall what happened.

If so, he is not absolved of his civic responsibility to testify. One can't help but wonder if he's afraid to testify under oath before the Committee is because he doesn't want to answer questions regarding the culture at Georgetown Prep that he described in his book.

Mark Judge is undoubtedly aware that his 'confessional' book recounting the rampant alcohol abuse of underage drinkers (alcohol abuse in which he regularly partook, according to his book) at his high school seriously undermines his credibility as a witness in this matter, which is likely why he refuses to testify under oath before the Senate Judiciary Committee.

I don't understand how you could have not seen PJ referenced anywhere if you've been following the case.

I don't know who this "P.J." person is. I've been following this story from day one and I've not heard of anyone by that name associated with this story.

Mark Judge is the other named person who was allegedly in the room. He went to school with Kavanaugh.

Mark Judge authored a book, titled "Wasted: Tales of a Gen X Drunk".

From the article (linked below):

Judge wrote the book "Wasted: Tales of a Gen X Drunk," where he details his experiences of extensive drinking while attending Georgetown Preparatory School.
Judge writes that he is "shocked" about what he got away with in high school -- recalling beach parties that hundreds of people would attend.
At another point he describes his high school as "positively swimming in alcohol."

Kavanaugh classmate Mark Judge details parties in writings - CNNPolitics

I'm not surprised he claims to not remember the incident in question if he was "wasted" that night. He may have been so intoxicated that he truly doesn't recall what happened.

If so, he is not absolved of his civic responsibility to testify. One can't help but wonder if he's afraid to testify under oath before the Committee is because he doesn't want to answer questions regarding the culture at Georgetown Prep that he described in his book.

Mark Judge is undoubtedly aware that his 'confessional' book recounting the rampant alcohol abuse of underage drinkers (alcohol abuse in which he regularly partook, according to his book) at his high school seriously undermines his credibility as a witness in this matter, which is likely why he refuses to testify under oath before the Senate Judiciary Committee.

Google Patrick J Smyth.

 

[kaen]

You've got to be kidding. Every accusation of this nature has to be proven. That's why we have rape kits,otherwise we end up with a lot of Duke University LaCrosse problems.

Not proven doesn't mean didn't happen. There are many crimes where the culprit is fortunate to have people unable to be prove they did a crime but they happened. WS has tons of "unsolved" murders where all the evidence points to a person but not enough evidence to be proven-- yet the people are still dead.

Why do we need to be looking at issues of a certain "nature" and say unless proven it didn't happen. A child raped by a step-parent where the facts come out 10 years later or they have a venereal disease---- did it happen if the evidence no longer exists to prove it?

The Duke University situation was wrong and criminal in my humble opinion. And there are hundreds of other cases where women were raped and abused with little effort to "prove" what happened to them. Then, when we start to put sunlight and video on it, we have the Vanderbilt rapes and the Louisville parties where girls were handed over to perspective players. Did those happen? Without the Vanderbilt video, her rape and abuse wouldn't have been proven--- but we know it did occur. Not so easy and not so cut and dried from my perspective.

 

[kaen]

When we finally come to a day where victims/survivors of sexual assault do not feel shame, shamed, and societal judgment, with a recognition that a sexual assault is not about sex but power over, we will see more victims/survivors who come forward when the assault happens. But, as our society continues to blame, shame and smear these people, it is not safe to report--LE may believe you but the greater community will villain you, especially if the abuser has more power than you.

 

[kaen]

P. J. Smyth has not been named by the woman. He heard he was and responded. Additionally, she has said that only one person was in the room---Mr. Judge. She stated she came downstairs and said nothing to anyone.

Not even the accuser can say for sure what party and the date, but Mr. Smyth can state that he didn't have a drinking party at all that summer. This is hard to believe since Mr. Judge's book talks a lot about drinking which he has stated was common then. And, Mr Kavanaugh has stated what happened at Georgetown Prep stays at Georgetown Prep....

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

This whole situation is political. JMO

Of course it is. I'm surprised it's allowed.

 

[kimlynn]

P. J. Smyth has not been named by the woman. He heard he was and responded. Additionally, she has said that only one person was in the room---Mr. Judge. She stated she came downstairs and said nothing to anyone.

Not even the accuser can say for sure what party and the date, but Mr. Smyth can state that he didn't have a drinking party at all that summer. This is hard to believe since Mr. Judge's book talks a lot about drinking which he has stated was common then. And, Mr Kavanaugh has stated what happened at Georgetown Prep stays at Georgetown Prep....

Loving your posts. You have hit the nail on the head in regards to the feelings and thought process of victims of these type of crimes.
Correct on P.Smyth. I have followed from day one and also can't find anywhere that Ford named P.Smyth.
He called out himself which is curious if you think about it. IMO

 

[kimlynn]

"Drinking problem". Where does anyone claim he had a drinking problem?

Even IF this event happened, it appears, so far, to be a ONE hit wonder.

Would be very different if multiple women came forward and made the same, or similar claim...such as happened with Bill Clinton.

There was a claim that he (Kavanaugh) had been passed out drunk with vomit on his face and we have the claim from Ford that he was stumbling drunk when he assaulted her.
All during his teen yrs. IMO

 

[sorrell skye]

I don't understand how you could have not seen PJ referenced anywhere if you've been following the case.


Google Patrick J Smyth.

I googled his name and I see that this "P.J." person has denied "being at the party". I still don't know who he is, other than someone who denies "being at the party". Say what? He denies "being at the party"? What party? As I've stated: Who the hell is PJ Smith? And what party was he not at? I don't know and I don't really care.

I've been focused on who has been named to have been in the actual room when/where the alleged sexual assault occurred.

Mark Judge is the other male named to have been in the room when/where the alleged sexual assault took place.

Mark Judge authored a book titled "Wasted: Tales of a Gen X Drunk" wherein he recounted his "wasted" high school years at Georgetown Prep.

Mark Judge says "I have no memory of this alleged incident," Judge states in the letter sent by his lawyer, Barbara Van Gelder.

Mark Judge tells Senate he 'has no memory of alleged' incident with Kavanaugh - CNNPolitics

Mark Judge boasted about his "wasted" high school years while he was under the influence of alcohol at Georgetown Prep.

Based on his own admissions of being "wasted" (which he detailed in his book), I'm not a bit surprised that he issued a statement via his attorney saying "I have no memory of this alleged incident". It's clear to me that his attorney advised him that this was the best tack to take regarding attempted felony rape.

As I stated in a previous post, he is not a credible witness about what happened that night, based on his 'confessional" book about his years at Georgetown Prep.

Furthermore, I'm quite certain that his attorney has advised him that there is no statute of limitations for attempted felony rape in the state of Maryland.

In Maryland, there is no statute of limitations for rape or attempted rape and the alleged incident took place in suburban Montgomery County, outside Washington, D.C.

Maryland Prosecutor on Kavanaugh Allegations: “When There’s Something the Police Have Brought to Us, We’ll Address It”

Here are the relevant Maryland statutes:

Maryland Rape and Sexual Assault Laws - FindLaw

Third Degree – includes any of the following: engaging in sexual contact (intentionally touching the victim’s or defendant’s genital, anal, or other private parts for sexual gratification or abuse of either person) in any of the following situations: Without consent while using a weapon, strangling or seriously injuring the victim, threatening the victim with death, serious injury, or kidnapping, or committed with another’s help

 

[kimlynn]

I googled his name and I see that this "P.J." person has denied "being at the party". I still don't know who he is, other than someone who denies "being at the party". Say what? He denies "being at the party"? What party? As I've stated: Who the hell is PJ Smith? And what party was he not at? I don't know and I don't really care.

I've been focused on who has been named to have been in the actual room when/where the alleged sexual assault occurred.

Mark Judge is the other male named to have been in the room when/where the alleged sexual assault took place.

Mark Judge authored a book titled "Wasted: Tales of a Gen X Drunk" wherein he recounted his "wasted" high school years at Georgetown Prep.

Mark Judge says "I have no memory of this alleged incident," Judge states in the letter sent by his lawyer, Barbara Van Gelder.

Mark Judge tells Senate he 'has no memory of alleged' incident with Kavanaugh - CNNPolitics

Mark Judge boasted about his "wasted" high school years while he was under the influence of alcohol at Georgetown Prep.

Based on his own admissions of being "wasted" (which he detailed in his book), I'm not a bit surprised that he issued a statement via his attorney saying "I have no memory of this alleged incident". It's clear to me that his attorney advised him that this was the best tack to take regarding attempted felony rape.

As I stated in a previous post, he is not a credible witness about what happened that night, based on his 'confessional" book about his years at Georgetown Prep.

Furthermore, I'm quite certain that his attorney has advised him that there is no statute of limitations for attempted felony rape in the state of Maryland.

In Maryland, there is no statute of limitations for rape or attempted rape and the alleged incident took place in suburban Montgomery County, outside Washington, D.C.

Maryland Prosecutor on Kavanaugh Allegations: “When There’s Something the Police Have Brought to Us, We’ll Address It”

Here are the relevant Maryland statutes:

Maryland Rape and Sexual Assault Laws - FindLaw

Third Degree – includes any of the following: engaging in sexual contact (intentionally touching the victim’s or defendant’s genital, anal, or other private parts for sexual gratification or abuse of either person) in any of the following situations: Without consent while using a weapon, strangling or seriously injuring the victim, threatening the victim with death, serious injury, or kidnapping, or committed with another’s help

I had also read about the potential for charges but I doubt that will happen. Perhaps that would explain the denial from the other two players and Kavanaugh.One has been silent so far.

 

[sorrell skye]

 

[Deleted member 227458]

link?

He's not charged with anything.

This isn't a criminal trial. These are (mostly) public hearings.

Of course he's been charged...that woman has made a serious charge against him, and he is being tried in the court of public opinion. IMO, he may well have grounds to bring slander and/or defamation charges against her. Perhaps his attorney has already communicated this to her lawyers, hence her reluctance to "testify" on Capital Hill unless it it is "on her terms."

 

[sorrell skye]

"All of Humanity is Woman-Born...

Our Wisdom cannot be lost
Our Spirits cannot be broken
Our Wisdom cannot be lost
Our Spirits cannot be broken

Women... I'm calling out to you...

Awaken to your power
Awaken to your power
Awaken to your power...

Wisdom cannot be lost
And our Spirits cannot be broken..."

~ Sheila Chandra

 

[Tripod]

I believe Kavanaugh is completely innocent of what this woman has accused him of- my personal belief only at this point. I could see right through this tactic- it came out of the well-used bag of dirty tricks by a certain group of folks. It's been used very successfully in the past, so it's used repeatedly. It's troublesome because sometimes there is at least partial truth to an incident, and sometimes there's not- but it can never be fully verified or dismissed. What makes me terribly sad is that in this day and age, simply an unverified accusation seems to be as good as a criminal indictment and conviction. Very scary times. There has been no rush or lack of transparency to hear her out and ask questions, but there's been delay and lack of transparency by those who claim to be respecting and protecting her. I believe that Ms. Ford was likely to have had an experience at least somewhat similar to what she now recalls, in high school, but there will be no way to ever prove or prosecute who the other party was, IMO. Unfortunately, the incident as she has described remembering was, and still is, common among teens. I also believe Ms. Ford is being used, at this point, and that is just wrong. This whole thing is a tragic attempt to ruin a good man's life and legacy, not to mention his wife, children, parents, etc. Hoping Ms. Ford tells her story and answers questions ASAP, and the same for Judge Kavanaugh.