Terrorist Attack at Boston Marathon #11 One Suspect Dead; One in Custody

[BeginnersLuck]

So with mother paying $1200 rent, TT had extra money (from wife's job) to buy bombing materials. Where did TT's mother get the money in Russia to pay the rent?

I don't think the bombing materials that were used were expensive and they are easy to get. The thought of the mother and wife supporting him makes me sick though. What a waste. This allowed him to devote all his time to his plan, including all the sick thoughts that went with it. I think in a lot of ways the mother enabled and encouraged his behavior and actions.

 

[noodled1]

I have never seen National guards at a sporting event like this before...
.....and unfortunately,if that's what they were there for,they did not do a good enough job

They (the National Guard) are at most sporting events in SoCal.

Before you start being overly critical of them "not doing a good enough job" understand that there is no way to secure 52 miles of spectator area no matter how many people are assigned that duty.

It's an impossible task at best, the only way to make an event like a marathon safe is to not have the event at all, it's not like a stadium/arena event where you can scan everyone going in and secure the venue for a week beforehand.

The best they can do is bomb sweeps immediately before and during the event but still that's 52 miles of spectator area to sweep and would only be effective if the dog and it's handler happen to arrive at the exact same place at the same time as the bomber does.

 

[SophieRose]

I don't think the bombing materials that were used were expensive and they are easy to get. The thought of the mother and wife supporting him makes me sick though. What a waste. This allowed him to devote all his time to his plan, including all the sick thoughts that went with it. I think in a lot of ways the mother enabled and encouraged his behavior and actions.

Yes I know they weren't very expensive but people were commenting initially about the couple not having much money and how could they afford any little extras. Including nice shoes for the wife. But if they weren't paying the $1200 rent, they gave them extra money.

Yes, his mother enabled him. I can't help but think of him as a and drifter going nowhere. Where was the attraction for his wife to stay?

 

[claudicici]

....and IT apparently was supported by both his girlfriend and his ex-wife !!!!
then again it's not an uncommon story for woman to support loser guys,aargh we here it so much on these threads,from enabling them with drug habits to even letting their own children be abused by them,so sad....

 

[claudicici]

http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/2013/05/26/ethiopian-marathon-runner-honors-boston-victims/hK5rDZbQFt4Z0Eft7IFNCP/story.html
The Marathon winner is returning his medal to honor the victims of the attack.

 

[CARIIS]

"But there is no question about Tsarnaev’s ties to Mess, who had recently moved to Waltham from Cambridge at the urging of Mess’s girlfriend, Hibatalla Eltilib, according to friends and relatives of the victims who spoke with the Globe. Mess and Tsaernaev had grown close as neighbors near Inman Square, sharing a love of fighting, as well as hip-hop music.


Newly named Middlesex District Attorney Marian Ryan on Thursday said she would have no comment on any aspect of the investigation. But friends and relatives of the victims, in hindsight, said police should have examined the relationship between Eltilib, a native of *Sudan, and Tsarnaev.


Although friends knew *Tsarnaev to be Muslim, they did not consider him to be an *extremist.



Eltilib, by contrast, was outspoken about her Islamic beliefs and disdain for many American values, friends said.


...Eltilib has since returned to Sudan. Repeated attempts to reach her in recent weeks were unsuccessful. It is unclear when she left the Greater Boston *area, but her departure mirrors those of Tsarnaev and Todashev, each of whom also left the area following the triple homicide. Tsarnaev visited *Russia for six months last year, and Todashev moved to Florida."


http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/20...le-homicide/ho0xNuDSCGdQsRNZI30QHK/story.html

Awesome POST !

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

Here it is Memorial Day. God bless all our veterans (five career military members in this family)!
When I think of refugees seeking asylum I can only remember my grandparents who came over from Hungry. They didn't even seek asylum; they came by the skin of their own teeth and then worked like heck on a piece of land they farmed in Ohio to help more of their family escape from the oppression of what Grandpa Misik used to call the "damn Bolsheviks."
It rankles my hide to hear how our country has been taken advantage of by those whose morals are less honest than my grandparents and dishonor our open door policy only to advance their own political/religious(?) agendas.
I am thinking we need to be more discerning about who we allow into our country . . . and who we allow to stay. And we certainly need to keep better track of them.
While I, too, find all of the conflicting publicity reports upsetting it makes me uncomfortable that there are people who seem to be eager to use those inconsistencies to somehow cast some implications of guilt on law enforcement for distorting facts. I cannot fathom why anyone would, without direct, pure and undeniable evidence, try to imply that le is manipulating facts. If anyone should be given the first honest ear ~ it should be those who are dedicated to protecting us. If we find something solidly wrong then, of course, they should be called out for it. But, dang, suspecting le before we support them just seems so very backwards to me. No blinders here ~ but if I see someone who has questionable criminal activity and le is investigating them ~ I will want to find out more about what that person who was charged did and their history rather than examining how faithful le was to all of the rules and regulations by which they are governed.
If nothing else, this horror has highlighted many weaknesses in our immigration and security systems. My prayer is that it will not, also, highlight the weakness in our judicial system as the Caylee/Casey Anthony case has done.
God bless America. And if there are those here who do not feel the same ~ then let's just ship them back from where they came.

:sigh:​

 

[CARIIS]

Haha. Your commentary.

We haven't even reached the probable hearing, let alone the trial! If it ever advances to that stage and there is no plea deal. I am anticipating the probable hearing, I am really curious to know what both sides present. You would think, if prosecutors had an overwhelming case (open & shut) against DT, like many here claim, they would be going harder at him to attempt to get this wrapped up. I think there's still a lot yet to come to light in this, it shows this investigation is a lot more complex than some assume. IMO

Oh, if it ever starts for real (!) I think it is going to be amazing -we got quite a cast of characters here , and we have only met the stars! HA!

 

[CARIIS]

So with mother paying $1200 rent, TT had extra money (from wife's job) to buy bombing materials. Where did TT's mother get the money in Russia to pay the rent?

Dealing! They say they have been watched by both Russia and US - so he mails her money from dealing and she mails it back (say mom is paying) raise no interest!

What ya think?

 

[CARIIS]

Here it is Memorial Day. God bless all our veterans (five career military members in this family)!
When I think of refugees seeking asylum I can only remember my grandparents who came over from Hungry. They didn't even seek asylum; they came by the skin of their own teeth and then worked like heck on a piece of land they farmed in Ohio to help more of their family escape from the oppression of what Grandpa Misik used to call the "damn Bolsheviks."
It rankles my hide to hear how our country has been taken advantage of by those whose morals are less honest than my grandparents and dishonor our open door policy only to advance their own political/religious(?) agendas.
I am thinking we need to be more discerning about who we allow into our country . . . and who we allow to stay. And we certainly need to keep better track of them.
While I, too, find all of the conflicting publicity reports upsetting it makes me uncomfortable that there are people who seem to be eager to use those inconsistencies to somehow cast some implications of guilt on law enforcement for distorting facts. I cannot fathom why anyone would, without direct, pure and undeniable evidence, try to imply that le is manipulating facts. If anyone should be given the first honest ear ~ it should be those who are dedicated to protecting us. If we find something solidly wrong then, of course, they should be called out for it. But, dang, suspecting le before we support them just seems so very backwards to me. No blinders here ~ but if I see someone who has questionable criminal activity and le is investigating them ~ I will want to find out more about what that person who was charged did and their history rather than examining how faithful le was to all of the rules and regulations by which they are governed.
If nothing else, this horror has highlighted many weaknesses in our immigration and security systems. My prayer is that it will not, also, highlight the weakness in our judicial system as the Caylee/Casey Anthony case has done.
God bless America. And if there are those here who do not feel the same ~ then let's just ship them back from where they came.

:sigh:​

As far as LE goes they are people – and people are people. The notion that in this day and age LE should not be explored and or mistrusted just defines the realities of today. Daily we hear about all kinds of corruption, racism xenophobic folks in LE...

In a case that the world is watching it totally defies any sort of logic that what went down in Orlando should not be raising all kinds of concerns.
If LE were following up on a stolen potted plant then a swing by for an “interrogation” sounds AOK to me.

I would think that SOP times 6 would have been done here.

However, we are talking about a gruesome triple homicide with ties to biggest terrorist attack in years, AND we suspect that the” interrogation” could run 8-10 hours (let’s not forget he was in his 8th hour before he was killed) then we conduct that investigation IN A STRUCTURE THAT SAYS LE ON IT!
Said structure should also include recording equipment recording the recording equipment!

Moreover, (and we are not sure yet) if the deal was not recorded then I am open to the notion that lets say unorthodox techniques were being used.
Stopping by his apt (for tea its cool to stop by for a visit) For an investigation of a suspect wherein the concern is the suspect is fond of chopping off multiple heads all the more reasons to have conducted it elsewhere. Concerns are, IMO, more than appropriate.

It defies logic and protocol……………………………….

Kind of like younger brother. Just silly to be interviewing a human being that has been playing with bombs, hungry, tired, a hole in his neck and some other parts of his body, has tubes in him, is on sedatives, and has just been operated on (another hole in his body).

It is more than fair to question some of the judgment calls that have been made in this situation!

 

[danzn16]

As far as LE goes they are people – and people are people. The notion that in this day and age LE should not be explored and or mistrusted just defines the realities of today. Daily we hear about all kinds of corruption, racism xenophobic folks in LE...

In a case that the world is watching it totally defies any sort of logic that what went down in Orlando should not be raising all kinds of concerns.
If LE were following up on a stolen potted plant then a swing by for an “interrogation” sounds AOK to me.

I would think that SOP times 6 would have been done here.

However, we are talking about a gruesome triple homicide with ties to biggest terrorist attack in years, AND we suspect that the” interrogation” could run 8-10 hours (let’s not forget he was in his 8th hour before he was killed) then we conduct that investigation IN A STRUCTURE THAT SAYS LE ON IT!
Said structure should also include recording equipment recording the recording equipment!

Moreover, (and we are not sure yet) if the deal was not recorded then I am open to the notion that lets say unorthodox techniques were being used.
Stopping by his apt (for tea its cool to stop by for a visit) For an investigation of a suspect wherein the concern is the suspect is fond of chopping off multiple heads all the more reasons to have conducted it elsewhere. Concerns are, IMO, more than appropriate.

It defies logic and protocol……………………………….

Kind of like younger brother. Just silly to be interviewing a human being that has been playing with bombs, hungry, tired, a hole in his neck and some other parts of his body, has tubes in him, is on sedatives, and has just been operated on (another hole in his body).

It is more than fair to question some of the judgment calls that have been made in this situation!

BBM
She said without evidence of LE wrongdoing. Which we have none of and is therefore ridiculous and insulting. To assume wrongdoing by LE and give the criminals the benefit of the doubt is what she is meaning and what is going on



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[claudicici]

No one is giving criminals the "benefit of a doubt".We are here to sleuth a case and in this particular case a guy that was on the F.B.I. watch list turns out to be able to carry out an act of terrorism and a guy that may have had answers in a brutal triple homicide ends up dead.That's frustrating and warrants questions.If we had evidence we wouldn't need to sleuth cases and discuss theories. No one should be made to feel guilty for embracing the most precious right we have in America which is Freedom of speech.

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

No one is giving criminals the "benefit of a doubt".We are here to sleuth a case and in this particular case a guy that was on the F.B.I. watch list turns out to be able to carry out an act of terrorism and a guy that may have had answers in a brutal triple homicide ends up dead.That's frustrating and warrants questions.If we had evidence we wouldn't need to sleuth cases and discuss theories. No one should be made to feel guilty for embracing the most precious right we have in America which is Freedom of speech.

Hi, claudicici :wave:. I'm certainly not trying to make anyone feel guilty for expressing their opinions. I was simply exercising my own First Amendment rights, too; explaining that it makes more sense to me, when puzzle pieces don't fit, to suspect the suspect before suspecting law enforcement. I think we'll have to wait a bit longer before we really know what to believe ~ as the reporting is just not reliable at this point. All :cow: !

 

[Elley Mae]

Here it is Memorial Day. God bless all our veterans (five career military members in this family)!
When I think of refugees seeking asylum I can only remember my grandparents who came over from Hungry. They didn't even seek asylum; they came by the skin of their own teeth and then worked like heck on a piece of land they farmed in Ohio to help more of their family escape from the oppression of what Grandpa Misik used to call the "damn Bolsheviks."
It rankles my hide to hear how our country has been taken advantage of by those whose morals are less honest than my grandparents and dishonor our open door policy only to advance their own political/religious(?) agendas.
I am thinking we need to be more discerning about who we allow into our country . . . and who we allow to stay. And we certainly need to keep better track of them.
While I, too, find all of the conflicting publicity reports upsetting it makes me uncomfortable that there are people who seem to be eager to use those inconsistencies to somehow cast some implications of guilt on law enforcement for distorting facts. I cannot fathom why anyone would, without direct, pure and undeniable evidence, try to imply that le is manipulating facts. If anyone should be given the first honest ear ~ it should be those who are dedicated to protecting us. If we find something solidly wrong then, of course, they should be called out for it. But, dang, suspecting le before we support them just seems so very backwards to me. No blinders here ~ but if I see someone who has questionable criminal activity and le is investigating them ~ I will want to find out more about what that person who was charged did and their history rather than examining how faithful le was to all of the rules and regulations by which they are governed.
If nothing else, this horror has highlighted many weaknesses in our immigration and security systems. My prayer is that it will not, also, highlight the weakness in our judicial system as the Caylee/Casey Anthony case has done.
God bless America. And if there are those here who do not feel the same ~ then let's just ship them back from where they came.

:sigh:​

Thanks, Happy Memorial Day to you and your family.

 

[CARIIS]

I am responding only to the notion that the system works. Not saying we know of his guilt or not. But according to wife and friend (posted linked earlier, they were not doing stuff with him regarding the triple -- it was ALL Boston.

[COLOR="Magenta"]DNA exonerations have proven that the problem is more widespread than many people think. In approximately 25% of the wrongful convictions overturned with DNA evidence, defendants made false confessions, admissions or statements to law enforcement officials. [/COLOR]




Law enforcement departments in the United Kingdom (England, Wales, Scotland
and Northern Ireland), Ireland, Canada, Australia and New Zealand record custodial
interviews in serious felony investigations. See the United Kingdom’s POLICE AND
CRIMINAL EVIDENCE ACT 1984 (Tape Recording of Interviews) Orders 1991
(Northern Ireland has an equivalent 1999 Order); see also Ireland’s CRIMINAL
JUSTICE ACT, 1984 (Electronic Recording of Interviews) Regulations, 1997. Police
departments we contacted in the United Kingdom and Ireland echo the endorsements
we received from United States agencies – emphatic support for recording as a
valuable law enforcement tool. Canadian and Australian authorities concur. See
ALAN GRANT, THE AUDIO-VISUAL TAPING OF POLICE INTERVIEWS WITH SUSPECTS
AND ACCUSED PERSONS BY HALTON REGIONAL POLICE FORCE ONTARIO, CANADA
(1987) (prepared for the Law Reform Commission of Canada); see also Wayne T.
Westling & Vicki Waye, Videotaping Police Interrogations: Lessons from Australia,
25 AM. J. CRIM. L. 493 (1998).

http://www.innocenceproject.org/docs/Police_Experiences_Recording_Interrogations.pdf

The specifics around procedures for detaining an enemy combatant in the U.S. we recently made clear by the president's top counterterrorism adviser, John Brennan in an interview discussing the attempted attack on the Northwest airline in December, 2009. Brennan confirmed that the FBI protocol for handling terror suspects is to (1) detain suspect, (2) bring in high-level interrogators to question the suspect for intelligence purposes and (3) read suspect Miranda rights.


This idea was formalized as "enemy combatant" logic by the Bush administration whereby those accused of terrorist activities or connections lose all rights to due process and the ability to challenge the accusation. The courts definitively rejected this proposal

http://career.myonlinecriminaljusticedegree.com/2010/02/what-is-fbi-due-process-for-suspected.asp


Others, knowing the technology that has been utilized in our countries to seek out terrorists, aren't so sure they want that type of monitoring in the USA. Yes, they are protecting our independence from the terrorists, but who is protecting our personal independence from the government?

The massive database of suspected individuals and inventory of eye scans has resulted in suspects being dealt with quickly and efficiently. With this technology, they can identify a suspected terrorist and shoot them immediately. There is no need for conversation, detainment, or to put the solider in harms way. If that sounds scary to you, that's because it is. Can you imagine this type of technology in the USA?

What started as a means of protection has evolved into an enterprise, where fear fuels the industry. It remains to be seen whether the fight against terrorism will give the government a legitimate reason to expand on domestic surveillance to the point where we all feel we are under a microscope.

http://career.myonlinecriminaljusticedegree.com/2009/11/how-far-can-homeland-security-take.asp



ME: We have more than enough FACTS that the system is problematic. In this day and age, and in this case, we have seen leaks to the media. The notion that we have not heard conclusively that the 8 hour interrogation was not taped is concerning.

The electronic recording of interrogations, from the reading of Miranda rights onward, is the single best reform available to stem the tide of false confessions.

http://www.innocenceproject.org/fix/False-Confessions.php

An exasperated trial judge recently told a police witness: “If you’ve
got audio and videotape there, I think you ought to use it. I don’t know
why I have to sit here and sort through the credibility of what was said
in these interviews when there’s a perfect device available to resolve
that and eliminate any discussion about it.”12

Detectives
with reservations became solid supporters after receiving training and
observing firsthand the benefits of an indisputable record.
“Recordings protect our ability to do our jobs. They have proven
beneficial to law enforcement, and ease public concern about how our
officers treat people who are in police custody.”

ME:Below notions about recording from local agencies. The Feral Bureau of Investagtion must certainly have protocols as to recording interogations.


Stockton, California Police Department — We observed the
same kind of apprehension as when cameras were put in patrol cars.
Now the recordings are accepted and valued.

Broward County, Florida Sheriff’s Office
observing and being involved in interrogations
I see how the use of video is much better than the old fashioned
method. . .
Many experienced officers said they would not consider
returning to non-recorded sessions,

Maricopa County, Arizona Sheriff’s Office — Every
detective should want to have a record of his questioning sessions.”

Butte/Silver Bow, Montana Law Enforcement Department —
“We would never go back to unrecorded statements

Mesa, Arizona Police Department — “Electronic recording of
custodial investigations has raised our level of sophistication in
interview and interrogation techniques.”

An experienced detective in Nevada said, “Recording is the
greatest thing since canned beans,” and another from Indiana
described recording custodial interrogations as “the best law
enforcement tool in recent history.”15

From FBI:
This is how it cut and paste!

Principle of recording interrogations
Is to accurately collect and
Preserve confession evidence
In the most unbiased and effigy
Client manner.

Testimony regarding what
Transpired inside the interrogation
Room can become tainted if
Only the participants witnessed
What occurred?

, problems associated with
Recollection can contribute to
Conflux citing statements. Interrogations
Often last for hours and
Exact transcripts cannot precisely
Memorialize everything.

Trial may not
Occur for years after the interrogation

Disparities in perceptions
Or preconceived biases
By participants might facilitate
Certain, and possibly wrong,
Inferences.

Electronic recording has proven
A valuable tool in administering
Justice by accurately preserving
Confession evidence.6

“Law enforcement
Agencies should
Address the
Contemporary issue
Of electronic recording
In a progressive
Manner.

Many courts
Recognize the
Value of recording
Interrogations for
Use in resolving
Matters.

Concluded that
Recording was now a reasonable
And necessary safeguard, essential
To the adequate protection of
The accused’s rights to counsel,
Against self-incrimination, and,
Ultimately, to a fair trial.

http://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publications/law-enforcement-bulletin/2006-pdfs/dec06leb.pdf


ME: He is dead.
If everything on the up and up, and they were doing triple not Boston, and it was recorded, and interviewing according to standards, why not release a snippet of him saying he is involved? Toot your horn. Bring on the symphony entitled "Job Well Done"

Congrats.

There is a reason why, some reason, , according to info out there as to why,a guy who is acknowledging chopping a bunch of heads off, goes, according to them, beserk in a room full of LE.There is no info suspecting psychosis or anything like that.

Can anyone come up with a reason why, if anything, a declaration that the 8 hours was recorded? Come up with a hypothesis.

 

[KarmaGet'em]

I don't know if it was mentioned yet (there are a lot of pages I have not read), but here is an interesting article that links TT with the 3 murdered in 2011 as well as the killing of the MIT officer:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2331114/Did-Boston-bombing-suspect-Tamerlan-Tsarnaev-steal-gun-used-kill-police-officer-Sean-Collier-victims-2011-triple-homicide-stands-accused-of.html

The woman, an African immigrant, also revealed that prior to his death, Mess had kept a handgun in his apartment but that police had told her after the bodies were discovered that it was missing.
...
It is believed that Mess’s missing gun was the same weapon Tsarnaev used when he shot MIT police Officer Sean Collier dead on the night of April 18 and wounded other officers shortly afterwards in the shoot-out in Watertown, Boston.

 

[CARIIS]

This also has been grossly under reported as well


http://www.cnn.com/2013/05/15/us/boston-watertown-shootout

 

[KarmaGet'em]

This also has been grossly under reported as well


http://www.cnn.com/2013/05/15/us/boston-watertown-shootout

With all due respect, the fact that the officer was shot by friendly fire was reported a lot.
They reported that they started investigating it 4/25:
http://www.boston.com/metrodesk/2013/04/25/authorities-investigate-friendly-fire-wounded-mbta-officer-shoot-out-with-boston-marathon-bombing-suspects/pnPFWw6A3irQKRzhlB6zIN/story.html

They have not been able to recover the bullet, so it takes time to determine what happened.

They have even interviewed the officer himself, who acknowledges that it was possible to be friendly fire and sees that as part of the job in such a chaotic scene. (That being said, if there was no shootout with TT and DT, the officer would not have been wounded.)
http://www.myfoxboston.com/story/22293108/2013/05/19/officer-shot-in-marathon-showdown-wants-to-work#ixzz2TpyOvIny

The only place I have seen people screaming TT and DT are being blamed for shooting Officer Donohue are ones that claim DT and TT are innocent and being framed. And even those people are confusing the fatal shooting of the MIT officer with the wounding of the MTBA officer (Donohue).

So, I guess my question to you is are you basing your opinion that it is grossly under reported because of the people that are claiming DT and TTs innocence and confusing the two incidents?

 

[PrairieWind]

I understand the police were in a very hectic and confusing situation, but sure seems they were a bit trigger happy. That is a lot of bullets flying around a residential neighborhood. What I also find interesting is the reports of homeowners of the bullets coming in one wall and continuing through their homes. Law Enforecement usually use hollow point bullets in part because it doesnt penetrate well so as to avoid this exact result.

 

[KarmaGet'em]

I understand the police were in a very hectic and confusing situation, but sure seems they were a bit trigger happy. That is a lot of bullets flying around a residential neighborhood. What I also find interesting is the reports of homeowners of the bullets coming in one wall and continuing through their homes. Law Enforecement usually use hollow point bullets in part because it doesnt penetrate well so as to avoid this exact result.

I agree that it was hectic and quite honestly scary. But they were being shot at by TT and had bombs tossed at them too. I certainly would not want to be in their place having to make a decision of how to safely stop TT and DT. IMO the brothers had plans for further destruction.
I don't know about hollow point bullets (not a gun person myself) and their impact on houses. I certainly would not be at the window filming a video if it was happening outside my home.