The case for murder

[inthedark14]

Upon further analysis of the red comforter found at the crime scene, yet not taken into evidence, that was located on the overturned white wicker, also not taken into evidence, the lotus-shaped markings are puzzling.

The lotus markings are visible in the forefront of the photo as well as along the outer edges. They do not seem to be evenly spaced as one would expect if inlaid within the fabric as a pattern. Two explanations come to mind:

(1) This could be an optical illusion due to folds and lumps not visible. It is also possible that the pattern exists on other areas of the comforter but due to the flash are not visible in the photo. OR

(2) A person wearing no-skid SOCKS with rubber lotus-pattern soles, especially if the soles were a "bit" damp, trampled back and forth on the red comforter before it was placed on the wicker chair. (FWIW I did my own experiment with similar socks, damp from walking on my lawn, then stamping on my navy blue comforter. Lo and behold the marks were visible.)

Attached is an enhanced close up of the comforter.
Also attached is an example of a no-skid sock with a close up of the lotus-pattern no-skid bottom.
Although the pattern is different, for visualization purposes, also attached is the "Combed Cotton PINK YOGA Non Slip Sock with Rubber Decorative for Women"

I'm still on the fence on this one. Just tossing it out as food for thought.
:fence:

Wow Caricoa. Great find. Thank you for taking the time to ponder this. It is especially intriguing to me because I can't see that pattern going anywhere else on the comforter except for where someone could have stepped on it. Super sleuthing gold star to you. I would have never even thought of "house socks" as I call them. I keep those around for when I'm in and out and I don't want my flip flops in the house but I don't want to be walking around barefoot either. (I really like my floors). :blushing:

 

[*Lash*]

Upon further analysis of the red comforter found at the crime scene, yet not taken into evidence, that was located on the overturned white wicker, also not taken into evidence, the lotus-shaped markings are puzzling.

The lotus markings are visible in the forefront of the photo as well as along the outer edges. They do not seem to be evenly spaced as one would expect if inlaid within the fabric as a pattern. Two explanations come to mind:

(1) This could be an optical illusion due to folds and lumps not visible. It is also possible that the pattern exists on other areas of the comforter but due to the flash are not visible in the photo. OR

(2) A person wearing no-skid SOCKS with rubber lotus-pattern soles, especially if the soles were a "bit" damp, trampled back and forth on the red comforter before it was placed on the wicker chair. (FWIW I did my own experiment with similar socks, damp from walking on my lawn, then stamping on my navy blue comforter. Lo and behold the marks were visible.)

Attached is an enhanced close up of the comforter.
Also attached is an example of a no-skid sock with a close up of the lotus-pattern no-skid bottom.
Although the pattern is different, for visualization purposes, also attached is the "Combed Cotton PINK YOGA Non Slip Sock with Rubber Decorative for Women"

I'm still on the fence on this one. Just tossing it out as food for thought.
:fence:

Nice job Carioca!

To add to the food for thought, hospitals stock non skid stocks. The socks are giving to almost every patient, even offered to the visitors of the patient. It is feasible this could be a pattern from non skid socks that came from Rady's hospital. Very interesting.

 

[Gilgamesh]

Hi everyone,
I am going on a one month trip to Europe starting tomorrow. Have a nice summer. -Gilgamesh

 

[time]

Hi everyone,
I am going on a one month trip to Europe starting tomorrow. Have a nice summer. -Gilgamesh

Wow... have a wonderful trip!

 

[bourne]

Hi everyone,
I am going on a one month trip to Europe starting tomorrow. Have a nice summer. -Gilgamesh

Have fun and travel safe!

You'll still have your laptop or iPad or iPhone, right? You'll be able to keep in touch and continue posting? We need your insights here to keep us on our toes! :rockon:

 

[bourne]

Nice job Carioca!

To add to the food for thought, hospitals stock non skid stocks. The socks are giving to almost every patient, even offered to the visitors of the patient. It is feasible this could be a pattern from non skid socks that came from Rady's hospital. Very interesting.

I was thinking the same thing! Maybe the investigators can compare the imprints on the comforter to the Rady hospital socks! HOW FANTASTIC that would be if they find a match! That'd be added proof someone from the Rady hospital who had access to these socks (namely Max's visitors -- Dina, Nina, Jonah, Adam) was stomping about the Spreckels mansion AFTER Max had his accident and was taken to the hospital and likely during the commission of Rebecca's murder.

 

[*Lash*]

It appears SDSO did not take the comforter as evidence, so it is probably gone by now. However, I'm so grateful SDSO took a photograph! At least they did something right. Yes, it would be wonderful if there was a match. I'm sure it would be easy to find out what distributor and or brand Rady was using at that time. Even better if they haven't changed since 2011.

 

[LoveAlways7]

"07-24-2013, 10:30 PM
IQuestion IQuestion is offline
Registered User Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 61

Since this thread is about the 911 call, and everyone reacts to an emergency differently, courts do compare the actions of an individual to the actions of a PRUDENT PERSON. How many times has it been asked in court, "Are these the actions of a prudent person?" So, I am going to present a scenario to you and ask yourselves..."What would a prudent person do?": A recent visitor to California walks out of his bungalow, to get a cup of coffee at the clubhouse. As he/she walks across the courtyard, notices a body floating face down in the swimming pool. Not only floating face down, but also has their feet tied together, and their hands bound behind their back! DOES A PRUDENT PERSON CALL 911? Yes, of course. DOES A PRUDENT PERSON ANNOUNCE TO THE 911 OPERATOR, "I got a boy, drowned himself." When the 911 operator asks, "What is the address?" DOES A PRUDENT PERSON SAY, "I'll call you back?"Or, would a prudent person, then decide they are a "can do, responsible kinda guy" and decide to take care of EVERYTHING himself? Doesn't bother to scream out to near by neighbors, asking for help? "Hey, I need some help! Does anyone know the address of this place? Somebody, anybody PLEASE, PLEASE HELP..THIS IS AN EMERGENCY!" No, AS doesn't perform any of the actions of a prudent person...not even bothering to unbind the victim before performing CPR. These are but a few of the problems I have with the 911 caller. Why did he take it upon himself to "Huff and puff to get the address? Huff and puff to get the knife?
Huff and puff to drag the table across the courtyard, even though their were chairs in the same room he had just retrieved the knife? Huff and puff to cut her down? And never once scream out to a neighbor for assistance, if this was truly a life and death scenario? Ask yourself, "Are these the actions of a prudent person?"
I think these are the actions of someone wanting us to believe he was acting in a prudent and responsible manner.... Frankly, parts of it sounded like an old time radio show drama...the prop man makes the sound of a dragging table, makes the sounds of exerting energy, embellishes the airwaves with huffing and puffing...quite a drama, huh?"

Bumped by me

 

[defense101]

Hi everyone,
I am going on a one month trip to Europe starting tomorrow. Have a nice summer. -Gilgamesh

Did a road trip through there it was awesome! Experience everything and enjoy it all!

 

[Serpico]

Nice job Carioca!

To add to the food for thought, hospitals stock non skid stocks. The socks are giving to almost every patient, even offered to the visitors of the patient. It is feasible this could be a pattern from non skid socks that came from Rady's hospital. Very interesting.

Yes, indeed interesting. Also, hospitals have an endless volume of white gloves I would imagine.

 

[*Lash*]

Yes, indeed interesting. Also, hospitals have an endless volume of white gloves I would imagine.

Non skid socks and white gloves? Hmm...I wonder if a murderer would use gloves to coverup their DNA and/or fingerprints? That is sarcasm intended for SDSO. Ya know because at EVERY murder scene the perp leaves behind their DNA.

Additional thought - those white gloves are usually available for anyone to grab. In most hospitals they even have different sizes stocked on the hospital walls of every patients room.

 

[Carioca]

Non skid socks and white gloves? Hmm...I wonder if a murderer would use gloves to coverup their DNA and/or fingerprints? That is sarcasm intended for SDSO. Ya know because at EVERY murder scene the perp leaves behind their DNA.

Additional thought - those white gloves are usually available for anyone to grab. In most hospitals they even have different sizes stocked on the hospital walls of every patients room.

And those gloves come in a variety of colors, including black. From this photo taken from Rady Children's Hospital website / research lab, these techs are wearing red and dark blue:
http://www.rchsd.org/research/researchprograms/index.htm

 

[*Lash*]

And those gloves come in a variety of colors, including black. From this photo taken from Rady Children's Hospital website / research lab, these techs are wearing red and dark blue:
http://www.rchsd.org/research/researchprograms/index.htm

Thank you for the link to Rady Children's Hospital. It has been awhile since I looked there. I could use a refresher course on Dr. Peterson and other doctors at Rady. The Ronald McDonald House, too.

 

[time]

And those gloves come in a variety of colors, including black. From this photo taken from Rady Children's Hospital website / research lab, these techs are wearing red and dark blue:
http://www.rchsd.org/research/researchprograms/index.htm

Maybe black latex gloves were available there also.

 

[time]

Thank you for the link to Rady Children's Hospital. It has been awhile since I looked there. I could use a refresher course on Dr. Peterson and other doctors at Rady. The Ronald McDonald House, too.

Our House closes at 8:00 p.m. nightly to all day visitors and guests. Resident guests have access via electronic key card.

http://www.rmhcsd.org/en/our-families/services-for-families/what-to-expect.html

 

[MissJ]

The statements credited to Dr. P by MS's family sound like soap opera dialogue, not something a professional would ever say to grieving parents. The CPR or lack of it have no bearing on this case. Unfortunately, there was never any reason for optimism for MS to ever recover once he had blunt trauma and cardiac arrest. MS's medical signs upon arrival at the hospital (without Xray, MRI or such) indicate as much. I am referring to his fixed pupils,posturing etc, all signs of severe brain injury. I don't believe a professional of any kind would have ever given the parents any reason to hope, ever. Are we to believe this MD didn't know what was going on with MS? Ludicrous! The ancillary hospital staff would have known and they aren't MDs. Because anyone with hospital ER experience knows the dire signs of severe brain injury from which there is no recovery. There never was a sudden turn for the worse. MS would never recover. That was evident in the ER within minutes of his arrival. JMO

 

[MissJ]

Sorry, didn't finish. RZ didn't commit suicide. There was no late night phone call. RZ was not guilty of any wrong doing and she knew it. JMO

 

[STS-135]

Non skid socks and white gloves? Hmm...I wonder if a murderer would use gloves to coverup their DNA and/or fingerprints? That is sarcasm intended for SDSO. Ya know because at EVERY murder scene the perp leaves behind their DNA.

Additional thought - those white gloves are usually available for anyone to grab. In most hospitals they even have different sizes stocked on the hospital walls of every patients room.

I was hospitalized a while back. I seem to remember being given non-skid socks. If those odd reflections on the comforter in fact came from the dust left by non-skid socks, and I realize this is all only speculation, could they have come from the hospital?

Also, I had asked earlier but don't recall anyone addressing the question: Do we in fact know it to be a comforter? To me it looks more like one of those TV blankets or confi robes that just happen to use similar materials.

Nice footwork, Carioca. Thank you!

 

[STS-135]

"07-24-2013, 10:30 PM
IQuestion IQuestion is offline
Registered User Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 61

Since this thread is about the 911 call, and everyone reacts to an emergency differently, courts do compare the actions of an individual to the actions of a PRUDENT PERSON. How many times has it been asked in court, "Are these the actions of a prudent person?" So, I am going to present a scenario to you and ask yourselves..."What would a prudent person do?": A recent visitor to California walks out of his bungalow, to get a cup of coffee at the clubhouse. As he/she walks across the courtyard, notices a body floating face down in the swimming pool. Not only floating face down, but also has their feet tied together, and their hands bound behind their back! DOES A PRUDENT PERSON CALL 911? Yes, of course. DOES A PRUDENT PERSON ANNOUNCE TO THE 911 OPERATOR, "I got a boy, drowned himself." When the 911 operator asks, "What is the address?" DOES A PRUDENT PERSON SAY, "I'll call you back?"Or, would a prudent person, then decide they are a "can do, responsible kinda guy" and decide to take care of EVERYTHING himself? Doesn't bother to scream out to near by neighbors, asking for help? "Hey, I need some help! Does anyone know the address of this place? Somebody, anybody PLEASE, PLEASE HELP..THIS IS AN EMERGENCY!" No, AS doesn't perform any of the actions of a prudent person...not even bothering to unbind the victim before performing CPR. These are but a few of the problems I have with the 911 caller. Why did he take it upon himself to "Huff and puff to get the address? Huff and puff to get the knife?
Huff and puff to drag the table across the courtyard, even though their were chairs in the same room he had just retrieved the knife? Huff and puff to cut her down? And never once scream out to a neighbor for assistance, if this was truly a life and death scenario? Ask yourself, "Are these the actions of a prudent person?"
I think these are the actions of someone wanting us to believe he was acting in a prudent and responsible manner.... Frankly, parts of it sounded like an old time radio show drama...the prop man makes the sound of a dragging table, makes the sounds of exerting energy, embellishes the airwaves with huffing and puffing...quite a drama, huh?"

Bumped by me

iQuestion posted his wonderful insight only a week ago. Surely most of us still remember it because it was even discussed. If I was working hard to try to point the finger squarely at AS, however, I too would keep bumping the thought.

 

[STS-135]

I was thinking the same thing! Maybe the investigators can compare the imprints on the comforter to the Rady hospital socks! HOW FANTASTIC that would be if they find a match! That'd be added proof someone from the Rady hospital who had access to these socks (namely Max's visitors -- Dina, Nina, Jonah, Adam) was stomping about the Spreckels mansion AFTER Max had his accident and was taken to the hospital and likely during the commission of Rebecca's murder.

Dang... Last night I changed my view options from FIFO to LIFO and I only now realized that I was replying to the most recent posts without having read all the posts that preceded them. You gals/guys may already be on to something. So I better go back to gardening for now. My apologies.