The Case of JonBenet Ramsey-CBS Sept. 18 # 2

[fedfan4life]

Yeah. I think she changed her user name.

I considered that last evening, but this one is quite a bit more aggressive.

 

[PositiveLight]

Here's a better quality coloured (although clearly touched up) copy of photo being discussed up-thread. I don't think there's any mark evident above the eye. I do find the dilation of her pupils interesting, though.

I find the dilated pupils odd too. I wonder if it is from a medication perhaps? Thank you for the photo! she was such a beautiful child.

 

[carolinea]

One thing I find interesting is that the Ramseys allowed Burke to be interviewed on 1/8, yet they wouldn't agree to be interviewed for quite a bit of time later. This seems odd to me if they were covering for Burke.

(That said, I do believe BDI accidentally. Still, this is one of those things that makes me pause and consider other scenarios.)

 

[fedfan4life]

I'm a social worker in abuse and neglect. I'm not going to verify myself on this sight ever. Everyone else makes claims and are not asked to "verify" themselves. I'm a mother and a social worker. Take my opinion for what it's worth

You are a social worker in abuse and neglect of children?

 

[carolinea]

Seriously? The pineapple means nothing. The Ramsey's left all of their dishes out from that day. I could see Patsy giving the kiddos a bowl of pineapple sometime during the day and it was left there. They left every single thing out from that day.

So why did Patsy deny ever getting out the pineapple? Why did she deny that Burke would have gotten the pineapple? By PR's own account, they didn't have any pineapple that day at home, nor was any served at the Whites'.

 

[ThinkHard]

A mother knows when her child is being abused irregardless of whether or not she consciously admits it. JMO

This is not always true.

I went to a home day care during elementary school.....the women's son, who was also my age, (3rd grade, roughly 8/9) use to threaten me and this other girl, he would force us to play "house" and take turns being the wife.....he liked to play "sleeping" a lot.....yes that meant husband and wife in bed time....and he would do things to us and make us do things to him......

I've never told anyone, EVER, until this post. My mom never had a clue.

 

[mauidreemn]

So why did Patsy deny ever getting out the pineapple? Why did she deny that Burke would have gotten the pineapple? By PR's own account, they didn't have any pineapple that day at home, nor was any served at the Whites'.

If I remember correctly, she didn't recall anything about the pineapple other than she wouldn't have used that big spoon.

 

[fedfan4life]

I'm not quite getting that. You are glad that they are getting Burke's name out there in a big way. Yet at the same time you are saying everyone is guessing - assuming you are accepting there is not enough evidence to do otherwise.

Can you accept that Burke may be entirely innocent. That he is being dragged into the public eye again. That this is most probably taking an enormous toll on his life. And there is next to no actual real evidence he did anything.

Speaking for me personally, no.

 

[elmomom]

I find the dilated pupils odd too. I wonder if it is from a medication perhaps? Thank you for the photo! she was such a beautiful child.

My Dad had some experience in high end model photography, years ago. He said they used to have the models pose, then shut their eyes for a minute, then shoot the photo as soon as they open their eyes to get the more dilated pupil effect. Which is supposed to be sexier than constricted ones apparently...

 

[mauidreemn]

Um. The pineapple is actually a HUGE clue! It shows time of death. Did you watch the program? They went into detail about where the pineapple was in her intestinal tract at the time of death and also that the evidence showed it was eaten much later than dinner because her dinner had already passed through and was broken down. That is HUGE. Who fed her the pineapple? Who ever did was awake and moving around the home at the time of her death. For PR to say she didn't recognize it and for BR to go wide eyed.... thats telling.
The spider web is fairly new info to me and again the only reason i was aware of it was recent research into the case. BUT the show proved to me the fact that no intruder came through that window. The show did the testing that we all wish we had the capability to do but can't. I'm so glad they did all of that testing and on national tv. If BR and JR are innocent, then they would not still be under a cloud of suspicion. THEY put themselves in that position by not helping the LE and hiding behind lawyers. If they really wanted the killer found they would gladly stand and be confronted and do what it took to clear their names. But they didn't. So, if people think they are guilty it's pretty much their own dang fault for not helping with the case. They held the case up by not letting LE rule them out. They looked at 150 other suspects and ruled them out. That is my opinion of course and how I feel but I will say this. Had it been my child? I would have beat the doors of the PD down to rule me out so they could move on to the next potential suspect.
Their lawyers did them an injustice then and their lawyer now is doing them an injustice.
When it is all said and done, a little 6 year old child has been brutally murdered and has never received any sort of justice. She never will either.

The pineapple was in her small intestine. There is no way of knowing when it was there or how long it was there. If the ME knew, he would say.

 

[otg]

One thing I find interesting is that the Ramseys allowed Burke to be interviewed on 1/8, yet they wouldn't agree to be interviewed for quite a bit of time later. This seems odd to me if they were covering for Burke.

(That said, I do believe BDI accidentally. Still, this is one of those things that makes me pause and consider other scenarios.)

They didn't "allow it." It was mandated by DSS (Dept. of Social Services) to make sure the sibling of a murdered child was safe and secure in the home where his sister had been murdered.

 

[elmomom]

I thought the tape of Burke crawling out of his skin trying to avoid saying "pineapple" was an amazing sight to see. I was already pretty convinced that he did it, but wow did that cement it for me.

 

[mauidreemn]

Burke isn't even close to a normal guy! Do you have much experience observing human psychiatric pathophysiology?



You assert a lot that CBS's claims that they backed with evidence holds no merit....yet you present no facts to back up your assertions.

He graduated from college. He's held a job in the computer industry for years. He has the same beautiful, successful girlfriemd for years. Seems okay to me

 

[PositiveLight]

The CBS show never mentioned that Fleet White was the FIRST person to check the basement shortly after he arrived at around 6am and was the first person that went to the basement and looked into the wine cellar. So may things were not mentioned that didn't fit into the BDI theory.

Fleet White also said he opened the WC door but didn't know where the light was and couldn't see anything from the doorway. Yet, when JR went down with Fleet he could see immediately that JBR was in there before he turned the light on. Odd. Considering she was wrapped up in a blanket.
My own speculation here, but Fleet went down there basically as the cops were getting there. EVEN IF her body wasn't in there at the time, it could have easily been moved there when JR went missing for the 1 1/2 hours (not missing from the house i doubt just out of Linda Arndt's field of vision.
JR was not aware that Fleet had went down there that morning on his own and JR changed his story to reflect that later on. It does look hinky.
JMOO and hopefully the long term sleuths can point you to the links to help you with references to these points.

 

[mauidreemn]

Fleet White also said he opened the WC door but didn't know where the light was and couldn't see anything from the doorway. Yet, when JR went down with Fleet he could see immediately that JBR was in there before he turned the light on. Odd. Considering she was wrapped up in a blanket.
My own speculation here, but Fleet went down there basically as the cops were getting there. EVEN IF her body wasn't in there at the time, it could have easily been moved there when JR went missing for the 1 1/2 hours (not missing from the house i doubt just out of Linda Arndt's field of vision.
JR was not aware that Fleet had went down there that morning on his own and JR changed his story to reflect that later on. It does look hinky.
JMOO and hopefully the long term sleuths can point you to the links to help you with references to these points.

So JR seeing a white blanket without light is hinky but Fleet White not seeing one minutes after he arrived isn't hinky?

 

[ThinkHard]

And this is why we can't have nice things. Every single bit of this is supposition and not backed up by a single person on this case.

It is an observation based on a picture and it is clearly stated as such, what is the problem?

Again you keep critiquing everyword that is remotely BDI by basically making banket statement saying things are impossible or not backed up (which in many cases they are, at nauseum)...yet you aren't actually providing any evidence yourself to back up your statements.

So it kind of just feels like you are just hear to troll rather then actually contribute.

 

[ZoriahNZ]

Still sifting through old threads. I am amazed at the amount of information there is available and yet at the same time it surely can't be as comprehensive as what the GJ had to go through over those gruelling months before they voted to indict the two parents.

I want to commend OTG for his/her stellar work on the 911 phone call. The CBS show really brought the ending part into question, but I still am not sure about the exact wording. Will take further comments to the appropriate thread.

A question I had while watching the special on youtube: What the heck is that small narrow object to the right of the crumpled white blanket at timemark 42:29? It's the recreated scene, not actual crime scene footage. In fact, I don't think we have a photo from the correct angle showing what it is.

I also found it weird that when they tried to re-enact the intruder theory and have Ms Richards climb back out using the suitcase, they had it flush with the wall, rather than perpendicular as seen in all crime scene shots.

With regards to the cigar box which wasn't mentioned on the special, do you think there's any significance in the detail of one or two of them being partially unwrapped? http://www.acandyrose.com/s-evidence-cigar-box.htm

When I read that transcript, I wondered if the kids had been playing with them in the WC that night.

 

[carolinea]

If I remember correctly, she didn't recall anything about the pineapple other than she wouldn't have used that big spoon.

16 TRIP DEMUTH: That is why we asked you, you

17 fed them pancakes in the morning.

18 PATSY RAMSEY: Late morning.

19 TRIP DEMUTH: Could you have fed them

20 pineapple with the pancakes?

21 PATSY RAMSEY: Not that I am aware. Not that

22 I can remember. They don't go together. You wouldn't

23 have pineapple with pancakes.

24 TRIP DEMUTH: I wouldn't, but we need to ask.

25 PATSY RAMSEY: No.

0490

1 TRIP DEMUTH: So no pineapple with the

2 pancakes in the morning, right?

3 PATSY RAMSEY: No. I don't remember when I

4 had pineapple in the house.

5 TRIP DEMUTH: Want you to move through the

6 day.

7 PATSY RAMSEY: I am trying to remember.

8 TRIP DEMUTH: Take your time.

9 When you are wrapping presents and what have

10 you, getting things ready, and JonBenet is riding her

11 bike some a little bit.

12 PATSY RAMSEY: Well, she rode her bike. We

13 were out there when she was riding her bike.

14 TRIP DEMUTH: Okay. There is a time when

15 John goes to the airport; right?

16 PATSY RAMSEY: Right.

17 TRIP DEMUTH: And the kids were playing with

18 their toys and what have you, right, and lunch.

19 PATSY RAMSEY: I don't remember lunch.

20 TRIP DEMUTH: I think you said earlier that

21 you may not have had lunch because there was an --

22 PATSY RAMSEY: I had breakfast.

23 TRIP DEMUTH: How late was the breakfast?

24 PATSY RAMSEY: I don't remember exactly, but

25 probably 10:00, 11:00.

0491

1 TRIP DEMUTH: That is what you mean by a late

2 breakfast, okay. How about, you go to the White's what

3 time, approximately?

4 PATSY RAMSEY: Right after, like 4:00,

5 5:00ish, so we could have very easily skipped lunch.

...
16 TRIP DEMUTH: What about before breakfast,

17 did you have any -- I don't know if you all had snacks

18 while you are opening presents.

19 PATSY RAMSEY: No. We had coffee, and the

20 kids don't care about eating. They just want to dig

21 in.

22 TRIP DEMUTH: That would be my experience as

23 well. So there was no pineapple served before

24 breakfast?

25 PATSY RAMSEY: No.

0493

1 TRIP DEMUTH: And then Christmas Eve, going

2 backwards.

3 PATSY RAMSEY: Christmas Eve, oh, Christmas

4 Eve we went to church and we went to Pasta Jay's.

5 TRIP DEMUTH: So spaghetti.

6 PATSY RAMSEY: Yeah. No pineapple.

7 TRIP DEMUTH: After you came home from Pasta

8 Jay's.

9 PATSY RAMSEY: No. I mean, you know, the

10 kids were full after Pasta Jay's.

----------

13 PATSY RAMSEY: Right. I did not feed

14 JonBenet pineapple, so I don't know how it got in her

15 stomach. I don't know where this bowl of pineapple

16 came from. I can't recall putting that there. I can

17 never recall putting a tea bag like that in a cup, so I

18 don't know. I don't know the answer.

----

 

[carolinea]

They didn't "allow it." It was mandated by DSS (Dept. of Social Services) to make sure the sibling of a murdered child was safe and secure in the home where his sister had been murdered.

Thanks, otg! The book I'm reading didn't mention that part.

 

[Closet_Sleuth]

TRICIA- can you repost how to block certain posts from showing in the feed- please and thank you.

Under Settings you can add people to the Ignore List. I am wondering if I will still have to see all the argumentative posts though if people quote them and respond?

ETA: ugh...all the quoted posts still show up after adding someone to your Ignore list. But at least I only have to see it once instead of twice, lol